Charlie Hales McCoy

PORTLAND, OREGON - JULY 11, 2014 - Portland Mayor Charlie Hales talks with New Columbia residents who participate in the 'Stop the Violence' rally at McCoy Park Friday afternoon. Xiaojie Ouyang/The Oregonian

(LC-)

Charlie Hales became mayor at an embattled time for the Portland Police Bureau.

Three months before he was inaugurated, a U.S. Department of Justice investigation into the police bureau found a pattern of excessive force used against people with mental illness.

Hales pledged to make reforms. And he has, he says: Officers receive more training on mental illnesses. Portland city and police bureau leaders have held community meetings and listening sessions. Hales and other top city officials, including Police Chief Mike Reese, attended

for white male managers.

But as the recent protests over grand jury decisions in Missouri and New York show, some community members, particularly African Americans, still distrust and fear the local police.

Tuesday, Hales invited

to a meeting in his office. One woman live-streamed the conversation, but members of the media weren't allowed into

, which lasted about two hours.

The Oregonian spoke Wednesday with Mayor Hales about the meeting and the on-going relationship between African Americans and Portland police officers.

Why did you want to meet with the members of Don't Shoot PDX?

There are two levels to this conversation. Both are valid. There's pain and outrage. One way to express that is going to the streets. People are doing that, and I respect that.

There's also conversations about what we do to make change. Are we doing the things as a community to not be Ferguson? That's a conversation that I as a mayor and police commissioner need to have with a lot of people. The people who have organized themselves are some of the people who need to be in that conversation. So I wanted to hear what their ideas were. I wanted to ask, "How can we as a community learn from what has not worked here and elsewhere?" That's not a one meeting conversation.

What did you learn yesterday?

A number of people there talked about the experience of kids in Portland, both in the school system and in their interactions with police officers. That really demonstrated that there's still real fear that kids of color will be treated differently. That's legitimate. It's not just a fear. It's a fact. Kids of color are disproportionately more likely to be disciplined or suspended. That starts a disconnection and a discrimination that's going to haunt those kids until they're adults. The connection from what happens to a young kid and what might happen 10 years later as they're interacting with a police officer, that was clearly drawn from those discussions.

Mayors have been talking about improving relations between the African-American community and police bureaus for a generation now. Why hasn't it happened?

Police bureaus have made little progress in diversifying their work force. That's something we are fervent about in Portland. Chief Reese in the last two recruitments has done a great job in recruiting a new class of diverse officer. The incoming chief, Larry O'Dea, is equally committed to that goal.

That's a slow process, the gradual addition of new people to the police force. But I credit Mike Reese for that systemic progress. It's going to continue, and month by month, year by year, that starts to take change in the bureau.

We are making big changes because of the U.S. Department of Justice settlement in how we train people, how we use force and what happens when a police officer violates policy. People need to know we're making those changes and see the results in their streets and in their neighborhoods.

Do you understand why many black Portlanders fear or do not trust the police?

Yes, I understand that as well as any white guy could. I know there are lived experiences that on a human and emotional level I haven't experienced. I don't have the depth of emotion about that as someone who has the fear in their own heart would have. I am a guy who has a privileged life. I've not been discriminated against. I can learn about what that experience is for other people, but that's not the same thing.

I feel the hurt and concern about whether people will see justice in their community. I also know that there are a lot of people in the police bureau, people I work with, that really do care about building a good relationship with the community, really are fair-minded people and try to do the right thing. I really do see a lot of good work. Part of what I see as a mayor isn't necessarily visible to the entire community. I get a report every morning about the calls from the night before. Almost every morning I read about police who successfully de-escalate a situation with someone who has a mental illness. I read about officers de-escalating situations involving someone who is suicidal. Those cases don't make the news. They're just doing their jobs. But it's clearly showing the effects of the training in dealing with a person who is not rational. The change we wanted, the change we're working for, the training people to de-escalate, I see that taking hold. I am heartened by that. That makes me believe change is going to be possible.

How do you get that message out?

We need to try harder, not as propaganda to say everything is fine or that no one needs to break a sweat. But there is a serious commitment to the Department of Justice settlement and everything that is in it. We do need to find ways to report back to the community. Part of that is going to be me meeting with citizens like those yesterday in my office.

What would you tell an African-American mom who is scared for her son? What would you tell a young person of color who doesn't trust the police or government?

Try to get to know the police officers in your neighborhood. Let her know who you are. Start building that relationship. Second, and I know this is going to sound bizarre to some folks, if you're a young ambitious person, think about serving as a police officer. We're going to be recruiting again soon, and we want smart community-minded people from diverse backgrounds. If people don't apply, we can't hire them. I'm very interested in encouraging people to seek these jobs and be part of the change from the inside

Some of the people who met with you yesterday left criticizing the White Males as Full Diversity Partners training.

I watched a lot of white police officers really grow and change in those trainings. It's not the only piece in working toward equity, but it was a health part of that change. Anything criticized from the left and the right is either really terrible idea or a really good idea. And I think this was a really good idea.

The result is going to be in the behaviors. How do our leaders in the police department lead? How do they relate to citizens they serve? What happens on the street when an officer encounters a person of color late at night walking down the street? What happens in a grocery store - and this happened on the day of the Ferguson decision - when an officer kneels down and gives kids a police sticker? There are thousands of interactions between police and the community. The more of those that are positive, the more an officer is walking down the street knows you or looks like you, the more you're going to see citizens saying they are our police bureau.

In 1829, Robert Peel said, 'The police are the public and the public are the police." If that's what most people feel in their hearts, we've arrived. But we're not there yet. It's a destination worth striving for.

After the Eric Garner grand jury decision, thousands of white Americans tweeted about crimes they'd gotten away with because of their skin color. Have you ever gotten off easier for something because you're white?

Probably. When I was a high school student, I got involved in a couple of dumb moves, which young men are known to perpetrate. I had a couple of encounters with police. I was let off easily. I'm not that sure that would have happened if I was an African-American kid in Virginia in the 1970s.

-- Casey Parks