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Most of us are to blame for our failures, believe it or not. We didn’t practice enough, plan ahead, or work hard enough. If we are honest, we could have done more to succeed, but something stopped us. In this episode, our hosts discuss why people sabotage their own success and fess up to whether or not they are sabotaging their own.

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“People would rather fail because they didn’t try rather than fail because they weren’t good enough.”

– Gabe Howard

Highlights From ‘Self-Sabotage’ Episode

[2:00] Do we sabotage ourselves?

[3:00] Some reasons for self-sabotage.

[6:30] Private rejection vs. public rejection.

[11:30] Failure and self-sabotage.

[17:30] As is our way, our mothers come up.

[19:00] Working hard and yet not succeeding.

[20:00] How do you stop self-sabotaging?

Computer Generated Transcript for ‘A Bipolar and a Schizophrenic Talk Self-Sabotage’ Show

Editor’s Note: Please be mindful that this transcript has been computer generated and therefore may contain inaccuracies and grammar errors. Thank you.

Narrator: [00:00:09] For reasons that utterly escapes everyone involved. You’re listening to a Bipolar, A Schizophrenic and A Podcast. Here are your hosts Gabe Howard and Michelle Hammer.

Gabe: [00:00:21] Welcome to A Bipolar, A Schizophrenic, And A Podcast. My name is Gabe Howard and I’m bipolar.

Michelle: [00:00:23] I’m Michelle Hammer and I’m schizophrenic.

Gabe: [00:00:26] And together we have a podcast.

Michelle: [00:00:27] That’s right we do it’s such a good one I love it so much.

Gabe: [00:00:31] I think that it is the very best podcast for mentally ill people by mentally ill people.

Michelle: [00:00:36] Me too I agree with that completely wholeheartedly.

Gabe: [00:00:38] I can’t really think of another one but I’ve noticed that since our podcast started to get popular people started showing up and saying “well I’m mentally ill and my podcast is for mentally ill people.”

Gabe: [00:00:49] And but I don’t think that’s true I think that they do live with mental illness, but I think they just had a podcast and hoped to gain an audience. Whereas we were like yes we need to create content for our community.

Michelle: [00:01:02] Our community is just underserved.

Gabe: [00:01:04] It is it’s incredibly under served. This is what I love about podcasting because it’s like such a niche thing. You know the mental health community and people who live with mental illness we are small which is good because you know thank god like everybody is not living with mental illness that would be terrible. So you know we’re never gonna be like on NBC at 8 o’clock. I mean that that’s where you get programming that appeals to like the mass markets and mass audience. So the nice thing about podcasts is we can have that little niche market. I mean some mentally ill people targeting a small group and that’s that’s why we exist. But it is sad because really we should be like super famous.

Michelle: [00:01:43] Oh yeah totally. If on self-sabotage it.

Gabe: [00:01:47] Exactly. And we have done this to ourselves with this very show on numerous occasions.

Gabe: [00:01:54] Many many many many many. Remember the time that you quit the show because you refused to talk to me for like an entire day.

Michelle: [00:02:02] When did that happen?

Gabe: [00:02:04] It happened you know like several months ago when we were at Olive Garden. You were just like I’m not making eye contact. I hope you die.

Michelle: [00:02:11] Yeah yeah I can remember that.

Gabe: [00:02:12] It was but it was incredibly awkward and we were talking about ways to make the podcast better and you got all all all all what did you get.

Michelle: [00:02:22] Quiet.

Gabe: [00:02:20] I believe but hurt is the term we’re looking for.

Michelle: [00:02:25] If you insist because you were being a dick.

Gabe: [00:02:27] How?

Michelle: [00:02:26] You said yeah this sucks and that sucks and you suck and everything’s OK.

Gabe: [00:02:34] Really. I said you suck.

Michelle: [00:02:35] Pretty much.

Gabe: [00:02:38] Ah and there is the key word when it comes to self-sabotaging behavior. It’s when we believe things to be true because they’re basically true like what you just said Michelle. You basically said you suck.

Michelle: [00:02:51] That’s not self-sabotaging behavior.

Gabe: [00:02:51] But did I actually say you suck?

Michelle: [00:02:59] Pretty much.

Gabe: [00:02:59] No not pretty much. Did the words “Michelle Hammer sucks” comes out of Gabe’s mouth.

Michelle: [00:03:05] Yes.

Gabe: [00:03:05] Liar liar liar. Now you know I’m gonna quit on the air.

Gabe: [00:03:10] Fine I resign in protest.

Narrator: [00:03:12] You’ve been listening to a schizophrenic and a podcast.

Michelle: [00:03:15] Number one reason number one for self-sabotage is when you feel like you don’t deserve to be successful. Have you ever felt like you don’t deserve to be successful? Oh, you’re gonna sit there Gabe. You just sit there and not even say anything.

Gabe: [00:03:31] You fired me.

Gabe: [00:03:33] The only reason I’m here is because we’re in my house.

Michelle: [00:03:35] Well do you see that I self sabotage this podcast.

Gabe: [00:03:42] I don’t think that your self sabotaging the podcast. I think you’re self-sabotaging yourself. Because as you pointed out in number one I think you are afraid of success.

Michelle: [00:03:51] You think so.

Gabe: [00:03:52] Yes.

Michelle: [00:03:54] Well it’s very interesting to point out because it seems like one of the biggest things about self-sabotage is the fear of trying one’s best and not succeeding.

Gabe: [00:04:04] Do you feel that you try your best.

Michelle: [00:04:07] Yes.

Gabe: [00:04:07] And when you try your best do you feel that you always succeed.

Michelle: [00:04:10] No.

Gabe: [00:04:11] And are you okay with that.

Michelle: [00:04:13] I mean it’s frustrating.

Gabe: [00:04:14] Well sure nobody said it can’t be frustrating.

Gabe: [00:04:17] I think a lot of people don’t think that they’re self-sabotaging because they think oh they’re protecting themselves or they’re giving it enough effort to work. But really self-sabotage behavior is kind of twofold. It’s one not giving something 110 percent because you think oh what’s the point it’s just going to fail anyway. And two when you get close to that success it’s also doing things like showing up late, or showing up unprepared, or to use a sports analogy, going out late the night before and eating a bunch of pizza.

Michelle: [00:04:48] I would agree with that.

Gabe: [00:04:49] Have you ever done that like before a lacrosse game like just gone out like drinking the night before.

Michelle: [00:04:54] No. We had rules.

Gabe: [00:04:55] Well but disobeying those rules would be a way of sabotaging yourself. You’d be sabotaging your success and then if you lose you can say oh I’m still the best lacrosse player. The only reason I lost is because I was drunk.

Michelle: [00:05:06] That would be really really ridiculous. And my whole team would be really really mad at me I wouldn’t do that.

Gabe: [00:05:12] So you care when your team is mad at you when you’re working on a project. Like, say a lacrosse game or a podcast.

Michelle: [00:05:20] Mm hmm. Another one. I was thinking about self-sabotage which I noticed that I did do was I looking up and said: “once in a while we self-sabotage simply to push buttons.” “We pick a fight and we incite drama to get a rush.” I would pick so many fights with my coach, so many fights. It was ridiculous. She once said to me “that she wished that I was bad at lacrosse so she could just cut me from the team.”

Gabe: [00:05:49] So you’re saying that when you respect somebody and look up to them you push their buttons so that a fight can ensue and you can not talk to them at Olive Garden.

Michelle: [00:05:58] Apparently.

Gabe: [00:06:01] That’s what I’m hearing.

Michelle: [00:06:02] I don’t know how you’re hearing that. How did we get to Olive Garden?

Gabe: [00:06:05] I guess you hurt my feelings.

Michelle: [00:06:06] You are my feelings.

Gabe: [00:06:07] You hurt my feelings.

Gabe: [00:06:08] My feelings were the most hurt.

Michelle: [00:06:10] My feelings were more hurt. Why do you think I wasn’t talking to you.

Michelle: [00:06:14] Back to self-sabotage. “It feels better to control your own failure. Then to let it blindside you.” So are you used to rejection?

Gabe: [00:06:26] I’m not. Every time I get rejected it hurts. Now I have developed some coping skills. Let’s talk about the difference between our reactions publicly and our reactions privately. And here’s why I want to touch on this. I don’t handle rejection well when people reject me. It really hurts my feelings and I get upset. I eat ice cream. I refuse to leave the house for a day. I get really really sad. My feelings get hurt. All of those things are true every single time I’ve ever lost an award a contest a contract. Anytime somebody went with a different speaker over me or a sponsor didn’t re-up whatever. I get hurt almost every single time.

Gabe: [00:07:07] But I handle it privately.

Gabe: [00:07:09] You know all joking aside to everybody Michelle was actually really good at this because I’ll wright Michelle and I’ll be like Oh my God our stats dropped and Michelle’s like “oh well we’ll get them next week” and then I don’t post on Facebook oh everybody hates us our stats dropped. And I think that’s what’s important to understand. I think that all of us are probably kind of prone to beat ourselves up privately. What I want to talk about are the people that do it publicly. We all know those people that every single time they fail or get rejected they just smear it everywhere. It’s all over social media. It’s all they talk about when you get together. They call up people and yell at them. They pick fights with their boyfriends and girlfriends just they can just never be happy because of a single rejection.

Gabe: [00:07:50] And they do it publicly. And I personally think it makes them look stupid.

Michelle: [00:07:54] I mean, I cannot stand passive aggressive Facebook statuses.

Gabe: [00:08:02] Like give me an example of one.

Michelle: [00:08:04] “One day somebody will care about me as much as I care about them.”

Gabe: [00:08:13] That’s a big one.

Michelle: [00:08:14] Yeah and obviously directed towards a person.

Gabe: [00:08:18] Yeah. That is an excellent point.

Gabe: [00:08:21] The other one is, “if you don’t see my value you’ll see me walk away.”

Michelle: [00:08:25] Or there’s the classic “don’t make someone a priority when you are just some afterthought” an afterthought or whatever it is.

Gabe: [00:08:35] Yeah it’s true.

Gabe: [00:08:36] I have seen all of these Facebook statuses on your Facebook wall.

Michelle: [00:08:39] I have never once posted a Facebook status like that.

Gabe: [00:08:43] I completely agree. You have not.

Gabe: [00:08:45] And I respect that about you and that is the thing that is really that is the professional part of our relationship as we do talk a lot about things that go on behind the scenes. But you know the olive garden thing happened literally months ago and we’re talking about it now in jest and to be funny and because it did happen and because the show relies on like real stories of our lives and problems that we have had. But I’d like to point out that the whole time that you refused to make eye contact or speak with me you weren’t like on Facebook like if he doesn’t realize that I’m half of this podcast that he can suck it.

Michelle: [00:09:20] Exactly.

Gabe: [00:09:22] Everybody would like I wonder who that’s geared at. Let’s see if she has one podcast. One co-host might be Gabe.

Michelle: [00:09:27] Might be who could she be talking about. This ginger haired man is a ginger-haired man.

Gabe: [00:09:38] Wow.

Michelle: [00:09:39] This Ginger head man being mean to me right now and I don’t like him a lot.

Gabe: [00:09:42] You know it’s mean to make fun of somebody’s physical characteristics. Big Nose.

Gabe: [00:09:49] I would never do something like that. Frizzy hair.

Gabe: [00:09:54] We’re gonna step away to hear from our sponsor and hopefully when we come back we’ll get back on track.

Narrator: [00:09:58] This episode is sponsored by betterhelp.com secure convenient and affordable online counseling. All counselors are licensed accredited professionals. Anything you share is confidential. Schedule secure video or phone sessions plus chat and text with your therapist whenever you feel it’s needed. A month of online therapy often costs less than a single traditional face to face session. Go to betterhelp.com/PsychCentral and experience 7 days of free therapy to see if online counseling is right for you. Betterhelp.com/PsychCentral.

Michelle: [00:10:30] Back to self-sabotage.

Michelle: [00:10:32] There’s also “perceived fraudulence and when you do something that raises your public profile you kind of feel like you only have further to fall.” I have suffered from this in my life because one day I think I realized that I have this online persona. People think I’m a cool person. I guess I don’t really think I’m that cool but maybe one day I kind of think what if people think I’m not cool and then everybody realizes I’m a big loser and nobody likes me anymore.

Gabe: [00:10:59] First off I sincerely doubt that you think you’re not cool. That’s that’s just the I’m going to call bullshit on that. You think that you are a badass. In fairness you are. You’ve accomplished quite a lot and you deserve the confidence that you have. But I think that what you are trying to explain is that you’re worried that even though you think you’re a good person and a cool person and you are capable you’re worried that people will think that you’re a fraud. And the reason that they will think you’re a fraud is because eventually, you’re going to fail. Eventually, you’re gonna have a project that doesn’t work and you’ve had projects that haven’t worked. Michelle, you pop up in New York City which is very very difficult.

Gabe: [00:11:40] I want to give you full props a lot of people think that you just sell this stuff online and the relative safety of your own home. But actually, you go out on the streets of New York City and sell your wares very publicly right?

Michelle: [00:11:53] Mm hmm.

Gabe: [00:11:55] Every time you go do you sell the same amount. Oh no. So that means that sometimes your sales are successful and profitable and sometimes even though you’re selling the exact same stuff and you’re the exact same person sometimes you lose money and you spend the whole day like for negative dollars.

Michelle: [00:12:13] That has happened. Yes yes.

Gabe: [00:12:17] Failure.

Michelle: [00:12:17] That’s how I started. I started in a deficit but now it’s getting way better with the connections that I’ve made through other places where I can pop up now in better spots for less of a price. Because when you do pop up in New York City unless you have a permit you have to pay to be at a pop-up shop in a certain place. So if you don’t make over the amount of money that you’ve paid to have your place you then lose money but then there’s also sales and then there’s revenue. Did you make more in your revenue that you’ve actually paid?

Gabe: [00:12:51] Are you explaining business to our listeners like we just became a business podcast. So we’re like Forbes for mentally ill people. Thank you Michelle for explaining business economics to our listeners.

Michelle: [00:13:05] I’ve done days where I’ve sold one shirt. I’ve done days where I’ve sold 30 shirts.

Gabe: [00:13:10] What’s the most shirts you’ve ever sold in one day?

Michelle: [00:13:15] About 30.

Gabe: [00:13:16] And what is the least number of shirts you’ve ever sold?

Michelle: [00:13:17] One.

Gabe: [00:13:18] So that that’s a world of difference.

Michelle: [00:13:21] So yes.

Gabe: [00:13:22] So even in your manufacturing enterprise it is wildly successful. I mean it really is you are. You are very successful as a designer and seller of clothes correct?

Michelle: [00:13:36] Yes.

Gabe: [00:13:37] But all days aren’t equal. So I think that sometimes people don’t look at the whole. And you know our show, for example, every single time we have an episode that goes poorly. What do I do?

Michelle: [00:13:50] You get upset.

Gabe: [00:13:51] And who do I call.

Michelle: [00:13:52] Me.

Gabe: [00:13:53] And what do you say.

Michelle: [00:13:54] Next time will be better.

Gabe: [00:13:55] Yes.

Gabe: [00:13:56] And you point out that our stats for the entire month are always great. But yeah you’ve got to have an episode that’s the worst one in a month. You’ve got to have an episode that’s the best one. They’re not all gonna be uniform. That’s impossible but it is mathematically impossible. Some shows are gonna do better than others. You always say it like that New York accent and usually mocking me. But that is the pep talk that you give me every single time. But I always tell you no no no. This is proof that people are losing interest and that it’s no longer good. And I start to just devolve very quickly into “Oh it’s gonna be over soon” and every month your right.

Michelle: [00:14:31] It goes back up.

Michelle: [00:14:33] Does those do you always try to find a scapegoat of why it failed.

Gabe: [00:14:39] I don’t try to find a scapegoat of why it fails because I do always try to find a scapegoat and I always think that it’s me and by extension of it being me I think it’s you.

Gabe: [00:14:52] So I always think it’s us because the show is just us. I don’t know that that’s a bad way to look at it though.

Gabe: [00:14:59] I mean if I’m being completely honest with myself I do take credit for the success of the show. We take credit for the success of the show and I feel very strongly that if you’re gonna take credit for something you need to take the negative. If you’re going to pat yourself on the back when you’re successful you need to take the blame for failure. And I just I really really detest people that want all the credit when things go well but they’re nowhere to be found when things go poorly.

Gabe: [00:15:28] I don’t like people like that. I don’t. I think that it’s that’s irresponsible. I will be standing at the finish line whether we win or whether we lose.

Michelle: [00:15:35] And I just believe that.

Michelle: [00:15:36] There is no I in team.

Gabe: [00:15:39] Yeah but there’s a me and an at.

Michelle: [00:15:43] What.

Gabe: [00:15:43] And meet. And a meta.

Michelle: [00:15:46] What is that supposed to mean?

Gabe: [00:15:48] Gabe is very meta.

Michelle: [00:15:50] I don’t like that word.

Gabe: [00:15:51] You don’t like meta. What is it like meta. Like a box of boxes is very meta or putting spectrums on a spectrum is very meta.

Michelle: [00:16:00] I don’t know what you’re talking about right now you’re just sabotaging this podcast.

Gabe: [00:16:04] That’s very true. Do you think that it is a form of self-sabotage. Anytime I ask you like a very personal question and instead of answering it you deflect onto something else.

Michelle: [00:16:14] I don’t think that’s sabotage. I just think that’s ignoring you.

Gabe: [00:16:18] No I’m I’m being serious.

Gabe: [00:16:20] Like for example right there it’s just you were really snarky I’m just ignoring you why. Really that’s why I’m being sincere that that’s what you want the audience to think that if Gabe asked you a question that you don’t like you just flat out ignore him. Isn’t it very passive aggressive you don’t you don’t say no thank you. You don’t change the subject you know what I mean you’re just I’m just ignoring you dick. I’m like your business.

Michelle: [00:16:41] What questions are you asking me that I’m not answering?

Gabe: [00:16:43] Do you love your mother?

Michelle: [00:16:45] Of course.

Gabe: [00:16:47] I wish we had video right now.

Gabe: [00:16:54] I actually know that you are very very fond of your mother but whenever I ask the question you always get like like I swear to God like your face turns red and some horns pop up and you’re like yes I do.

Michelle: [00:17:13] Do you love your mother?

Gabe: [00:17:14] Damn skippy she brought me into this world.

Gabe: [00:17:18] She makes me Turkey she makes those little Hershey Kiss cookies that I like but not the apple cookies that I like. She made them one year nobody liked them but me. So she’ll never make them again. That bitch I know and now she claims that she lost the recipe in the world of Google. How do you lose a recipe?

Michelle: [00:17:39] You know she’s lying to you. I think she is 100 percent. She is sabotaging Thanksgiving.

Gabe: [00:17:48] Don’t say that. Thanksgiving is way over.

Michelle: [00:17:49] Oh she is sabotaging your happiness. She is. I think that she is sabotaging my happy. You know what you could you Gabe you could just make those Apple cookies.

Gabe: [00:18:00] That is actually an excellent example right now I am upset that last Christmas my mother did not make me the cookies and I blamed her for not finding the recipe. And I blamed her for not using google to find the recipe but I am capable of finding the recipe for her and she’d probably make them. I’m capable of finding the recipe and making them myself. I’m capable of going to a bakery and just buying the damn things but instead I am sabotaging the relationship that I have with my mother by continuing to complain about something that is easily wrecked a fireball because in my mind it’s easier to be pissed off and angry and put upon than to just solve the damn problem.

Michelle: [00:18:41] Did you self sabotage when you were younger.

Gabe: [00:18:43] Yes. And I think that everybody does when they’re younger because we don’t understand the consequences yet. Hard work is hard work and working hard to get nothing is just the ultimate in depressing. It really is. We’ll go back to the sports analogy. You know how everybody says there’s no second place there’s just the first loser. I mean look. Being the second best at something in the entire world is a pretty good place to be. But I understand it.

Michelle: [00:19:10] You worked so hard and so long and you gave it everything you had and it didn’t matter.

Gabe: [00:19:19] Somebody was better than you.

Gabe: [00:19:21] My God that is devastatingly awful but I try to remember that if I didn’t give it 100% and I come in second that means if I would’ve come in first. So the whole reason I’m not standing on top of the pile is because I half-assed it and I think that’s worse in my mind self sabotaging is worse.

Gabe: [00:19:44] It’s why I put in way too much effort into any everything. You know how many people make fun of us for how much effort we put into our little podcast.

Michelle: [00:19:52] People make fun of us?

Gabe: [00:19:53] They make fun of us constantly.

Gabe: [00:19:55] Remember when we started and somebody said you will never find a sponsor ever.

Michelle: [00:19:59] Who said that?

Gabe: [00:20:00] Yeah we’re not going to out people on the show.

Michelle: [00:20:03] But well you know what they can do. Yeah.

Gabe: [00:20:08] You know they can do Michelle when you told your family that you were going to start a podcast did they ever think that it would be a money-making enterprise.

Michelle: [00:20:15] Oh absolutely not.

Gabe: [00:20:16] Yeah yeah. And is it a moneymaking enterprise.

Michelle: [00:20:19] I’m making millions.

Gabe: [00:20:21] OK. No. Now you’re just lying.

Gabe: [00:20:23] Yeah. Now exaggeration and grandiosity is going to be next week’s show.

Gabe: [00:20:29] Michelle tie this together in a bow. Why do people self-sabotage and how do we get them to stop.

Michelle: [00:20:34] I think people are just afraid of doing well because they’re afraid to fail. You’re afraid of failing then you’re just going to mess everything up when you’re doing well in high school. I was undiagnosed schizophrenic. I also had ADHD. They didn’t know about I was really bad at reading books because I had I just couldn’t concentrate on any of the books. So instead of handing in an essay that was going to be awful I just wouldn’t hand in an essay because I didn’t want the teacher to see how stupid I was. So that’s just self-sabotage right there.

Michelle: [00:21:08] I’d rather get a zero than let the teacher know that I couldn’t write because I was dumb.

Gabe: [00:21:13] You’d rather fail because you didn’t try than fail because you’re not good enough.

Michelle: [00:21:19] Exactly.

Gabe: [00:21:21] But you deprived yourself of the opportunity to get better and possibly succeed.

Michelle: [00:21:26] Well I realized this now but I did not realize this then.

Gabe: [00:21:29] But somebody did realize it for you right.

Gabe: [00:21:32] Your parents the teacher I mean somebody corrected this you are a woman who knows how to read and graduated from college and you are quite successful. So I refuse to believe that you went through your entire school career doing no homework turning nothing in and getting all zeros. So somebody fixed this.

Michelle: [00:21:47] I do the easy stuff. I mean I could read the short books but if you put a gigantic book in front of me and tell me to read it I’m going to have a panic attack.

Gabe: [00:21:55] What if I take a gigantic book and I cut it into like four hundred little books. Then could you read it.

Michelle: [00:22:01] No. I read a book and I constantly check how many pages I have left.

Gabe: [00:22:08] How does that help?

Michelle: [00:22:08] It doesn’t get I just get so overwhelmed when I’m reading books.

Gabe: [00:22:14] Still.

Michelle: [00:22:15] Yes.

Gabe: [00:22:16] How do you make it through college?

Michelle: [00:22:16] I was an art major Gabe.

Gabe: [00:22:20] That’s fair. I forgot. The only thing lower than an art major.

Michelle: [00:22:25] A gym teacher.

Gabe: [00:22:27] No. Somebody who plays sports.

Michelle: [00:22:32] You know sports is not a major.

Gabe: [00:22:33] Isn’t it.

Michelle: [00:22:35] It’s not.

Gabe: [00:22:36] Isn’t it.

Michelle: [00:22:36] It’s you can’t graduate with a sports degree.

Gabe: [00:22:39] What about all those all those college football players where do they end up.

Michelle: [00:22:44] To conclude Gabe stop being afraid of success.

Michelle: [00:22:49] Don’t be afraid to fail, strive for the stars because if you fall at least you land on the treetops. A soccer coach used to tell me that over and over again.

Michelle: [00:23:02] And that’s why you switched to lacrosse.

Michelle: [00:23:05] Yes.

Gabe: [00:23:07] Thank you, everybody, for tuning into this week’s episode of a bipolar schizophrenic and a podcast. My name is Gabe Howard and with me as always is Michelle Hammer. Remember you can head over to store.PsychCentral.com and buy the official define normal shirt which supports the show. Send us your topic ideas to [email protected]. Remember to leave a comment.

Gabe: [00:23:34] Everywhere you see these comments really really help us leave us a five-star review. Pass this on to your friend. Don’t let our show die otherwise. Michelle and I will just continue to fight.

Narrator: [00:23:51] You’ve been listening to a bipolar schizophrenic podcast. If you love this episode don’t keep it to yourself head over to eye tunes or your preferred podcast app to subscribe rate and review. To work with Gabe go to GabeHoward.com. To Work with Michelle go to Schizophrenic.NYC. For free mental health resources and online support groups. Head over to PsychCentral.com. Show’s official Website PsychCentral.com/BSP you can e-mail us a [email protected]. Thank you for listening and share widely.

Meet Your Bipolar and Schizophrenic Hosts

GABE HOWARD was formally diagnosed with bipolar and anxiety disorders after being committed to a psychiatric hospital in 2003. Now in recovery, Gabe is a prominent mental health activist and host of the award-winning Psych Central Show podcast . He is also an award-winning writer and speaker, traveling nationally to share the humorous, yet educational, story of his bipolar life. To work with Gabe, visit gabehoward.com

MICHELLE HAMMER was officially diagnosed with schizophrenia at age 22, but incorrectly diagnosed with bipolar disorder at 18. Michelle is an award-winning mental health advocate who has been featured in press all over the world. In May 2015, Michelle founded the company Schizophrenic.NYC, a mental health clothing line, with the mission of reducing stigma by starting conversations about mental health. She is a firm believer that confidence can get you anywhere. To work with Michelle, visit Schizophrenic.NYC

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