In an exclusive interview, Team Secret coach Seung Gon “Heen" Lee goes in-depth on the recent 7.23 patch changes, his contributions as a coach, how he feels about the new line-up, the tier 2/3 scene, slot allocations for majors, as well upcoming events such as ONE Singapore Invitational and DreamLeague Leipzig Major...

Hey Heen. First things first. Congratulations on qualifying to your first Major with Secret. How does it feel to be back with a bang?

Qualifying for the major feels good, mostly because of the fact that we're done with open qualifiers for the rest of the year and, amidst all the confusion that comes with the new patch, we were able to stay on course and pull through.

In short, tell us how you got to Secret?

I was approached by several teams after TI9 and I tried to make a decision based on balance of quality of life and winning.

How good do you think the current Secret roster is, with the addition of MATUMBAMAN as carry and Nisha taking over the mid role? Was it difficult for this kind of swap to happen?

The swap happened invisibly, as in this is the way the roster started, so it doesn't feel like swap. That said, it's not like Matu is new to carry and Nisha is also not new to mid so the two are adjusting to their roles just fine. I imagine finding a style that suits us will be an ongoing process for the rest of the year.





Let’s go directly to the new patch. Before we go into details, I’d like to know your initial thoughts on 7.23. Doesn’t it feel like playing a new game altogether with the massive changes in game due to the Outlander update?

When I first read the 7.23 notes, or rather while I was reading it, I wasn't sure how to take it in. I thought the game changed too much unnecessarily but honestly after playing it, it didn't feel like it wasn't Dota anymore. You still have to do 90% of the things you needed to do before to win the game.

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In which ways has 7.23 changed the way Dota 2 is played?

The map has changed so much in that outposts are a serious point of contest and Roshan is not like before. Also towers die very easily sooner in the game probably because everyone's stronger from extra experience and free items.

With this update, has the game become fast paced or has the possibility increased for games to go on for longer time duration than before?

I'd say faster-paced. It's easier to move around the map and once you gain a significant edge, you can hold on to your lead more ruthlessly through controlling outposts.

We’ve seen crazy changes in plays — for example — Aghanim’s Scepter on Magnus that dramatically reduces the skewer time. We’ve seen Nisha own on that hero against Nigma in the closed qualifiers for DreamLeague. How broken is the current patch when it comes to such heroes? Are there any other examples you’d like to mention?

Well, our opinions about heroes change all the time but for sure there needs to be several more patches to stabilise the patch. Having to ban certain heroes 90% of the time regardless of who your opponent is, is not healthy for the competitive scene.

Remove Iron talon from the game. What a worthless piece of shit item

What about the neutral drops? We’ve items like Poor Man’s shield, Ring of Aquila, etc back into the game along with other items. How beneficial it can be to a team who’s slacking behind in a match and turn the tide in their favour? According to you, how important of a role do these neutral drops play in determining the outcome of a match?

I've yet to see a game won or lost purely on item RNG. Sure, if you get a shit drop and the opponent gets a good one you feel bad but, mostly, I don't think the tier 1-3 make a huge difference. I'm not denying that there is RNG and that the current state of neutral items is fine.

Some items feel much nicer than others and have longer time being useful because they can be passed around different heroes in the game. By the way, remove Iron talon from the game. What a worthless piece of shit item.

What are your thoughts on the map changes as well as the outposts? How significant are these changes?

Outposts basically make it easier to move around the map even after t1 towers fall and conceding one half of the map depending on where your opponents are. Just because you see them on the opposite side doesn't mean they can't reposition to your side. There's a far stronger incentive to take fights because of outpost control. Just watch the qualifiers and see how many fights happened near an outpost, previously a random spot on the map with a side shop.

Thoughts on the new DPC structure

Let’s talk about the qualifiers system. How crazy is the new open qualifiers system that basically doesn’t give a second chance to a team if they haven’t participated in the previous Major? If one fails to make it out of the open qualifiers then they should try their luck again in the next Major. It also rules out their participation in the Minor qualifiers. What do you think about this? Does this rule need to be tweaked a little?

People need to think about open qualifiers with their purpose in mind. What is the point of open qualifiers? They're there so that anybody who is driven enough can have a chance to make it to the main qualifiers without having any contacts or sponsors.

I think placing top three at a major should get you invited to the next major directly



First of all, the open qualifier format is bad because bo1 is bad. Like, there's not even a coin toss in these open qualifier games. You random both rad/dire and 1p/2p which is an insult to competitive game play.

I understand there are problems to running an open qualifier with a format that is too thorough so at least having two qualifiers with the same slot allocation might be an improvement. That said, we had to play open qualifiers so it was what it was. Rules are rules but it's still a stupid system.

By that logic, why don't all teams go through open qualifiers for the 1st major? Why are there teams who just sit there waiting to play main qualifiers? Because they've proved time and time again that they're the strongest teams the region has to offer.

I think placing top three at a major should get you invited to the next major directly. Sometimes people want to see the best competition and other times they want to see upsets to justify their childish flames. You can't have it both ways.

That being said, the current DPC season doesn’t offer any kind of incentive to tier 2/3 teams. Is this a serious concern going forward?

Dota's a very top-heavy game in terms of rewards. I don't know how to solve this issue or if it is solvable. Do many people root for tier 2/3 teams in the first place?

Whenever I see some lesser-known teams play, I see a very low viewer count compared with t1 matches. Where are these people who supposedly want more support for the t2/3 scene?

People naturally want to see the strongest competition available. If there's more demand there's more money. It's not complicated. But you shouldn't pretend to care if you're also someone who doesn't support these teams.

I don't really watch sports but it's like Korean fans are super critical of Korean soccer and they make fun of them the same way the Dota community does. They prefer watching European leagues and wonder why the scene sucks domestically.

As long as the main source of income in Dota is through prize pool, I don't see things changing. They changed the prize distribution to be flatter this year but I don't think it's enough to impact the t2/3 scene in a positive way.

There was quite a bit of discussion regarding the slot allotments in the Majors. While an extra slot to Europe has been taken rather positively by many, there has been a debate of North America losing a slot to SEA that makes it 2 and 3 slots, respectively. Do you think the third slot allocation to SEA is justified or should it have stayed with NA?

I don't think its super clear which of the two regions deserves the extra slot but I think it's safe to say the 'average' skill level of SEA is greater than NA. And also the sheer amount of teams is SEA > NA.

Between two vs three slots it comes down to which region's third-best team would win in a head-to-head match with each other. I can definitely see NA's third-best team beating SEA's third-best team but I think it's reasonably unpredictable, so they decided to give the slot to SEA because they judged the competition to be fiercer.

Bigger-picture thinking at Team Secret

In which ways are you contributing as a coach to Secret? Is it strictly in terms of drafts?

So far it's been mostly draft and concepts, since big new patch changes means finding new heroes and reprioritising elements in the game. It's not been long so we're dealing with the bigger picture not the smaller things.

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Going forward, what mantra will Secret adopt to stay on top of the game?

Just play and learn as we go. There's not much to it. We need to be confident in our ideas but if there's something better, drop our ego and re-evaluate if there's improvements to be made.

According to you, which heroes do you think are going to be favoured in this patch? Do you see Void Spirit and Snapfire entering the meta once they are introduced to Captains Mode?

I think both Void Spirit and Snapfire are strong heroes. I actually thought Void Spirit was garbage when he first came out but they've buffed both heroes and people are learning quickly so we'll see. New heroes are for fun heroes to professional teams so, honestly, it's not something you think about until it's about time they're added to the pool.

We want to be the best team and that's all there is to it

Which teams do you believe will become great contenders to Secret this season?

Same as usual?

I don't mean to sound rude but who knows, who cares? We want to be the best team and that's all there is to it. Even if a team is not tier-one, we can watch them play and learn some ideas and improve upon them.

This scene is all about following your instincts about the game, looking at the examples of others and adding to your own.

Do you think you can win the upcoming ONE Singapore Invitational as well as the DreamLeague Major with Secret in Leipzig? How confident are you?

I think we played not as well as we hoped to in the qualifiers, actually, but if we polish up I think we have a fair shot at winning. The game and teams change fast. We'll see what happens.

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