Fighters have been a big pain point for small to medium gangs for awhile now, especially the long range heavy fighters which feel incredibly broken right now, so I thought it would be a good idea to take a look at some ~real life~ fighter DPS numbers versus typical sub-capital ships, and what the anti-subcap ship of that size can deal out.

So first of all, let’s take some typical Carrier and Super Carrier fits; Starting out with the standard ratting Nidhoggur fit.

[Nidhoggur, Delve Ratting Standard] Drone Damage Amplifier II

Drone Damage Amplifier II

Drone Damage Amplifier II

Drone Damage Amplifier II

Sentient Omnidirectional Tracking Enhancer Sentient Omnidirectional Tracking Link, Tracking Speed Script

Drone Navigation Computer II

Adaptive Invulnerability Field II

Adaptive Invulnerability Field II

Capital Shield Extender II

Capital Shield Extender II Fighter Support Unit II

Fighter Support Unit II

Fighter Support Unit II

Networked Sensor Array

Cynosural Field Generator I Capital Core Defense Field Extender I

Capital Core Defense Field Extender I

Capital Core Defense Field Extender I

Templar II x9

Templar II x9

Templar II x9

This Nidhoggur fit is something I personally ratted in for about a year while I was in KarmaFleet in Goonswarm. It deals just shy of 1.8k DPS sustained with turret attacks on the fighters, and 2931 DPS when you take into account the limited missile abilities. I used to have Imperial Navy DDAs on my Nidhoggur, at the time they were 100m each, however Navy DDAs have risen in price to close to 200m each, so I decided to use T2 instead for the fit here for demonstration purposes, as it’s more realistic and more conservative.

When using the MWD ability. The fighters travel at 14.8km/s so are completely unavoidable and go just shy of 300km in one MWD cycle, so you pressure entire grids easily. They also travel at over 2.5km/s with no MWD ability, so still faster than most nano cruisers in the game without snakes/links making them incredibly difficult to kite even when the ability is on cooldown.

These light fighter turret attacks have an explosion radius of 122m and a explosion velocity of 126m/sec. To put that into context, A max skilled heavy missile being shot by a player has a explosion radius of 105m and an explosion velocity of 122m/sec. So light fighter turret attacks are very similar to navy HML application, being about 15% worse.

A Caracal with 5x Heavy Missile launchers and 3 BCU IIs has a DPS of 299. This Nidhoggur as mentioned has a DPS of 1777. So a Nidhoggur is essentially doing the DPS of 6 max skilled T2 fit triple damage mod HML Caracals with just the non-limited turret attack alone against cruiser targets, that’s incredibly powerful! And the problem: Fighters are currently the best anti-subcap weapon in the game by a large margin.

Let’s move over to see how well they actually apply to actual targets.

Starting with Frigates. I’m going to use the standard roaming Imperial Navy Slicer as an example target. I think it’s very fair, It doesn’t get a sig reduction bonus like the Retribution or Interceptors. It does however, not use any defensive rigs (Both Armor and Shield either slow you down or increase sig so improve fighter damage), nor does it have a plate or extender. In Practice most frigates would take a lot more damage than the Slicer does from fighters, I’m also fielding 2 nano-fibres, so it’s going to be faster than most brawling frigates and therefore mitigating more damage. The Slicer is also just naturally faster than most frigates and has a low base signature.

[Imperial Navy Slicer, Imperial Navy Slicer fit] Heat Sink II

Heat Sink II

Nanofiber Internal Structure II

Nanofiber Internal Structure II

Small Ancillary Armor Repairer 5MN Y-T8 Compact Microwarpdrive

Warp Disruptor II Small Focused Beam Laser II

[Empty High slot]

Small Focused Beam Laser II Small Energy Locus Coordinator II

Small Energy Locus Coordinator II

Small Energy Locus Coordinator I

The important stats are here;

It goes 3786m/s with a signature radius of 228. How much DPS will our Nid being doing to this slicer?

384 DPS.

This is more DPS than if the Slicer was sitting on top of a 2x Magstab Neutron Blaster Daredevil with void loaded BTW!

So; Against a completely untackled, relatively fast and light frigate, it is out DPSing the highest damage close range brawling ships in the size bracket. A Daredevil can be kited outside it’s measly 2km optimal range on void. You can’t kite 15km/s fighters.

Let’s take a look at a brawling Merlin fit to see how much it takes from a Nidhoggur. Remember, I am just using the turret attacks in all of these examples, I am not using the missile attacks would result in even more DPS!

A Merlin with; A T2 MSE, 3x Shield rigs, and a MWD has a signature radius of 300 with a speed of 2838m/s

Our completely untackled Merlin is taking 552 DPS! That’s more than a Rapid Light Caracal with 3x T2 BCU and T2 Fury and heat does on paper! Remember that the Merlin is fighting up close so it’s probably going to webbed, taking even more damage from the fighters. Our Merlin is actually, unironically, better off sitting on top of a CODE. Ganking Catalyst than it is with Nidhoggur fighters using only the turret attacks on it.

Well maybe it’s just frigates that have it rough! Let’s move on to an Example cruiser. To keep things relatively consistent, I’ll use the Omen Navy Issue as an example cruiser. Just like the Slicer, it doesn’t rely on buffer tanking modules that will make it take more damage from fighters, nor does it use rigs that slow it down or increase it’s sig. It’s also one of the fastest cruisers in the game and has a relatively low signature radius for a Cruiser, it’s also using 2 nanos.

[Omen Navy Issue, Standard Roam MedInj] Nanofiber Internal Structure II

Nanofiber Internal Structure II

Medium Ancillary Armor Repairer

Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II

Heat Sink II

Heat Sink II

Heat Sink II 50MN Quad LiF Restrained Microwarpdrive

Medium Electrochemical Capacitor Booster I, Navy Cap Booster 800

Warp Disruptor II Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M

Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M

Small Energy Neutralizer II

Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M

Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M Medium Energy Locus Coordinator II

Medium Energy Locus Coordinator II

Medium Ancillary Current Router I

Hornet EC-300 x5

Warrior II x5

Base Speed: 2738

Sig: 550

You guessed it! 838 DPS! Again, just like how the Slicer is better off sitting on top of a gank fit Daredevil. Our Omen Navy Issue would also be better off sitting on top of a triple Magstab Void M Neutron Vigilant rather than taking damage from ratting Nidhoggur fighters only using the turret ability while completely untackled at max speed.

Let’s take a look at something Beefier. Like a Brawling Moa.

[Moa, Moa fit] IFFA Compact Damage Control

Co-Processor II

Magnetic Field Stabilizer II

Magnetic Field Stabilizer II X-Large Ancillary Shield Booster

50MN Y-T8 Compact Microwarpdrive

Faint Epsilon Scoped Warp Scrambler

Fleeting Compact Stasis Webifier

Adaptive Invulnerability Field II Heavy Electron Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M

Heavy Electron Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M

Heavy Electron Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M

Heavy Electron Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M

Heavy Electron Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M Medium Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer I

Medium Anti-Thermal Screen Reinforcer I

Medium Anti-Kinetic Screen Reinforcer I

Acolyte II x3

Standard Blue Pill Booster

Null M x2000

Void M x2000

Navy Cap Booster 400 x27

Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M x2000

Nanite Repair Paste x50

Base Speed: 1560

Signature: 882

Oh how this Moa would love to sit on top of a Vigilant! This Moa would also rather sit on top of a max gank V I N D I C A T O R! than have fighters on it. It takes close to max damage from the Nidhoggurs raw output.

Same Moa, just with MWD off. 1760 DPS taken!!! without using the missile ability at all. Yeah it takes more damage with it off. (Like with all the other ships I’ve already posted in these examples). I just wanted to show off the fact that the MWD on numbers are actually more favourable, and I’m not using them to strengthen my argument. Untackled Moa without MWD running is only about 20 DPS away from taking max damage from the Nidhoggur btw. The Moa I posted doesn’t even have a shield extender and literally only has 3 shield rigs increasing it’s sig.

If the Nidhoggur actually used his missile abilities on it. The Moa, while completely untackled would take more damage per second than if he was sitting on top of a max skilled T2 Disintergrator 2x Entropic Heatsink Leshak at max ramp… Or a Polarized Vindicator.

Yikes. I think this shows that Light Fighters are outperforming Anti-Subcap Subcap roles (That’s a mouthful to say) easily by a factor of 4-5x. It would take 5 Anti-Support HACs to be able to actually out-damage a Nidhoggur versus a completely untackled Moa with 3 shield rigs fit.

Buckle in, We’ve just scrapped the tip of the Iceberg. Super Size me.

[Hel, Standard Ratter] Sentient Damage Control

Sentient Drone Damage Amplifier

Sentient Drone Damage Amplifier

Sentient Drone Damage Amplifier

Sentient Drone Damage Amplifier CONCORD Capital Shield Extender

CONCORD Capital Shield Extender

Pithum A-Type Adaptive Invulnerability Field

Pithum A-Type Adaptive Invulnerability Field

Sentient Omnidirectional Tracking Link

Sentient Omnidirectional Tracking Link

Gist X-Type 500MN Microwarpdrive Networked Sensor Array

Syndicate Cloaking Device

Cynosural Field Generator I

Fighter Support Unit II

Fighter Support Unit II

Fighter Support Unit II Capital Core Defense Field Extender II

Capital Core Defense Field Extender II

Capital Core Defense Field Extender II

Ametat II x6

Ametat II x6

Ametat II x6

Templar II x9

Templar II x9

This is pretty much the Standard Ratting Hel. You can forego the CCDFEs if you want for Hyperspatials for more Krab Power versus less buffer tank. I think a Cloak + 500mn MWD for 10s aligns is realistic for safety. 15.5M EHP before links and 78%~ Average resistances give you a huge safety net when dropping under your own capital umbrella. I’m not using implants but obviously a Genolution set for combat, or Nomads/Hyperspatials with a few shield hardwirings would also improve the fit listed.

Our Light Fighters are back, and now much stronger, thanks to moving the 1 enhancer to a Omni now. The Hel naturally has a higher base damage bonus and we’ve upgraded T2 DDAs to Imperial Navy. Even though we’re only using 2 light fighters, thanks to the raw power of the Hel and Faction DDAs, with Turret attacks they are doing 1535 DPS versus the 1777 DPS of the 3 from the Nidhoggur.

They are joined by our new Heavy Fighters! These deal a staggering 4645 DPS with their turret attacks alone.

Our HFs have an explosion radius of 222m and an explosion velocity of 153m/s. For Reference, a Precision Cruise Missile fired from a max skilled player has an almost identical explosion radius of 223m, but with a lower explosion velocity of 124m/s. So our Heavy fighters are out-applying precision cruise missiles, and aren’t too far away from fury Heavy Missiles.

It would take 8! 3x BCU precision cruise Ravens just to out damage the 3 heavy fighters, with worse application. And about 16 of them to outdamage a Hel versus a cruiser sized target.

Let’s go back to our earlier examples, first, the Slicer.

Untackled Slicer takes 616 DPS from a Hel. Better for the slicer to sit on a CODE Catalyst or be shot by a RLML Cerberus.

Merlin Next.

Ouch, Nearly 950 DPS! That’s worse than sitting on top of the max gank Vigilant with drones on you.

Omen Navy Time

1554 DPS – Max Gank Vindicator DPS while completely untackled.

And now… The Moa.

Completely untackled Moa with just 3 shield rigs… yeah… Better to find TWO VINDICATORS than have just Hel turret attack fighters on you.

Same Untackled Moa, this time with his MWD cut off. 3680 DPS. LOL.

What if we use the Light fighter missile attacks too!

Over 4k DPS applied!

Remember that this is literally just a Moa with 3 shield rigs, completely untackled, we’re using a Hel with only 2 Omnis, and no heat on them.

What would happen if we apply just one web to the Moa, from the Cyno that brings in the Hel.

I don’t think any comment I can give will give credence to just how absolutely broken this is. Welcome to 100mn AB/Retributions online, stay for awhile, but not too long… Hopefully.