Top Judiciary Democrat: Justice Department is being run in 'third world' style Michael Roston

Published: Friday May 18, 2007 Print This Email This Last year, Rep. Linda Sánchez took the stage of a DC comedy club and was awarded for being the "Funniest Celebrity in Washington." But in 2007, the wisecracking Congresswoman from California is spending less time writing new jokes and more time sending subpoenas to Bush administration officials involved in the firing of US Attorneys by the Justice Department. "Right now, the lack of confidence that people have in [the Department of Justice], the lack of morale at the DOJ, the way it seems to be running seems so third world. It's third world in the way they're doing it," she told RAW STORY on Thursday. The California Democrat spoke with RAW STORY in an exclusive interview at the Judiciary Committee in the House of Representatives, where she is the Chair of the Subcommittee on Commercial and Administrative Law. In that position, Rep. Sánchez is initiating many of the major moves on behalf of the full committee in pressing the investigation into the US Attorney firings. At 38, the Congresswoman is one of the youngest members of Congress to be helping to head up an investigation as weighty as the probe of the firing of eight US Attorneys by the Bush administration. She is also one of the only women to be sitting in such a position. "In a word, no," she laughed, when asked if she thought she'd be spending her third term in Congress engaged in this kind of investigation. She added, "When I became the chair of the [Commercial and Administrative Law] subcommittee, it was sort of this sleepy little committee. Nobody really thought it'd have sexy issues coming through it and, bam, the biggest issue this Congress so far, it's smack dab in the middle of the controversy." The Congresswoman, who says on her website that she is the first woman of Latin descent to serve on the Judiciary Committee, worried that it would be hard to cure the "political virus" she said had "infected the Department of Justice." "Really, the big change will come when the Bush administration is no longer in power," she said. Still, she said it was important to press on with the investigation. "There are some ways that I think that we can legitimately address some of the concerns that we have seen come up. And part of that will be also continuing the investigation and enforcing any laws that may have been broken against the people that were involved." she argued. Rep. Sánchez was also adamant that it was time for Attorney General Alberto Gonzales to step down from office. "The guy should be fired," she said. "I just think it's ridiculous that somebody who heads up one of the most powerful departments in the United States, one of the cornerstones of our democracy, which is the enforcement of the laws of this country, can't answer simple questions about who is running what or making decisions. It's just incompetent." The full transcript of the interview can be read below. # RAW STORY : Is dealing with the US Attorneys controversy how you expected to be spending the 110th Congress? Rep. Linda Sánchez: [Laughter] In a word, no. When I became the chair of the [Commercial and Administrative Law] subcommittee, it was sort of this sleepy little committee. Nobody really thought it'd have sexy issues coming through it and, bam, the biggest issue this Congress so far, it's smack dab in the middle of the controversy. We have dedicated quite a bit of time and attention and resources to the investigation, and that's going to be ongoing, and it's not exactly how I envisioned the CAL subcommittee would be spending its time. RAW STORY : So how does it feel? From my review it seems like you're one of the only women, and one of the youngest Members of Congress to be helping to lead an investigation of this scope, so what's that been like so far? Rep. Sánchez: It was, obviously because being a chairman was new, a steep learning curve at the beginning. I think I found my footing very quickly with help from my colleagues that serve on that subcommittee, and John Conyers has been very supportive and backed me up on a lot of things that we wanted to do, including issuing the subpoenas to the US Attorneys to come testify. I've had a lot of support from colleagues and I think I'm actually doing a pretty good job of feeling my way around this issue, which is a substantial and weighty issue. I want to handle it in a way that's fair, but also thorough. That's sort of the balance that I'm trying to strike, hey, we want the investigation to go forward, and we need the information that we need, we need to be firm on getting the information that we need, but we want to be fair as well. So it's sort of a balancing act. RAW STORY : What's the steepest thing you've had to learn so far? Rep. Sánchez: That's a good question. I guess the biggest thing that we try to do now, and this is something I haven't given a lot of thought to, is trying think two to three steps ahead about what the next move is. It's sort of like chess in that respect. You know, you have to be aware every time you take a step forward, you have to have alternate paths for achieving your ultimate goal. You have to be thinking two or three steps ahead of each move. RAW STORY : The Washington Post today says that we're up to 26 Attorneys that they wanted to toss out on their behinds. What do you think is the implication of that news coming out? Rep. Sánchez: It's really interesting because although they may have at some point considered 26, the fact of the matter is that the investigation we're looking at is the particular 8 that were sent packing, and we still have not been able to get the information from anybody, current or former members of the DOJ that should have been in on this discussion about performance and who was performing or not. We still haven't been able to figure out who made the list, how names got added to the list, why names got added to the list, nobody has taken responsibility for that. That is the fundamental question at the heart of this investigation. To me, it's interesting that there's a broader universe. And I think the implications are that various factors obviously came into play in recommending certain people for the chopping block. But what were the motivations for the people that actually got sent packing? That's what I want to know. RAW STORY : In terms of how this list was put together, you heard from the Attorney General one day, and then the next day he had this press conference where he said it's pretty much all Mr. McNulty, the Deputy Attorney General. Do you think that's credible? Rep. Sánchez: I don't, and l'm going to give an example. I think several of the US Attorneys, the rationale was that they were poor managers of their departments, they delegated too much authority, weren't involved in the day-to-day. [We pause while the Congresswoman checks on the progress of a vote on the House floor.] So Gonzales says, "Well I take responsibility for the list." He can't say who made the list or why. He sort of said that it was input from different people. He's delegating hiring and firing authority to young, inexperienced staff members and if that doesn't show a lack of ability to manage the DOJ and oversee the inner workings of the DOJ, that tells me that the guy should be fired. I reserved judgment on that as long as I could because I wanted to hear the evidence and I wanted to be able to make up my own mind. But if that was the rationale for firing some of these US Attorneys, then apply the same rationale to Gonzales, and he should go. I just think it's ridiculous that somebody who heads up one of the most powerful departments in the United States, one of the cornerstones of our democracy, which is the enforcement of the laws of this country, can't answer simple questions about who is running what or making decisions. It's just incompetent. RAW STORY : That's interesting because you've made this statement that you think there's not a lot of competence there. And it seems like in the Senate, a lot of the Republicans on that Judiciary Committee said let's get out of here, it's time to move on and get a new Attorney General... Rep. Sánchez: And I give them a lot of credit. The Republican Senators who recognize that the department basically doesn't have effective leadership, that partisan politics has been injected in many different levels of that, that it's sort of been twisted as a way to help one party gain elections, and that there needs to be accountability, I give them credit for standing up and saying if there's one department in this country that should not be politicized, it's the Department of Justice. Kudos to them for recognizing that our system of justice should be above that. By the same token, House Republicans show none of that. And I'm sort of amazed and befuddled as to why they wouldn't want to stand up and say, hey, our system of enforcing the laws needs to be above reproach. Because right now, the lack of confidence that people have in the DOJ, the lack of morale at the DOJ, the way it seems to be running seems so third world. It's third world in the way there doing it. And it doesn't seem to trouble my colleagues on this side of the aisle on the House side. RAW STORY : Why do you think that is? Do you think they've been whipped into political line? Rep. Sánchez: I don't know. They seem to be saying there's no evidence of wrongdoing because you haven't caught us yet. My response is, we're still doing the investigation, the evidence that emerges seem to be more and more damaging. Every day there's more and more revelations. And, "Oh, there's no credible evidence." I think the most compelling evidence was when the US Attorneys themselves testified, as to receiving political phone calls pressuring them on their investigations. That to me is extremely troubling, and if it's not troubling to my Republican counterparts here, I think there's something seriously wrong with the way they're looking at this whole issue. RAW STORY : How are your constituents reacting to this? I know how this sounds in Washington and other places that follow inside politics very closely, but way out in California, far away from a lot of this... Rep. Sánchez: Well, I think the nuances or the day-to-day happenings are very much inside the beltway. But people back in my district get that they don't want to be, you don't want somebody who has the full weight of prosecutorial discretion in this country being able to target people based on their political ideology or affiliation. They get that that's really really bad, and they don't want any part of it. They want to see that end. They don't want to feel like one party is manipulating our government to help one party stay in power, or to help them win elections. They're very much troubled by the voter fraud allegations, the fact they seem to have wanted to go in a direction despite some career people saying these were not credible cases, some US Attorneys saying I can't bring cases, there's no evidence. And then, disregarding that, replacing people and pushing forward on these allegations of voter fraud where there was not criminal, or it was de minimis and not a big problem. That was a message to create the cynicism in the electorate, I think, to suppress voting. There's very clear rules about not announcing indictments or cases just prior to elections and they disregard that and went ahead anyway. RAW STORY : Are they connecting this, are they asking questions about the US Attorney in your district? Rep. Sánchez: Not so much. The Yang stuff, there are some things that need to be scrutinized in terms of her departure and then going to work of course for the firm that is representing Mr. Lewis in the investigation they have ongoing. But I think overall, people have a sense of unease that the department is being mismanaged and that it's being politicized, this political virus has infected the DOJ, and that's not good. RAW STORY : Some people are saying we're at the point that the Justice Department can't really function any more. What changes do you think the Justice Department is going to need to make going forward? Is this something where we're just going to have to run the clock down on the Bush administration, or is it something that can be fixed now? Rep. Sánchez: I think there are some legislative steps that we can take. There are a number of fixes that we have attempted with respect to the provision that was inserted in the PATRIOT Act for unconfirmed US Attorneys. There's also some legislation that was addressed, that US Attorneys being selected from the districts in which they will represent, there's a geographic requirement. There are some legislative fixes that we can do. But really, the big change will come when the Bush administration is no longer in power. But there are some ways that I think that we can legitimately address some of the concerns that we have seen come up. And part of that will be also continuing the investigation and enforcing any laws that may have been broken against the people that were involved.



