That sounds right.

So what changed?

Well, one, I’m not sure I was telling the truth wherever I said that quote… I guess there was a period where I was trying to find a story and felt like I was failing. I didn’t realise at the time my approach was wring but I was very kind of plot-oriented. I’m like, ‘oh, this was cool, and here’s this kind of journey…’ and then I’d step back and look at it and be like, ‘Oh no, there’s this kind of interesting twist, but what are we trying to say with this?’ I didn’t have anything to say.

And then I kind of stumbled on this concept that we could talk about but I’m actually glad that because of a bunch of circumstances I was diverted to work on Uncharted 4 for two years. And because of those two years I really got to develop this concept and let it marinade and come to its own. And now we feel very confident in the story that we’re telling and the reason to have a sequel.

Can you elaborate on ‘this concept’?

Yeah, absolutely. So with the first game, the thing that really sparked the whole thing is this concept of the unconditional love a parent feels for their child, and how a parent is willing to do anything - even horrible things - to protect their child. So it’s got this love aspect, this really dark aspect, and it felt ripe to explore in a video game. That’s like the whole concept of Joel and Ellie and their relationship and that how do we make a player feel the unconditional love a parent has for their child. That’s the whole first game.