capricrab:

So I’ve been seeing this theory going around that doomed Godtiers are actually the horrorterrors (I can’t find the original post, sorry) , and that got me thinking… What does Hussie say about Gamzee again?

Not a single timeline. Not one. Which means in every single doomed timeline, guess who keeps on living no matter what? Gamzee. In timelines where he is Godtier and in timelines where he is not. This means there are an endless amount of Gamzee’s running around in timelines that no longer exist, and yet he keeps living, and living, and living, and living for all eternity.



However, unlike Godtiers who’s bodies regenerate, no matter how much Gamzee goes through his body cannot regenerate. It has been show canonly that his body doesn’t heal like a Godtier would.



Any Godtier would have had to regenerate from all those wounds. Any normal person would be dead. Getting shot by a machine gun multiple times and being beat with a crowbar all in a row? Yeah. Pretty deadly.

But what happens to a body after thousands if not millions of years of getting wounded, aging, and much more? (For anyone that has seen Doctor Who or Torchwood, just think Jack Harkness! ) It heals wrong, and of course his body would heal wrong because he doesn’t know how to take care of himself. On top of that it distorts by aging past when it should, and who knows? Do trolls ever stop growing? We don’t know what their canon biology is like, but there are many headcanons about it.

After so long one might begin to slip past a natural state and into something more “God-like”, especially given his psychic abilities that he already possesses, plus floating around paradox space, and a slow decent into madness from being neglected and alone not only during his early life, but also after everyone else had faded completely out of existence. Without hope, which a Bard of Rage needs to survive, the decent into madness and mental torture would not take long.



And what color blood do the Horrorterrors have?

Purple. They have purple blood, like Gamzee.

Now, when you take a look at the abilities that we have seen the Horrorterrors use, they are very similar to Gamzee’s chucklevoodoos. As we know, chucklevoodoos are very powerful and can do many different things. What we know for canon fact about them so far is as follows:



They can pull things from other places, such as memories, or the void, etc, and materialize them into peoples dreams.

They can be used for telepathic communication, as seen with Kurloz when he “talks” to Gamzee.



They are also used for manipulation and mind control, however the levels vary depending on the will of the user. Kurloz subtly manipulates Meulin at first, implementing the cod piece in her mind to give it to him, and when she does he has a fully mind controlled conversation with her.



Relating this back to the Horrorterrors, all of these things seem to be things that the Horrorterrors are also capable of. For starters, before the dream bubbles were created, all dreamers without dreamselves when sleeping came in contact with the horrorterrors though their dreams. Where do chucklevoodoos have the most power? As seen in the examples above, in dreams and the subconscious mind.



Not to mention Horrorterrors created the dream bubbles, which ties back into the ability of chucklevoodoos.



Creating dream bubbles through chucklevoodoos would not be hard.



They can pull things from other places, such as memories, or the void, etc, and materialize them into peoples dreams.

Pulling memories from others and creating new “dreams” with them inside it wouldn’t be difficult for someone who has transcended past the confines of the natural.



And what is showing up in the dream bubbles? Carnivals!



No one really understood why there was a carnival here, because it sure wasn’t one of Vriska or Meenah’s memories. If the Horrorterrors created the dream bubbles they could also put whatever they wanted into them using their abilities. And if they are indeed Gamzee, then his want to create the Dark Carnival could finally become a reality using the dream bubbles. The paradise planet too, perhaps?

Another interesting fact that had been heavily implied in canon is the use of shades against the influence of things. It is explicitly said by Rose to Dave about the Horrorterrors.



This may also be true for Lil Cal’s influence, which would explain why Dave was never fully influenced by the puppet, unlike Gamzee or Jack English.

Gamzee is a servant of Lord English and had been under Lil Cal’s influence in most, if not all of those doomed timelines. Gamzee is fully influence through void powers(Equius) and chucklevoodoos(Gamzee). If the horrorterrors are Gamzee, that influence would still linger making the Horrorterrors be engulfed in void-thus now residing in the Void, or furthest ring. It would explain why the Horrorterrors are also unable to be heard through shades.

But looking even farther into this theory, where did Rose receive her grimdark powers?



She got her grimdark powers from the Horrorterrors, however she had to ask the cue ball. But whole was the one who suggested she ask in the first place? Doc Scratch. Who is Doc Scratch? Lord English. Who is Gamzee employed by? Lord English. When one is employed by Lord English they stay cursed with immortality and employed until their contract is ended. Any doomed Gamzee’s contract would never be ended, thus allowing Doc Scratch to use the Horrorterrors, through their chucklevoodoos, to manipulate Rose to do his bidding. When Rose asks the cue ball if the gods are evil, they respond with grimdarkness, which could possibly be abilities given to one by implementing such powers into ones subconscious, or perhaps what might even happen to a user of chucklevoodoos after descending past the confines of the natural.

Yet another factor would be that Lord English has no use for doomed Gamzee’s. Lord English needs only a select few to create him, but all the others might as well be called useless. He might as well abandoned them. Now, Gamzee clings to Lord English for his hope. As said earlier:



Without hope, which a Bard of Rage needs to survive, the decent into madness and mental torture would not take long.

Gamzee needs to put his hope in something. Originally it was miracles, and when that was pulled from him via Lord English himself, using Condesce and Dave as messengers.

Which turned Gamzee’s hope towards Lord English through Lil Cal.



Now, as a person of faith myself, I can say for a fact that when you feel as though your God does not love you, that your God has left you, it feels horrible. But Gamzee knows that his “God” is real. Gamzee knows that his “God” needed him. However, doomed Gamzee’s that are no longer useful to Lord English become neglected, unwanted, and unneeded by the God they so fully adored. They sit and rot in a timeline with absolutely no one, not even the “God” that told them they needed him. To have his “God” stop talking to him and abandon him for thousands, if not millions of years, and as a Bard of Rage, chances are that he would grow very angry and bitter towards Lord English(just like someone of faith may grow angry and bitter towards their God after a love one dies, or their God does not prove themselves like they needed).

Then to have his “God” suddenly come back to him after an eternity only to begin to murder all of them without a single care?



They are angry, and bitter, and do not want to be murdered by this “God” they fasley worshiped, nor would they ever want his creation in the first place after realizing who and what he really is, not to mention how he treats them alone.

There is also the theory that Calliope is the Second Messiah that Gamzee talks about.

With that being said, the Horrorterrors were the ones who created a dream bubble specifically for Alt. Calliope to hide from Lord English in.

The Horrorterrors would know how important Caliope is, seeing as how she is ‘The Second Messiah’, and they would need to protect her.



Ontop of all this, when going through the Horrorterror wiki you stumble across this about one of them: “His name(Nrub'yiglith) also bears a (less startling) resemblance to the names of several eldritch beings from H.P. Lovecraft’s Cthulhu Mythos, such as Shub-Niggurath, “The Black Goat of the Woods with a Thousand Young,” and Yig, “Father of Serpents,” as well as “the Twin Blasphemies,” Nug and Yeb. This matches Fluthlu’s obvious allusion to Cthulhu himself.”

“The Black Goat with a Thousand Young” - Gamzee is Capricorn, the sea Goat. There are an endless amount of ‘goats’ running around paradox space that can never die.

“Father of Serpents” - Who raised Caliborn and Calliope? Gamzee.

“Twin Blasphemies” - Mirroring of the ‘Two Messiahs’. What happens when someone of faith turns their back and speaks against the faith? They become blasphemers.



A few extra small thoughts to wrap this up.



Gamzee is a character we do not know much about, at least if you do not dig for it. We don’t know his motives, his thoughts, or almost anything about him. The same goes for the Horrorterrors. We do not know what their motives are, we do not know who or what they are, we know practically nothing about them. Just like we know nothing about Gamzee. Another interesting connection is that the Horrorterrors only whisper when in contact with people, while Gamzee is very quiet in person and doesn’t talk much. His (post)murderstuck quirk also goes between yelling and whispering which leads into another observation. Feferi’s lusus, Gl'bgolyb, is an ‘Emissary to the Horrorterrors’, created by Doc Scratch for the ruling class on Alternia. Gl'bgolyb is known to release the Vast Glub. What is another cry in Homestuck to be referred to as vast? The Vast Honk, which putting with a Horrorterror, would tie in with the yelling part of Gamzee’s quirk.



As far as I can see, it seems to me that Gamzee being the Horrorterrors is not that far fetched!

