I conducted these interviews April 3, the first day that a small-business portion of the $2 trillion CARES Act went “live.”

The Paycheck Protection Program allocated $349 billion for two-year loans to small businesses, defined as under 500 employees. Employers who maintain payroll numbers through the upcoming eight weeks and who use the loan proceeds to pay for payroll — as well as, in a limited way, for mortgage interest, rent and utilities — may have their loans forgiven.

Seemingly every shut-down bar and restaurant owner, in addition to myriad other small-business owners, hopes to access the PPP.

Participating banks started accepting applications April 3, although many banks indicated that they would limit their application support to existing customers only. Nonbanked or underbanked businesses have had few avenues for submitting an application for the PPP.

Independent contractors or self-employed individuals could have first applied for PPP funds beginning last Friday.

The first owners: Damien and Lisa Watel, married, co-owners of Bistr09 at 6106 Broadway. Lisa closed Bite, a restaurant on South Presa, in January.

On closing Bite, just prior to the COVID epidemic:

Lisa: We made the hard decision to close Bite when a new landlord took over the entire building, canceled everyone’s leases and indicated he would raise rents. The hardship of the restaurant business is pretty specific. The more sophisticated your menu, the harder it will be to stay in business.

On their business now:

Damien: Currently, we do takeout and curbside. That represents about 10 percent of the business we normally do. The margins of a restaurant being about 6 to 8 percent. That means we operate at a large loss right now.

The rent is just going to accrue. Same with utilities. If I can make something from this, it’s money I didn’t have yesterday. I figure I’m better off with the extra $1,000.

We haven’t fired everybody. We’re just working people with very low hours.

We applied this morning (for a PPP loan). And my employees are better off staying on the payroll, as the government says they will be covering it.

On the PPP, and why it is not enough:

Lisa: For us in the restaurant community, it’s been a blow. As it is, 25 percent of us will not reopen. If people have been around for 20 years, maybe, but if you’re a startup, you’re wiped out with this. It’s a tough deal.

Damien: You can only borrow 2.5 times payroll. But you have to pay 90 percent of the previous payroll for all employees. So you would be paying out all of the money, but not rent. That will run out after 2.5 pay periods, so the covered period is only through June 30.

Do I pay the employees, or do I pay the rent? Because (with PPP) they are not letting us pay more than the payroll. I don’t know how to figure that out.

I think we are going to get (a PPP loan), and I think the employees are better off staying with us (than going on unemployment). But the worry is after (June 30). Unless the government comes out with a second package, what comes after is worse than this. It’s a deep recession if it stays as is. A majority of small businesses won’t be able to sustain this.

If they loosen up another trillion dollars, it is more debt, but is that better than 20 million businesses closing? We expect if we’re opening sometime in May, we’re open minus $100,000 from where we were in March, when we open the doors. This stimulus will only work if they have a second one. It will be a waste of time doing this, for the same thing happening three weeks from now.

Another week of this will be pretty tough. A number of big decisions will be made by all small businesses. Every day that passes will be another blow. Three weeks will be too late.

The second owner: Rob Martindale, owner of Big Hops Beer, at 226 Bitters and 11224 Huebner. Martindale franchises Big Hops Beer to a third location, 7915 W. Loop 1604.

On the impact of COVID-19 on Big Hops:

We were two weeks from starting construction on two new franchise locations, with bank approval and everything for the build-out. The SBA lender notified us Monday (March 30th) that these would be put on immediate hold for at least six months. 2020 started out looking amazing for us, a game-changer for Big Hops. I had plans in 2020 to have five locations open, and then another five locations in 2021.

On the decision to not do takeout service and to lay off all employees:

Ninety-six percent of our business is on-premise. We’re just a bar. There’s a small amount of to-go, filling growlers and crowlers. With it being that small amount of our business, that would not sustain business. We do not serve food, so I had to close. I decided we would not make enough money to be profitable, or to sustain employees. I think we would all be worse off, and I would be digging further into a hole. Plus, employees would not be able to sustain themselves versus unemployment payments. I decided it’s better off for the business and the staff if we all hunker down.

On discussions with landlords:

I have two, at the two locations I operate. Both are excited for me to get relief from the government, and they are still hoping I’ll be able to pay it. One of my landlords — I have to give them credit — contacted me within two days of me being shut down to offer a break on rent for April. But he asked me to keep it confidential, as this was only being offered to tenants on a case-by-case basis.

On applying for PPP:

As of the morning of April 3, despite the national press conference the night before (with Treasury Secretary Steve Mnuchin and President Donald Trump), banks didn’t have enough information. I’ve filled out the paperwork.

At midday, my banker (at Broadway bank) just emailed me an update with word that “we can accept the application.”

On employees filing for unemployment, versus going back on payroll:

I have five employees at each of my two locations, plus five at the (separately owned) franchise for a total of 15 as part of the Big Hops family.

We have to figure it out. I think my employees are better off not going back on regular payroll. It’s very fluid. Employees have to report cash tips. Our payroll reports credit card tips, but the employee individually declares cash tips. Now that’s a tricky thing, obviously. In unemployment, you get a percentage of previous payments. (As tipped employees), they have a $2.13-per-hour minimum wage. Servers’ weekly payroll for 25 hours then amounts to about $50 for a weekly payroll, which is enough to maybe only cover the taxes.

My employees are going to fall into this category (of tipped employees). The entire industry falls into that category. That’s why I don’t know exactly what we’re going to do next. Ideally, I would (put them back on payroll), if it was good for them. And then find them projects while the bar is shut. But it may not be worthwhile.

I’m excited about when we do get back to work. My employees have been unemployed for two weeks. I communicated with them to file (for unemployment) immediately. They haven’t received a first check yet, I know that.

The third owner: Denise Aguirre, co-owner with her husband of the Point at 24199 Boerne Stage Road in Leon Springs. They are also partners in a co-located coffee roaster on premises called Just the Drip SA as well as partners in Dignowity Meats at 1701 E. Houston St.

On staying open for to-go orders:

Even if I make a couple hundred dollars per day, that’s something, and we’re trying to help staff members. The money we’re making every day is helping them with groceries.

We’re not paying ourselves, but we still are using the same electricity, and I can still pay the water bill. We’ve already suspended a lot of services, like the dumpster service. I’ve had a very hard time wondering, do I continue to do this? If I had to pay somebody else to do the to-go service, it wouldn’t be worth it.

On discussions with the landlord, and being a landlord:

I think the biggest thing weighing on us is our rent. Our landlord wasn’t particularly helpful.

And each of our three businesses has the same landlord. We’ve been with him for many, many years. He’s been a really good landlord. He’s always tried to help us when we needed help. The first year, when we started the project in 2010, he didn’t charge us rent.

I came to him recently with, “I want to pay you. I just don’t know how right now.”

I’m worried. If he decides to evict us, that’s a business decision that he could make.

At the Dignowity Meats location, he responded to our partner along the lines of “You could do delivery, and orders to go.” That was disappointing, because it showed he didn’t understand the full situation.

We also charge rent to our resident food trucks (at the Point) because they’re paying for space, and we have three on a semi-permanent basis. The food trucks have said, “We can’t afford to pay you,” and we’ve said, “I wouldn’t even think of charging you.”

On applications for PPP loans:

I don’t even know what I applied for, to be honest. I think it was the rent and payroll loan. … We did the application, we got a confirmation number, and they said, “We’ll contact you.”

On employee layoffs:

We have four part-timers. Two of them are students, and one is an 18-year-old, and she’ll bounce back. Another one works for a school district full time. But at Dignowity Meats, (our partner) had to lay off his people there. There is the unemployment process, which people need to take advantage of.

Michael Taylor is a columnist for the San Antonio Express-News and author of “The Financial Rules for New College Graduates.”

michael@michaelthesmartmoney.com | twitter.com/michael_taylor