At age 39, John Legend has carved a major role in American culture. He has found success as a singer, songwriter and actor with hits like "Ordinary People" and "All of Me" and in movies such as "La La land." He is one of just 15 entertainers to win individual Emmy, Grammy, Oscar and Tony awards. Born into a blue-collar family in Springfield, Ohio, Legend studied English at the University of Pennsylvania and worked for a global business consulting firm. While building his music career since then, Legend has become unusually informed about, and active in, American politics.

Listen to this episode of Speakeasy on Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. He sat down with editor-at-large John Harwood during a political swing to promote Democrat Stacey Abrams, the African-American women running for governor of Georgia, and the Florida ballot initiative Amendment Four to restore voting rights for felons who've completed their sentences. Over drinks at The Abbey, an Orlando, Florida, entertainment venue, they discussed criminal justice reform, Democratic presidential politics, and the Twitter fights he and his wife Chrissy Teigen have waged with President Donald Trump. What follows is a condensed, edited transcript of their conversation. John Harwood: Cheers. John Legend: Cheers, John. Harwood: I'm fascinated by the mix of things that have been in your life. Music, obviously, but also politics and also business. When you were little John Stephens, what did you want to grow up to be? Legend: When I was little John Stephens, I wanted to be quite a few things. One of them, I wanted to be a musician. I loved playing the piano. I started when I was 4. I started playing in church when I was pretty young. I was singing in the church choir, and I would watch the Grammys. I would watch some of my favorite artists on television, like Stevie Wonder, and I wanted to be them. I wanted to be doing what they were doing. Also, when I was a kid, I wanted to be president.

Of course they've told me to shut up and sing. John Legend

Harwood: Once you left the consulting world, you made it big in the music business. Like anybody who makes it big, you have a decision to make about what other things you're going be involved with. Michael Jordan famously once said, "I'm not very political because Republicans buy shoes too." I happen to know that Republicans listen to all of me, because I heard it at a wedding of Republican friends last year. Why have you decided to lend your celebrity, your time, your money to so many political causes? Legend: I can't help it. Honestly, it's probably not good for business. It's probably alienating some people and I understand that, but I think it's worth the risk for me. Because I care enough about these issues that I cannot just be silent. I care about me being an honest person, me being an authentic person, me living in my truth, and part of my truth is caring about these issues and speaking out about them when I care. It would be too hard for me to be silent about it. I just couldn't do it. It's not in my constitution. It's interesting, because when I was 15, I wrote an essay. It was for a Black History essay competition and the question was, "How are you going to make black history?" And I literally said, "I'm going to become a famous musician, and I'm going to use my platform to fight for justice and equality and give back to my community." So, I've wanted to do this since I was young. And if that loses me some fans, it's OK, because I feel like it's easier for me to be honest, it's better for me to be honest and authentic, and I think a lot of my fans appreciate that about me because you want your artists to be honest. Harwood: Do you get a lot of grief from people on the other side politically that, you know, why are you speaking out? You don't know what you're talking about, you're a dilettante, that sort of thing. Legend: Yeah, well we get it a lot of ways. So, you know, of course, you've seen people like Laura Ingraham tell LeBron to shut up and dribble. Harwood: Has anybody told you to shut up and sing? Legend: Of course they've told me to shut up and sing. And in general, I think Hollywood, when it comes to actors and entertainers, more of us lean toward the left than toward the right, and so the right has kind of taken on this idea that celebrities should shut up. Of course, they just elected a celebrity, who hosted "Celebrity Apprentice" of all shows. So, I don't think they actually believe that celebrities should shut up. They just want celebrities to agree with them and if they don't agree with them, they want them to shut up. So, they're happy to have Ted Nugent on their network. They're happy to have, you know, whatever B-list actors they've had on their network. They'll take anybody that will come to them. They're so happy that Kanye is on team MAGA now and they're embracing it. So, they don't want you to shut up. They want you to shut up if you don't agree with them. So, I don't.

They're so happy that Kanye is on team MAGA now and they're embracing it. So, they don't want you to shut up. They want you to shut up if you don't agree with them. So, I don't. John Legend