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MemberActivity: 98Merit: 10 Re: NXT :: descendant of Bitcoin - Updated Information January 30, 2014, 07:37:24 AM #26102 Quote from: QBTC on January 30, 2014, 03:52:55 AM The possibility to use LaTeX with JavaScript could be put into the www site. I'm not sure of the purpose. As of now the site is not open for contributors other than myself. It might serve your goals better on the forums or wiki where contributors may want to share mathematical expressions. It's a great idea for the right place. I look forward to hearing more!



Yeah I meant the forums. Joefox is including it in the wiki for the whitepaper (we ought to be proving theorems in it, not just writing prose). Math is the foundation of the Nxt protocol, and supporting algorithms like the Reed-Solomon address encoding ricot and nxtchg are working on and which I've helped with. Definitely easier on the eye if we can display it more like math, instead of like English.



I guess you mean the forum is managed by someone else? (adminius?) I somehow equated forum with www in my mind (even though I realize the wiki is also using a nxtcrypto name and run by joefox rather than you). I'll post this in the forum then. Yeah I meant the forums. Joefox is including it in the wiki for the whitepaper (we ought to be proving theorems in it, not just writing prose). Math is the foundation of the Nxt protocol, and supporting algorithms like the Reed-Solomon address encoding ricot and nxtchg are working on and which I've helped with. Definitely easier on the eye if we can display it more like math, instead of like English.I guess you mean the forum is managed by someone else? (adminius?) I somehow equated forum with www in my mind (even though I realize the wiki is also using a nxtcrypto name and run by joefox rather than you). I'll post this in the forum then. Don't leave your Nxt account with a weak password. Learn how to create a strong password.

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MemberActivity: 111Merit: 10 Re: NXT :: descendant of Bitcoin - Updated Information January 30, 2014, 08:09:22 AM #26108 Quote from: rickyjames on January 30, 2014, 02:31:17 AM Quote from: PeercoinEnthusiast on January 30, 2014, 12:17:38 AM Any UK Nxt holders? We need to position ourselves to get on Bittylicious to increase liquidity. The ability to purchase Nxt without Bitcoin is a big deal and one we should put some energy towards.



I was hoping somebody else would step up to the plate on this one, but since they haven't. here's my two cents, er, shillings worth. I have a UK Barclays bank account I use to fund my online poker adventures. It's a totally legal one in my own name, no funny business; I've filed the correct paperwork on it with the IRS and Department of the Treasury here in the US and even voluntarily gave up the number for it during my last security clearance interview. I go thru a proxy and look like I'm in London since the online poker sites block me otherwise coming from an American IP address block. All of these gyrations are due to the 2006 UIEGA anti-online-poker act that was passed here in America, land of the free; but I digress...



Bottom line, I've got the UK bank account but I have no desire to sell any of the NXT I've accumulated. However, I understand the importance of getting NXT hooked up to Bittylicious so I'm willing to try and help. If I've got enough public trust built up here, maybe people could dump NXT they wanted to sell into one of my toy NXT accounts, Bittilocious could take it out of that account to give to a buyer, send GBP to my Barclays account, and I could send that back to the original NXT holders via Moneybookers/Skrill (I've also got accounts there, too.)



This would require me to be a trusted middleman, which I'm OK with if you are.



If we really want to pursue this, let me know, I'll do my part to get NXT rolling in the UK.

I was hoping somebody else would step up to the plate on this one, but since they haven't. here's my two cents, er, shillings worth. I have a UK Barclays bank account I use to fund my online poker adventures. It's a totally legal one in my own name, no funny business; I've filed the correct paperwork on it with the IRS and Department of the Treasury here in the US and even voluntarily gave up the number for it during my last security clearance interview. I go thru a proxy and look like I'm in London since the online poker sites block me otherwise coming from an American IP address block. All of these gyrations are due to the 2006 UIEGA anti-online-poker act that was passed here in America, land of the free; but I digress...Bottom line, I've got the UK bank account but I have no desire to sell any of the NXT I've accumulated. However, I understand the importance of getting NXT hooked up to Bittylicious so I'm willing to try and help. If I've got enough public trust built up here, maybe people could dump NXT they wanted to sell into one of my toy NXT accounts, Bittilocious could take it out of that account to give to a buyer, send GBP to my Barclays account, and I could send that back to the original NXT holders via Moneybookers/Skrill (I've also got accounts there, too.)This would require me to be a trusted middleman, which I'm OK with if you are.If we really want to pursue this, let me know, I'll do my part to get NXT rolling in the UK.

As soon as the Decentralized Exchange is released we should have our EUR-NXT gateway ready.. It should give people an option to buy NXT for Euro As soon as the Decentralized Exchange is released we should have our EUR-NXT gateway ready.. It should give people an option to buy NXT for Euro

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NewbieActivity: 56Merit: 0 Re: NXT :: descendant of Bitcoin - Updated Information January 30, 2014, 08:23:58 AM #26109 Quote from: salsacz on January 30, 2014, 04:15:11 AM full text version of the NxtMyths:



https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BwAGADgnQcrtM3g1cU1VSHZtTGM/edit?usp=sharing



New still unpublished chapters - 7. Rich get richer and 8. (no) Innovations over Bitcoin start at the page 25 (actually 8th chapter is only one known table..). There are also some new tables you probably didn't see on previous pages.



Comments are enabled for grammar mistakes. Facts and wrong ideas can be discussed here...



If you think it's worth any donations, feel free to send them to: 15003961341330858247





Now I can finally switch to the infographics stage (infographics will mention the NxtMyths paper as a source...)

After a month of almost daily work I can present you aNew still unpublished chapters -start at the page 25 (actually 8th chapter is only one known table..). There are also some new tables you probably didn't see on previous pages.Comments are enabled for grammar mistakes. Facts and wrong ideas can be discussed here...If you think it's worth any donations, feel free to send them to:Now I can finally switch to the infographics stage(infographics will mention the NxtMyths paper as a source...)



This paragraph at the bottom of page 25 seems to conflict with the general thrust of the argument it is supporting:



"The person with 1 million Nxt has 100x higher chance to get the transaction fees than

the person with 100 Nxt. He still pays the same electricity. The person with 1 million GPU

miners has 100x higher chance to get Bitcoin block than the person with 100 GPU miners.

But he pays 100x more for the electricity."



You should add: "However, he was able to purchase those 1 million GPU miners at a fraction of the cost per miner than the person who only purchased 100, due to the economies of scale advantage associated with large-scale acquisitions."



This provides a logical connection with the next statement concerning economies of scale.



Also, I don't know anything about this, but do economies of scale also apply to electricity? I.e. is it more efficient/cheaper-per-unit to run 10000 computers than it is to run one? This paragraph at the bottom of page 25 seems to conflict with the general thrust of the argument it is supporting:"The person with 1 million Nxt has 100x higher chance to get the transaction fees thanthe person with 100 Nxt. He still pays the same electricity. The person with 1 million GPUminers has 100x higher chance to get Bitcoin block than the person with 100 GPU miners.But he pays 100x more for the electricity."You should add: "However, he was able to purchase those 1 million GPU miners at a fraction of the cost per miner than the person who only purchased 100, due to the economies of scale advantage associated with large-scale acquisitions."This provides a logical connection with the next statement concerning economies of scale.Also, I don't know anything about this, but do economies of scale also apply to electricity? I.e. is it more efficient/cheaper-per-unit to run 10000 computers than it is to run one?

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NewbieActivity: 56Merit: 0 Re: NXT :: descendant of Bitcoin - Updated Information January 30, 2014, 08:49:20 AM

Last edit: January 30, 2014, 09:05:47 AM by bithic #26113 Quote from: 2Kool4Skewl on January 30, 2014, 08:29:18 AM Quote from: bithic on January 30, 2014, 08:23:58 AM Also, I don't know anything about this, but do economies of scale also apply to electricity? I.e. is it more efficient/cheaper-per-unit to run 10000 computers than it is to run one?



Yes. If you use a lot of power, you can negotiate with your power company to get cheaper rates.

Yes. If you use a lot of power, you can negotiate with your power company to get cheaper rates.

Ok, if that's true, then the assumption of linearly increasing electricity costs needs to be corrected as well. Any idea what rate of discount is reasonable? On page 25:



"The person with 1 million Nxt has 100x higher chance to get the transaction fees than

the person with 100 Nxt. He still pays the same electricity. The person with 1 million GPU

miners has 100x higher chance to get Bitcoin block than the person with 100 GPU miners.

But he pays 100x more for the electricity.

However, he was able to purchase those 1 million GPU miners at a fraction of the cost per miner than the person who only purchased 100, and negotiate a discount with his electricity supplier, due to the economies of scale advantage associated with large-scale operations. "



And on page 26:



"World of Bitcoin:



- If you have 1000$, you can mine X Btc thanks to the GPU

- If you have 100.000$, you can mine 1000X Btc thanks to some super machine

you buy

- if you have 100x1000$GPU, you get 100X Btc (+ pay 100x minus discount for electrocity electr i city)

- if you have 1x100.000$Machine, you get 1000X Btc (+ pay for electrocity electr i city)"



Quote from: salsacz on January 30, 2014, 04:15:11 AM full text version of the NxtMyths:



https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BwAGADgnQcrtM3g1cU1VSHZtTGM/edit?usp=sharing

After a month of almost daily work I can present you a

Another edit: on page 26 the title "Only PoW is unfair and rich gets richer" would make more sense as "The rich are favored more in PoW than PoS".

Ok, if that's true, then the assumption of linearly increasing electricity costs needs to be corrected as well. Any idea what rate of discount is reasonable? On page 25:"The person with 1 million Nxt has 100x higher chance to get the transaction fees thanthe person with 100 Nxt. He still pays the same electricity. The person with 1 million GPUminers has 100x higher chance to get Bitcoin block than the person with 100 GPU miners.And on page 26:"World of Bitcoin:- If you have 1000$, you can mine X Btc thanks to the GPU- If you have 100.000$, you can mine 1000X Btc thanks to some super machineyou buy- if you have 100x1000$GPU, you get 100X Btc (+ pay 100xforelectrcity)- if you have 1x100.000$Machine, you get 1000X Btc (+ pay forelectrcity)"Another edit: on page 26 the title "Only PoW is unfair and rich gets richer" would make more sense as "The rich are favored more in PoW than PoS".

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NewbieActivity: 56Merit: 0 Re: NXT :: descendant of Bitcoin - Updated Information January 30, 2014, 08:57:24 AM #26114 Quote from: NxtChg.com on January 30, 2014, 08:33:40 AM Quote from: Come-from-Beyond on January 30, 2014, 07:13:35 AM Quote from: jl777 on January 30, 2014, 07:02:27 AM



https://github.com/Zerocoin/libzerocoin

you also have their C++ code?

Mom told me to study C++, but I preferred useless stuff like Asm, Basic and Pascal.

Mom told me to study C++, but I preferred useless stuff like Asm, Basic and Pascal.

That source code is old, anyway.



Here's what I could understand from video and reading till 4 in the morning yesterday:



The core of their proof is SNARK (Succinct Non-interactive ARgument of Knowledge) - voodoo math that allows others to verify that you actually executed some piece of code, that's why it's so complicated. Everything else is easy: in new version they just use SHA256 and Merkle tree to store the coins.



So this SNARK thing looks a bit suspicious to me, but that's probably because it's so original and counter-intuitive and I don't even fully understand it yet



Anyway, what they do with it, is create an alternative way for you to prove that you did a chain of SHA256's up to the root.



So you can prove that your coin is somewhere on the tree, without revealing any actual hashes, which would identify on which branch your coin is located.



Gonna drink my coffee and read more.





That source code is old, anyway.Here's what I could understand from video and reading till 4 in the morning yesterday:The core of their proof is SNARK (Succinct Non-interactive ARgument of Knowledge) - voodoo math that allows others to verify that you actually executed some piece of code, that's why it's so complicated. Everything else is easy: in new version they just use SHA256 and Merkle tree to store the coins.So this SNARK thing looks a bit suspicious to me, but that's probably because it's so original and counter-intuitive and I don't even fully understand it yetAnyway, what they do with it, is create an alternative way for you to prove that you did a chain of SHA256's up to the root.So you can prove that your coin ison the tree, without revealing any actual hashes, which would identify on which branch your coin is located.Gonna drink my coffee and read more.

He also said he hopes people don't invest too much in it at first in case it's flawed. This might give him reason to be cautious about integrating with Nxt before he can prove it works well in a real-world test application. He also said he hopes people don't invest too much in it at first in case it's flawed. This might give him reason to be cautious about integrating with Nxt before he can prove it works well in a real-world test application.