JavaNomad



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MemberActivity: 96Merit: 10 SERIOUSLY? Bitcoin Singapore 2013 - NOT What I Expected (Or Hoped For) November 20, 2013, 01:39:28 PM #1



As someone who has used / exploited technology to live where and how I want for most of my adult life - the arrival of bitcoin was the most promising piece in the "finding freedom" puzzle I have been working on solving. (Still trying to to test and it live every day of my life.)



With this is mind - I was looking forward to an exciting day with fellow free-thinkers, crypto-anarchists, futurists, PTers, libertarians and other related types.



People who would be discussing how bitcoin was going to make the world a freer place.

People who were interested in data privacy and operating off the grid.

People who develop bitcoin products and services that make trading goods easier between producers and consumers around the world.

Maybe even some people selling THINGS for bitcoin.

I was so excited - here was a chance to have a whole day with "my" kind of people.



But that's NOT what happened.



Instead, I ended up in a room with around 200 mostly suit-and-tie people who apparently were only interested in finding out how to "invest" in Bitcoin in order to make a profit from it in their chosen fiat currency.



That's right - just traditional central-bank-worshipping-fiat-addicted investors who could give a rats ass about what (in my mind) Bitcoin is REALLY about.



And to top it off - most of the presenters were just those involved with Bitcoin to fiat exchanges, bitcoin wallets, and "consulting" type services to help you deal with upcoming financial regulations for bitcoin by the current powers that be.



During the first 7 hours of the day - there was only ONE single presentation about what bitcoin could actually be USED for (BitTunes). Otherwise no mention of what is actually bought or sold with it, no mention of businesses accepting it as payment. Nothing like that at all. And the phrase "Silk Road" never came up once.



I sat through 7 hours straight of - "why you should invest in bitcoin and bitcoin (trading) startups, so you can make more fiat and how to get the regulators on your side".



In fact, it wasn't until the final two panel discussions before there was even a single mention of ANYTHING related to privacy, free-trade, free-markets and futurism. Many had left by then.



Fortunately, those last two panels were awesome - and made the rest of the day worthwhile.



I got to listen to, meet and even have brief chats with:



Tomas Forgac - He made the first and only mention of Austrian economics during the entire day. Maybe 6 of us clapped.



Roger Ver - I had no idea who he was when I first heard him speak. I now list him as a top defender of bitcoin's true potential.



Edan Yago - Who inspired me with his talk on the free city projects including the current revised efforts in Honduras.



Hakim Mamomi - who helped make this conference happen. I had the pleasure of sharing coffee with him the day after the conference as well and listening to his thoughts on how technology could be used to promote direct democracy and increase freedom and standards of living the world over.



- Another panel speaker, who's name I didn't catch, who explained future visions of sentient programs running in the blockchain. Mind-blowing.



Simon Edhouse - From Bittunes - again, the ONLY person I met there who was developing an online platform for bitcoin that was being used to actually SELL something (music).



David Moskowitz - who did a great job moderating the panel discussions.





In summary, if I had only attended the first 7 hours of Bitcoin Singapore, I would have come away no idea why bitcoin is useful and what its future potential held, beyond being something I could "invest" some of my fiat in.





Now, I'm back hiding in the jungles of Indonesia and my one question is...



"Where and when do my bitcoin people get together in person and discuss and work on developing the meaningful stuff?"



Where are you? When are you there?



Please let me know - I'm doing what I can on my own - but damn it's lonely.



Java Nomad

The Roast Station Project









Last week, I took a break from roasting coffee in the jungles of Bali for the Roast Station Project to fly into Singapore and attend the Bitcoin Conference.As someone who has used / exploited technology to live where and how I want for most of my adult life - the arrival of bitcoin was the most promising piece in the "finding freedom" puzzle I have been working on solving. (Still trying to to test and it live every day of my life.)With this is mind - I was looking forward to an exciting day with fellow free-thinkers, crypto-anarchists, futurists, PTers, libertarians and other related types.I was so excited - here was a chance to have a whole day with "my" kind of people.Instead, I ended up in a room with around 200 mostly suit-and-tie people who apparently were only interested in finding out how to "invest" in Bitcoin in order to make a profit from it in their chosen fiat currency.That's right - just traditional central-bank-worshipping-fiat-addicted investors who could give a rats ass about what (in my mind) Bitcoin is REALLY about.And to top it off - most of the presenters were just those involved with Bitcoin to fiat exchanges, bitcoin wallets, and "consulting" type services to help you deal with upcoming financial regulations for bitcoin by the current powers that be.During the first 7 hours of the day - there was only ONE single presentation about what bitcoin could actually be USED for (BitTunes). Otherwise no mention of what is actually bought or sold with it, no mention of businesses accepting it as payment. Nothing like that at all. And the phrase "Silk Road" never came up once.I sat through 7 hours straight of - "".In fact, it wasn't until the final two panel discussions before there was even a single mention of ANYTHING related to privacy, free-trade, free-markets and futurism. Many had left by then.Fortunately, those last two panels were awesome - and made the rest of the day worthwhile.I got to listen to, meet and even have brief chats with:- He made the first and only mention of Austrian economics during the entire day. Maybe 6 of us clapped.- I had no idea who he was when I first heard him speak. I now list him as a top defender of bitcoin's true potential.- Who inspired me with his talk on the free city projects including the current revised efforts in Honduras.- who helped make this conference happen. I had the pleasure of sharing coffee with him the day after the conference as well and listening to his thoughts on how technology could be used to promote direct democracy and increase freedom and standards of living the world over.- Another panel speaker, who's name I didn't catch, who explained future visions of sentient programs running in the blockchain. Mind-blowing.- From Bittunes - again, the ONLY person I met there who was developing an online platform for bitcoin that was being used to actually SELL something (music).- who did a great job moderating the panel discussions.In summary, if I had only attended the first 7 hours of Bitcoin Singapore, I would have come away no idea why bitcoin is useful and what its future potential held, beyond being something I could "invest" some of my fiat in.Now, I'm back hiding in the jungles of Indonesia and my one question is...Where are you? When are you there?Please let me know - I'm doing what I can on my own - but damn it's lonely.Java NomadThe Roast Station Project http://CoffeeCoin.io Blockchain Efficiency For The Specialty Coffee Trade

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Hero MemberActivity: 775Merit: 1000 Re: SERIOUSLY? Bitcoin Singapore 2013 - NOT What I Expected (Or Hoped For) November 20, 2013, 03:26:42 PM #2 Quote from: JavaNomad on November 20, 2013, 01:39:28 PM



As someone who has used / exploited technology to live where and how I want for most of my adult life - the arrival of bitcoin was the most promising piece in the "finding freedom" puzzle I have been working on solving. (Still trying to to test and it live every day of my life.)



With this is mind - I was looking forward to an exciting day with fellow free-thinkers, crypto-anarchists, futurists, PTers, libertarians and other related types.



People who would be discussing how bitcoin was going to make the world a freer place.

People who were interested in data privacy and operating off the grid.

People who develop bitcoin products and services that make trading goods easier between producers and consumers around the world.

Maybe even some people selling THINGS for bitcoin.

I was so excited - here was a chance to have a whole day with "my" kind of people.



But that's NOT what happened.



Instead, I ended up in a room with around 200 mostly suit-and-tie people who apparently were only interested in finding out how to "invest" in Bitcoin in order to make a profit from it in their chosen fiat currency.



That's right - just traditional central-bank-worshipping-fiat-addicted investors who could give a rats ass about what (in my mind) Bitcoin is REALLY about. Last week, I took a break from roasting coffee in the jungles of Bali for the Roast Station Project to fly into Singapore and attend the Bitcoin Conference.As someone who has used / exploited technology to live where and how I want for most of my adult life - the arrival of bitcoin was the most promising piece in the "finding freedom" puzzle I have been working on solving. (Still trying to to test and it live every day of my life.)With this is mind - I was looking forward to an exciting day with fellow free-thinkers, crypto-anarchists, futurists, PTers, libertarians and other related types.I was so excited - here was a chance to have a whole day with "my" kind of people.Instead, I ended up in a room with around 200 mostly suit-and-tie people who apparently were only interested in finding out how to "invest" in Bitcoin in order to make a profit from it in their chosen fiat currency.That's right - just traditional central-bank-worshipping-fiat-addicted investors who could give a rats ass about what (in my mind) Bitcoin is REALLY about.

There's just so many parasitic middlemen controlling the financial system and trying to sap free energy from the real economy. That's the problem with it. If you look at the traditional banks in terms of what they do, it's really at about the same level as telcos. Yet even telecommunication companies have been rolling out a whole lot of new infrastructure because of the Internet and mobile phones. What new things has the banking sector been coming up with? Apart from usury and asset grabs? Very little. Just incremental, cosmetic changes in customer service -- nothing ground-breaking.



Quote During the first 7 hours of the day - there was only ONE single presentation about what bitcoin could actually be USED for (BitTunes). Otherwise no mention of what is actually bought or sold with it, no mention of businesses accepting it as payment. Nothing like that at all. And the phrase "Silk Road" never came up once.



I sat through 7 hours straight of - "why you should invest in bitcoin and bitcoin (trading) startups, so you can make more fiat and how to get the regulators on your side".

Because most regular entrepreneurs aren't that interested in money. They are idea people, not greedy people.



Quote In fact, it wasn't until the final two panel discussions before there was even a single mention of ANYTHING related to privacy, free-trade, free-markets and futurism. Many had left by then.



Fortunately, those last two panels were awesome - and made the rest of the day worthwhile.

I'm sure the timing was purely accidental

There's just soparasitic middlemen controlling the financial system and trying to sap free energy from the real economy. That's the problem with it. If you look at the traditional banks in terms of what they, it's really at about the same level as telcos. Yet even telecommunication companies have been rolling out a whole lot of new infrastructure because of the Internet and mobile phones. What new things has the banking sector been coming up with? Apart from usury and asset grabs? Very little. Just incremental, cosmetic changes in customer service -- nothing ground-breaking.Because most regular entrepreneurs aren'tinterested in money. They are idea people, not greedy people.I'm sure the timing was purely accidental

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MemberActivity: 96Merit: 10 Re: SERIOUSLY? Bitcoin Singapore 2013 - NOT What I Expected (Or Hoped For) November 20, 2013, 03:59:05 PM #5



I'm not talking about the electric power grid



I guess I understand promoting BTC this way to help with adoption - I just didn't realize ahead of time that would be the main point of one of these conferences. Based on the speakers listed, I thought it was for people who already understood BTC to explore using it and taking it further - not just 7 hours trying to convince Singapore and Chinese businessmen to throw more SGD and CNY at it...



re: people who are "off the grid"I'm not talking about the electric power gridI guess I understand promoting BTC this way to help with adoption - I just didn't realize ahead of time that would be the main point of one of these conferences. Based on the speakers listed, I thought it was for people who already understood BTC to explore using it and taking it further - not just 7 hours trying to convince Singapore and Chinese businessmen to throw more SGD and CNY at it... http://CoffeeCoin.io Blockchain Efficiency For The Specialty Coffee Trade

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Hero MemberActivity: 756Merit: 500 Re: SERIOUSLY? Bitcoin Singapore 2013 - NOT What I Expected (Or Hoped For) November 20, 2013, 04:34:12 PM #7 Quote from: solomon on November 20, 2013, 04:24:23 PM They're helping us by propagating bitcoin regardless of their personal goals. Not everyone will see the full potential of bitcoin, or see it as more than an investment tool, but that is fine. I still find the fact that people are getting it at all to be amazing. Let people get familiar with it, let it's use normalize in whatever sector they are working in, as long as they are pulling for bitcoin i don't think it's a problem.



Fiat still plays a role, whenever I buy stuff with Bitcoin I always buy the same amount of Bitcoins back with fiat. That way I'll never have the regrets that the 10,000 BTC pizza guy must be feeling now. Of course these guys want to make money but over time Bitcoin will become really useful as a currency in itself. It might not replace fiat but it has great potential in the remittance market. I don't have a credit card (most people here in the Netherlands don't have one) and it sucks to send money to another (non-SEPA) country. Either putting money in my PayPal account or paying by eCheck takes days, if not weeks. Fiat still plays a role, whenever I buy stuff with Bitcoin I always buy the same amount of Bitcoins back with fiat. That way I'll never have the regrets that the 10,000 BTC pizza guy must be feeling now. Of course these guys want to make money but over time Bitcoin will become really useful as a currency in itself. It might not replace fiat but it has great potential in the remittance market. I don't have a credit card (most people here in the Netherlands don't have one) and it sucks to send money to another (non-SEPA) country. Either putting money in my PayPal account or paying by eCheck takes days, if not weeks.