MrTeal



Offline



Activity: 1274

Merit: 1000







LegendaryActivity: 1274Merit: 1000 Re: centralized post of pirate payouts or other related news to the closing. August 26, 2012, 07:48:52 PM #206 Quote from: P4man on August 26, 2012, 07:40:18 PM Quote from: Piper67 on August 26, 2012, 07:36:45 PM But, but, but... if he had the resources to pull off a 51% attack... wouldn't he already be rich and powerful and not need to pull a ponzi scheme?



IM not saying its a 51% attack, but if it were, when would be the best time to cash in? WHen BTC value and market depth peaks, and you can sell soon to be worthless coins for as much as possible hard dollars. So he could sell his 500K coins now, then publish his alternate chain, and pay back as much BTC interest as he wants.

IM not saying its a 51% attack, but if it were, when would be the best time to cash in? WHen BTC value and market depth peaks, and you can sell soon to be worthless coins for as much as possible hard dollars. So he could sell his 500K coins now, then publish his alternate chain, and pay back as much BTC interest as he wants.

[wild conspiracy theory]Imagine how much of a soap opera it would be if it turned out that Pirate and Vladimir were working together. Pirate borrows the coins needed to cash out and spends part of it to finish funding Vlad's planned ASIC farm, and Vlad uses his new 50TH/s to recover the BTC for almost no cost to repay investors.[/wild conspiracy theory] [wild conspiracy theory]Imagine how much of a soap opera it would be if it turned out that Pirate and Vladimir were working together. Pirate borrows the coins needed to cash out and spends part of it to finish funding Vlad's planned ASIC farm, and Vlad uses his new 50TH/s to recover the BTC for almost no cost to repay investors.[/wild conspiracy theory]

DeathAndTaxes

Legendary



Offline



Activity: 1218

Merit: 1007





Gerald Davis







DonatorLegendaryActivity: 1218Merit: 1007Gerald Davis Re: centralized post of pirate payouts or other related news to the closing. August 26, 2012, 07:53:42 PM #207 Quote from: P4man on August 26, 2012, 07:40:18 PM Quote from: Piper67 on August 26, 2012, 07:36:45 PM But, but, but... if he had the resources to pull off a 51% attack... wouldn't he already be rich and powerful and not need to pull a ponzi scheme?



IM not saying its a 51% attack, but if it were, when would be the best time to cash in? WHen BTC value and market depth peaks, and you can sell soon to be worthless coins for as much as possible hard dollars. So he could sell his 500K coins now, then publish his alternate chain, and pay back as much BTC interest as he wants.

IM not saying its a 51% attack, but if it were, when would be the best time to cash in? WHen BTC value and market depth peaks, and you can sell soon to be worthless coins for as much as possible hard dollars. So he could sell his 500K coins now, then publish his alternate chain, and pay back as much BTC interest as he wants.

There is nowhere he could spend 500K BTC that he wouldn't get caught. The only place which could handle that kind of action would be MtGox. Now lets pretend it is his goal to send 500K BTC to MtGox, exchange it for dollars, and cause a 51% to return the coins to himself. If he sold 500K BTC on the exchange the USD would be limited to MtGox AML policies and it would be kinda obvious when the 51% attack occurs. At the highest level MtGox requires notarized document with an apostle seal from the state and even then it is limited to only $100K per day. To unload 500K BTC would require almost 60 days. Of course in 60 days he won't owe 500K BTC he would owe 908K BTC. So even if he managed to rob MtGox of $6M (sent to his bank account by bank wire, and his identity confirmed w/ notorized docs approved by the State of TX). He would now owe creditors more than the amount he stole.



Now hypothetically he could REPAY THE INVESTORS FIRST, then do a 51% attack and in the alt-chain he doesn't repay the investors and instead sends the coins back to himself. Still to do that would require him actually having the 500K BTC. That 500K number is on paper only. It never existed. It includes weeks and months of compounded ponzi interest. Even if he didn't spend a single coin he likely has half that or maybe a third of that. Of course 500K BTC isn't enough to pay the creditors. He now owes ~546K BTC and that number is increasing by 5000 BTC per day (or ~4 BTC per minute). So hypothetically if he did have 500K BTC AND the ability to pull off a 51% attack he would still be short.



There is nowhere he could spend 500K BTC that he wouldn't get caught. The only place which could handle that kind of action would be MtGox. Now lets pretend it is his goal to send 500K BTC to MtGox, exchange it for dollars, and cause a 51% to return the coins to himself. If he sold 500K BTC on the exchange the USD would be limited to MtGox AML policies and it would be kinda obvious when the 51% attack occurs. At the highest level MtGox requires notarized document with an apostle seal from the state and even then it is limited to only $100K per day. To unload 500K BTC would require almost 60 days. Of course in 60 days he won't owe 500K BTC he would owe 908K BTC. So even if he managed to rob MtGox of $6M (sent to his bank account by bank wire, and his identity confirmed w/ notorized docs approved by the State of TX). He would now owe creditors more than the amount he stole.Now hypothetically he could REPAY THE INVESTORS FIRST, then do a 51% attack and in the alt-chain he doesn't repay the investors and instead sends the coins back to himself. Still to do that would require him actually having the 500K BTC. That 500K number is on paper only. It never existed. It includes weeks and months of compounded ponzi interest. Even if he didn't spend a single coin he likely has half that or maybe a third of that. Of course 500K BTC isn't enough to pay the creditors. He now owes ~546K BTC and that number is increasing by 5000 BTC per day (or ~4 BTC per minute). So hypothetically if he did have 500K BTC AND the ability to pull off a 51% attack he would still be short.

DeathAndTaxes

Legendary



Offline



Activity: 1218

Merit: 1007





Gerald Davis







DonatorLegendaryActivity: 1218Merit: 1007Gerald Davis Re: centralized post of pirate payouts or other related news to the closing. August 26, 2012, 08:02:02 PM #213 Quote from: P4man on August 26, 2012, 07:58:57 PM He could own 10 million BTC tomorrow if has a longer blockchain. They may not be worth a lot of dollars but it would let hem repay his debt as promised.



51% attack wouldn't give him the ability to own coins he doesn't have the private keys to.



Quote Fair enough, but if he sold or is about to sell the actual coins he received, its still a tangible (pun intended) sum of money. It certainly is but it wouldn't involve repaying anyone or a 51% attack.



Step 1) Acquire coins

Step 2) Sell coins

Step 3) There is no need for step three you already have ~$1M gift wrapped and handed to you by idiots (assume ~100K real coins deposited and sold @ avg price of $10 ea).





Quote disclaimer: Im not seriously arguing pirate is doing a 51% attack, but I just want to show how it could theoretically fit what we know. Oh I understand that I am just saying even with an imaginary 51% attack he still wouldn't have the potential to pull it off (or at least not at a profit). If he had to do all those and still lose a huge sum of money it would be far easier to just walk away with a guaranteed profit. 51% attack wouldn't give him the ability to own coins he doesn't have the private keys to.It certainly is but it wouldn't involve repaying anyone or a 51% attack.Step 1) Acquire coinsStep 2) Sell coinsStep 3) There is no need for step three you already have ~$1M gift wrapped and handed to you by idiots (assume ~100K real coins deposited and sold @ avg price of $10 ea).Oh I understand that I am just saying even with an imaginary 51% attack he still wouldn't have the potential to pull it off (or at least not at a profit). If he had to do all those and still lose a huge sum of money it would be far easier to just walk away with a guaranteed profit.