Ireland has always had a fascination with combat sports.

Boxing has captivated the Irish nation at Olympic Games for decades. July 1972 saw the greatest of all time, Muhammad Ali, fight Alvin Lewis in front 25,000 baying fans at Croke Park.

In recent years Katie Taylor has become a household name and inspiration; rom an often under-covered amateur to a professional superstar in just a few years.

The rising underground popularity of MMA eventually saw the mainstream acceptance of Conor McGregor. Michael Conlan is in the early stages of something similar. It’s no surprise, then, that Muay Thai is earning more recognition in Ireland. Gyms have opened around the country and supplied fighters for sold out shows in Cork, Limerick and Dublin.

In 2016 the International Olympic Committee granted temporary acknowledgement of the sport and Irish fighters are fighting at the world stage on a regular basis. To learn more about Ireland’s third most popular, and fastest growing, combat sport I sat down with Clonmel native and professional fighter, Dylan Meagher.

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Combat sports may be getting bigger in Ireland but how did you end up in Muay Thai rather than one of the big two; boxing and MMA?

Dylan: I was kind of doing nothing. I was getting into a bit of trouble, the typical shit. I played GAA and I got sick of that. I wasn’t in good shape. I started at like 102kg because I remember weighing myself and I was like, what? I’m 15! What’s going on here?

Within a year and a bit of starting Muay Thai, I said I was ready for a fight because my coach was saying you can’t be fighting heavy, you’re a kid. I had to be down around the 70-80 kg range. So I got down to 75kg and I was like yeah I think I’m ready now. Then I got my first amateur fight at 16.

That was five years ago, how much popularity has the sport gained in that time?

Dylan: When I started doing it, it’s wasn’t half as big it is now. So it’s really after coming along in the last few years. Fighters can get more amateur fights. I had my six amateur fights and after that there was no else to fight. I thought I may as well go pro and give it a shot and I have been ever since.

Why is it getting more popular with people? And how do you see the sport growing in the next five years?

Dylan: Well, obviously [Conor] McGregor has something to do with it. As well as that, people don’t really know what Thai boxing is. They think you’re wearing belts and doing all this karate stuff. Then they come to see the show and they’re watching the fights thinking “this is crazy!”.

I think it’s the most exciting sport in the world. If you look at an MMA fight, the fights everyone loves are the ones that stay standing. And it’s pretty much a Muay Thai fight.

So, in terms of excitement, do you think it might be an easier sell than MMA?

Dylan: The thing about Thai boxing that makes it hard for people to understand is the scoring. And the tradition of it as well. If you look at K1 and MMA, it’s kind of volume that wins fights. Whoever is hitting the guy the most. You’ll see a lot of MMA fights where a fighter will land big shots on a lad and he’ll hurt them but because the other guy was tapping him the whole fight, that guy wins. Whereas in Thai boxing it wouldn’t be that way.

You have to show effect, your strikes have to be affecting the other guy. So, in K1 lets say, if I throw a combination and kick a guy and he didn’t move, he took the kick, I would still score. In Thai boxing if I kick my opponent and he doesn’t move that wouldn’t be a score for me. It has to show effect, you have to be moving him. You can’t just be throwing up the kicks. Equally, if he throws a kick at me, and I walk into it, that’s no score for him because it has no effect.

How is it scored then?

Dylan: This is what throws people off because there are 5 rounds in a full Thai fights. So, with the proper Thai scoring, you could actually lose the first three rounds and you could win the last two rounds strong and win the fight. Where as in MMA if you lose the first three rounds it’s game over.

So the fighter who finishes strongest often will win. Seems to make sense.

Dylan: It does make sense. It’s just grasping your head around it. Sometimes when you’re watching the fights you’re thinking “How the fuck did that guy win?”. If you can watch fights with it in mind that it’s about who’s finishing stronger and who’s looking the strongest at the end of the fight, you’ll get it.

Even something as simple as after the fight, if one fella falls down in a heap and the other guy is up strong, that makes a big difference. The judges will be like “Well that fella is much stronger at the end of the fight”.

You’re fighting out of Courage Muay Thai, with Siam Warriors in Cork and Warriors Gym in Dublin to name a few. Considering its nature would you recommend Muay Thai to people as a hobby?

Dylan: Oh definitely! Especially the way I’ve seen it change my life. Like I said I was overweight when I started, I wasn’t doing much. I wasn’t confident and I’ve become a different person over the last five years. If you ask anyone that knew me then they’d have said I was a totally different person. It’s a complete change!

Exercise has been directly linked to improving mental health and you seem to have gained a lot of confidence from this.

Dylan: It’s more mental strength then physical strength. You get discipline, especially when you’re fighting. You have to be disciplined. But if you’re just doing it as a hobby, it’s great for your mental strength. Because it’s hard.

There does seem to be a macho culture about combat sport gyms and in the past people may have been put off by that. Is that still the case? Or is it just a stereotype?

Dylan: Of course! That’s the biggest stereotype people have about combat sports gyms. It shouldn’t be like that either. People say to me “Oh I’d love to do that but I couldn’t be training with you. You’d kill me!”. But I’m not going to be sparing them at all.

You’re going to come up and be hitting the bag, tipping away on the pads with another beginner. I won’t have anything to do with you and if I do, I’m not going to hurt you. You see people on their first night looking around really nervous saying “Is it ok if I participate?”. I don’t think people should have that view of it, that it’s scary. My girlfriend, Casey, came up and trained there for a year and never sparred. There is a lot of people there just for their fitness too.

After five active years (8-1 pro record)how much of physical toll has it taken? Have you been hurt?

Dylan: Obviously you’ll have your aches and pains but I was fresh out of that last fight. I was sore for two or three weeks afterward but it’s all good now. I’m so used to it all the little niggles don’t really get at me anymore. And I’ve never had a bad injury really. I’ve had a concussion but that’s kind of different really. A bit of a touchy subject.

Are you worried about head trauma after five years?

Dylan: Not really, no. I feel alright in the head like. I had a concussion before and I know what it feels like. If I’m physically sore I’ll push on but if something’s not feeling right with the head, I’ll take a bit of a break. Some people would have that macho attitude and I did too, the first time.

I text my coach saying “I think I have a concussion and I’m going to the hospital for a CT scan but I’ll still fight. I’m grand, I feel OK” but he wouldn’t let me.

You do see coaches who don’t pull their fighter out when they look hurt, often with the fighter insisting their fine. It’s something critics of these sports often point to. Do coaches need to be more honest with fighters at times?

Dylan: They do, yeah. There’s a lot of coaches who are ‘yes men’. They’re telling fighters that they’re brilliant when they’re not. You need a coach who’s honest and when you’re doing something wrong they say “What the f*ck are you doing?”.

With Wally and Sean, my two main coaches, if I don’t fight a good round I’m coming back to some sh*t in that corner. Now that works for me but they know me. There are coaches out there who think the world owes them something, they think their fighters are hot shit and they’re not. They’re not because they’re protecting their fighters and putting them up against lads who can’t fight.

There have been a few lads who I’ve wanted to fight and it just never happens. Then you see them on the show I wanted to fight them on and their fighting against lads no one has ever heard of.

So in your opinion they’re not challenging themselves?

Dylan: There’s too many lads that are just stuck in their comfort zone and you won’t learn anything there. You have to get into the danger zone a bit.

Fighters throughout combat sports are often not paid a large amount. Many fans see McGregor’s millions and think everyone is making that kind of money. How have you found it as a professional?

Dylan: I’m not making any money really. I’m paying to fight. For the amount of work I put in before the fight it’s not really worth it, it’s not enough. It doesn’t really bother me though. The way I look at is that your rewards are in proportion to your effort. So it’s going to come eventually. I’m not worried about the money because obviously the better you get at something people can’t not pay then. And even at the highest level of Thai boxing it’s not enough money.

When you compare it to MMA and boxing it‘s a huge difference. For a high level Thai boxer you’re looking at a maximum of a couple of grand a fight. That’s another reason I like it so much because no one is in Thai Boxing for money. Lads go into MMA for money.

They move from Thai boxing into MMA for money. That’s why it’s so exciting. You’ll see a lot of other types of fighting where it’s a lot of standing off and looking at each other. In Thai boxing you can’t do that.

You have had the opportunity to travel to Thailand and train too. How was that experience?

Dylan: I’ve been there twice now. The first year was in Bangkok so I was getting to train with Sitthichai (Glory lightweight champion) and Thongchai (Glory welterweight). That was a really good experience, getting to spar with them. It was unreal and in that camp the first year I was training with other guys from around the world. Craig Jose from England, for example, is another top level Muay Thai fighter and I got to train with him. I was actually roommates with him so it was nice to get to talk to and learn from him.

At twenty years old you’ve already fought for an Irish title. What are your goals in the sport?

Dylan: World titles really. Obviously the Irish title is first, then European, then World. I’ve had this plan in my head for years, which is important to because you have to visualise everything. I’ve had a title fight already and it very was close. I 100% want to fight Wayne Grant again because I want that belt.

The Irish title is my main goal but I’m not confining myself to just doing this here. I want to be the best in the world. I want to be winning world titles and I do want to get into Glory (the UFC of kickboxing) eventually.

Some might say those are lofty aims.

Dylan: They are big aspirations but I reckon once I’ve got this guy beat in April, then I’ll rematch Grant for the title. I don’t even know if he will fight me again. I think he might be moving down weight but he hasn’t confirmed that yet. He needs to make an announcement, vacate the belt if necessary.

Stop holding on to it like a little p**sy and hiding behind people. No one has heard anything from him since our fight. I’ve fought twice since then.

With no large event happening in Clonmel, you are almost always fighting in a hostile environment. Are you used to that by now?

Dylan: Pretty much, yeah. The people in Cork seem to like me, when I’m not fighting someone from Cork obviously! I’ve found my best performances have been in hostile territory. I actually live off that atmosphere. I love a hostile crowd.

Muay Thai is a sport more rooted in respect and tradition then many others. How important is that when you’re essentially going in there to hurt each other?

Dylan: We are fighting each other but we’re all doing it for the same reason. There is a lot of mutual respect. There isn’t the rivalries other sports have. There’s none of this all up in your face stuff. In my last fight, the opponent was doing that at the weigh in but I was just laughing at him. There’s no need to act like this big, tough man ya know. You’re going to fight tomorrow, everyone will see how tough you are then.

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Respect for your fellow fighters can often be lost within the fight promotion game, but it is an absolute requirement for those who enter a cage or a ring.

Dylan and his peers juggle fighting with work, family, friends and training. Their passion and resilience comes with little financial reward or notoriety – for now at least. Muay Thai is growing and Dylan Meagher is one of a number of Irish fighters leading the way.

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