Book of Tyrael Interview with Micky Neilson and Matt Burns

by JR Cook - 7 years ago

We were afforded the opportunity to sit down with Blizzard Entertainment’s publishing lead Micky Neilson and the author of the Book of Tyrael Matt Burns.

Check out our full review of the book here if you want to learn more about it and why it’s a must buy for any Diablo fan.

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Transcript

Twizz: Ladies and gentlemen, in this very special episode we’re going to be speaking with some of the most creative minds behind Diablo lore. We’re also going to be exploring one of the most fascinating relics that Blizzard has ever released, the Book of Tyrael. Welcome to BlizzPro’s TwizzCast.

Welcome everyone to a very special episode of TwizzCast. This episode is going to be quite a bit different than the ones that you are used to hearing. A lot of the Blizzard interviews that take place on this show are geared towards game development and what we can expect from some of our favorite titles. But we are switching up gears this time around and we are going to discuss one of the most fascinating relics that Blizzard has ever released. First off please, please allow me to make a few introductions just to kick this off. Co-hosting this episode with me is BlizzPro’s lead Diablo III editor and expert, Neinball. Welcome to the show sir.

Neinball: Guten Tag!

Twizz: I didn’t know you were German today!

Neinball: Just today.

Twizz: Also with me on the line would you please help me welcome to the show for the very first time as well, Blizzard Entertainments Publishing Lead, Mr. Micky Neilson. Welcome to TwizzCast sir.

Micky: Hey everybody, thank you very much.

Twizz: It’s good to have you here. And last but certainly not least, I’d like to welcome to the show Associate Story Developer, and the author of the Book of Tyrael, Mr Matt Burns. It is an honor and privilege to have you on the show as well sir.

Matt: Hey, how’s it going? Thanks so much for having us on.

Twizz: Oh our privilege, trust me on that. Gentlemen, your time is exceptionally valuable and we really want to dig into this as much as we can. So let’s start covering some ground if you don’t mind. I’d like to start with Micky real quick. I visited your website. which is http://www.mickyneilson.com and the about section that talks about your past is unbelievably impressive. You’re the Publishing Lead at Blizzard Entertainment and you’ve been there for about two decades now. The Book of Tyrael obviously isn’t your first foray into the realm of Diablo. What other works have you done to explore the world of Sanctuary.

Micky: Let’s see, the most recent I believe was the Hatred and Discipline short story. So that was the story about the demon hunter, Bala. And that was released on the website around the launch of Diablo III. And then that was also published as part of an anthology of short stories that’s available now through Amazon. It is called Heroes Rise, Darkness Falls. That was the last thing I did for Diablo as far as writing goes. Then I also, I actually, I was a voice director for awhile. The first thing that I did as a voice director was back I think it was on, D2. It was either D2 or D2X, and that was kind of my first foray into voice directing. So I did a little bit of that. At different times I did a little bit of writing for the game journals and things like that. But that’s mainly it. I think. I might be forgetting something.

Twizz: Kind of a jack of all trades, that’s unbelievable.

Micky: And overseeing the books. The Order was the first thing that I really kind of oversaw as a novel for Diablo.

Twizz: Very cool

Neinball: By overseeing, you can make sure that everything fits well and that the writer doesn’t go too far off track in terms of how you want to keep the lore?

Micky: Yeah, it’s interesting, for our process the way we develop novels and really all our fiction is we have Story Developers. Like Matt for instance is a Story Developer. What we’ll do is we’ll bring in an author and we’ll have an outline in mind for them usually. We’ll hand off the outline to them and they’ll go through and they’ll add to it and bring their own voice and their own ideas to the project. Then they’ll go through and they’ll do their first draft and the Story Developer will then take a look at that and they’ll make sure all kinds of things. They’ll make sure that it’s telling the story that we want to tell. They’ll make sure that it’s tying in the way that we want the story to tie in to game content. And they’ll just look at things like characterization and flow and pacing and all the kinds of things that a really really good story teller is going to look for and that people are going to look for in a good story. That was kind of my role for The Order and also for the upcoming book Storm of Light, also by Nate Kenyon who did the The Order. Then we have the lore folks, the historians who will go through and they’re the ones who really really get into the details and fact check everything.

Neinball: That’s Evelyn and her team right?

Micky: Yep, exactly. Evelyn Frederickson.

Neinball: For the overseeing the novels and such, in the Book of Tyrael, you’re credited with additional writings. Is that how you approached the Book of Tyrael, were their little parts that you wrote or were you also in charge of going through and keeping all the sections together and making it coherent. Or is that something more that Matt was involved with.

Micky: Yeah, for Book of Tyrael I was pretty much just at the top level. Just making sure that everything was running smoothly. For Book of Cain I did some actual writing. Me, Flint Dille, Matt Burns, we all jumped in on Book of Cain at various parts. It was mainly Flint. For Book of Tyrael it was really Matt’s show as far as the writing goes. He was just a one man wrecking ball on this thing. He went through and, you know he’s awesome. He did a great job and the credit absolutely goes to Matt for the writing on this book.

Matt: Just to add to that, in a lot of ways Micky was kind of like my editor on Book of Tyrael. That’s a good way to look at it too. I would be writing and we would meet up and he would read over it and we’d talk about it, we’d make changes and stuff like that.

Twizz: Awesome

Micky: That was really noticeable, because it had a much more coherent vibe going from cover to cover. Instead of being a collection of notes like Book of Cain was.

Neinball: Very cool

Twizz: Speaking of Book of Cain being a loose collection of stories about the creation of the universe and a timeline of Sanctuary. Along with the detailed notes on the major players involved in the backstory. But the Book of Tyrael is written with a much more concise goal in mind. Was this something that you just set out to do? Or was this change in narrative spurred by something that you learned by putting together the Book of Cain.

Micky: It was a little bit of both. Something else I should mention too is, Chris Metzen and his involvement in all of this. Especially for Book of Cain, because that was really a source book and so much about the origins and everything else. A lot of that was really just inside Chris’ head. There were lots of meetings and everything else and figuring out the best way to convey all of that information. So it was a little bit looser, it was exploratory and trying to figure out, what are these different origins and what are the different stories we’re gonna tell. Even just figuring out the structure of the book and what should come first. Should we talk about the high heavens first? Or the hells and different demons and everything else? And figuring out what made the most sense. So it was a different process for Book of Tyrael, where we sat down and we had a much clearer idea of what the direction was going to be, pretty much from the outset.

Matt: Yeah, and I think that kind of worked in our favor too. Because Deckard Cain as a character, I can see him writing and it being a little more scattered because he’s gathering information from all of these different places and he’s just laying it out there. Whereas Tyrael, he’s a little more orderly, maybe because of his angelic background. I could see him being much more concise and clear if he’s going to, if he would layout a book. You know what I mean?

Twizz: Oh sure!

Matt: So there’s some cool character differences there as well between the two books.

Micky: Law and Order

Matt: Justice

Twizz: Absolutely fascinating guys. Well, this obviously wouldn’t be a lore type book interview without some lore questions. I’m certain that you guys will have some fun answering these. In the Book of Tyrael, Leah’s Journal references in game dates along with months such as Ratham and Ostara. These months along with others have been referenced in other works as well. Are these names that are just thrown together for convenience or have you made an actual calendar for Sanctuary.

Matt: We haven’t made a calendar that we’ve published publicly. Micky mentioned the historians earlier. They kind of keep track of all these months and dates. They have their calendar for the world that we can draw on and use. So yeah I guess to answer the question we do have a calendar for Sanctuary. We haven’t really released that whole thing yet.

Twizz: I’ll tell you what, day one when it launches I’m buying it. Don’t be scared of that.

Neinball: It would be an interesting touch to add to the yearly Diablo calendars that you guys release.

Matt: Yeah that would be cool.

Neinball: Moving on to the next question. The Book of Tyrael has some sections where Tyrael was lamenting the fact that he wasn’t able to participate in the light song, the birthing of new angels. During this event are only new angels formed, or is this a point when dead ones resurrect, like when Tyrael was able to reform 20 years after the destruction of Mount Arreat. Do these angels just reform themselves at any particular point and time or are they only re-birthed during the light song as well?

Micky: My understanding, and Matt you can correct me if I’m wrong on this, but my understanding is that it’s.. The situation with Tyrael was a very unique situation. Where typically if an angel is destroyed, that’s it, they’re gone. Then new angels are formed. So with Tyrael it’s really really kind of interesting that he was able to reform and it’s kind of a momentous thing that you don’t see. And that doesn’t happen, I think, very often at all in the high heavens, if ever. I don’t think we’ve talked about it happening with anybody else. And I think that makes Tyrael even more special which I think is really cool. That whole concept is touched on a little bit more in Storm of Light as well.

Neinball: Okay, Really looking forward to it.

Micky: Something to really keep and eye out for there.

Neinball: So, I guess that’s one of the things that further separates the demons and the angels. Because we obviously seen through the short story Wrath, that you guys did prior to the launch of Diablo III, that the Prime Evils just will eventually come back over time. But that obviously doesn’t go for the Angiris Council as well.

Micky: Yeah and the Prime Evils, they’re destroyed on Sanctuary but their essence will go back to the burning hells and they’ll just kind of hang out there till they get a chance to pop back over to Sanctuary. Unless you destroy, what’s the name of the forge?

Matt: Oh the Anvil of Annihilation right?

Micky: Yeah, if you destroy the soulstone at the Anvil of Annihilation then supposedly they’re gone forever.

Matt: You never know!

Twizz: Weirder things have happened!

Neinball: The appendix, kind of the like the miscellaneous section for the Book of Tyrael, takes up almost half the entire book. And it was really surprising to see the sheer list and amount of the NPC’s and other minor characters through the series that appeared there. Though some of them kind of seem somewhat at random. Such as you had a Norrec Vizharan being listed but not Kara Nightshade from the Legacy of Blood, the first Diablo novel. You also included some other minor NPC’s like Pindleskin from Lord of Destruction. Was there a specific motive behind the ones that were included and the ones that weren’t? Or was it more or less just you kind of picked pieces and NPC’s that were important that you thought you wanted to touch on.

Matt: So during the development process… Well let me say first; For Book of Cain, when we were working on that we had lot of content and ultimately we had to cut some of it out. Just due to space constraints. We ended up putting a little bit of that in Book of Tyrael. But basically the same thing happened with Book of Tyrael. During the meetings we had, the development meetings, I remember having this huge list of all of these different characters that we can put in the back, in that Persons of Interest section. And you know, ultimately it just came down to, we didn’t have room for all of them. We kind of had to go through, whittle them down, cut some of them out. So that’s probably the biggest reason why some characters are in there and some aren’t. Another thing though is that there were certain characters that I noticed the fans wanted to know a little bit more about. Kind of like fan favorites and stuff like that. So we wanted to include some of those in there. Like Pindleskin is one example. I know a lot of people liked Pindleskin.

Neinball: Everyone knows Pindle Run

Twizz: Well, speaking of characters, I don’t know what kind of answer I’m going to get out of this. But who are Ardleon and Morbed? I don’t ever recall coming across them before in any of the other prior lore books

Micky: So I can speak to Morbed. Morbed is one to keep an eye out for. I can’t say too much other than he’s a really interesting character. There’s going to be a story associated with him and he has very unique abilities and kind of a character kit that I think is really awesome. I’m a little bit biased because I’m doing a lot of the writing for that. But definitely something to look out for. Morbed is an awesome character.

Matt: For Ardleon, one of the cool things about D3 was that there’s all the little side conversations where they mention a character from the past lore. Or even some of the legendary items they’ve had some flavor text that mentions certain characters. So Ardleon, I think if I remember correctly, he was mentioned in a conversation you could have with Tyrael. As just an angel that he had known in the past and had fought alongside.

Twizz: Okay

Neinball: So bringing them to the forefront and touching on any of the newly created characters in D3

Matt: Yeah, definitely

Neinball: Of course one of the big draws for coming up in the Reaper of Souls is the new class, the Crusaders. What exactly has been driving the Crusaders all these years? We know that their mission was to try and purge corruption from the Zakarum faith, but it seems that most of the order was sent out into the wilds beyond Kehjistan, outside of the influence of the church. Without any actual formal structure to their leadership, they’re all just kind of acting on their own. What was it that was driving them? What motivations did they have to continue this quest?

Matt: I think a big part of it was just that original, I think his name was Akkhan, the guy who basically created the order. When he sent them out I think part of it was probably that he chose the right guys, the right men and women, that really believe what he did. That there was this corruption at the heart of the Zakarum faith, that needed to be healed. Having chosen those paragon individuals he basically made it so that they would carry on that tradition to all their apprentices. That’s a big part, I think it’s just that you can see, we saw it in D2 that there is corruption in the church. Seeing that manifest on the world I think has really driven the Crusaders to continue that quest to search for a cure for it basically.

Neinball: So this was the original quest given by my masters masters master, 100 or 200 years ago and they just continued that on the entire time.

Matt: Yeah

Micky: They’re really kind of looking for the holy grail that’s going to purge the corruption. They don’t necessarily know what that’s going to be. It’s one of those things, they know they need to find it and they’re going to scour all of Sanctuary until they find whatever that thing is. Or it might be multiple things. But that’s really the goal. With the Crusaders we’re gonna keep exploring those concepts in the fiction.

Neinball: And that’s why they started headed East.

Micky: Right

Matt: Yeah

Twizz: Speaking of which, why is, I’m throwing this out there, why is East the most evilest of directions? Everyone seeking evil seems to head that direction. What did I miss, did I miss something here?

Matt: I don’t know. That’s a good question.

Twizz: Then there’s the change of pace. The Crusaders are now doing the unthinkable and they’re headed West. What’s pulling them back to the Western Kingdoms? Or did they just travel so far East that they ended up going West?

Matt: Well I think part of the reason they went East originally, it was a few things. One was there was some legends, I think, that Akarat, the guy who had basically created the Zakarum religion; there were some legends that he had last been seen going East. Maybe they thought in following in his path they would find something important. Another reason was, at the same time the Crusaders were founded, Rakkis was bringing his army West. So I think there was a little bit of, if we go West too we’re going to be kind of stepping on each others toes, and I think it was just convenient of them to start with East.

Micky: Nobody ever goes South.

Matt: Forget South, or North.

Twizz: Very awesome, you know what? Just like that we have eaten up 20 minutes of time. Gentlemen, this has not only been fun but highly educational. Everybody, if you’re listening to this or watching the video and you’re on the fence about making the purchase on the Book of Tyrael; I can tell you that the price you pay for it half of what it’s worth. The cover, the artwork, and just how beautiful the book is, it’s absolutely breathtaking. Micky, Matt, I can not thank you guys enough for taking time out of your schedules to talk to me about this. It’s just so appreciated and this was fun.

Micky: Well I definitely had a blast and I appreicate you guys having us on. Thank you very much.

Matt: Yeah this was great, thanks so much guys.

Neinball: Thank you for joining us.

Twizz: Yes, you are welcome back anytime. Also, make sure you guys are visiting MickyNeilson.com as well. Everything about Micky is up there and it’s very impressive, very cool website.

Matt: Everything about him, everything. He’s going to KMart tonight.

Twizz: The links for everything else is going to be in the show notes. That is going to do it for us here. So on behalf of BlizzPro and the TwizzCast crew, we encourage everyone to game safe, love one another, and please everyone within the sound of my voice, take care.