I can vividly remember where I first heard Sinking Steps...Rising Eyes. I can recall walking down the hallway of my high school sometime in early 2012, after I just uploaded a fresh batch of music onto my iPod classic the night before. I scrolled down to their name and opted for their first EP instead of the LP. I clicked the first track, which started out with a ride bell, followed by a fast picked octave chord over blast beating. Honestly, I immediately wrote it off as generic and quickly moved on to another band I wanted to check out.





About a month later I was scrolling through again and came across the name and decided to give it a good honest listen before I just wrote it off. Around the 50 second mark of the first track, I was hooked. This band I had written off on the surface previously now had my full attention. I think I listened to the entire EP a bunch throughout my school day, and walking around town.





A quick google search revealed that they were from Sioux Falls, South Dakota, where a lot of my favorite bands hail from. As time would pass, that EP would be solidified in my favorite releases of all time. The emotion in the lyrics, the beautiful guitars, bass, well accompanied drums, keyboards and even a flute solo, continues to make me feel today as if i'm listening for the very first time.





After the EP the band released what is considered by hardcore fans of screamo to be the absolute pinnacle of the genre, an LP called Majestic Blue. A big departure from their previous release, it's a heavily layered album with longer, more elaborate songs, and more experimental additions to the point where it actually set the bar higher for me on what can be included on a screamo/hardcore record.





After a two song EP and a reunion at Initfest in 2011, the band has remained quiet ever since. I've always been insanely curious as to what the bands influences are, and just finding out more about them in general, so I got in contact with Eli DeGroff, and he agreed to this interview. If you've made it this far through my rambling and fanboy-ness, read on!





NJ: I start off each interview having the person talk about their childhoods. What kind of house did you grow up in? Was there a presence of music in your household?





Eli: I grew up in South Dakota, in a good stable home. My dad worked for the state in human services/counseling etc, and rebuilt cars for extra money and my mom was a stay-at-home mom at least until I was in middle school I think, then she worked at the schools to be involved and close to us. I have a twin brother (identical) and one older brother (3 years older).





Pretty religious home, active in the church etc, my mom played piano at home and at church, and my mom used to play ukulele, and she had an acoustic guitar, but I don't think she really played it or knew how.





NJ: Being from a religious home, was your first exposure to music through the church? Or did your parents have their own records they would play in the house?





Eli: Her dad was a piano player, a good one, he wrote music and played with Lawrence Welk some before he was really big I believe. My parents had a lot of records.. My dad and mom, probably more so my dad, were into music when they were in college, Zeppelin , Bob Dylan, Moody Blues, James Taylor, Janis Joplin, stuff like that. I don't know if heard much of that at home ever. I think by the time I was old enough to have memories, it was mostly christian music.





I really liked music, i had to buy music at the christian music store though. But I didn't really know any better so i got into bands like Stryper, Petra, Rez when I was like 7-10 age range.





In the late 80's there all that super fear of "satanic" music and shit. I remember they had seminars at our church about all this "satanic" stuff in music. Pretty funny in retrospect.

That "stuff you should know" podcast recently did a good episode on that era called the "satanic panic"





NJ : How did you get into “alternative” music (punk, hardcore, etc) from your christian music roots? Recall your first exposure to this, and talk about how you felt when upon discovering it.





Eli: B y the time I was 10 - 12 years old, I was getting into radio music or hard rock secular music. Slaughter, Ratt, etc, the good stuff haha. Once I was in high school I was getting really interested in music and finding out there was more out there than what was on the radio, so that was really exciting for me. When I was a freshman/sophomore I got really into Phish and jam stuff and my older brother was really into that stuff and I think I went to some shows with him. It really wasn't my bag exactly but I was into the community/underground part of it.





Then when I was a junior I think, I was working at a grocery store and one of my coworkers was in a grade below me and I knew him and his friends were "punks" and had a band. He would let me borrow his car sometimes for lunch so I could go get food and smoke his cigs, haha, and I would listen to whatever he had in his car, it was stuff like NOFX, Rancid, Pennywise, Bosstones, etc, it blew my mind. I was like "yes this is what I have been looking for". I asked him to give me recommendations on what I should go buy, so I starting buying tons of punk rock albums, and I went to some punk rock shows in Sioux Falls with him and his friends. We lived in Yankton then, (1 hour from Sioux Falls where I live now)





I was all in at that point. I started going to shows and finding out about more bands. It was a little weird cuz most of the music was very anti religious, which bothered me a little because it was still a big part of my identity at that point, b ut everything else about it made sense to me. I loved it.





NJ: What was the Sioux Falls scene like back when you first started going to shows? The community aspect in jam bands like Phish, Grateful Dead, is kind of similar to hardcore, though maybe not as die hard. Did you find that sense of community going to your first shows?

Also, a separate question, when you first started going to shows and listening to this music that has overtly anti-religious, anti-authority tones, how did your parents react to it all?





Eli: A t that point I didn't really know anyone in the Sioux Falls scene, but there were tons of local bands which was really inspiring. There was a really cool bar/venue that was kind of legendary and they did lots of all ages shows, so some really amazing bands played there. I remember lots of flyers of shows that later I wish I would have seen, but i didn't know whose those bands were at that point. My first few shows were bands like Mu330, Suicide Machines, Dillinger 4, FYP, and some basement shows of local hardcore bands. I don't know if I saw that community at the first few shows, but the kids I knew from Yankton that I went with and I saw some of that later, more so in just the "team" aspect. I felt like I was part of something rad.





My parents knew I was getting into a lot of extreme music, punk and hardcore, screamy stuff, at that point they didn't hassle me about what I was listening to. They didn't really ask me about it, I tried not to play stuff at home with swearing and stuff.





I remember one time when I was home from college the first year, and I had a Nobodys CD in my car, and if you know that band, its filthy fast shitty punk. Probably the song about "I wanna fuck your girlfiend " or something was on, my dad was just like "i don't think i wanna listen to that" or something and turned it down. I think it was a mix of trusting me and knowing they didn't have much say in the matter anymore. My dad was always good at knowing when it was time to let me make my own decisions on things.





NJ: So, after you started going to more underground shows, at what point did you start to play an instrument? Or does your first instrument experience pre-date your discovery of the Sioux Falls punk scene?





Eli: Y eah, so I didn't pick up a guitar till I was 18, so my senior year I was at a friends house and he had a guitar. I picked it up and started fooling around with it and it made sense. I saved some money and my parents helped me buy an electric guitar and little practice amp, then I started playing a few hours a day. I was obsessed, figuring out how to play shitty punk songs and stuff...





My first year of college I was still going to lots of shows and playing guitar with friends. I was at a show and a band from small town nearby played. I lived in that town (Mitchell) when I was 5-10 years old. One of the people in the band was my 3rd grade teacher, and so I was talking to them, and later that year, a few of the members were moving for college (they were in high school then) and needed a guitar player, so I was like me me me!!! so I started practicing with them and picked up all their songs in a few practices.





So that was my first band. I knew some people in Sioux Falls, so we played some shows in Sioux Falls, and other surrounding towns, and played my house at college, it ruled. We played for about a year, recorded a cassette tape and then a CD, then broke up.





I met a lot of Sioux Falls kids in hardcore bands through that and at that point I was in college 3 years I think. I was always playing music and failing out of school.





Some kids I knew were starting a new band and I was all about it. This was in the summer and we started practicing in Sioux Falls. I quit school, and moved to Sioux Falls and got a house with a few of them, and that was Sinking Steps...Rising Eyes. We wrote 5 songs that summer/fall and recorded, then went on tour the next summer





NJ: What year would that be that you first started playing guitar?

The first release from Sinking Steps was the 2002 E.P, if I’m correct. I read somewhere else that these songs were written sort of quickly just so you could tour. What were your influences in writing for SS...RE? What bands was everyone into going into this band? Talk about the SS...RE practices and how you all wrote together.









Eli: 1998 I got a guitar





Yeah, we wrote them pretty quick I would say, in a few months I think. For influences... hmmm, I'm sure we were all somewhat influenced by Spirit of Versailles (another Sioux Falls band) Brandon and Brogan and Mary were good friends with those guys. I was pretty into Orchid, Bright Calm Blue, Black Heart Procession, Blood Brothers, Red Scare, and bands like Neil Perry, Jeromes Dream were listened to a lot too by most of I think. I wouldn't say those were influences for me though. I listened to a lot of rock n roll stuff and pop punk type stuff too. I loved the Lillingtons, and Murder City Devils.





Most of the songs on that EP were written guitar first by me. A lot of it on an acoustic I was working at a music store/CD store in Brookings where I was in college, (before I moved ) and I would play acoustic when there was no one in the store, write stuff then bring it to practice. Then josh (drummer) and I would bang it out. But we practiced together, all at once, jamming through parts and bass and keys would play along til they found the parts they wanted. O ne song in particular was written around a bass line Seth wrote.





Originally it was just Brogan on bass, but while we were writing, he moved back to Dubai. His parents lived over there, but the plan was that he would come back at some point, so our friend Seth jumped in to play bass. Then when we knew Brogan was coming back, we wrote (Brandon wrote) 2nd bass lines for the songs. So Seth played high stuff, kind of like guitar melodies and Brogan played lower more "bass line" bass lines. S o Seth had this noodley melodic thing he wrote, so I wrote guitar riffs over it and added a little structure and it turned out really sweet. T hat was "the deepest hymn" which is song 2 I think on the 2002 EP. At least on the CD version it was. I think we re-arranged the songs for the 7" so we could fit the songs on there.





Brandon and Brogan were in a band together before this but they didn't do much, played a few local shows, and Josh was in a band before this ( my first band used to play with them that's how I knew him before ) it was like a rap-core band, haha but I think this was soo much fun and we felt like we were pretty decent and writing fun music... so it was just such a fucking blast, those first 5-7 songs we wrote were just came together nicely.

NJ: Spirit Of Versailles was a local Sioux Falls band, would you say that band had a pretty huge effect and influence on the scene?

So, after you wrote the EP you hit the road with Sinking Steps, what were some of your first tour experiences like? Was a DIY ethic prominent in your band and important to you when it came to merch, and booking shows?





Eli: Y eah I think spirit had a big impact on the scene. They went on a few tours, and seeing another band do that really encourages/inspires other bands to do it too, showing that it can be done you know? Plus by doing that they brought a lot of bands to town, and a few of them had a house they would do shows at "the 605 house". I saw a lot of cool bands there. It helps give your town/bands some cred when touring. I would say they inspired us to write/record/tour they way we did and I know we had that same impact on bands that came later. We are a small place but we had a lot of bands touring in that indie/hardcore scene in that era, 2000 - 2006 era.





Tour was great. It was all of our first time touring. Josh and I were 22 I think and the rest of the crew was under 21. We were just stoked to be out on the road playing music and meeting people. I spent months going to the computer labs on the local college campus to try and book shows. We went out for a month and I think we played 22 some shows. We didn't know what we were doing and it's amazing it went as well as it did. We were having fun no matter what shows were like.





Yeah, DIY was super important... We booked everything ourselves, I screen printed our first batch of t shirts... for our first tour... I think we had a local shop print them for us. But the artwork was done by one of our vocalists, Aaron Hagen, and a friend of ours worked at a Kinkos and he was a show promoter and musician. He would always help local bands print CD packaging/paper stickers etc.





So we made CDR's and made hand made sleeve CD packaging. W e made buttons and stickers too. Had someone print the vinyl stickers of course. W e all pitched in and bought a van and a small trailer.





NJ: After you toured a bit with the EP songs, the next release would come out two years later and would be the release everyone is usually exposed to when listening to Sinking Steps, Majestic Blue. It’s a stark contrast between the EP songs. What was song writing like for this LP? Did the jam bands that you enjoyed when you were younger bleed into the song writing style? Talk about your influences and the period between the EP and the LP.





Eli: S o much happened between those 2 recordings.





When we got back from that first tour, Brogan and I were homeless haha. We all moved out of our house before we left for tour so when we got back, we slept on some couches for a few weeks, I moved back to Brookings to start school again, and I would come back on weekends to practice. Josh was married and was having a kid, so he was kind of stepping away because he knew he wouldn't have much time, so we needed a drummer. Seth was going to get married and wanted to focus on that part of his life, and we didn't have a place to practice.





So I had moved back to Brookings, Brogan moved in with a bunch of other friends who used to be straight edge and now all were discovering drinking and smoking pot. I smoked pot and did drugs in high school, but really hadn't since. So since Brogan was smoking pot, I did sometimes too. Not a lot but kind of got into it again for awhile.





We tried playing with different local drummers and we found this kid Brandon (2nd Brandon in the band now) He had been in some other local bands, mostly pop punk/american football type stuff. He was much younger than us, I think he was in high school still. He had a much different style which changed things.





We got a practice space at this old building that some other bands we knew had spaces there. A spot opened up and we shared it with another band, so we had this big room that would set the vibe in. Before we had always been in our own basement.





There was a lot of transition going on. I was in Sioux falls all weekend, drinking, smoking pot, then I'd go back to school for the week. I wasn't very focused, getting shitty grades, so I was kind of depressed I would say. We were all getting really into bands like ISIS, Denali, Engine Down. Brogan was getting really into Beatles and Pink Floyd (funny, so cliche for new pot smokers)





So writing was much different. I would write guitar stuff at school, sometimes while smoking so I was writing from a much different place. I would say this time our writing was more collaborative. Brogan, Mary and I were really learning to listen to each other...





So with the new drummer and a more intentional writing style, it wasn't just guitar songs now. We were writing stream of consciousness style music with no parts repeated ever. Just what happens next. It took a long time to write those songs. Brandon (drummer) was always flaky and bailing on practice. B y the time we recorded, he was done. But we got him to agree to record with us and play a few shows, then he could be done.





So when we did a short tour on majestic stuff. Josh (old drummer) played it. The core of the band was the same, but it was really a new band. We had all changed/evolved/morphed a lot. T he first time was like "best friends/summer/fun" and nobody really drank or anything then. I had a beer once in awhile, but the tour was dry. Just good clean fun.





This time everyone was trying to figure out some life direction, and it was winter and more depressed, moody, drug and alcohol induced. A t least Brogan and I were, maybe not Mary so much.

NJ: The vibe of that album really channels a dark and depressing mood. I recall a review where someone said the opening track reminds them of standing on a beach in the winter time. Just an overall gloomy mood. The song writing is stream of consciousness, but are you able to comment on the lyrical aspect of things? Particularly dealing with religious themes. Was Ss...re a Christian band? What were the goals with majestic blue, and going forward from there and how were the different from your EP?





Eli: Brandon wrote all the lyrics on Majestic blue. On the EP, Brandon and Aaron each wrote lyrics.

I think I could speak for Brandon and say the lyrics were sort of like poetry trying to reflect the mood of the music - nothing super personal in the lyrics.





Yeah, the lyrics had sort of a religious or christian theme. When the band started, we would have called ourselves a Christian band, we all had similar religious upbringings and I think most of us still went to church regularly.