"When you've got negotiations with your employer about your wage, you don't have any power. Do you know what I mean?" she said to him.

"So if the National Government says, 'The adult minimum wage is going to be $16.50', there's no incentive for a company to raise the wages of their workers if they are doing well."

Mr English replied, saying, "The point you make, I think, is the opposite of what we were talking about before. We will continue to increase the minimum wage."

She interrupted saying, "You've raised it $3.75 over nine years. Now, how would you like it if your hourly rate went up $3.75 over a period of nine years?"

Mr English said, "Look, it would be quite a challenge. No doubt about that."

"I tell you what. It's a huge challenge," she said.

"That's why we keep these consistent moderate increases flowing through, because that's how the wages, that's how the floor rises," Mr English said.

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