TONY JONES, PRESENTER: Larissa Waters is the Greens Senator for Queensland. She was elected as co-Deputy Leader of the party today, sharing that role with West Australian Senator Scott Ludlam. She joins us now Canberra.

Thanks for being there.

LARISSA WATERS, CO-DEPUTY LEADER, GREENS: Hi, there, Tony.

TONY JONES: What are you going to miss most about Christine Milne?

LARISSA WATERS: Oh, look, it's been an absolute honour to work with Christine for the last three years. She is the warmest, smartest and funniest person that I know in this game and she's kept that good humour and determination and focus on positive long-term outcomes for the community for her 25 years in politics. The woman's just a force. And she is so dear to all of us. We're really going to miss her. But thrilled to have the opportunity to start a new chapter for our party. And Richard Di Natale, who's a good friend to us all, is going to do a sterling job. So it's a sad day, but it's an exciting day for us too.

TONY JONES: OK. Alright. You know not everyone feels exactly the same way about Christine Milne, nor the Greens, for that matter. We like to engage with social media on this program, so the Defence Minister Kevin Andrews sent a question on Twitter today: "Does it really matter who will lead the freedom-hating Greens, with their anti-family and community-destroying policies?"

LARISSA WATERS: Mmm. Well I was really disappointed by that Tweet and I thought, paradoxically, the Prime Minister showed a bit more grace in the way he responded to Christine's announcement.

TONY JONES: Well he might think he's got a chance of the getting something out of you, like, for example, a vote on the fuel excise increase, for example. Do you think he's got any hope there? Or has Kevin Andrews destroyed it?

LARISSA WATERS: Well, no, we're bigger people than that. But just firstly on Kevin Andrews's bizarre Tweet, I think it's family-hating to be cutting support services for single parents and the unemployed. So I think he should probably have a bit of a look at his own party's policies if he's concerned about the future of families. But in terms of the Budget, this is a real opportunity for the Government next week to severely change direction after last month's budget, which was an absolute attack on the sick, the young, the poor and the vulnerable. What an opportunity that they now have to turn the focus on raising revenue from the big end of town, who can afford to contribute more. I hope that they take this opportunity, but if they don't, then we Greens will continue to fight in the Parliament to protect people and to look after the planet better than this government has been doing.

TONY JONES: OK. And what an opportunity for the new leadership to prove its pragmatism by allowing the Government to put a - or to increase in fact a tax on fuel with the fuel excise. Do you think you'll do that?

LARISSA WATERS: Well, on the fuel tax, the partyroom took a unanimous decision on this and we stand by that and the reason for that is Joe Hockey said at the time and has continued to say all along that the money that would've been raised from increasing the fuel excise was going to go to build new roads and urban highways, for more cars, so that people could sit in more congestion, burn more petrol and create more pollution and waste more time in a commute. There's no sense in that sort of approach.

TONY JONES: OK, so briefly on this 'cause we don't have a huge amount of time, so does that mean that unless the way the money's going to be spent changes, you will keep that vote and keep voting against increasing the fuel tax excise - or fuel excise?

LARISSA WATERS: We said at the time that if the money was going to be used for public transport, then we would consider that. The Government's given us absolutely no truck in that regard and that remains our view. It's up to the Government now to change course.

TONY JONES: OK. Let's go to this new leadership. Do you think that the party is essentially turning its back on the old Tasmanian roots and going not only more pragmatic, but more national with its new leadership team?

LARISSA WATERS: Look, I'm really thrilled to have the opportunity to be part of a team that has representatives now from Victoria, from Western Australia and from my home state of Queensland. I think this really reflects the fact that we've grown and matured as a party. And it's an exciting time and I look forward to us continuing to speak for the vulnerable and to stand up for the planet in the Parliament like we've been doing ever since we began in this place.

TONY JONES: And - well your new leader's talking about going mainstream, but do you think mainstream Australians would actually be more comfortable with a party that's more transparent about how it chooses its leadership?

LARISSA WATERS: Oh, look, we've run a wonderful process and today it happened just the same way as it happened last time. We followed the rules ...

TONY JONES: Yeah, behind the scenes, behind closed doors, with no-one founding out who voted for who or why they did or what happened to the former Deputy Leader or any explanation as to why the party itself has no role in the vote.

LARISSA WATERS: That's not the case. Tony. No, look, that's not the case. We've been completely transparent about today's process. We were elected unopposed and unanimously. Everybody had the chance to nominate and I know our Deputy, Adam Bandt, who has done a sterling job, first at taking the seat of Melbourne and then holding the seat of Melbourne and being Deputy to Christine, he has the good fortune to be becoming a father in a few weeks. And so he decided not to nominate for either of those leadership roles and we've all thanked him for his service.

TONY JONES: Some have speculated that he just - he didn't get a heads-up about it. Did you get a heads-up? Did you know in advance and did Richard Di Natale know in advance to be able to organise the numbers to get the leadership? That Christine Milne was going to resign? Because it came as a surprise, apparently, to everyone else.

LARISSA WATERS: Well, look, certainly we've known that Christine is not going to be around for another decade, another two decades. She's put in 25 years to politics already. So, clearly, it was something that we had thought about. But I'm really excited that today, we used the process that we've used in the past and we've spoken to the membership about whether they wanted to change that process and have a bit more of a say themselves in electing the leader. They chose to stick with the process that we've got and we used that today and we've come out with a unanimous result that's an exciting new chapter for our party.

TONY JONES: OK. Looking back at Christine Milne's legacy, when she controlled, effectively controlled the climate change agenda, she advised the Greens to vote against an emissions trading legislation in 2009 in the Senate. It went down. She then helped force Prime Minister Julia Gillard into what most political analysts would say was a suicidal pact with the Greens, have a five-year carbon tax. Is the new leadership team likely to be more pragmatic and less kind of hardline than the team that did those things?

LARISSA WATERS: Oh, look, I don't think you can say that that was hardline. With the CPRS, we know it was a system that had incredibly low ambitions and was designed to lock in a pathetic pollution reduction target that was going to be very difficult to increase because of the way the legals were set up. And of course, we tried to speak with the Government and the Opposition at the time, and the then Opposition, Tony Abbott, used that as an opportunity to simply change the leadership and turned it into some political spectacle. With the carbon price that was working so well and already bringing down emissions at this crucial time in history ...

TONY JONES: It was working so well at bringing down a prime minister and a government as well.

LARISSA WATERS: Well, it was working to address pollution and to safeguard our future for us all and was about to make that transition to the emissions trading scheme portion of the system. I think it's a real shame that the current Prime Minister used a base three-word slogan and fear-mongering and denial of the science about the climate, which is something that is going to change the face of this planet. I think that's really tragic, that he's reduced it and debased it so much that we're now in the situation we're in. But I am confident that Australia can't put its fingers in its ears for much longer and the rest of the world is moving so quickly to transition to clean renewable energy, which is job-rich and we know can work and doesn't make climate change worse or threaten our agricultural productivity or our Reef. We'll get back there again, Tony.

TONY JONES: OK. Have you sat down with your parliamentary colleagues to work out or try to analyse why the Greens actually lost so much of their vote, from 12 per cent in 2010 down to 8.7 in the elections in 2013? Have you thought about why this is and is there anything you can do about it?

LARISSA WATERS: Look, I actually think that it was a fantastic result at the last election. When the tide was coming in for Tony Abbott's party, we not only held on to all of our seats, but we added another senator to our team in Janet Rice for Victoria. So we've increased our numbers ...

TONY JONES: Yes, but as Senator Di Natale pointed out, that was sort of clever politics, but the raw numbers tell you your vote went down a lot and there must be a reason for that. Have you thought about why your vote went down and is there anything you can do to change that?

LARISSA WATERS: Well it was clever focusing of our strategy on where we felt we could do best and offer that representation to the community and it was a successful strategy because we're a team of 11 now in this parliament. We've continued to share that influential role. We now share it with a few others in this place as well. But we've continued to go up and up every election, Tony and we've just seen in recent state elections ...

TONY JONES: Well you went down and down the last time - that's the point. I mean, your representation went up, but your actual vote went down.

LARISSA WATERS: Well in recent state elections, we've really brought it home. We've just seen the election of our first regional member in New South Wales as well as some additional folk to the Lower House, we had our highest-ever result in a state election in Queensland and we did incredibly well in Victoria before that. So, it's a slow-and-steady increase for us Greens. We've been here for many decades and we plan to be here for many decades to come.

TONY JONES: OK. As we saw earlier in the program, the Labor Party's headed for some tough debates at its national conference. They've just put out their party platform and it does indicate the left has sort of lost out on the asylum seeker issue. I mean, if those debates keep going and you obviously want to steal the progressive - as you seem to be saying, the progressive vote or the progressive voters from the Labor Party, do you see that as fertile ground, that kind of argument going on inside the Labor Party conference?

LARISSA WATERS: Well, we want to give voice to the Australians who don't think that you should lock up children and who can accept that Australia is a multicultural community that is made so much stronger by that diversity and who see that there are other ways of us embracing our international obligations and helping people who are seeking asylum because they are fleeing from situations that most of us have the good fortune to never have to face.

TONY JONES: OK, that's - I mean, that's your Green principles. I'm just talking about the politics now. Very briefly, do you see a fight within the Labor Party as fertile ground for Green recruitment?

LARISSA WATERS: Oh, look, I think it's tragic that the Labor Party has gotten closer and closer to Tony Abbott's way of demonising people seeking asylum to the extent of referring to them incorrectly as "illegals" and calling people, human beings and children, by a number. I'm deeply disappointed that the Labor Party have followed Tony Abbott down that path. And I hope for the sake of this nation and our big heart that I believe we have, that they can change that perspective. It sounds today as if they've not taken that opportunity. I would urge them to rethink that for the good of the country.

TONY JONES: Larissa Waters, thanks very much. Congratulations on your new leadership role and I'm sure we'll see you again in the future. Thanks for joining us.

LARISSA WATERS: Thanks. Thanks, Tony.