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<Dudewmc> That is more power then a central bank...

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<TAiS46> hey

<Guest65302> Hi

<galge> @mintz yes they did in podcast 4, haven't heard number 5 yet

<Evilmax> hi TAiS46

<Divine___> he's alive

<mintz> hey you're not the troll fro mthe other night are you?

<c0rw1n> hi TAiS46

<TAiS46> open for some questions, lets go :)

<ikbenwouter> hi TAiS46

<Xang_> hi tais46, any news ?

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<ikbenwouter> good to hear from you, good luck with everything is all I have to say ;)

<galge> Hello TAiS46

<PeehsNoic> sry guys i really like bitcoin and i have almost 90% of my money stored as btc @ btc24 so i don't try to scare people or something but this all came to my mind yesterday and i wasn't sure if i should talk about it... but i had to

<PeehsNoic> wow

<PeehsNoic> hi tais

<Guest65302> TAiS46: nice to see you again in chat

<Mannn> Ooh, look at that btc price crash

<Divine___> TAIS46: I think the burning question is, how do plan to take it from here? Any schedule?

<Evilmax> tais we need answers

<TAiS46> first: I am working to get out the BTC from your accounts. little login page with the withdrawal function. but I must reset all password, because much people logged in into a scam page -.-

<Evilmax> no questions

<mintz> How do we know it's actually him? - Someone was trolling pretending to be him the other night.

<PeehsNoic> he got op

<Dudewmc> mintz did he have @?

<TAiS46> i am just answering simple questions :P i am the real simon

<darkee> then they managed to take over his nickserv account since he was opped here now... so prolly him

<Guest65302> TAiS46: The new server is ok again?

<mintz> ok

<EwwSup> he could sent 0.0001 btc to a randome adress :)

<Casimir1904> hi TAiS46 could you leave some ops here....

<TAiS46> Guest65302: yes all fine

<TAiS46> Casimir1904: sure

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<mintz> you said the video was a joke?

<PeehsNoic> i got a question: Why did the hotwallet start to pay out btc tonight? And why is there a satoshidice transaction? ^^

<darkee> TAiS46: so for now bitcoin withdrawals will be made possible but eur/usd withdrawals will probably have to wait due to bank account issues, I'm assuming?

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<z3c0> TAiS46: how was the trade rollback implemented, was everything rolled back to a certain point in time or was it more surgical?

<Casimir1904> i said also it didnt confirm about 1000 times last days and that double trades showed up for 10:00 CET

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<Evilmax> tais about euro?

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<Dudewmc> PeehsNoic +1 about hotwallet

<Dudewmc> and satoshi :P

<dafuqer> i second z3c0 as i would like to know if i have btc or euro on the site ;)

<Xang_> Tais, what about SEPA sent to the PL bank and not yet added to btc24 accout ?

<amyntor> "TAiS46: how was the trade rollback implemented, was everything rolled back to a certain point in time or was it more surgical?" I was just about to ask the same.

<Casimir1904> he is the real TAiS46 his bnc and also nickserv identify else no auto op :-)

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<galge> @TAiS46 1. Why have you been so slow at giving info? 2. why no info at the site but only here and at reddit? 3. can you give us copies of all the documents your lawyer is writing as well as communications you have recieved from your bank(s)?

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<Casimir1904> thx

<TAiS46> z3c0: only the trades wich where made double

<TAiS46> to the hotwallet tonight:

<TAiS46> after I set the site offline, where where 0 bitcoin left on the hotwallet but open withdrawals

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<dafuqer> TAiS46: was there trading after the site went offline? (api?)

<TAiS46> some user (i dont know who) send bitcoins to the hotwallet! and the server started to send out the BTC to the users!

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<TAiS46> dafuqer: not directly but after a few hours

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<Casimir1904> the same user sended before also btc to the hotwallet...

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<Dudewmc> ok thanks TAiS46, but there were also users here who had this situation, but still no btc from the hotwallet.

<DikkieDik> TAIS46 the withdraw site you are working on, will you reset the passwords?

<PeehsNoic> so someone send ~400btc to the hotwallet for fun?

<ikbenwouter> DikkieDik, he already answered yes to that question ;)

<guidebook> Hi TAiS46! I started a SEPA EUR withdrawal on March 9, got the confirmation email on April 4 but I haven't received anything. Is this ok? Is my money safe?

<Dudewmc> DikkieDik Yes, he just said so

<PeehsNoic> (not caring about loosing it all)

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<z3c0> interesting, the wallet from which the 465 BTC came from was already involved with the btc24 hotwallet in February, but not exclusively

<DikkieDik> thanks Wouter, I came in too late.

<ikbenwouter> no worries

<TAiS46> DikkieDik: i must as i said. some users logged in into a scam site and they steal the password from the users. or I will make an email / sms confirmation like it was.

<DikkieDik> OK, good job, thanks

<Casimir1904> yes the phising site was repeated yesterday here after every join, to bad no op was here...

<l-b> http://blockchain.info/de/tx/4b1f4714ae21662f3cd7e6d03d3f1f4f94eeff3c6ef460a7536f006e7d320d1d

<guidebook> March 29, not 9, sorry

<Casimir1904> and freenode staff did nothing

<c0rw1n> yes, there have been two or three phishing attempts already

<wwww> Your German account is not frozen, so can we withdraw EUR SEPA sent to that account?

<Flaz> TAiS46> Why don't you post updates directly on the website bitcoin24?

<Xang_> Tais, you must update the news in the official website, a lot of people don't read reddit

<l-b> ^ please!!

<stackofcats> TAiS46, is there anything we as users/customers can do to speed up the process of unfreezing the bank account(s)?

<Casimir1904> the german account has limits what TAiS46 wrote also on reddit

<DikkieDik> Perhaps a small link to reddit on the bitcoin-24 site would be a good idea?

<PeehsNoic> let him some time to think guys ;)

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<djesys1> TAIS, any ETA when the provisional site for withdrawing BTC will be up ?

<Casimir1904> should we +m the channel and give voice to small group of people in a row?

<Flaz> TAiS46> A lot of people also would like to know who is legally reprensenting you or at least have an official statement. Indeed until there we can unfortunately only blindly trust you.

<waynerr__> TAiS46, nobody can login right now and change any data i guess, then just force a new pass for everyone

<TAiS46> stackofcats: i will ask my lawyer if you can directly write to poland or something

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<stackofcats> thx

<Dudewmc> TAiS46: What about users that had BTC withdrawals pending, and approved through email or sms, but have not received the funds in their wallet? Also not after the strange refill today. Do those funds appear back in your system? Or are they stuck in the payout queue waiting for another hotwallet refill?

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<PeehsNoic> Casimir1904: +1 for moderated Q/A

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<lassdas> so, when your bank account receives dirty money, it's "NOT YOUR PROBLEM" (with your own words), but when stupid users login to a scam site and get their passwords phished, it IS your problem? dats funny

<amyntor> @Dudewmc good question!

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<galge> TAiS46: Is it possible for you to post all the communication between you and the banks and lawyers and everything? (Of course removing any personal info)

<Casimir1904> lassdas, sending dirty money is something you cant prevent without user verification and deny payment from non matching accounts

<PeehsNoic> @dudewmc +1 from a friend of mine

<Flaz> +1 galge

<Casimir1904> against known phising you can

<TAiS46> Flaz: i am in contact everyday with my lawyer. i can not publish much news at this moment he says. I will ask him if I can publish the information from my lawyer. we had some people sittig in poland (WDR TV) and maybe we will make a press release on the newspaper, we have also contact to internet press and will also publish later there some information, but first we must get back the BZWBK bank account

<waynerr__> lassdas, especially as its super easy to just transfer money without ever giving personal information ...

<davidoz_> sounds pretty counter productiv to make media buzz about it.

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<TAiS46> Dudewmc: I must think about it. maybe I will reset this withdrawals. it should be better i think if someone pay an invoice with this bitcoins and the bitcoins will then double send or something like this.

<waynerr__> lassdas, just go to local post office and transfer <500euro to any account without ever showing any ID

<TAiS46> galge: i must ask my lawyer tomorrow

<lassdas> you guys don't get it

<DikkieDik> lassdas is there any good reason not to protect the stupid users who entered their credentials? Is the phissing site yours perhaps?

<Casimir1904> specialy in germany you can fill in paper wire transfers with bank details you get somewhere from and good chance bank dont check the signature

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<Dudewmc> ok thx TAiS46

<TAiS46> little information. i THINK the biggest exchange has the same problems but i am not sure and can tell it to 100%! i have contact with the CEO and the lawyer of them

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<mintz> so what about the video of double trades going back months, you said it was a joke?

<moebiusz> i know that at least 1 more exchange has his back account closed

<PeehsNoic> i guess that's why the biggest exchange have a qeue of ~10k users waiting to be verified ;)

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<wwww_> Tais: Some of us are scared these money laundering charges are serious and the Polish account will stay frozen for a long time, what makes you confident you can get it back?

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<Flaz_> Well that's maybe not a good thing to leak

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<galge> @TAiS46: Right. Good stuff. I really hope you have great success. I just want to know because it is interesting to the bitcoin community how these letters/emails go back and forth and what kind of legal issues, language etc are involved. If you could relese all the communication it would be incredibly useful for all the people wanting to start up exchanges or any kind of bitcoin business.

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<djesys1> TAIS, please give us an ETA when site for withdrawing BTC will be UP

<worriedGuy> hi

<warefare> @TAiS46: Will you add a verification system in the future as suggested by some users on Reddit? Would make sense I think

<worriedGuy> i heared that our money is safe... thats great.

<Casimir1904> you cant just release all informations and communication, this could create terrible problems you can't imagine...

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<Flaz_> Well some extracts at least then

<c0rw1n> redact them, send to wikileaks, trololo

<TAiS46> wwww_: the bank account was first closed for 72 hours! i got no informations from my bank and think it was only a techical issue. after that I got the information, what my bank account is closed for 3 month now! but we had 7 days to make an objection! and as I can read, the polish bank has no reason to close the bank account. I will censor some lines in the mail from them and publish it tomorrow!

<Casimir1904> what would it change for the users?

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<TAiS46> warefare: if we had a verification in the past, the same thing did be happen, i am sure ;)

<davidoz_> they dont need a reason

<Flaz_> Most trust and confidence in the process that's being led in the background (not to say the shadows)

<davidoz_> they can just end the business with you.

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<Casimir1904> TAiS46, check the censored version with your lawyer before , better release one day later but sure they cant take action against you because of that

<TAiS46> caqa

<TAiS46> Casimir1904: sure, i will do it

<stackofcats> davidoz_: yes, but they cannot just ground the money in there

<mintz> can you release the BTC asap

<moebiusz> TAiS46: What did you mean by saying "It is time for something new. A new big business and a very serious Company, which can not be fuc***! We will be back for sure!" Are you considering closing bitcoin24 and starting a new exchange

<wwww_> so right now its already frozen for 3 months :(

<davidoz_> that is true stackofcats :)

<galge> @Casimir1904: I only meant what will not cause problems. Also I'm not fuzzed if it is released a month from now,but I still think it is very interesting to read this kind of stuff.

<z3c0> TAiS46: if an ETA for the different stages isn't viable right now, could we at least stipulate that you'll give a short-term schedule before certain functions of the site come back online? (as not to surprise people and catch them off guard)

<Flaz_> 3 months. A very interesting information that we did not have.

<Casimir1904> no its frozen for 3 months but with time to react within 7 days to the case

<Casimir1904> the information was on reddit also before...

<waveydave> TAiS46, thanks for your efforts to get this sorted. :)

<c0rw1n> is the time now still within those 7 days?

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<wwww_> yes but its already frozen, now Tais needs to provide some great reason as to why they should unfreeze...

<Flaz_> TAis46> Would it help if all users sent you "verification" material (ID, proff of residency, origin of moneu) ?

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<godzilla123> TAiS46 maybe you have answered this, but when can we expect to get our btc back.

<TAiS46> moebiusz: no, not closing btc24, but we have new partners, good lawyer which will make an bank account with us together, make new contracts with the banks specified to bitcoin and so on! we also planning new projects, but this has no priority at this moment. the first think is to get the bank account bank!!!

<waveydave> I am waiting only for a pending withdrawal. Any timeframe for these to be actioned?

<PeehsNoic> TAiS46: Did I understand it right, that you're planning to resume trading? I really liked you're platform and i find it extremely important that there is an alternative to mtgox. Also when you're talking about btc24 2.0 what exactly do you mean? Total rewrite? If so, what do you expect when it will be launched? (Just a rough estimate: week, month, year?)

<waveydave> Ah, godzilla123 beat me by moments

<TAiS46> z3c0: my lawyer told me, that it is no good idea to tell an ETA. If i say friday, and the bank account is not open, the people will start to fight again ;)

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<TAiS46> godzilla123: yes, we are workin on it and try to publish a withdrawal page tomorrow

<Divine___> so does that mean that some of the services like cash via DHL will be reconsidered?

<godzilla123> TAiS46 thanks thats good info. Hope it hold up tomorrow

<TAiS46> Flaz_: I don't think that it would help and it has also not helped in the past

<Evilmax> tais what about euro withdraw?

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<wwww_> How confident is your lawyer that you can get the account unfrozen this week, small % chance or high possibility? Give us an idea

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<z3c0> TAiS46: I understand that, I merely mean if you're ready to start something within the next couple of hours (whenever that will be) you'll give us a heads up as soon as you're certain

<Evilmax> i have only euro there

<Casimir1904> the euro withdraw problem already told about on reddit and also here

<phlogiston> TAiS46 thanks for keeping a calm and positive mentality while everyone goes total chaos and sorting this problem out properly.

<Casimir1904> not possible as long account closed

<Evilmax> ok

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<worriedGuy> tais46 and thanks for showing up in here, and finally (after 5 days or so) saying something about the bug

<Casimir1904> not closed frozen

<Evilmax> so...i can buy btc and then withdraw them?

<Dudewmc> if this is really TAiS46, then i truly think he is the real deal. An internet cowboy caught up in the world that is not ready for this new age. He is (after some delay, but still) facing up to the monsters and fighting his way out. It feels like a movie :P

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<TAiS46> PeehsNoic: yes, someone is working on 2.0 but it will be more performance, not much change in the system. maybe a little design change

<Casimir1904> Evilmax, no one will sell his btc to euro when euro withdraw isnt possible...

<mintz> they will make a movie about Bitcoin in a few years I think.

<c0rw1n> ... and we can't sell frozen euros for btc either

<Flaz_> TAiS46: What is the plan in the case we cannot get the polish account unfrozen?

<Evilmax> maybe someone...

<Xang_> TAiS46: what about SEPA sent to the PL bank last week ?

<galge> @TAiS46: kudis for shutting up about ETA. We DONT need another BFL...

<godzilla123> A withdrawl form would be great. We can wait for 2.0 after that

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<galge> **kudos

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<Casimir1904> about eta all is said

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<TAiS46> Flaz_: we will! i have big contacts in poland now. also to the one, who closed the bank account. the germans asked ONLY for help from the polish government! and they agreed and closed the bank account. as I sayed, it is really no big problem the german had! i don't know why they are doing this! its really crazy, i try to say tomorrow more, but must aks my lawyer

<Casimir1904> <TAiS46> z3c0: my lawyer told me, that it is no good idea to tell an ETA. If i say friday, and the bank account is not open, the people will start to fight again ;)

<phlogiston_> Think of it as a euro cold wallet :)

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<TAiS46> Xang_: they will be deposit on your account asap the page is online again

<godzilla123> TAiS46 just sort it out and btc24 will regain its respect slowly back

<amyntor> @TAiS46 what about open orders? are they canceled, or do you you plan to let users cancel them?

<Evilmax> who has btc on btc24...could sell them for an high price and take the risk

<Wxll> Hey TAiS46 nice of you to drop in to give an update, I hope you're doing well and things go well in progress

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<M3n70r_> Hi Simon, i`ve deposited 100 EUR for the 1st time on your german account. can you please tell me if you have recieved the payment? can you post money back or at least give me some hope i haven`t lost em? reference note is : mentor 2430396

<PeehsNoic> TAiS46: good to hear that! i don't know if i'm talking for everybody but at least for me you restored all trust in btc24 by appearing here! THANK YOU! It's a important thing for the BTC community to have someone running an exchange while beeing trustworthy. I even don't trust mtGox so congratulations ;)

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<Flaz> TAiS46: Thanks for your answer

<TAiS46> amyntor: i must think about it. maybe i will start the page without traing function for 12 hours. so the users can cancel the orders and place new one. after that the traing will start again, or i will cancel all trades before starting

<galge> @Casimir1904 +1 In these kind of situations ETA is impossible.

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<worriedGuy> Tais46 i'd really urge you to consider the withdrawing thing.. if it turns out, that money is lost in the polish account, it might be fairer, to let all users share the losses, not only the ones that were on EUR at the second it happend, or the ones that deposited money that wasn't put into there account fast enough

<worriedGuy> Tais and i would suggest to cancle all trades.. 12 hours might not be enough time for everyone

<Casimir1904> better cancel all orders, gives only more crying when some ordes executed for the last price...

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<Casimir1904> remember it was €80-90 at the moment of shutdown

<godzilla123> TAiS46 can you also let us know to what date will it be rolled back.

<TAiS46> i am trying really really everythiny to bet BTC24 online! i am traveling around the "world" to lawyer in poland, germany and clear all thinks. i am only at my mobile phone and trying to reach something

<ikbenwouter> TAiS46 when bitcoin-central was down and went live again they removed all orders that was around 10% at the current rate

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<Casimir1904> better remove all orders, not big thing to place new orders i guess...

<c0rw1n> +1 to deleting all remaining orders

<EwwSup> +1 ^^

<Wxll> That worked very well with bt-central, and nobody complaeined

<l-b> bitcoin.de doesn't let you post asks at more than 200% of the current price even

<PeehsNoic> yep +1

<bartz_daniel> yep +1

<phlogiston_> +1

<amyntor> +1

<PeehsNoic> i can't even remember if i orders placed :D

<ikbenwouter> yep worked very well with bitcoin central, there they also gave you 24 hours to cancel your orders beforehand

<PeehsNoic> *have

<bafin_> -1

<M3n70r_> @TAiS46 Hi Simon, i`ve deposited 100 EUR for the 1st time on your german account. can you please tell me if you have recieved the payment? can you post money back or at least give me some hope i haven`t lost em? reference note is : mentor2430396

<TAiS46> worriedGuy: sure, if the account is blocked for 3 month or more, I will tell you, but just to let all know 2.000.000 € are safe on another bank account ;) If the polish bank will not release the bank account, i am still able to pay the users (not all but maybe some % of all funds available in the users balance)

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<Wxll> ikbenwouter: that is time enough… if you are serious about your orders you will manage them..

<Flaz> TAiS46: Who do you think credited the hotwallet with 450BTC if it was not you? Was would be his interest? I don't get it

<tronic1704_> Tais, Did not quite understand: What about our rest Euros in btc24? Can we buy coins and withdraw it?

<worriedGuy> tais46 it would still be fair to let all users participate

<TAiS46> just to let you know, my lawyer told me that i can publish the information. where are about 5.000.000 EUR frozen atm

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<worriedGuy> tais not only the ones in EUR

<galge> TAiS46: +1

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<PeehsNoic> OUCH

<davidoz_> noone will sell coins if they cant withdraw ;)

<Dudewmc> TAiS46 +1

<TAiS46> tronic1704_: no, you can't but btc atm for it!

<TAiS46> Flaz: i really don't know who it was! it was also not the address from the second hot wallet / offline wallet!

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<mintz> So what about this video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3YN101xieCY) from April 2. Are you saying it's fake?

<nomailing1> @TAiS46, when you restart your exchange you don't need a waiting period. Just clear the orderbook. The waiting period on bitcoin-central was unneccessary

<Arbitron> ,# by: , views)

<Sjors> TAiS46: I can imagine you're super-stressed about all this, but do know we appreciate your efforts :)

<Casimir1904> TAiS46, you had also private bitcoins? what about selling (some) of them when they freeze the account for 3 months?

<wwww> I also think its unfair people stuck in Euros have to bear all costs in case account cant be unfrozen

<Wxll> Might be one of the arbitrage bug traders that sender the profits back

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<waynerr__> TAiS46, Flaz, probably satoshi tought you could not pay stuff anymore =D

<Flaz> wwww: Second that !

<PeehsNoic> i always thought that there are multiple coldwallets? but i would also understand if you try to protect them ;) anyway it's not that important me thinks

<davidoz_> also unfair to get bitcoins from people who never used EUR or SEPA deposits etc ;)

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<moebiusz> Will the people that wired money to the German account not be able to used it if the polish gets locked?

<worriedGuy> davidoz but they would be affected by the freezing anyway, at least if they by change were in euros at the second it happend

<Xang_> TAiS46: Can you still see the account balance and the money arriving to the PL bank ?

<TAiS46> Casimir1904 / all: if they really froze the bank account for 3 month! I will sell my private bitcoins for you money. I will think about, how I will handle it. maybe that the user can only exchange some % of their money to BTC … but i must also ask my lawyer what he says about this.

<galge> I'd say TAiS46 has more love than the guys behind Mt.Lag...bitcoin-24 +1

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<TAiS46> Xang_: yes i can

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<worriedGuy> tais thats awesome

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<PeehsNoic> galge: +1 totally awesome step to come here and answer questions

<godzilla123> TAiS46 can't you just ask your banks to reverse the payments

<godzilla123> reverse everything

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<Casimir1904> i dont have money in the site, just for the others as possible option, introducing trading fees would also be an option to cover loss...

<godzilla123> btc trades, euro deposits etc

<c0rw1n> mh that's not how banks work godzilla123

<TAiS46> godzilla123: asked, but they will not do it! i am not able to do any transaction on this bank account anymore

<worriedGuy> tais46 i know that its very private information, and totally understand if you dont wanna tell.. but how much btc could you spend for that? so is it only a few %, or can we be sure to get a large amount (<75%) of our money back?

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<worriedGuy> tais46 (just talking about the case where the money is frozen for 3months, and you have to sell private coins)

<TAiS46> worriedGuy: I will not tell how much BTC i am holding private. but i can tell, that it is not 5.5 million EUR ;)

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<c0rw1n> depends at what rate... :)

<ikbenwouter> lol c0rw1n

<PeehsNoic> ^^

<Casimir1904> in few years maybe...

<TAiS46> if the money is really frozen for 3 month! ALL OF YOU have the chance to write an mail to the government. I will give you than more informations. but 3 month is the maximal time!!!

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<floater> @TAIS: Everyone would cool down a little if you could at least partially pay out EUR withdrawals from the other bank account right off. Than many wont sue you and even wait 3 months

<mintz> but if account frozen for 3 months you'll still be able to release the BTC and USD right?

<nomailing1> ohh yes, i would write a letter, if that helps

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<galge> PeeshNoic: agreed. I have great sympathy for people struggling with regulation, govt and banks

<Casimir1904> i could live with that and would also deposit money again to buy bts when trading engine open again

<djesys1> And release BTC´s...that would make a lotta people happy !

<DontTrustThisMan> Who exactly had the account in Poland frozen? "German government" makes no sense.

<zewelor> TAiS46: what about transactions before turning off webist ? If i sold my btc there were sold or not ? I got 3x euro for that trade, does it mean i still have that bitcoins, or i have sold them and got correct euro amount ?

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<Sjors> DontTrustThisMan: it's probably german law enforcement as a whole

<Casimir1904> the other bank account is limited as TAiS46 said earlier...

<worriedGuy> tais46 ok.. I wish you good luck with all this. You seem to be a really good guy.. according to your posts you're a really bad coder, and you might have been way to naive for this, but at least you're an idealist and believe in what you're doing.

<ikbenwouter> he told us already that everyone can withdraw their BTC soon ;)

<Wxll> @floater you can't sue someone for having a frozen bank account…

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<TAiS46> floater: the german bank account it canceled by the bank without reason! and there is a low limit for online transactions. it was only a backup bank account where i can access 2.5 million EUR. i will use them to withdraw EUR if the bzwbk bank account will stay frozen! but I must clear this things with my lawyer and how to do it

<TAiS46> zewelor: they will be canceled and are restored.

<zewelor> not good :(

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<PeehsNoic> tais46: one last question than i'm totally statisfied ;) Why did you prefered to release informations ons reddit instead of your website? i wasn't really sure if it was the real tais posting there because so many people tried to fake you/btc24 in the last few days.

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<godzilla123> <@TAiS46> zewelor: they will be canceled and are restored.

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<godzilla123> Actually this is a bit unclear

<EwwSup> TAiS46: how far back in time transactions are reset?

<worriedGuy> tais46 yes, peehsNoice has a good point there. You should put a link on your website to the reddit-posts so everyone sees them

<guidebook> TAiS46: I received a SEPA withdrawal confirmation email on April 4 but I haven't received the money. Is the money safe?

<Casimir1904> he canceld the wrong orders and the amounts before restored

<TAiS46> worriedGuy: i know about the coding ;) but i have now some one, who will code for me :) all is fine now with the code

<godzilla123> basically this means all transactions are cancelled or only the extra ones

<galge> Peesh: +1

<phlogiston> If you solve the problems, you have gained an epic amount of trust. I think bitcoin-24 2.0 will succeed.

<wwww> Don't allow BTC to be withdrawn before EUR account is free!! It's possible that this whole mess is created by some 'bad people' who have BTC in the account in the first place. Why people with legit EUR have to pay for this?

<DontTrustThisMan> Sjors: Would be nice to know who exactly is behind this and why. Criminal investigation because of compromised bank accounts/money laundering or BaFin because of missing license.

<TAiS46> PeehsNoic: i think that in reddit and irc are the most people. you can see my english is not the best. i am waiting for a good text / statement from some english speaking guy to publish it on the site!

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<c0rw1n> DontTrustThisMan: no matter which this is megaupload all over again

<godzilla123> Casimir1904:say someone had 10 btc, and he traded 5 and was supposed to get 200 Euros, but got 800 instead

<TAiS46> EwwSup: my programmer does it, i does not check it, but i think he only restored the double made trades

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<Casimir1904> godzilla123, when did i say that?

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<godzilla123> Casimir1904 does this mean balance will be rolled back to 10 BTC or 5 btc and 200 euros

<TAiS46> guidebook: the money is safe and I know wich transactions are not leaving the bank account! they will be reset!

<galge> TAiS46: Great stuff. I agree that a statement on the website should be well written.

<Casimir1904> funny so much people say that i said things i never said...

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<worriedGuy> Tais46 just put something like "For more recent information please also read my reddit-posts where I try to keep everyone updated as often as possible <insert link here>"

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<godzilla123> <@Casimir1904> he canceld the wrong orders and the amounts before restored

<TAiS46> worriedGuy: ok thx will do it

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<Sjors> DontTrustThisMan: he said on Reddit earlier that it was because of a suspicion of criminal activity because he was getting money from bank accounts associated with criminals

<stackofcats> TAiS46, maybe you can find someone close to you who can help you maintaining contact to your users via twitter or sth to keep the people from panicking ;)

<phlogiston> Casimir1904 they read poorly I think

<godzilla123> Casimir1904 Im asking you since you seem to understand the rollback

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<ikbenwouter> yes some PR help and maybe some IRC moderators would be great

<Wxll> Casimir1904: d:) prob tried the new BTCsmartShop Mushrooms before they read your words LOL

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<c0rw1n> there's this post : http://kuttler.eu/post/what-happened-bitcoin24/

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<Casimir1904> just tried to make more clear what TAiS46 said in my understanding from his german to english translation

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<godzilla123> Casimir1904 exactly and im trying to clarify what you meant

<flyingkiwiguy> so what you would need are some German / English speakers

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<phlogiston> ikbenwouter + 1 IRC moderation

<worriedGuy> Tais46 maybe it would also be good to post all important updates in german AND english.. then someone could do a better translation later on ;)

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<godzilla123> no sense in asking TAiS46 again and again. Let him answer other questions

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<wwww> Letting people withdraw BTC before knowing exact reason EUR account is frozen is just wrong...

<worriedGuy> tais i think some of your posts are pretty confusing due to language problems

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<worriedGuy> wwww let me guess, you've got EUR on the site, right?

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<Casimir1904> ikbenwouter, i got now +o here and i will give +o to some users i trust later...

<M3n70r_> @TAiS46 are EUR/SEPA deposits made after shutdown to german account safe? i`ve sent some, did not recieve any message confirming, service is down...any info appreciated. thx

<Wxll> Casimir1904: thats good news

<ikbenwouter> Casimir1904, yes very nice

<wwww> yea i have like 7.5k euro and i dont wana lose that because some illegal people bought BTC and its not my fault

<Casimir1904> wwww, <TAiS46> guidebook: the money is safe and I know wich transactions are not leaving the bank account! they will be reset!

<worriedGuy> wwww so, who should loose them?

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<davidoz_> nor is it simons fault...

<Wxll> Now we can untroll the main channel as well :-D

<floater> wwww: I have 15k and the same here. I think everyone should share the intermitent loss. When the 3 months is up than full solution

<wwww> if he cant identify who the illegal people are, then should be shared among everyone

<floater> It is not fair to leave half of the user base in cold

<Casimir1904> i can forward the order again to this one also :-)

<godzilla123> TAiS46 and you got to be a bit polite in what you say on facebook, twitter

<davidoz_> how would u do that...

<DontTrustThisMan> Sjors: Thanks. Consensus on forum.bitcoin.de however is that he needs a license for what he's doing. His legal troubles might not be over.

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<godzilla123> TAiS46 even if its government we are talking about

<worriedGuy> wwww ok, so you're willing to participate in the loss? then im completly with you :)

<davidoz_> and what about people with btc AND Euro like me?

<galge> TAiS46: Great info. Good luck with your lawyer nightmare and good night!

<TAiS46> M3n70r_: deposits are clear. after we are online again, the funds will be added to the user accounts

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<wwww> yea ofc i will participate, equal % loss for everyone

<Sjors> TAiS46, DontTrustThisMan: my most pressing question: for how much money can TAiS46 sue the German government for closing his accounts, keeping him out of doing business for a week, without even asking him once?

<worriedGuy> tais46 so i think you should really consider to let everyone particpate in the losses, not only the people in EUR

<davidoz_> he cant sue german goverment for anything.

<Sjors> why wouldn't he?

<wwww> its possible Polish bank will get even more angry because you release the BTC of the criminals!

<Casimir1904> to sue the goverment will cost much time and money, not sure i would to that when i was him...

<worriedGuy> Sjors i guess he can sue them for any ammount he sees fit. But im 99% sure he will loose

<TAiS46> Sjors: good question, I will see it, after the bank account is open again and my lawyer will tell it to me ;)

<ikbenwouter> worriedGuy, you are jumping to conclusions, so far the money is not gone yet, he is still in the process of recovering the bank accounts

<Sjors> well

<EwwSup> worriedGuy: i'm in full euro and i still don't think that's a good idea

<godzilla123> I would sugggest to let people get their BTC out asap, before this problem worsens, since there are currently no government orders to freeze btc

<Sjors> it _seems_ to be quite clear the german government is doing something way out of legal bounds here

<godzilla123> do it before it happens

<floater> @TAIS: Can we get an official confiramation at least in email that how much are Frozen EUR balance is? Than we could sue the bank one by one...

<godzilla123> then take care of Eur separately

<godzilla123> independently

<Sjors> they can't just pull the plug on a legal business on the basis of some suspicion

<godzilla123> I have both btc and eur

<davidoz_> makes sense.

<Sjors> yes, suing will cost money

<davidoz_> me too

<PeehsNoic> @Tais46 kann ich verstehen ;) Ich glaube du kannst auch deutsch schreiben und es würde irgendjemand übersetzen. Denk bitte dran den "fremdcode" auf hintertüren zu prüfen.. es gab schon einmal einen zwischenfall mit fremdcode. btw falls du probleme mit der datenbank bekommst kannst du mir ne nachricht schicken (CoinSheep @ reddit) ich hab im beruf tägl. mit datenbanken mit >10mill. rows zu tun. nur ein angebot ;)

<Sjors> but it seems like he's on the right side of the law

<TAiS46> floater: on the polish bank account are still 3.5 million eur frozen