

ArrayList

DevOps

Premium Member

join:2005-03-19

Mullica Hill, NJ ArrayList Premium Member okay Let's get something straight. "Bad" behavior depends on your point of view. From where I'm sitting, the NSA isn't bad. It's doing what it is designed to do. Congress is bad.



keyboard5684

Sam

join:2001-08-01

Pittsburgh, PA keyboard5684 Member Re: okay I do not think the NSA is bad either, but my view is slightly different from yours. I do not really care what the NSA gathers on me, go nuts.



I think the "bad" behavior is the spouse checking out her husband, but that is more of an "HR" issue. Any company will have, at some time, an employee doing something they should not be doing. The NSA just has more "stuff" to look through.



I know I will get somebody that disagrees with me, but the NSA "spying" on it's own citizens is harmless (and catches bad guys). If the NSA/government was kicking in doors because someone talked crap about the government, that would be a different story.



PlusOne

@50.182.138.x -1 recommendation PlusOne Anon Re: okay said by keyboard5684: I do not think the NSA is bad either, but my view is slightly different from yours. I do not really care what the NSA gathers on me, go nuts.



I think the "bad" behavior is the spouse checking out her husband, but that is more of an "HR" issue. Any company will have, at some time, an employee doing something they should not be doing. The NSA just has more "stuff" to look through.



I know I will get somebody that disagrees with me, but the NSA "spying" on it's own citizens is harmless (and catches bad guys). If the NSA/government was kicking in doors because someone talked crap about the government, that would be a different story. Plus One. All good points I agree with.



Rob

Premium Member

join:2001-08-25

Miami, FL 1 recommendation Rob to keyboard5684

Premium Member to keyboard5684

said by keyboard5684: I know I will get somebody that disagrees with me, but the NSA "spying" on it's own citizens is harmless (and catches bad guys). If the NSA/government was kicking in doors because someone talked crap about the government, that would be a different story.



There's no checks and balances, and that concerns me. When even Congress & the Senate can't even get some information out of the NSA, that concerns me as well. It's harmless it until they do it to you and there's a misunderstanding, but because they are the NSA, it's very difficult to have any recourse.There's no checks and balances, and that concerns me. When even Congress & the Senate can't even get some information out of the NSA, that concerns me as well.

elefante72

join:2010-12-03

East Amherst, NY elefante72 Member Re: okay



Look at how the blabbering torture report is damaging assets all over the place. The congress has the purse strings, but as far as operations go if they need to look at my records go ahead.



Now the points above are individual abuses, and with power comes abuse. A woman scorned is a dangerous thing The whole point of the NSA is secrecy. It is a spy agency...Look at how the blabbering torture report is damaging assets all over the place. The congress has the purse strings, but as far as operations go if they need to look at my records go ahead.Now the points above are individual abuses, and with power comes abuse. A woman scorned is a dangerous thing



KrK

Heavy Artillery For The Little Guy

Premium Member

join:2000-01-17

Tulsa, OK Netgear WNDR3700v2

Zoom 5341J

1 recommendation KrK Premium Member Re: okay I guess I take a different view. It's not the "blabbering" that's the problem.



The torture IS the problem. It's always bad when people are caught breaking the law or saying one thing and doing another. Also, people should not be surprised when other people do back to you what you do to them.



Torture is not an effective means of gathering intelligence.



keyboard5684

Sam

join:2001-08-01

Pittsburgh, PA keyboard5684 Member Re: okay I do not think the NSA tortures anyone, they just hand off information.



Terrorist do not waterboard someone, they skin them alive plus far more horrible things I do not think I need to mention.

Cutting off heads is more of a favor compared to their torture techniques.



So if we are talking CIA stuff, I say waterboard and sleep deprive away - even if it is not effective. If other people want to do it back to us (like keeping a prisoner awake for days on end) that is fine - it would be an improvement on their current practices.

Wilsdom

join:2009-08-06 Wilsdom to keyboard5684

Member to keyboard5684

Can't catch the bad guys because that's who they are, all they know how to do is steal, kill, cheat, and abuse



Ieyasu

@107.207.74.x Ieyasu to keyboard5684

Anon to keyboard5684

It's a threat to our democracy. What happens in 100 years when the government has an incredibly detailed file on not only your entire life but everyone you've ever known?



Sir can you help us? No???? Sir you know we've got this recording of you from 10 years ago and if you don't.... I thought you'd understand.



Or Sir, if you can't help us I can't promise this somewhat unfortunate info won't find it's way to your uncles employer, you know how tight money is for that family this time of year, him losing his job would be a real shame.



It's like SWAT team. They were made for one purpose, and are almost completely used for another (much to the chagrin and pain of the public)

Once the government has a tool, it's inclined to use it.



I mean sure even if you trust your government today, how about tomorrow? Or in 5 years? Or 30?



cork1958

Cork

Premium Member

join:2000-02-26 cork1958 Premium Member Re: okay "I mean sure even if you trust your government today"



Nope,

Don't trust them already today!



rebus9

join:2002-03-26

Tampa Bay 1 recommendation rebus9 to keyboard5684

Member to keyboard5684

said by keyboard5684: I do not really care what the NSA gathers on me, go nuts. and supported by probable cause. said by keyboard5684: I know I will get somebody that disagrees with me, but the NSA "spying" on it's own citizens is harmless



If they can so easily, and with impunity, violate the Fourth Amendment then what is next? First Amendment? If this goes un-checked, you can believe that a day is coming where we won't enjoy freedom of speech, press, and expression, either. What's next after that? That attitude is exactly what the NSA wants while they completely ignore the Fourth Amendment, which prohibits unreasonable searches and seizures and requires any warrant to be judicially sanctionedEven though it clearly violates our constitutional rights as Americans?If they can so easily, and with impunity, violate the Fourth Amendment then what is next? First Amendment? If this goes un-checked, you can believe that a day is coming where we won't enjoy freedom of speech, press, and expression, either. What's next after that?

8744675

join:2000-10-10

Decatur, GA 2 recommendations 8744675 to ArrayList

Member to ArrayList

How is violating the Constitution, eavesdropping on US citizens without a warrant and lying to the Congress not considered being bad? The NSA has a purpose, but I would rather die in a terrorist attack then live my live with the government monitoring my private conversations all the time!



DaveRickmers

join:2011-07-19

Canyon Country, CA 1 recommendation DaveRickmers to ArrayList

Member to ArrayList

said by ArrayList: Let's get something straight. "Bad" behavior depends on your point of view. From where I'm sitting, the NSA isn't bad. It's doing what it is designed to do. Congress is bad. The NSA is working on behalf of someone other than the People. They work for the Deep State, the Hidden Government, the Military Industrial Complex as we used to call them. Read your Ed Snowden and you won't be so willing to accept these people at face value. They ain't working for me.



ArrayList

DevOps

Premium Member

join:2005-03-19

Mullica Hill, NJ ·Comcast XFINITY

ArrayList Premium Member Re: okay said by DaveRickmers: The NSA is working on behalf of someone other than the People.



And I don't believe Snowdens lies. No, the NSA is doing exactly what I want them to do. Many others think they are doing what they are supposed to do also. Your argument doesn't hold up.And I don't believe Snowdens lies.



RootWyrm

join:2011-05-09 1 recommendation RootWyrm Member Re: okay Your argument doesn't exist. It's just pathetic ad hominem attacks based on ignorance and religion.



Let me clue you in to something. I've seen their handiwork up close and personal. I am unquestionably more familiar with it than you will ever be. And you are as a point of fact, a complete and utter moron if you think any of it is legitimate.



ArrayList

DevOps

Premium Member

join:2005-03-19

Mullica Hill, NJ ArrayList Premium Member Re: okay Who's throwing the ad hominem attacks now?



seriously though. your personal experiences mean jack here. we have no way of verifying them.



KrK

Heavy Artillery For The Little Guy

Premium Member

join:2000-01-17

Tulsa, OK KrK Premium Member Re: okay .... said the man who just claimed the NSA is doing exactly what he wants. Based on what "personal experience" or data we have to just accept without verification.



Controlling

@50.182.138.x -1 recommendation Controlling Anon Re: okay said by KrK: .... said the man who just claimed the NSA is doing exactly what he wants. Based on what "personal experience" or data we have to just accept without verification. Transparency for spy agencies is stupid and entirely unworkable. So no, they have to be accepted without verification. That is the reality of living in a world where violence is SOP and the goal is to take what belongs to others and not pay for it. And where religious fanatics wants to impose their views on everyone.



KrK

Heavy Artillery For The Little Guy

Premium Member

join:2000-01-17

Tulsa, OK Netgear WNDR3700v2

Zoom 5341J

KrK Premium Member Re: okay .... and what is the difference between religious fanatics oppressing people and secret Government agencies oppressing people?



Honestly, you either have your values or you don't. Torture isn't an effective means of gathering intelligence, as they will tell you something, anything, just to make it stop.

KrK KrK to ArrayList

Premium Member to ArrayList

Really? Since you know absolutely nothing the NSA is actually doing and when, how are you so sure they are doing what you want?



Jim Kirk

Premium Member

join:2005-12-09

49985 Jim Kirk to ArrayList

Premium Member to ArrayList

You should move to North Korea. They seem to share your way of thinking.



IPPlanMan

Holy Cable Modem Batman

join:2000-09-20

Washington, DC 1 recommendation IPPlanMan Member Ridiculous... Christmas Eve... I expected no less. Some communications/press flack planned that way ahead of time.



It's clear the the querying system is prone to user error. Maybe they need "Clippy" from Microsoft Office?



"Hello. It looks like you're trying to run a query in violation of established procedure. Would you like to undergo mandatory retraining now?" Yes/No



n2jtx

join:2001-01-13

Glen Head, NY n2jtx Member My Take In a 2012 case, for example, an NSA analyst searched her spouses personal telephone directory without his knowledge to obtain names and telephone numbers for targeting, according to one report. The analyst has been advised to cease her activities, it said. Lesson learned. Never marry a person who works for the NSA. And if you are married to someone who works there, encrypt, encrypt, encrypt! Lesson learned. Never marry a person who works for the NSA. And if you are married to someone who works there, encrypt, encrypt, encrypt!



keyboard5684

Sam

join:2001-08-01

Pittsburgh, PA keyboard5684 Member Re: My Take Yes, but my ex did the same thing and she just worked for Verizon. I also do not think she got any "don't do that" warning - in fact I believe my name is in some funny memo the employees now pass around and laugh at.

wkm001

join:2009-12-14 wkm001 Member Single Occurances I think we can all agree there will be individual cases of abuse when wielding that much power. Like the commenter above said, his wife did this to him as a Verizon employee. I can handle that. It is the mass surveillance and data collection to all Americans that I disagree with.



I personally believe every phone call, text message, instant message, web search, etc... is recorded and stored. I have no idea how long it is archived for.



Rogue Wolf

voted for you for GOAT

join:2003-08-12

Troy, NY Rogue Wolf Member Re: Single Occurances You see a single occurance of malfeasance like you see a single cockroach. There's always more hiding from the light of day.

jefyyy

join:2013-10-14

Calabasas, CA jefyyy Member Trust us... My Biggest problem isn't that they try to keep things secret, my Problem is that people keep screwing up unintentionally or on purpose and they get a warning?

Oooh that will teach them...



If I thought they were actually trustworthy I wouldn't mind massive surveillance but I don't and they are NOT.

Telcos spy on us but at least they don't put anyone in jai... well... nm



Need to win the lotto and move to a deserted island

MaynardKrebs

We did it. We heaved Steve. Yipee.

Premium Member

join:2009-06-17 MaynardKrebs Premium Member It was a Naughty or Nice thing to report on Christmas Eve...

... seems the NSA wanted Santa to leave them a big present - the keys to the kingdoms - and so decided to 'fess up on Christmas Eve. Trouble is that they did so with their fingers crossed behind their backs and with a forked tongue.



Flyonthewall

@206.248.154.x Flyonthewall Anon Give them an inch and they'll take the whole planet. The reason you have a Bill of Rights and a Constitution is because the geniuses who wrote it KNEW that people are human and WILL abuse power.



tfrionli

Tom F.

join:2001-06-21

Kings Park, NY tfrionli Member stop it. Under the guise of security, this is not helping our freedoms, us pesky "civilians" are just in the way.



KrK

Heavy Artillery For The Little Guy

Premium Member

join:2000-01-17

Tulsa, OK 1 recommendation KrK Premium Member Re: stop it. The day is fast approaching where savvy civillians who try and protect themselves from this abuse will actually be considered criminals themselves.