Wednesday on MSNBC’s “All In,” Sen Mazie Hirono (D-HI) reacted to the news that a federal judge ruled former Donald Trump campaign manager Paul Manafort “intentionally” lied to investigators in special counsel Robert Mueller’s probe.

Host Chris Hayes asked, “Do you have a theory why so many people have lied in these high-stakes situations under oath to investigators, to Congress and now to the special counsel’s office after having struck a plea agreement.”

Hirono said, “It’s pretty amazing. They must have something very major to hide. I think this really shows that Trump surrounded himself by all these people who lie, who are basically grifters and takers.”

When asked about a possible presidential pardon for Manafort, Hirono said, “Unless it could be some sort of obstruction of justice, but as you say his pardon powers are unfettered. What we’re left with is a president who will do anything to protect himself. As I said many times, there are only two things that Trump cares about. One is protecting himself and money. So what could end up is —aside from, by the way, all these other investigations that are going on —he could be before a jury and a judge for all these other allegations, who knows? But I think the bottom line might be that he’s going to have to face the voters and possibly if the Mueller investigation leads to impeachable offensives, then the House will have to make a decision.”

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