OldManSenex Profile Joined June 2011 United States 130 Posts Last Edited: 2012-05-02 19:19:12 #1





Welcome to the FRB Grand Tournament! $150 is up for grabs as a wealth of mega-talented players duke it out while playing under the Fewer Resources per Base concept and the unique variant of StarCraft II that it creates.







Fewer Resources per Base is the brainchild of Barrin, the Starcraft 2 mapmaker who first started drawing attention to the question, “What effect does the amount of resources available at each base have on Starcraft 2?”



The basic answer is that with the large amount of resources available at each base players have less incentive to expand and greater incentive to build maxed out "deathballs" or attack aggressively off of a relatively small number of bases. FRB addresses this by lowering the amount of minerals at each base from "8 minerals, 2 gas geysers" to "6 minerals, 1 high yield gas", effectively reducing the amount of both resources available at each base by 25%. With less economic power gained from low base counts, players are encouraged to expand more aggressively and split their army to protect their holdings rather than take a small number of bases, build a "deathball" in a defensive choke, and then attack.



For more information on what "Fewer Resources per Base" entails, check out the thread that started this entire movement, "Breadth of Gameplay in SC2".



------------------------------



PLAYERS



The FRB Grand Tournament is proud to reveal our official 16 player bracket!







And here are the up-to-date brackets leading all the way up to the finals:



+ Show Spoiler +



We would like to extend our deepest thanks to the FRB community who have been so passionate and inspired us to make this tournament come to life in the best way possible!



------------------------------



The tournament race breakdown is as follows, and be sure to follow up on the Liquipedia entries to learn about the considerable accomplishments of each player.



Terran:

(CompLexity Gaming)

(Vile Gaming)

NMxMasa (Team Nightmares)

(NrG Gaming)

(StarTale E-Sports)



Protoss:

(Infinity Seven)

(Team Clash)

areaSaroVati (Area 51 Gaming)

stsZephos (Community Applicant)

puCK (Community Applicant)



Zerg:

(It's GoSu)

(CompLexity Gaming)

(It's GoSu)

(LighT eSports)

cvgFitzyHere (Convergence Gaming)

cvgSasquatch (Convergence Gaming)



We'll be using z33k.com to organize and gather replays, so all players who don't have an account already should create one. We'll also be sending PM's with information on your first opponent and your invitation code to the z33k tournament entry in the next couple hours. The z33k page for the FRB Grand Tournament is:



http://www.z33k.com/games/starcraft2/tournaments/6488-frb-grand-tournament-1



And the brackets, as well as where players can upload their replays, are here:



http://www.z33k.com/games/starcraft2/tournaments/6488-frb-grand-tournament-1/brackets



------------------------------



TOURNAMENT SCHEDULE



Round of 16* (Best of 3) - Friday, April 13th (8PM EST)

Round of 8 (Best of 3) - Friday, April 20th (8PM EST)

Semi Finals (Best of 3) - Friday, April 27th (8PM EST)

Finals** (Best of 5) - Friday, May 4 (8PM EST)



Each Friday's broadcast will feature live commentary by Senex and Pull.



* Due to time constraints, four series will be casted live on stream, while the rest will be made available in VOD format.

** Also includes the 3rd Place Match, a Best of 3*



------------------------------



PRIZE POOL



The Prize Pool will be distributed to the winners as follows:

1st Place: $100

2nd Place: $60

3rd Place: $25

4th Place: $15



Update: Thanks to support from our sponsor from Peepmode we've upped the prize pool to $200! The new distribution will be as seen above.



------------------------------



FAN GIVEAWAY



Check this space soon for information on some awesome prizes made possible by our wonderful sponsor, Youre.Pro! In the meantime, please show your support by signing up for their site. You are given a bank of Credits that you can wager against other users - attain enough credits and you can redeem them for various rewards such as a GSL Annual Pass, a Korean StarCraft II account, Amazon.com vouchers, and more!



For the most up to date information about the raffle as information becomes available, follow @FRBGrandTourney and get one step ahead of the game!



------------------------------



HOW TO WATCH







We are thrilled to announce that each of our four broadcasts will be featured on the wonderful 24/7 e-sports channel, CyberSports.TV! Show your support by following them on at @CyberSportsTV



Alternatively, you can also tune in on one of our casters, PullSC's stream.



Miss the live stream? No problem! Check out the VODs hosted on the channel of our other caster, Senex!



------------------------------



Map Pool



The 5 maps that are currently accepted by FRB's creator Barrin and will be used as the map pool for this tournament are:

6m FRB Devolution

6m FRB Braxis Delta

6m FRB Shakuras Plateau

6m FRB Tal'darim Altar*

6m FRB Cross Point



Each match in the Round of 16 will start on the map '6m Devolution', the Round of 8 with '6m Shakuras Plateau, the Round of 4 with '6m Tal'darim Altar' and the Finals with '6m Cross Point.' After that first map the loser of each game picks the next map from the map pool until the overall winner is decided. Repeat maps will be allowed to help the players compensate for the smaller map pool.



*6m Tal'Darim has been changed in more ways than just adjusting the resource counts. The rocks blocking third bases have been removed and the main is now a high ground with a ramp down to the natural. We highly recommend players explore the map before playing official games on it.



-------------------------------



Additional Content



+ Show Spoiler +







Watch the FRB Grand Tournament and talk about it! Tweet to your favorite e-sports community figures about the idea and the tournament! The best way for the Tournament and FRB in general to grow and succeed is for you, the community, to be active in supporting them. For those interested, writing Blizzard or major community figures, (I'm looking at you Day9, this needs to be a Funday Monday! ) is another great way to get the ideas of FRB out there.



If you want to play some FRB games yourself or just hang out with other FRB fans, you can go to the channel 'FRB' (without quotes) on both the NA and EU servers. If you want to find the FRB maps via the Custom Games finder search for '6m' or '6m1hyg' (without quotes) to see all the maps currently available in FRB format!





+ Show Spoiler +

Q: This isn't Brood War, this is Starcraft 2. Why are you trying to turn Starcraft 2 into Brood War?



A:The goal of FRB isn't to transform Starcraft 2 in to a copy of Brood War, it's to find some of the features that have made other strategy games successful and incorporate those elements into Starcraft 2. No one is saying that Starcraft 2 is a bad game; indeed everyone involved in the FRB project is working so hard because we love the game and hope to find ways to make it even better, not transform it into something it's not.



Q: Is there any real chance of Blizzard taking these ideas seriously, or would such a change be too radical and too disruptive to core gameplay for them to implement?



A: There has already been indications that Blizzard is paying attention to the idea of Fewer Resources per Base, for example, in the talk show below starting at 49:50







That aside, it's the size of the community response that will determine how seriously the FRB ideas are considered. So if you like the concepts in FRB be sure to support the FRB Grand Tournament, post in the 'Breadth of Gameplay in SC2' thread on Team Liquid and write Blizzard to voice your opinions.



As a final note: it could very well turn out that the 6 mineral fields and 1 high yield gas version of FRB we're using in this tournament is not the optimal distribution for Starcraft 2. We're far more interested in getting the key ideas out there among the community and developers than trying to find the perfect 'fix' Starcraft 2 ourselves, (if it's even 'broken.') The FRB Grand Tournament and FRB in general are meant to serve as proofs of concept rather than solutions.



Q: Doesn't having fewer resources per base create imbalances in the game?



A: Thus far there have not been any glaring imbalances between races or units demonstrated in FRB games, and indeed many previously underused units have seen a resurgence in popularity and usefulness. However, it could very well be that there are some imbalanced aspects created by having 6 mineral fields and 1 high yield gas, but that's all the more reason to have this tournament. It's only by having a large number of well-analyzed games that potential problems with FRB can be found and corrected, and this tournament is a unique opportunity to explore the positive and negative effects of having fewer resources per base.

A:The goal of FRB isn't to transform Starcraft 2 in to a copy of Brood War, it's to find some of the features that have made other strategy games successful and incorporate those elements into Starcraft 2. No one is saying that Starcraft 2 is a bad game; indeed everyone involved in the FRB project is working so hard because we love the game and hope to find ways to make it even better, not transform it into something it's not.A: There has already been indications that Blizzard is paying attention to the idea of Fewer Resources per Base, for example, in the talk show below starting at 49:50That aside, it's the size of the community response that will determine how seriously the FRB ideas are considered. So if you like the concepts in FRB be sure to support the FRB Grand Tournament, post in the 'Breadth of Gameplay in SC2' thread on Team Liquid and write Blizzard to voice your opinions.As a final note: it could very well turn out that the 6 mineral fields and 1 high yield gas version of FRB we're using in this tournament is not the optimal distribution for Starcraft 2. We're far more interested in getting the key ideas out there among the community and developers than trying to find the perfect 'fix' Starcraft 2 ourselves, (if it's even 'broken.') The FRB Grand Tournament and FRB in general are meant to serve as proofs of concept rather than solutions.A: Thus far there have not been any glaring imbalances between races or units demonstrated in FRB games, and indeed many previously underused units have seen a resurgence in popularity and usefulness. However, it could very well be that there are some imbalanced aspects created by having 6 mineral fields and 1 high yield gas, but that's all the more reason to have this tournament. It's only by having a large number of well-analyzed games that potential problems with FRB can be found and corrected, and this tournament is a unique opportunity to explore the positive and negative effects of having fewer resources per base.

Welcome to the$150 is up for grabs as a wealth of mega-talented players duke it out while playing under theeweresources perase concept and the unique variant of StarCraft II that it creates.Fewer Resources per Base is the brainchild of Barrin, the Starcraft 2 mapmaker who first started drawing attention to the question, “What effect does the amount of resources available at each base have on Starcraft 2?”The basic answer is that with the large amount of resources available at each base players have less incentive to expand and greater incentive to build maxed out "deathballs" or attack aggressively off of a relatively small number of bases. FRB addresses this by lowering the amount of minerals at each base from "8 minerals, 2 gas geysers" to "6 minerals, 1 high yield gas", effectively reducing the amount of both resources available at each base by 25%. With less economic power gained from low base counts, players are encouraged to expand more aggressively and split their army to protect their holdings rather than take a small number of bases, build a "deathball" in a defensive choke, and then attack.For more information on what "Fewer Resources per Base" entails, check out the thread that started this entire movement,------------------------------The FRB Grand Tournament is proud to reveal our official 16 player bracket!And here are the up-to-date brackets leading all the way up to the finals:We would like to extend our deepest thanks to the FRB community who have been so passionate and inspired us to make this tournament come to life in the best way possible!------------------------------The tournament race breakdown is as follows, and be sure to follow up on the Liquipedia entries to learn about the considerable accomplishments of each player. http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/GanZi (CompLexity Gaming) http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/Illusion (Vile Gaming)NMxMasa (Team Nightmares) http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/LuckyFool (NrG Gaming) http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/RainBOw (StarTale E-Sports) http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/Axslav (Infinity Seven) http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/Shew (Team Clash)areaSaroVati (Area 51 Gaming)stsZephos (Community Applicant)puCK (Community Applicant) http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/ViBE (It's GoSu) http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/Goswser (CompLexity Gaming) http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/Tgun (It's GoSu) http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/Heavens (LighT eSports)cvgFitzyHere (Convergence Gaming)cvgSasquatch (Convergence Gaming)We'll be using z33k.com to organize and gather replays, so all players who don't have an account already should create one. We'll also be sending PM's with information on your first opponent and your invitation code to the z33k tournament entry in the next couple hours. The z33k page for the FRB Grand Tournament is:And the brackets, as well as where players can upload their replays, are here:------------------------------Round of 16* (Best of 3) - Friday, April 13th (8PM EST)Round of 8 (Best of 3) - Friday, April 20th (8PM EST)Semi Finals (Best of 3) - Friday, April 27th (8PM EST)Finals** (Best of 5) - Friday, May 4 (8PM EST)Each Friday's broadcast will feature live commentary by Senex and Pull.* Due to time constraints, four series will be casted live on stream, while the rest will be made available in VOD format.** Also includes the 3rd Place Match, a Best of 3*------------------------------The Prize Pool will be distributed to the winners as follows:1st Place: $1002nd Place: $603rd Place: $254th Place: $15Thanks to support from our sponsor from Peepmode we've upped the prize pool to $200! The new distribution will be as seen above.------------------------------Check this space soon for information on some awesome prizes made possible by our wonderful sponsor,! In the meantime, please show your support by signing up for their site. You are given a bank of Credits that you can wager against other users - attain enough credits and you can redeem them for various rewards such as a GSL Annual Pass, a Korean StarCraft II account, Amazon.com vouchers, and more!For the most up to date information about the raffle as information becomes available, followand get one step ahead of the game!------------------------------We are thrilled to announce that each of our four broadcasts will be featured on the wonderful 24/7 e-sports channel,! Show your support by following them on atAlternatively, you can also tune in on one of our casters,Miss the live stream? No problem! Check out the VODs hosted on the channel of our other caster,------------------------------The 5 maps that are currently accepted by FRB's creator Barrin and will be used as the map pool for this tournament are:6m FRB Devolution6m FRB Braxis Delta6m FRB Shakuras Plateau6m FRB Tal'darim Altar*6m FRB Cross PointEach match in the Round of 16 will start on the map '6m Devolution', the Round of 8 with '6m Shakuras Plateau, the Round of 4 with '6m Tal'darim Altar' and the Finals with '6m Cross Point.' After that first map the loser of each game picks the next map from the map pool until the overall winner is decided. Repeat maps will be allowed to help the players compensate for the smaller map pool.*6m Tal'Darim has been changed in more ways than just adjusting the resource counts. The rocks blocking third bases have been removed and the main is now a high ground with a ramp down to the natural. We highly recommend players explore the map before playing official games on it.-------------------------------Watch the FRB Grand Tournament and talk about it! Tweet to your favorite e-sports community figures about the idea and the tournament! The best way for the Tournament and FRB in general to grow and succeed is for you, the community, to be active in supporting them. For those interested, writing Blizzard or major community figures, (I'm looking at you Day9, this needs to be a Funday Monday!) is another great way to get the ideas of FRB out there.If you want to play some FRB games yourself or just hang out with other FRB fans, you can go to the channel 'FRB' (without quotes) on both the NA and EU servers. If you want to find the FRB maps via the Custom Games finder search for '6m' or '6m1hyg' (without quotes) to see all the maps currently available in FRB format! For FRB shoutcasts and analysis check out www.youtube.com/wiseoldsenex

ZenDeX Profile Blog Joined May 2008 Philippines 2872 Posts #2 Must have some prize of any sort to entice more top players into joining in.

chuky500 Profile Blog Joined March 2010 France 472 Posts Last Edited: 2012-03-26 18:13:15 #3 I don't really see why there needs to be a tournament to study whether less minerals and geisers is balanced. It's kind of obvious it shifts the balance towards Zergs and Terran since they benefit the most from more hatches and orbitals (more larva and mules, hatches are cheaper, cc can lift and mine other bases later). Zergs will also benefit from the fact that 1 rich gas now cost 25 minerals + 1 drone compared to 50 minerals + 2 drones.



The game has been balanced around 2 gas geisers and 8 mineral patches mostly because it allows more variety in gameplay, I don't have anything against smaller bases here and there like on crevasse or daybreak but it can not be the norm unless you also change the cost of buildings and units.



Tournaments helping the mapping community are a good idea but they should play all kinds of maps not just trying to prove Barrin's ideas, like when he said the only viable symmetry was the "VARS", the true left right symmetry. If these maps work I'll make maps with 3 patches 1 gas, and gold bases with 1 gold patch and 1 gas and we'll see if games are more interresting.

neo_sporin Profile Blog Joined August 2010 United States 513 Posts #4 I approve of this idea EXCEPT the idea that round of 16 being a best of 1. If we are going to give the players (hopefully myself included) have a week to arrange a good time to play it may as well be a best of 3 as time constraint wouldnt be a problem for the players.



For casting purposes you can either skip series if it is a matchup repeat or if a series goes to game 3 just do the cast of game 3 so it is essentially a best of 1 for the viewer.



This is from someone who always thinks BO3 is better if time permits. But I hope I get in (low masters on ladder, havnt played much of the FRB)

yakitate304 Profile Joined April 2009 United States 655 Posts #5 Well, this seems like a MIGHTY GOOD IDEA to me. Yaki's Streaming Madness: twitch.tv/YakiSC ||| FRB Grand Tournament Organizer ||| @YakiStarCraft ||| Youtube.com/YakiStarCraft

vervejl Profile Joined October 2010 United States 55 Posts #6 You might wanna fix the date. May instead of March =D the 4 "S" rule, supply, scv, scout, and spend ^_^

OldManSenex Profile Joined June 2011 United States 130 Posts #7 O.O Thanks Verveji! I totally missed that on the first readthrough!



About prize pools: Right now the FRB Grand Tournament is meant to be a community tournament to draw attention and enthusiasm to the ideas of FRB. We're hesitant to involve money just yet, because while none of the games we've seen so far have suggested that there are imbalances in the game we won't be sure of that until after this tournament at least. In light of that, it seems premature to put money on the line. However, if there is a lot of support for making a prize pool we'll definitely be open to reconsidering for this tournament or in FRB Grand Tournament 2!



About having the tournament be about balance: The effects of FRB have been studied over several weeks with more than a thousand hours played on just 6m Devolution. This tournament is the next step, to get a lot of high-level players together playing on maps that have thus far been balanced, entertaining and fun. For FRB shoutcasts and analysis check out www.youtube.com/wiseoldsenex

Pull Profile Joined April 2010 United States 296 Posts #8 I'm incredibly excited about this tournament and can't wait to see the turn out for it. As for what Chuky said, it's purpose isn't to test the balance, we've been doing that for the past 2 weeks. It's just to provide an entertaining event that's a little different than what people are used to seeing. The ideas that Barrin has come up with are really cool so we want to let the community see how they play out in a more official style :D Co-Creator of the FRB Grand Tournament...Check out my epic commentaries at YouTube.com/pullsc and twitch.tv/pullsc ESPORTS FIGHTING!

-ForeverAlone- Profile Joined June 2011 274 Posts #9 Can't wait for this! Loving 6m. Way more fun to cast and watch than SRB. omg terran is hard to play

yakitate304 Profile Joined April 2009 United States 655 Posts #10 As an aside, another purpose of this tournament is to further the momentum that FRB/6m has generated thus far. As stated in the "Mappers" video, Blizzard would need to see that FRB is something embraced by a large portion of the community for it to really stick. With Heart of the Swarm's release coming up soon-ish, we feel that we have an opportunity to make a real change to StarCraft II as a whole. Right now, this is a very, very niche community within the larger SCII ecosystem, but this tournament is hopefully the first of many, with each being bigger and better than the last.



SO with that in mind, please spread this to your SC friends and introduce them to the FRB/6m idea. The more groundswell we can create, the more likely it is to catch Blizzard's eye and potentially bring about changes to the core of Heart of the Swarm. Yaki's Streaming Madness: twitch.tv/YakiSC ||| FRB Grand Tournament Organizer ||| @YakiStarCraft ||| Youtube.com/YakiStarCraft

itsMAHVELbaybee Profile Joined October 2008 292 Posts Last Edited: 2012-03-26 19:17:37 #11 On March 27 2012 02:40 chuky500 wrote:

I don't really see why there needs to be a tournament to study whether less minerals and geisers is balanced. It's kind of obvious it shifts the balance towards Zergs and Terran since they benefit the most from more hatches and orbitals (more larva and mules, hatches are cheaper, cc can lift and mine other bases later). Zergs will also benefit from the fact that 1 rich gas now cost 25 minerals + 1 drone compared to 50 minerals + 2 drones.



The game has been balanced around 2 gas geisers and 8 mineral patches mostly because it allows more variety in gameplay, I don't have anything against smaller bases here and there like on crevasse or daybreak but it can not be the norm unless you also change the cost of buildings and units.



Tournaments helping the mapping community are a good idea but they should play all kinds of maps not just trying to prove Barrin's ideas, like when he said the only viable symmetry was the "VARS", the true left right symmetry. If these maps work I'll make maps with 3 patches 1 gas, and gold bases with 1 gold patch and 1 gas and we'll see if games are more interresting.



By variety, you mean 2 base deathballs.



Lots of players now understand that you can do so much on 2 base, you never need your 3rd till much much later. You can have all the tech and upgrades and be at least 170 food with each race just on two base alone. This just leaves to shitty variety as its whoever gets a deathball first and does enough damage to win the game.



Sure you can QQ about mules and hatches all day, but don't lie to yourselves and say, "Oh, theres tons of variety on 8m2g."



Things like this tournament is whats needed to really start seeing how things pan out when theres something to work toward. If someone can figure out something broken/OP/exploit because of 6m1hyg then so be it -- we return to deathballs galore. By variety, you mean 2 base deathballs.Lots of players now understand that you can do so much on 2 base, you never need your 3rd till much much later. You can have all the tech and upgrades and be at least 170 food with each race just on two base alone. This just leaves to shitty variety as its whoever gets a deathball first and does enough damage to win the game.Sure you can QQ about mules and hatches all day, but don't lie to yourselves and say, "Oh, theres tons of variety on 8m2g."Things like this tournament is whats needed to really start seeing how things pan out when theres something to work toward. If someone can figure out something broken/OP/exploit because of 6m1hyg then so be it -- we return to deathballs galore. I am boss. -Minami-ke

Barrin Profile Blog Joined May 2010 United States 4998 Posts Last Edited: 2012-03-26 19:25:31 #12



@Senex, Pull, you guys are awesome for putting this tournament together (I am a mere helper ^^). And for all the casting you've been doing on FRB maps. ♥



@YOU If you're getting tired of the way SC2 gameplay has been thus far, please give this a chance. If you like the idea ( Woot woot!!! Ferby tournaments are the best tournaments :D@Senex, Pull, you guys are awesome for putting this tournament together (I am a mere helper ^^). And for all the casting you've been doing on FRB maps. ♥If you're getting tired of the way SC2 gameplay has been thus far,give this a chance. If you like the idea ( I am confident that you will ) Blizzard will listen to us, if only we show them that we like watching this stuff! Grandfather of LotV's resource model. "Fewer Resources per Base"

jeeneeus Profile Blog Joined September 2010 1158 Posts #13 How good do you have to be to participate in the tournament?

y0su Profile Blog Joined September 2011 Finland 7871 Posts #14 On March 27 2012 04:24 Barrin wrote:

Woot woot!!! Ferby tournaments are the best tournaments :D



@Senex, Pull, you guys are awesome for putting this tournament together (I am a mere helper ^^). And for all the casting you've been doing on FRB maps. ♥



@YOU If you're getting tired of the way SC2 gameplay has been thus far, please give this a chance. If you like the idea ( Woot woot!!! Ferby tournaments are the best tournaments :D@Senex, Pull, you guys are awesome for putting this tournament together (I am a mere helper ^^). And for all the casting you've been doing on FRB maps. ♥If you're getting tired of the way SC2 gameplay has been thus far,give this a chance. If you like the idea ( I am confident that you will ) Blizzard will listen to us, if only we show them that we like watching this stuff!



I'm currently happy with SC2 gameplay... However, I see the potential here for something even better! I'll definitely be keeping an eye on this.



Very cool! I'm currently happy with SC2 gameplay... However, I see the potential here for something even better! I'll definitely be keeping an eye on this.Very cool!

Barrin Profile Blog Joined May 2010 United States 4998 Posts #15 On March 27 2012 04:29 jeeneeus wrote:

How good do you have to be to participate in the tournament?

I believe we're hoping for master+, but for now it would be foolish to discourage lower from signing up. I believe we're hoping for master+, but for now it would be foolish to discourage lower from signing up. Grandfather of LotV's resource model. "Fewer Resources per Base"

chuky500 Profile Blog Joined March 2010 France 472 Posts Last Edited: 2012-03-26 20:00:37 #16 Yes there's more variety when you have 2 gas instead of 1 because you can choose to have 1 or 2. And with more mineral patches there's more room for strategies that involve cutting probes. In the youtube video there's a valid argument by ProdiG. He says 6 mineral bases would be useful in the late game because when a terran or zerg have a stock of minerals and need to rebuild a quick army they can produce marines or zerglings while zealots are useless for a protoss.



That said it's fine this tournament is happening but it's a bit sad to read 6 mineral maps had thousand of hours of playtime while the whole mapping community could have benefitted from this play time. imo it's the same as when iccup ran community maps tournaments on their own maps. It's just not aimed at the community but centered on particular people.

Barrin Profile Blog Joined May 2010 United States 4998 Posts Last Edited: 2012-03-26 20:16:37 #17







Fallacy B:



"But isn't lowering the resources per base going to give players less options and thus make it less interesting?"



It's important to understand that when you give one person something you're also giving it to the other person. When you give each player more resources, you are giving both of them what they need to both defend and attack. Interestingly enough, this has not proven to create back-and-forth games by itself.



However, when you limit their resources, you are limiting their tools. You are forcing them to make decisions with which tools to use. This gives both players the opportunity to find which tool(s) the opponent lacks and attempt to punish it with superior use of another tool. This does not necessarily imply imbalance or coin-flipping, and



In other words, giving both players all the tools they need (more resources) is like a macho-man, arm-wrestling, head-butting match (that catalyzes the snowball effect). Limiting the tools they have (less resources) turns it into an intricate dance (in a masculine way ^^). (except from Breadth of Gameplay in SC2)It's important to understand that when you give one person something you're also giving it to the other person. When you give each player more resources, you are giving both of them what they need to both defend and attack. Interestingly enough, this has not proven to create back-and-forth games by itself.However, when you limit their resources, you are limiting their tools. You are forcing them to make decisions with which tools to use. This gives both players the opportunity to find which tool(s) the opponent lacks and attempt to punish it with superior use of another tool. This does not necessarily imply imbalance or coin-flipping, and Asymmetric forces are exciting In other words, giving both players all the tools they need (more resources) is like a macho-man, arm-wrestling, head-butting match (that catalyzes the snowball effect). Limiting the tools they have (less resources) turns it into an intricate dance (in a masculine way ^^).



This is not about just a few people, this is about an entire game and history RTS gaming... and the gameplay issue cuts much deeper than balance. This is the game we play, and this is about staying true to what it should have been in the first place. Balance should have been done around lower income rate (achievable in multiple ways) in the first place. Almost unanimous by



While I believe 2g > 1g... 6m1hyg with 2000m/5000g is the very best we can do without touching the data editor. I'm not really convinced you completely understand what can make "more room for strategies". Here is a large part of the story that is common to miss.This isabout just apeople, this is about an entire game and history RTS gaming... and the gameplay issue cuts much deeper than balance. This is the game we play, and this is about staying true to what it should have been in the first place. Balance should have been done around lower income rate (achievable in multiple ways) in the first place. Almost unanimous by recognizable people who have been around long enough to know what they're talking about . We just need to make it bigger and bigger so Blizzard gets it.While I believe 2g > 1g... 6m1hyg with 2000m/5000g is the very best we can do without touching the data editor. Grandfather of LotV's resource model. "Fewer Resources per Base"

RustySpork Profile Joined March 2012 United Kingdom 49 Posts #18 really like what you guys are doing here! look forward to seeing a sc2 that is even more interesting to watch

TheFish7 Profile Blog Joined February 2012 United States 2814 Posts #19 On March 27 2012 05:13 Barrin wrote:

This is not about just a few people, this is about an entire game and history RTS gaming...



I have already seen a bunch of Masters players play on 6m maps and I have to say, they are a ton of fun to watch. I am really really excited to watch this tournament! I have already seen a bunch of Masters players play on 6m maps and I have to say, they are a ton of fun to watch. I am really really excited to watch this tournament! ~ ~ <°)))><~ ~ ~

Natespank Profile Joined November 2011 Canada 448 Posts #20 I feel strongly about the bo1 for the ro32/ro16. They need to be best of 3s at least. Bo1 is begging players to lose due to surprises in the map style, probably in the form of build order losses and cheese.



Cheese testing is important for the format, but you don't want a cheese tournament where one player makes a tricky build and just crushes the others because it's so new.



bo3

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