Over the last few weeks, it was brought to the attention of Aggie Confidential that the infamous Heaven’s Gate cult, the one that broke headlines in 1997 when the members committed the largest mass suicide in the United States, had a website at that time. That bit of trivia isn’t so odd since the internet does allow for a wider audience to be reached, but what did strike me as unusual was that the website was still active and hadn’t been revised since then. It even had an e-mail address listed to contact them, so I sent them a line after the curious nature within won me over. If I was surprised to see that the site had been maintained for over a decade, I was downright shocked when a unit of individuals that called themselves ‘Telah’ sent a response and agreed to an interview.

I say ‘unit of individuals’ because that was how the four of them were instructed to refer to themselves by their leader Do. A little background might be in order here; in 1975, a native Texan named Marshall Applewhite came to the conclusion that the same spiritual entity that found itself within Jesus Christ was now within him. With his wife Bonnie, he obtained almost one-hundred followers circa 1980. He taught them that the beings within himself and Bonnie wished to be known as Ti and Do, and then instructed them to abandon their human lives and loved ones. Over time, the members were taught which television shows to watch, how to behave, and some of them even accompanied Marshall Applewhite south of the border to endure surgical castrations. It turns out that what happens in Mexico, does literally stay in Mexico (especially when what happens involves having your testicles removed).

Before Marshall killed himself and instructed almost forty followers to do likewise, he told a few members to remain alive and answer those that wanted to know more about their beliefs. That’s how I found myself in conversation with the collective of individuals known as ‘Telah’. When asked about an interview and told that it would be for a Texas A&M arts and entertainment-based site, their approval came with an optimistic note that, “We don’t really need a larger voice in College Station but since you all took advantage of Lincoln’s Agricultural and Mechanical College Act only eleven years after the Civil War, you must be progressive, and open to a different point of view.” With an introduction like that, I knew I was about to have an interview that needed to be witnessed. Without additional hesitation, here is the first interview with Telah.

Aggie Confidential: How did you hear about Heaven’s Gate? Were you involved when Do and Ti were still in their vehicles [Interviewer’s Note: This is how Marshall and Bonnie referred to their human bodies]?

Telah: We joined the Group in 1975 when Ti and Do first started their mission on earth. They had a meeting in Waldport, Oregon and we met them then. Ti and Do served as our instructors till June, 1985 when Ti departed. Do them followed through till 1997. The Group named us Telah in 1996, so that is the name that we have kept.

AC: Concerning the use of ‘we’ and ‘us’, how many members of Heaven’s Gate am I currently speaking to? Who is considered to be the current instructor, and how many instructors (if any) have followed Ti and Do?

T: There are no current instructors. Ti and Do were it. Without them, there is no Group. There are a few of us left here on Earth.

AC: Is it a belief of Heaven’s Gate that Ti and Do have the ability to communicate with the members still here on Earth? Through what means could Ti and Do communicate? Have they used these means before, and how recently?

T: Yes, Ti and Do could communicate if they want to. Ti and Do only communicate through physical means. Either face-to-face or through advanced physical means. There are no spirits, telecommunication, telepathy, etc. We wouldn’t be able to tell you how recently they did that kind of communication.

AC: By face-to-face, is it fair to say that the belief of Heaven’s Gate is that Ti and Do have and do inhabit other bodies besides those identified as Marshall Applewhite and Bonnie Nettles? Also, what do you mean by ‘advanced physical means’?

T: Ti and Do can inhabit what every body they like, but they prefer their one Next Level body, instead of “slumming” it in the human body. A hundred years ago it was not possible for humans to conceive of sending out radio and TV waves into space. In the same way, the forms of communications the Next Level uses are up to them.

AC: Do you believe that the Next Level can be reached or felt through means other than those established by the instructors of Heaven’s Gate? For example, I’ve read some first-hand accounts of hallucinogenic substances (as well as spiritual experiences) that detail their contact with another dimension. Basically, are the teachings of Ti and Do the only way to reach this new understanding?

T: No, you cannot contact the Next Level through spiritual, transcendent or drug-induced means. All you connect with it the nasty static inside the confines of this planet’s atmosphere. It sounds good at times, even blessed and wise, but it is all cheap imitation to what the Next Level is about. Ti and Do are the only way OFF this planet.

AC: What was it that first convinced you that you needed to be involved with Heaven’s Gate?

T: When you meet Ti and Do, you realize that they are not from this planet. Their understanding finally provides the missing puzzle pieces that all world religions only point to.

AC: On meeting Ti and Do, what was it about meeting them that made you specifically (as an individual finger of the hand of Telah) realize that they were not of this planet? Have you felt that realization with anything or anyone else since the departure in 1997?

T: No, only Ti and Do were clearly not from this planet. No one else before or after. It was like you were in the presence of a higher kingdom level. It was undeniable.

AC: Do you all hold indvidual names in the group, or do you refer to each other as Telah even amongst yourselves? How many members are collectively recognized as Telah? Have you had new members since Do evacuated in 1997? What would be the initial steps to becoming a member now?

T: We use the names that Ti and Do gave us in the Group. There have been no new members since 1996. In March of 1997 there were about eight individuals left here. Now there are four since some have died natural deaths.

AC: Have you doubted your beliefs before? It isn’t my intent to be ‘devil’s advocate’, but it must be a struggle to maintain faith in a situation where your instructors left their vehicles almost two decades ago. What would you tell someone involved with Heaven’s Gate that did have doubts?

T: No, we have never had doubts. If someone had doubts, they could do what ever they deemed best. The Group had an open door policy. Individuals came and went from the Group all the time (from 1975 to 1997) depending on their beliefs or issues in their personal lives. We think the media portrayed a confined situation (against their will) which was not true. We are examples of that. No, there would be no attempts to reassure a member that has become skeptical. There is no reason to. Either it is part of your being or it is not. Your question implies that as time passes that people need to reassure or strengthen each other. You don’t understand, this isn’t a religion based on faith. It is a scientific theory that humans haven’t entertained yet. Humans are currently in the “flat Earth” part of their understanding of the caretakers of this universe. It will take time. It’s like asking us to reassure ourselves that the Earth is round when we have “doubts”.

AC: How does a Next Level form differ from that of human forms? When Ti and Do were within the bodies of Marshall and Bonnie, did either of them mention whether or not Marshall and Bonnie were the first human forms that they had taken? Have they taken a human form since the vehicles of Marshall and Bonnie were left behind?

T: Yes, the Next Level has space-capable bodies. Humans bodies cannot take prolonged space travel. The illustration of a Next Level member is on the website. Ti and Do have not returned in human, or any other form since 1997. Do did take on other bodies in the past such as Jesus, Moses, and one or two other teaching circumstances in the past history of man.

AC: What in your former lives have you willingly given up to be involved in Heaven’s Gate? What are some things that’d be different, if anything at all, between a regular day in your lives and that of someone that isn’t a member?

T: As a Group we chose to live a monastic life. If that meant that a monk would not have as much contact with the outside world, then we elected to have less contact. It’s always funny how the media frames a news angle (producer driven tags such as “Bad Mother”, “Corrupt VA” or “Brainwashed Cult”) when they want to heighten the conflict to increase viewers. Then they go to Nepal and frame a story on gentle monks persecuted by Chinese and speak of their ways as noble and ideal.

As far as TV shows, we didn’t want to watch excessively violent or sexual content. It was our choice. Ti and Do understood that thoughts in the brain can run wild without the discipline that comes from within one self. Does anyone really believe that unrestricted human thoughts and choices has lead to an ideal world or society?

One has to leave human ways when you enter the group. Addictions and vices have no part in a monastic environment. Not because you have to, but because you seek the company of others who want to. Things like smoking, drinking, sex and emotional issues like jealousy, envy, lust, greed or any other kind of self-centered activity would be left behind. Even the thoughts related to it.

Imagine living each day with no agenda, no attitudes, no negative thoughts and no defenses to make it through you life. It was a wonderful and meaningful existence.

AC: Now that Ti and Do have left their human forms for now, do you still adhere from relationships, television shows, and so on? What, to you personally, was the hardest human indulgence to leave behind?

T: We still follow the teachings. For us, the hardest things was feeling that our brain and body had to control each situation they came upon. Sometimes, it is just as good to get an assist in basketball instead of the dunk. For others, the sexual impulse was down the line from basic eating, breathing, and sleeping; but it can be a strong influence, unless your own private discipline reins it in.

AC: I had read that Do and some of his male followers were surgically castrated. Did any of the four within Telah pursue such a surgery for themselves, either alongside Do or otherwise? Is there anything in that vein that the females of Heaven’s Gate did?

T: One of the four almost did. Of the seven who did do that castration in Mexico, it wasn’t to control any activity, just the hormonal-based thoughts. No females did anything. Individuals demanded castration. This wasn’t from Do. He didn’t want it to happen. It was to control hormone-based thoughts, not actions or behaviors. This issue was very internal and no one, absolutely no one, would ever have a clue as to what was going on in someones thoughts. When two of his students did it, he had to try it because he felt they shouldn’t be put through it. When his was botched and all the complications of it were realized, he asked others to not do it. Four others went ahead with it and that made up the seven total. We heard from some that they felt lighter in thought.

AC: When Do and the other members evacuated in 1997, what was it that allowed his followers to ascend to the Next Level? Would anybody ascend that died during the time that HALE-BOPP was near Earth [Interviewer’s Note: The mass suicide in 1997 coincided with the HALE-BOPP comet as it neared Earth, since Marshall taught that there was a UFO that had trailed the comet that would allow them to ‘hitch a ride’]?

T: The Group knew in 1997 that the human body cannot take prolonged space travel and activity. The human body was designed to work on this planet. This means that that those particular individuals, and those individuals only, were going to get new space-capable bodies when they graduated off this planet. Since this had never happened before, on this planet, there was a question of shedding their bodies before or after they entered the craft. It would have caused no issue at all if they had done it after they boarded the craft. No one one this planet would have known anything about it. It was determined that this dramatic event was to happen to catch the attention of the world. Two thousand years ago there had been a crucifixion and resurrection to attract the attention of the world when Jesus went back to the Next Level with no graduates off this planet. This time there would be graduates and they wanted it to be noted. This act was a one time event only. Humans can find no consolation in suicide because they just reincarnate into their next life here on this planet to repeat the same lesson steps again. In this case, and in this one only, those individuals broke the cycle of reincarnation and their loss of bodies was just symbolic. They took on their new Next Level bodies (smaller, grey, large-set eyes, etc.) and joined other Members of that Kingdom to perform the tasks assigned to them, in the literal universe.

AC: What other steps were done by the Heaven’s Gate Away Team in preparation for their departure? The mass media mentioned a ‘boot camp’ of sorts, and while we’ve already mentioned buzzwords and the connotations they draw, was there anything similar to such an idea?

T: The Group carefully prepared their attire so that there would be a unified presentation to the public of who they were and the “band of brothers” mentality that made for the uniforms united dialogue. They paid all their bills, in full, including their taxes. All loose ends were tied up and when done, they enjoyed a few days of fun, visiting key locations, before they departed. There was no particular boot camp that was anything different than they normally did. They visited a Buddhist monastery outside of Las Vegas and did play slots on the side. They went to Sea World and to a bird sanctuary. They visited the place in Oregon that Ti and Do received their instructions, but we won’t be specific on that. No, we didn’t go but they gave us the connection to all of it. All of the Members of that Class were so special. There were none like them in the world.

AC: Did Ti or Do mention a sign or signal that might serve as an indication to their return to human bodies? Since the other four members have died since the departure in 1997, what does Heaven’s Gate say happened to them? What do you believe happens to the remaining four of you if none of you live to see Ti and Do return to human forms? If you do die before their return, will the time spent in this life in obedience to the instructions of Do benefit somehow?

T: There will be no signal that will be perceptible on the human level. If all die before they return, then we will just wait and reincarnate at the time that the Next Level will return. The time frames you are all referring to are just a blink of an eye to the Next Level. Any who want to join the next Group, whenever it is, will not be denied that opportunity.

AC: Is there anything in what Ti and Do taught that suggested other caretakers on the Next Level besides themselves? Not meant to sound like tomfoolery, but it feels like if there is two, there likely is more than two; and if Do has lived through Jesus and Marshall, maybe another caretaker lived through the Buddha or another through Plato.

T: There and many individuals in the Next Level. Many play different roles. It would take a while to get up to Do’s level to accomplish a task like that. Ti is above Do so she could do it but the vibrational difference cause too much problems as in her exiting early last time around [Interviewer’s Note: Bonnie Nettles died of natural causes a little over a decade before the mass suicide]. We do not know their names but others were sent down to push the civilization along. Moses, Enoch, Elisah all helped but were pulled back when humans could only go so far. We don’t know if others from the Next Level did this but usually the same individual is assigned to a planet and sticks to it. (remember the old saying, “I shall be with, yea, even until the end of the time”).

AC: Is there anything about Heaven’s Gate that you feel like I’m not understanding?

T: The simple belief is that there is a real, physical level above the humans one here on earth. It is not a spiritual existence. It is real individuals, in real bodies, in real crafts taking care of the issues of their planet. The Next Level, as it is called, created this planet and all the life on it. The Next Level are the care takers of not only this planet but all the systems of the universe. From that, all the other beliefs follow. They periodically come down to this planet to check in on this civilizations development. The last time they took a very close up observation, in human form, was from about 1974 to 1997. The time before that was two-thousand years ago. At those times, they talk to those interested about the opportunity of the Next Level and how a very select few can enter into it only after a long period of transition and instruction.

The time of discovery is coming soon. Scientists will not have to continue to hold some of their information in secret because the world will be prepared for the encounter. Society can only move so fast in not acting primitively to each “observable” visit. Once we know that humans will not destroy themselves in their own knee-jerk response to knowing that this planet isn’t the end all of the universe, then real study and theories can be put to the test.

AC: Do you expect that it will take another two-thousand years before Earth receives a vist from Ti and Do once more?

T: Could be, but we doubt it. The civilization is proceeding along more quickly now. The visitations will be more regular.

AC: You mentioned that Telah chooses to avoid material with too much sexual or violent content, and that is the same as most other families do in their own homes to some extent. Tell me about what forms of entertainment that you took enjoyment from before and which ones you still take enjoyment from today. What music did you enjoy before you became involved in Heaven’s Gate, and what now? How about the same for books? Movies and television? I know this seems shallow, but I feel like there is as much connection to be found in the mundane matters about ourselves as there is in our more complicated conundrums. Has there ever been work from some entertainment-based medium that you were interested in (with questionable themes or elements), but the desire to adhere to the discipline taught by Ti and Do won out?

T: Nature shows, news and information shows, game shows, Star Trek, Knight Rider, etc (shows that were basically light). It’s about the same now. Some appropriate light comedies and news shows. Survivor and things like that. Just watch a bit and do other things too. Mostly classical music, then and now. We liked James Taylor before and still do now. Books before the Group always dealt with spiritual journeys (Siddhartha, The Prophet, Vonnegut and Salinger). The Group had many philosophy books and some science fiction books. Nowadays, it is a lot of biographies.

On the movie issue, the Class liked Star Trek, Close Encounters, Star Wars, StarMan, etc). We are about the same way. Very few movies. Grand Budapest Hotel and things along that line. No fighting robots or comic book stuff, but the Class did see Superman. We watch Gravity recently and that was fine.

As far as the questionable, no Sopranos or Games of Thrones. No sexual or violent movies. We have had to watch a few movies we gave licensing rights to (in using the Group’s intellectual property or clips) and most were tame, but one pushed the edge too much.

AC: When Do was within Christ (according to Heaven’s Gate), he had to die to return to the Next Level and to leave a message for us to remember. When Do led the departure that happened in 1997, all the members of Heaven’s Gate had to die to enter the Next Level. Will that remain to be the final prerequisite to entering the Next Level or could Do take himself and others there without all of them allowing for or causing death to their human forms?

T: It was a one time demonstration. It shouldn’t be needed again. Probably next time that Group will board the craft, shed their human bodies and take on their new, Next Level bodies. Human bodies cannot take prolonged space travel. It would have been easier to have done that in 1997 but we wouldn’t be having this interview right now, would we?

AC: You mention that scientists have had to hold some discoveries secret for now since society isn’t ready to accept them, what do you feel like some of those discoveries are? Are there any scientific minds in particular that you feel are unable to tell what they really know?

T: We don’t get into conspiracy theories. Frankly they are boring. We do know that governments and some scientists have information about events that have happened. We do not know their specific names. When the world won’t go crazy if some information comes out, more will come out. It will probably take and upcoming encounter.

Part II of our discussion with Telah will be online soon, we’re still in the middle of conversation with Telah now. Until then, what are your thoughts and comments? What would you like us to ask in the upcoming second segment of the interview?