Rudolph Giuliani refused to rule out the possibility that President Donald Trump could plead the Fifth Amendment in Robert Mueller’s Russia investigation. “How can I ever be confident of that?” Giuliani said on ABC’s This Week. “When I’m facing a situation with the president … in which every lawyer in America thinks he would be a fool to testify, I’ve got a client who wants to testify.” At the end of the day though, Trump “may testify” and “we may actually work things out with Bob Mueller, because working with him directly is good.”

Giuliani also said that Trump doesn’t actually have to comply with a subpoena from the special counsel. “Well, we don’t have to,” Giuliani said when host George Stephanopoulos asked if the president would comply with a subpoena. “He’s the president of the United States. We can assert the same privilege as other presidents have. President Clinton negotiated a deal in which he didn’t admit the effectiveness of the subpoena. They withdrew it.” When Stephanopoulos pointed out that Clinton testified before the grand jury, Giuliani dodged the question about whether that is something Trump would be willing to do. “He has no case,” Giuliani said of Mueller.

Pres. Trump’s attorney Rudy Giuliani tells @GStephanopoulos “we don’t have to” comply with a potential subpoena from the special counsel, adding “He's the President of the United States. We can assert the same privileges other presidents have.” https://t.co/R6JsMQN9yM pic.twitter.com/RX6MLYeQ2e — This Week (@ThisWeekABC) May 6, 2018

In another hint about what Trump may be thinking, Joseph diGenova, a former U.S. attorney who declined an offer to join Trump’s legal team earlier this year, said on Fox News Sunday that the president won’t agree to be interviewed by Mueller. “The president will not sit down for an interview because this investigation has reached a level of bad faith,” diGenova said. “This is no longer a good faith investigation.” Giuliani touched on a similar theme, saying on ABC that he would not want Trump to talk to Mueller “after the way they’ve acted,” he said. “I came into this case with a desire to do that, and—and they just keep convincing not to do it.”