On the fourth day of public impeachment hearings, Gordon Sondland, the U.S. ambassador to the European Union, took questions from the ranking members of the intelligence committee and their lawyers. Sondland testified that the arrangement Trump was pushing for was a quid pro quo .

Trump wanted investigations into his political rivals in exchange for granting the Ukrainian president a White House visit. The FiveThirtyEight Politics podcast is reacting to the impeachment hearings as they happen, and in this installment, the crew discusses Sondland’s testimony and the arguments both Democrats and Republicans pursued.

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FiveThirtyEight Politics Podcast: Sondland Ties Trump, Top Officials To Quid Pro Quo