The first time I ever spoke to Tyler he had been sleeping on his Grandma's couch. These days he still sleeps on couches but he also designs them and he has a mansion and a trampoline and other things, too. This interview condenses several conversations that took place over the course of two days, during which Tyler was putting the finishing touches on Cherry Bomb and blasting PM Dawn in his BMW while mashing through LA traffic.

Andrew: Years ago you told me that Odd Future was first conceptualized as a zine. Is that what this is going to be?

Tyler: No, this is based around the album. I thought damn I should interview people because I'm good at it. I was watching Freaks & Geeks so I interviewed Seth Rogan. It was cool, I learned shit about Jews. I'm not gonna ask the questions that everybody else is asking. When I interviewed Nas [for XXL] niggas was mad that I didn't sit and talk about Illmatic for thirty minutes.

A: Well if I wanted to know about Illmatic there's no shortage of -

T: Information! There are forty fucking interviews about it. When I told him that God's Son and Streets Disciple was my favorite shit from him he was so confused.

A: That makes sense though, given your age. That was the Nas that kids of your generation grew up on.

T: Niggas be pretending though. You ask another 23 or 24 year old what their favorite albums are "aww Illmatic, Ready To Die, 36 Chambers, The Chronic..." I have a line on the album where I say In Search Of did more for me than Illmatic / that's when I realized we ain't cut from the same fabric."

-----

A: It seems like a lot of people of all ages are hardwired to only liking the records they're supposed to like these days.

T: That's what I'm saying. Like Death Grips is about to come out with new shit and I'm stoked. I hit my friend Ethan, the kid that put me on to them, and we talk and text about it. It feels good to share that moment with someone who's genuinely excited. Like Kendrick's coming out with a new album - that's cool, not trying to talk shit - but I feel like people aren't as excited as they make themselves out to be. The genuine feeling is so great and it sucks that people are kind of faking themselves into having fun. I hate that shit. One thing you will know about me - I hate posers. I hate liars, I don't like people who aren't a hundred percent true to themselves.

Want to listen to some songs on this shitty sound system? I'll just play the album so far. It's not mixed or nothing. [Plays music at a punishing volume] That's the feeling I want from that one, where you're barely able to hear it. Like if that was loud you would not be able to hear shit. But the mixed ones sound cool. I mix them all the way up to how I want them then when I send them to the mixer I'm like "yo just make it sound listenable from what I gave you" and I keep sending notes.

A: I remember you saying that you didn't like the mix on Wolf.

T: Yeah like on "Cowboy," that fucking bass hit, I wanted it to distort just like "Buoooonnng." Okay you know that song "Diaper" I randomly released? It was a minute long and everyone's complaining about how poorly it's mixed but no... it's perfect. It's how I want it. I want you to hear it like that. I want that bass to sound like a fucking elephant. This one is supposed to just "bluuuuuhhh." I want shit to distort so you don't hear what I'm saying. Fuck what I'm saying, I'm not no fucking deep intricate poet. It's the whole vibe, it's the whole world of that song. That's what's wrong with music today. It doesn't really give you much feeling.

A: I feel like that's all we've been talking about - this is what's wrong with music. In the interest of not being negative about everything who else besides Death Grips is doing cool creative shit to you?

T: New or old?

A: New.

T: Uh. I could say Kanye. Or do you mean someone newer?

A: Someone from your generation.

T: [Sighs]

A: Damn.

T: I think Toro y Moi is awesome, Kali Uchis is cool. Um. I appreciate Jaden and Willow a lot. It sucks because from the internet you might think they're some douchy little fucks who think too much but if you were actually with them you'd be like damn. They're interested in things, they want to learn. He was building pyramids in his house.

A: Pyramids? Out of what?

T: Like... shit... he rich as fuck.

A: So actual stone pyramids?

T: Yeah. I remember he said he hated math but now he's trying to learn it to do his pyramids. I think that's cool. I fucking hate math and I never understood it but I would love to find something that I liked, that I need math to do, then go back and try to figure out math.

A: But music is math.

T: Is it?

A: Yeah, scales and quarter notes and all of that.

T: See I'm so bad at that but I'm teaching myself the basics. I've always wanted to learn music and no one taught me so I just learned by ear. Now when I'm at the piano and there's no camera around I want to be able to write these chords down so I can play them later. I like learning. When I get jewelry made - most rappers just go and buy whatever jewelry's right there - but I was like no I want to know what different stones are. What is sapphire? What is ruby? What is coral? At one point you could only find sapphire in Sri Lanka but in '96 they found a mine in Madagascar. I'm studying stones and the health benefits and the soul.

A: Oh you're gonna go all New Age.

T: I'm gonna be weird at 30, dog. I want a garden.

A: Having a garden is not very weird for a 30-year-old.

T: It's not. But that's where my heads at. I want a lot of pink flowers. [Opens notebook full of drawings] Like these are ways that I want to redo my house and shit. My fucking bed's gonna float. I want to be an architect. That's gonna happen. It's gonna be tight. Then I'm gonna get rich as fuck and spend the money on parks and gardens in LA. I like parks. I think people really need grass and trees.

[Flips pages] That's a real couch in my room right now. [Flips again] That shirt is the shirt that you see on the album cover, that's a real Go Kart. I gotta piss. Do you want to have sex?

A: Yeah when you come back.

...

T: Yeah I never thought of it like that until people started saying that. I was always a clear vision person. Like [flips to drawing of a car] I don't have this car yet. That's a Mclaren 12C MP4. I'm getting that car in the next two months. That's a goal that I set for myself in my own head. I am so determined to get this fucking car and I keep putting it in the universe. All my friends know I'm getting that car. I have a fucking song where I talk about it like I have it right now. I know I am gonna get it and I'm working my ass off to make sure I get it. I've been in this fucking studio for three weeks in a row. Today because we couldn't get the studio until 3 that was the only free time I've really had in a while. I gotta get this album done because it has to come out during this time, it's the perfect time for it so I can fucking get that shit. I want that car so bad that you don't even fucking know.

A: Do you worry that there's gonna come a time in your life where you're not going to be able to make your every goal a reality?

T: No. I mean I'm logical enough to know that's possible but I just think I'm gonna have a fucking amazing life. Forever. Why even entertain that shit? "Yo nigga what if I was broke tomorrow? I'd probably kill myself!" That's fun to joke about but [pulls out chains from backpack] let me entertain the thought that I'm gonna make this shit bigger. They're heavy, I want to make them heavier.

You can't let fear of failure dictate shit. I don't have a Plan B, dog. My Plan A has always worked. I feel like if you have a Plan B you a bitch. You didn't try hard enough for your Plan A to work. [Pauses] That's fucked up! Shit doesn't always work out. I'm just saying fuck Plan B, nigga. Believe and work to make that Plan A go through. Figure it out, find your wings.

Even at 15 years old my Plan A was the same. You could go onto youtube.com/bloxhead and see videos of me and Jasper in front of our apartments like "this is gonna be on adult fuckin swim." I could show you a fake album cover I made when I was 15 saying "featuring Pharrell, Kanye West, Herbie Hancock." The At Your Own Risk album and now that shit is fucking real. I talked to Roy Ayers on the phone yesterday morning my nigga!

T: What did you guys talk about?

A: I played him the record and he called me and was like "Yo the changes are crazy." I study his chord changes! So for him - an old dude who can play any damn instrument and has worked with everybody - to tell me that!? Oh man.

Dude I'm so fucking happy. Look at what I'm wearing! [Points at a pair of bright green shorts that look to be cut off from hospital scrubs] I look like a gay nurse. A stylish gay nurse that just got off work. You see how the fuck I drive, man. I'm living happily ever after. There's no personal songs on the record where I'm talking about what's wrong with my life at all. The only thing that's sad is the fact that my mansion is empty. My sister lives in Utah, my mom's always in Sacramento and I'm always sleeping on a friend's couch out here. I went home the other day to grab something and I walk in the fucking house and it's no one home. It's six rooms, no one there. That bummed me out so bad. Oh and my bed is too soft. Those are my only complaints. What the fuck? I had a mental breakdown like four months ago for a couple hours. I was sitting there just fully losing my mind.

T: I was too happy! I know it sounds crazy but I was sitting there at 2 in the morning thinking about how my life is too good right now. I can buy anything I want, I can wake up and do whatever I want. I was like okay something bad has to happen. Someone is gonna die soon, I'm gonna break an arm. I wasn't sad, I think I was panicking.

The only people I talked to about it was Thebe and Andre 3000. Andre was just like [in an Andre voice] "hey man that's just how it goes man you just in a good spot." Then I talked to Thebe about it and whoa... did he go left field. I remember texting him like "life is cool but the fucking cameras, I don't know if people like me or they just want a photo for me for their instagram. am i a pawn? am i just an object that they use me for? when they ask me for photos do they actually give a fuck about Tyler? Or do they just want a couple likes? Is it just like taking a picture next to a car for them?" I forget what he said but he got so weird about it. That made me snap out of it like "Yo Thebe dog, are you okay?"

Fuck, working on an album sucks!

A: Yeah?

T: No. Just finishing it. I don't really want to make new shit because I want to focus on that. I don't know what to do. Out of everything you've heard what stood out to you?

A: I liked that one grimy rock track.

T: Oh that fucking Death [indecipherable ?? - I think this is a song title?] shit.

A: It's cool to hear a fusion of rock and hip hop that actually makes sense, most people who've tried that in the past have just made awful tacky music.

T: That's the thing I don't think that those people who make those songs have an appreciation for rock or punk or whatever. My niggas are punk kids. This is some hardcore kid shit. My fucking punk friends dye their hair blond and wear short shorts and go to punk shows. That's shit that I know. And I didn't even know I knew it. It's just you're a product of what you're around. So me liking that shit kinda makes it less corny. That's actually what I know.

We would always get compared to punk stuff when we first came out and I didn't understand it. But I guess it's the energy that reminded people of punk shows. Now everybody want to fucking mosh pit and stage dive. Get the fuck out of here, you're rapping about fashion. You're not angry. That was my natural energy, that's actually who I am. Highly energetic and annoying. So when I see niggas try to wild out and jump in the crowd and get crazy it's forced to me and it annoys me. And that goes back to me hating frauds.

A: How do you even manage to exist in the hip hop world while hating frauds?

T: It's easy to exist. I don't fuck with nobody. I fuck with Schoolboy Q, he's cool. I fuck with P but he's a legend. I fuck with Wayne. I talk to Ye here and there and I talk to Andre. Other than that, other than guys who influenced me and Schoolboy Q, I don't really fuck with [rap] people. My immediate friends don't make music. The people I am tight with who make music are kids who play guitar and shit like that. I'm not at these niggas little parties taking pictures like "Aye I'm here with my bro @soandso." We do our shit. I skate down the streets still. I'm excited to finish the album so I can get Mario Party 10. I enjoy the cookies at the studio. It's easy to live in a world with these dudes because I don't even associate with them.

A: It does seem like you guys were a real breaking point for how people digest rap music in general, especially on the internet. Like the hype cycle accelerated so much in your wake.

T: Yeah. I have friends who'll be like "if it wasn't for OF taking off a lot of niggas wouldn't have deals." I never thought of it that way. We was just doing us man and nothing's changed. I make songs for myself still. I tell the label when I'm putting my video out and when I'm shooting. I upload my shit and tell them what date. I tell them I want five covers. Nothing's changed. 100% creative control. It's just more resources. I still operate in the same way almost. It's just that all my ideas are now easier to get out. I can now really go make a couch or make air fresheners. Like "I want to make air fresheners that smell like Bath & Body Works that my mom used to get back in 2003" because it's a comforting smell to me. And I literally made it. [Points at air freshener hanging from his rear view mirror].

A: I'm disappointed that the OF shop is closed, I never had a chance to see it.

T: That was home base. But some weird shit happened with the guy leasing it for us. I miss that spot. We'd be on that block all day. That shit being closed kills me. We can go open up another store but that was just a safe zone. I'm safe on that block. I met a lot of friends [on Fairfax]. Travis, Thebe. Me and Jasper would go over there. There's a whole legion of younger kids like 15 or 16 that would hang around there so we like their big homies or whatever. That was a hangout spot for them and it was good because it would kind of keep them out of trouble.

A: Do you feel like a mentor to these kids?

T: We've all got little homies. You learn stuff from [them too]. Like I said I didn't know shit about Death Grips until that kid put me on Death Grips. And because of that you have certain songs on this album. It's cool learning stuff. It's so much we don't know. [Points at air freshener again] Like what is this?

A: An -

T: You'll say air freshener, right? Yeah of course you would. But what the fuck is this?! What are we? What is earth? We don't know anything!

A: I try to stay anchored to the logic of an air freshener being an air freshener because otherwise I'll go down a dark path.

T: But I like going down it. My imagination loves running free. Look at this [pulls out a copy of Transworld magazine]. Na-kel got a cover. I would always tell him "you can do anything you want, you just gotta figure it out." If you want a car door as an arm you can have that. You just have to figure it out. He was one of the few that listened and now he has a cover. When I saw that my eyes started watering up. I used to keep a picture of that McLaren in my pocket all through January. But it fell out. [Turns up a track from Snoop Dogg's new album] Oh my god I love music so much! Dude I just wish there was more music.