SinCitta Profile Blog Joined August 2010 Germany 2127 Posts #1

MOD EDIT: On June 13 2013 01:09 TaKeTV wrote:

It´s a sad day for the Acer TeamStory Cup powered by Intel. We have to announce the disqualification of Karont3 E-Sport Club. This step was extremely hard for us, but there was no other possible solution in our mind.



What happened?



Karont3 E-Sport Club closed his doors and disbandend his Starcraft 2 Squad. The remaining Players were ViPro and LoLvsxD. Additional the joker Socke also remains. 3 Players left, 1 of them plays for Team Alternate, 2 without any team, searching for an new home.



Our idea and our solution for the Acer TeamStory Cup is written in the name. We desire a Teamleague. We want wars with lesser known players, nice comebacks with Ace players backed up by team spirit. This is the reason why we made a best-of-9 format. Our target was to get teams with big and deep rosters. At any point in time, we tried to avoid mix teams. We don´t want any "Allstar"-Parties. We need teams, no rosters. Teams for our TeamStory Cup.



Sadly, Karont3 isn´t that team anymore. It´s no team anymore, it´s a roster of pro-players, searching for a new home. We can´t continue with Karont3 cause it fit´s not in our understanding of a professional team.



What were our option?



Just continue with just the remaining players.



This option is contra productive to our understanding of a team. We need at least 4 players for a team-cup, the remaining won´t have them, it´s a too small roster nor it´s a team anymore.



Add to the remaining players new ones.



So we do not want any mix teams - but we accept a roster of players to play in a "mixed"-Team? This can´t be the aim of a team league. This wouldn´t be a team. Also this wouldn´t be fair for all teams in the league.



Add the manager to the player-roster.



This is a solution we discussed way more often. Would this be the best solution? Just add the manager to the roster and there are 4 "players" left. But after we thought about this scenario, what happens when one of the players leave this roster (Like ViPro who´s playing for coL now, yes we were informed about this step before!). What´s up if more players are leaving, to get a contract and to get paid? You have to make sure, Vipro and LoLvsxD are pros and they want a team. Yes a team - no roster to play in a team league. We end up with a mixed roster of players.



We spoke about this topic intern and ofc with all other teams in the league as well. We didn´t kick just anyone. We tried and thought about it all the way and spend a lot of hours to let ex-K3 players play in our Acer TeamStory Cup any longer. But with the leave of viPro, LoLvsxD's "team-search" and Socke as the joker, without any company - this roster of ex-Karont3 isn´t Karont3 E-Sports Club anymore.



We are sad and don´t like this outcome. We would like to say a big sorry especially to the fans and viewers. They played a great season, they are pretty well players and humans. It´s our fault to bring that statement way too late. Blame us for being not that fast, but we tried and thought about so many ways to go on with Karont3. In the end, we think this is the only way.



Farewell, Karont3 E-Sport Club, Ryo, ViPro, LoLvsxD and Socke as their joker.



What will happen now?

• Karont3 will went to the last Spot of the league, regardless of their score.

• Every new clanwar will result in a defwin (5-0) for the other team.





http://www.twitlonger.com/show/n_1rkohal



Translation by MadJack

http://www.twitlonger.com/show/n_1rkohalTranslation by They are kicking us from the Acer TeamStory Cup



First a little context. As you know, after the release of lucifron and vortix from Karont3 and the following closure of the SC2 division, the members that were left from the team, we decided to keep playing toguether the competition. We played our next match against Acer however we could and won 5-3. This would let us keep second place in the league with 6 victorys and 2 loses, after having played once with every team and 8 rounds more to play (half to be precise). So far so good.



Once we played the match against Acer, I asked the admin whom we use to comunicate with normaly if it would be possible to have 1 or 2 signings maximum so that we could have 5 players again since that was the number of players that we had till the release of my brothers, and the minimum required by the league being 4. At that moment we only had 3 players: LoLvsxD, viPro and Socke. Having 2 signings would have led into us keeping 60% of our original team, as minimum. The main admin at first tells me that yes, we can sign all the players that we want with the only restriction: If they had already played the ATC with another team, they had to wait to round in order to be elegible to play with us. He tells me that he will talk to the rest -admins i assume- but taht there shouldnt be any problems, and tells me to talk to TaKe (The big boss of TaKeTV) just to confirm it. Next day, I talk to TaKe and he himself confirms to me, and asks me to tell him asap who we sign and under what name do we want to compete

at that point in time. We started looking for players and after a couple of days of asking many players and teams against the clock -they felt gainst the clock- ThorZaiN and SortOf join us (With EG's and WW's consent). This was ideal because we were replacing a terran and a zerg with the same races, also keeping the orignal number of members of the team.



Once the team was formed, i talk to TaKe again, and he gives me the OK and sends me to another admin, diferent that the first, so that i give him all the info to make public the changes on the team. To our surprise, this second admin tells me for the first time that we CAN NOT count in those players, since their teams already played the qualifications for the ATC and thus, not elegible. At that point we told him that the 1st admin didnt told us any of that, and that we already had TaKe's OK. Plus, I told him that we had already been moving to contact the players and their teams and that we had the OK from everybody, also that they belong to teams that didnt even made it to the league itself. He does not budge (Even tho hes going against his own boss) and asks me to give him 1 day to talk to TaKe and the rest of the admins from TaKeTV.



Next day, I talk to the admin with certain untrust, y he tells me that yes, they would allow us to play with those signs: “TaKe's Word”, he says. Following thing, this adming sends a mail that informs all the managers of all teams about the changes, hoping that they "can live with them somehow" and that he hopes they "accept this decision that has been really hard to make". In that main, I felt the admin was informing something that he didnt agree with -as in the admin was showing how unhappy he was about the decision-. After the mail, the managers of 2 participant teams answer, saying that they dont think its allright, that its against the rulesd since we are not a real team anymore and that besides we would be playing with 3 jokers. I tell them that its nottrue, but we only try to remain in the league with the same number of players that we had and even players of the same races, so that the league can go on with the least number of changes. However , they "stay on their 13"-popular saying that means being stubborn or not change their mind- hoping that other/s teams adds to the protest and that the admin changes the decision.



At that moment enters the scene the head admin of TaKeTV and we keep talking about the subject with him. At once he tells us that its impossible that that we remain in the league with those reinforces. We tru to talk about it but it was definitive, so we finally had to tell ThorZaiN y SortOf that in the end they could not play. Some teams propoused that we could go on the league having 1 "revive" en each round, that way we could finish the league with the 3 players that we had. Rapidly the admins and other teams discard the solution, sticking to the rule of the number of revives per season (that is 2).



After this, we try proposing various solutions. The first was to still make the 2 signs that were not related to any team, so that we would be a team made of teamless members + 1 joker: Socke. This, under my point of view, doesnt contradict any of the rules of the league. However, we were also told that it is not possible either, because the team would not cover the definition of "ideal" team from the admins by not being a real team/organization. To this we answered that a group of teamless players that joined toguether to play the league, after having played the majority of the rounds 8 of them and having strickly kept the schedules and same manager, could easily accomplish the obligations of the league as any of the other teams, and as done till the date. But nothing, there was no way. We decided to propose another solution: Keep going with no signs and no extra revives, just using me as fourth player, to not give a defwin every match once we run out of revives. The same 4 players that had played under Karont3 tag, no changes, except one name change. So to this propose, the answer was that they could not allow it because "A match of a professional players vs Ryo would not be interesting to the spectators and would be unbalanced" and, by that, we had not enough players to go on.



We keep trying to talk to the, saying that it was better that, than making us dissapear from the league after being second place, voiding all our matches and leaving the league with one less team at half the season. In addition, we were the same that had been from the start during the whole season, that we have had kept-fill in: preformance- at all times, and that we want to keep going even without he signings, since the 3 players that we had left wanted to keep playing and theat they could achieve a spot in the final, as was seen with Acer. After talkin to the head admin for the last time, he tells me in few hours he will give me a definitive answer. After a while, he comunicates me that we are out of the league, that we do not meet the definition of "ideal" team for them. At that moment I show him some teams that played the american qualification round for the ATC that were not professional teams, And i ask him to explain in what are we different from them. At that moment the admin disconnects from skype without answering and have not have any news from them since. Socke and viPro have tryed to talk with them on their own but to no aval, we are out.



My personal opinion about all this is that after losing Luci and vortix, some teams counted on of dissapearing, which would benefit all the teams except MVP (the only ones who have not said anything about the subject, that i know of) facing the top 4. Since this was not going to be the case, and that we were going to have kept a strong team and that we even defeated Acer with 3 players, they decided to make pressure to have us kicked out, and the admins comply and take their side. At the end, we were the small team.



Its a shame, because LoLvsxD, Socke y viPro wanted to go on, but they just simply didnt let them. At the end the only thing that we asked for was to keep playing with the same players that had been playing till that moment, execpt the 2 releases, without breaking a rule or anything like that. Simply, keep playing. But as I said, they have not allowed us. And its not because we have not tryed, as you can see, we have tryed everything.



Now you see that the rosary of lame excuses that they hae put on us has been very motley-as in varied-, and the admins have been throwing the ball from one to another till the final outcome. The motives that have to do with rules can be accepted. Even tho this is quite an exceptional situation we can understand that they want to respect the rules, even tho there are teams taht have weeks of delay in their matches and they dont seem to have had nothing happened to them or the fact that my brothers were in fact able to inmediatly play and with no trouble at all with their new team after having played with us (Wheres the 2 rounds of wait in this case?). However, the last motives have not feel to me strong justifications to kick a team out of a league, by far.



Anyways, Simply giving the thanks to all the fans who have followed to the end. I feel sorry that we can not go on, because we feel that we had a chance to make the playoff, especially after the match against Acer, there was certainly a lot of desire on trying. Also, thank you to the 3 players that were left, that have been till the last trying by any means to remain in the league and thanks to TaKe, that give me the impression to be the only one of the admins i have talked to to use common sense y wanted us to keep going, but i suppoused that being surrounded of so much people, he has to accept what the majority wants.



¡Salutations!



Correction of my translation by Topin:

+ Show Spoiler +





We were kicked out of the Acer TeamStory Cup.



First a little background. As you know, following the departure of LucifroN and VortiX from Karont3 and the subsequent closure of the SC2 section, the remaining members of the team decided to stay together playing in the competition. We played out our next match against Acer and we and won 5-3. This allowed us to go second in the league with 6 wins and 2 losses, after playing against every team in eight playdays (exactly half).



So far so normal. Once the game against Acer was done I ask the admin with which we communicate regularly whether we could make 1 or 2 signings to regain a 5 player roster as it was the number of players that we had before the departure of my brothers, and the minimum required by the league is 4. At that time we had only 3 players: LoLvsxD, VIPRO and Socke. Making 2 signings would at least have maintained 60% of the original team. At first the admin said yes, we can sign all the players we want with a single constraint: if the ATC had played with another team we had to wait two days (T/N playdays?) to play with us. He said to me that he would talk to the rest but that there should not be a problem , and tells me to talk to TaKe (the boss of TakeTV) to confirm. The next day, I talked to TaKe and he confirmed me, and asked me to tell who we signed as soon as possible and under what name we want to compete from then on. We started looking for players and, after a couple of days and after asking many players and teams sortof Thorzain and joined us (with the consent of EG and WW). This was ideal as we replaced a terran and zerg players from the same races, while also keeping the original number of players on the team.



Once the team was formed, I returned to speak to TaKe who gave me the OK and refered me to another admin, other than the first, to give him all the info to post the changes on the website. To our surprise, this second admin tells me for the first time that NO, we can't have these new players, as their teams played the qualifiers for the ATC and therefore would not be eligible. At that time we said that the first admin did not tell us anything, and we already had the OK of TaKe. Furthermore, I said that we had been moving to contact players and their teams and had the OK from everyone (TFunk and SortOf and their teams) also, EG and WW didnt play the actual league (only tuq qualis i assume). He does not budge (despite being contradicting his own boss) and asks me to wait for one day, so he could talk to TaKe and other TakeTV admins.



The next day, I return to speak to the admin that FIRST said NO and now he said yes, we can play with those signings: "Word of TaKe" he says. Then the admin sends a mail that informs all managers of all the teams about the changes, hoping that theycan live with it in some way" and hopes to "accept this decision, which has been very difficult to make ". In this mail I thought the admin was reporting something that he didnt agree. After the mail, the managers of two teams who play the league answer by saying that it's not okay, it's against the rules since we are not a real team and also would be playing with 3 jokers. I tell them that's true, but we just tried to stay in the league with the same number of players we had before and even with players of the same race, so that the league can continue with as few changes as possible. However, they are still on their heels, giving rise to some other team will join the protests and that the admin changes his mind again.



Now the head admin of TakeTV appears and we're speaking about the subject with him. He tells us it is impossible to go on with these two signings. We tried to continue to speak but it was his final decision, so I finally had to tell sortof and Thorzain they couldn't play. Some teams proposed that the league could continue with allowing everyone to revive a player on each playday so that we could finish the league with 3 players. Quickly, the admins and some teams discarded the solution, clinging to the existing revive number rule of per season (which is 2).



After this, we tried to propose several solutions. The first was to continue doing one or two signings of players who were completely teamless, so that we would be a team of teamless players + 1 joker: Socke. This, in my point of view, does not contradict any league rule. However, they also told us that it is not possible, since it does not meet the league admins' definition of an "ideal" team and we weren't a team / organization really. To that we responded to a group of people without team that got together to play the league, having played most of them eight days and have always strictly complied schedules and keeping the same manager, could play quietly with the obligations of the league as the other teams, as we had done so far. But nothing, no way. We decided to propose another solution: continue to do without signings and additional revives, using me as the 4th player, so we would not give a defwin in each match. The same four people who had played under the tag of Karont3, unchanged, except for a name change. In this new proposal, the response was that they could not do that because "a match of a professional player vs Ryo would not be interesting for spectators and would be unfair" and therefore we did not have enough players to continue.



After that we tried to follow up by explaining them that it was better to not disappear from the league after finishing second, forfeiting all our previous matches and leaving the league with a team less midseason. In addition, we were the same as we had been throughout the league, we had met every team once, and we wanted to continue even with no signings, since our 3 players were eager to continue and we could have even reached the final as could be seen with our win against Acer. After speaking with the head admin for the last time, he said that in a few hours he would give me a definitive answer. After a while, I was given notice that we are out of the league and that this decision was final, because we are not meeting the definition of an "ideal" team for them. At that time I gave him examples of some teams that played in the American qualifier for ATC that aren't professional teams and I asked him to explain how we are different from them. At that time the admin disconnects from skype and and went missing. I have not heard from him since then. Socke and VIPRO have tried talking to them on their own, but nothing, we're out.



My personal opinion about this is that after losing VortiX and Luci, some teams had expect that we would dissapear, which benefits everyone except MVP (the only one that have not spoken about it, to my knowledge) and increased their chances to get into the top 4 (playoffs). Seeing that this was not about to happen, and that we would continue with a good team that even could beat Acer with 3 players, they decided to put pressure on the admins for us being expelled, and the admins caved in and did their part.At the end of the day, we were the small team.



Its a shame, as LoLvsxD, Socke and VIPRO wanted to continue, but just have to leave. At the end all I asked was to allow us to continue to play as the same we had so far, except with two less players, without breaking any rules or anything special. Simply continue. But as I said, they didnt let us. And not because we have not tried since, as you see, we have tried everything.



You already see that the string of excuses that they gave us have been very mixed, and that the admins have been passing the ball to each other until the final outcome. The reasons that are according to the rules can be accepted. Although this situation is exceptional I can understand they did not want to make exceptions to the rules, even though there are teams that are weeks late in their schedule and it seems that nothing happens, or that my brothers could have played immediately and without any problem with their new team after playing with us (where are the two (T/N play-)days of penalty in this case?). However, the last reasons they gave us had no weight behind them to leave the league without a team.



Anyway, just to say thanks to all who had followed us all the way. Sorry we can not continue, because we believe that there were chances to get to the playoffs, especially after the match against Acer. Also thanks to the 3 players that we had, we have been trying to continue our path in the league, and also thanks to TaKe, which gave me the impression of being the only one of the admins I spoke to who used common sense and he really wanted us to continue, but I suppose being surrounded by so many people you have to accept what the majority says. Greetings!





My original translation:

+ Show Spoiler + Disclaimer: I don't speak a word of Spanish. I tried to make any sense of what Google Translate told me, which works okay for most of the time between European languages. But there are probably wrongly translated statements in there. It would be nice if a Spanish speaking person could correct me.





We were kicked out of the Acer TeamStory Cup.



First a little background. As you know, following the departure of LucifroN and VortiX from Karont3 and the subsequent closure of the SC2 section, the remaining members of the team decided to stay together playing in the competition. We played out our next match against Acer and we and won 5-3. This allowed us to go second in the league with 6 wins and 2 losses, after playing against every team in eight playdays (exactly half).



So far so normal. Again played the match against Acer, ask the admin with which we communicate regularly whether we could make 1 or 2 signings to regain a 5 player roster as it was the number of players that we had before the departure of my brothers, and the minimum required by the league is 4. At that time we had only 3 players: LoLvsxD, VIPRO and Socke. Making 2 signings would at least have maintained 60% of the original team.



At first the admin said yes, we can sign all the players we want with a single constraint: if the ATC had played with another team we had to wait two days (T/N playdays?) to play with us. I said to him talk to the rest but that should not be a problem (T/N don't know what this means), and tells me to talk to TaKe (the boss of TakeTV) to confirm. The next day, I talked to TaKe and he confirmed me, and asked me to tell who we signed as soon as possible and under what name we want to compete from then on. We started looking for players and, after a couple of days and after asking many players and teams to trial, sortof Thorzain and joined us (with the consent of EG and WW). This was ideal as we replaced a terran and zerg players from the same races, while also keeping the original number of players on the team. Once the team was formed, I returned to speak to TaKe who gave me the OK and refered me to another admin, other than the first, to give him all the info to post the changes on the website.



To our surprise, this second admin tells me for the first time that NO, we can't have these new players, as their teams played the qualifiers for the ATC and therefore would not be eligible. At that time we said that the first admin did not tell us anything, and we already had the OK of TaKe. Furthermore, I said that we had been moving to contact players and their teams and had the OK from everyone belonging to teams that came to play (T/N unsure from who he got the OK exactly... EG and WW or all the teams playing in ATC) and the league itself. He does not budge (despite being contradicting his own boss) and asks me to wait for one day, so he could talk to TaKe and other TakeTV admins. The next day, I return to speak to the admin he said yes, we can play with those signings: "Word of TaKe" he says. Then the admin sends a mail that informs all managers of all the teams about the changes, hoping that "(T/N they?) can live with it in some way" and hopes to "accept this decision, which has been very difficult to make ". In this mail I thought the admin was reporting something that was not right.



After the mail, the managers of two teams who answer by saying that it's not okay, it's against the rules since we are not a real team and also would be playing with 3 jokers. I tell them that's true, but we just tried to stay in the league with the same number of players we had before and even with players of the same race, so that the league can continue with as few changes as possible. However, they are still on their heels, giving rise to some other team will join the protests and that the admin change (T/N should change or changes?) his mind again.



Now the head admin of TakeTV appears and we're speaking about the subject with him. He tells us it is impossible to go on with these two signings. We tried to continue to speak but it was his final decision, so I finally had to tell sortof and Thorzain they couldn't play. Some teams proposed that the league could continue with allowing everyone to revive a player on each playday so that we could finish the league with 3 players. Quickly, the admins and some teams discarded the solution, clinging to the existing revive number rule of per season (which is 2).



After this, we tried to propose several solutions. The first was to continue doing one or two signings of players who were completely teamless, so that we would be a team of teamless players + 1 joker: Socke. This, in my point of view, does not contradict any league rule. However, they also told us that it is not possible, since it does not meet the league admins' definition of an "ideal" team and we weren't a team / organization really.



This responded to a group of people without computer that attached to play the league, having played most of them eight days and have always strictly complied schedules and keeping the same manager, could play quietly with the obligations of the league as the other teams, as we had done so far. But nothing, no way. (T/N I think he said: Some teams have argued for Karont3 that they had never any problems playing with them, so they should be able to continue to play as before)



We decided to propose another solution: continue to do without signings and additional revives, using me as the 4th player, so we would not give a defwin in each match. The same four people who had played under the tag of Karont3, unchanged, except for a name change. In this new proposal, the response was that they could not do that because "a match of a professional player vs Ryo would not be interesting for spectators and would be unfair" and therefore we did not have enough players to continue.



After that we tried to follow up by explaining them that it was better to not disappear from the league after finishing second, forfeiting all our previous matches and leaving the league with a team less midseason. In addition, we were the same as we had been throughout the league, we had met every team once, and we wanted to continue even with no signings, since our 3 players were eager to continue and we could have even reached the final as could be seen with our win against Acer.



After speaking with the head admin for the last time, I said that in a few hours I need to get a definitive answer. After a while, I was given notice that we are out of the league and that this decision is final, and we are not meeting the definition of an "ideal" team for them. At that time I gave examples of some teams that played in the American qualifier for ATC that aren't professional teams and I asked him to explain how we are different from them. At that time the admin disconnects in skype and and went missing. I have not heard from him since then. Socke and VIPRO have tried talking to them on their own, but nothing, we're out.



My personal opinion about this is that after losing VortiX and Luci, some teams would have liked had that we would disappear, which benefits everyone except MVP (the only we have not spoken about it, to my knowledge) and increased their chances to get into the top 4 (playoffs). Seeing that this was not about to happen, and that we would continue with a good team that even could beat Acer with 3 players, they decided to put pressure on the admins for us being expelled, and the admins caved in and did their part.



At the end of the day, we were the small team. Shame, as LoLvsxD, Socke and VIPRO wanted to continue, but just have to leave. In the end all I asked for was to allow us to continue to play as the same we had so far, except with two players less, without breaking any rules or anything special. Simply continue. But as I said, we have left (T/N probably: We were forced to leave). And not because we have not tried since, as you see, we have tried everything.



You already see that the string of excuses (T/N we got) have been very mixed, and that the admins have been passing the ball to each other until the final outcome. The reasons have to do with rules which is acceptable. Although this situation is exceptional I can understand they did not want to make exceptions to the rules, even though there are teams that are weeks late in their schedule and it seems that nothing happens, or that my brothers could have played immediately and without any problem with their new team after playing with us (where are the two (T/N play-)days of penalty in this case?). However, the last reason I found no justification to lend weight to a league team, not even close (T/N unsure what he wants to say).



Anyway, just to say thanks to all who have followed us all the way. Sorry we can not continue, because we believe that there were chances to get to the playoffs, especially after the match against Acer. Also thanks to the 3 players that we had, we have been trying to continue our path in the league, and also thanks to TaKe, which gave me the impression of being the only one of the admins I spoke to who used common sense and he really wanted us to continue, but I suppose being surrounded by so many people you have to accept what the majority says. Greetings!

Correction of my translation byMy original translation: