Ellen Pao cross-examination leads to visible cringing

Elizabeth Weise | USA TODAY

SAN FRANCISCO — Ellen Pao took the stand to answer questions from Kleiner Perkins' lead attorney Tuesday afternoon, facing a packed courtroom and questions over her relationship with a married partner whom she is accusing of retaliating against her when their affair ended.

Pao is suing the venture capital firm for $16 million in a sex bias trial that has the full attention of Silicon Valley.

She claims she was passed over for a promotion to the lucrative position of senior partner because she was a woman, and is owed lost compensation.

She also claims that after her relationship with Ajit Nazre ended, he retaliated against her for years, undermining her ability to work while the firm did nothing.

The questioning by Lynne Hermle, the lead lawyer for Kleiner, was pointed and at times excruciating.

Hermle is known as a formidable adversary who's both aggressive and charming. True to this reputation, the initial volley of questions put to Pao were cutting — and made with a smile.

Some in the courtroom visibly cringed when questions about when Pao began having sex with Nazre were discussed.

"You don't have any recollection of what he said to you, or you to him, that led to your having sex?" Hermle asked her.

"I don't," Pao responded.

Things did not begin well between Pao and Nazre.



In February of 2006, the two were on a business trip in Germany when Pao was hit by a taxi.

As she was sitting, dazed, Nazre touched her inappropriately, Pao testified.

Hermle countered, "When Mr. Nazre went to touch you, you didn't say no."

"No," Pao replied. "I had just been hit by a cab and I couldn't move."



Four months later, the two began a relationship.

In previous testimony, others have said Pao felt pressured into it. The affair ended when Pao found out Nazre had in fact not left his wife, as he had told her he had.

Though Hermle spent time questioning Pao about sex, she began by talking about money. If Kleiner can establish that Pao didn't face that substantial a pay cut when she left the firm, her case is less strong.

Hermle asked Pao to confirm her cash salary at Reddit, the news aggregation site where Pao is interim CEO. Answer: $250,000 plus stock options.

Previously, she had testified that her base salary at Kleiner was $400,000 per year plus bonuses and investment profits.

Hermle then questioned her about how the suit was leaked to the press and her suitability for the job.

'LONG JOURNEY'

In a soliloquy of sorts, Pao earlier in the day had ended her testimony under questioning by her lawyer by saying, "It's been a long journey."

"There should be equal opportunity for women and men to be venture capitalists," she said from the stand.

As a person who wanted to be a venture capitalist but wasn't able to because of what she's called gender bias and retaliation at the powerful firm, she wanted to make sure that in the future, opportunities were available to others.

"And, I wanted to make sure my story was told," she said.

During the morning's testimony, she said she asked for $10 million when she began exit discussions with Kleiner because it is a "meaningful number" that would show the venture capital firm that it is more painful to avoid problems than to fix them.

An eight-figure settlement "would actually hit their radar." Her hope was to create an even playing field for women at the firm, she said.

Pao began her second day on the stand Tuesday, continuing her account of the almost seven years she spent at Kleiner Perkins Caufield & Byers as she was questioned by her lawyer, Therese Lawless.

She told her version of several stories that feature in this gender discrimination and retaliation case, whose outcome could change how the tech industry deals with women.

They included raunchy talk on a private plane trip to New York, women being relegated to the back of the room at a high-level computer security meeting and stories about Nazre.

'FEMALE CHIP ON HER SHOULDER'

The trial, now entering its 11th day, has featured a seesaw of impressions, each incident portrayed first one way and then another.

On Monday, just how differently two sides could view the same thing was made clear during testimony by investigator Stephen Hirschfeld, whom Kleiner hired to investigate Pao's claims of bias and retaliation.

Earlier in the trial, Kleiner senior partner John Doerr had been quoted as saying that Pao had "a female chip on her shoulder."

"Normally, you might take that to mean that someone is constantly perceiving gender-based affronts where they don't exist," said Jason Knott, an employment lawyer in Washington, D.C.

However in his testimony Monday, Hirschfeld reframed the meaning of the phrase.

"Female chip on the shoulder, in this context, means this was a women, Ellen Pao, who seemed to always blame other people for the demise of her relationships — in other words, it was always someone else's fault."

HIRSCHFELD WANTED JOB AT KLEINER

An interesting revelation about a potential conflict of interest in one of the trial's key players came to light Tuesday.

Pao testified that Hirschfeld asked about a job at Kleiner during his investigation.

He is a lawyer and employment investigator. He was hired by Kleiner in late 2011 to investigate complaints by junior partner Trae Vassallo that she had been subject to inappropriate sexual advances by another partner, Nazre.

His finding in the Vassallo investigation was that she had, indeed, been subject to unwanted sexual advances.

After he completed the Vassallo investigation, Hirschfeld was asked to return to conduct a second investigation into whether Pao had been discriminated against or treated differently than male partners.

Pao testified on Tuesday that while he was investigating her complaints, he interviewed Susan Biglieri, Kleiner's chief financial officer.

Pao said that Biglieri told her that during the interview, Hirschfeld told her that when he was done with the investigation he wanted to work for Kleiner and that he would like to be the firm's human resources lawyer.

When Hirschfeld completed his investigation into Pao's allegations, he concluded that she had not been discriminated against or treated differently than male partners.

MORE ON THE PAO-KLEINER PERKINS TRIAL

March 9:Ellen Pao begins testimony in Silicon Valley sex bias trial

March 6: Mary Meeker quotes cap second week of Ellen Pao trial

March 5: Ellen Pao trial takes a raunchy turn

March 4: Kleiner bigwig takes heat over tape

March 3: John Doerr testifies at trial brought by ex-mentee Pao

March 2: Man Ellen Pao accused of retaliation had bonus docked

Feb 27: Little 'upward mobility' in venture capital

Feb 26: Ellen Pao could have made $2.6 mln as a senior partner

Feb 25: Pao case presents dueling views of opportunity

Feb 24: Ellen Pao lawyer says KP 'not a level playing field'