During an interview set to air on CBS’ “Face the Nation” on Sunday, Senator Tim Kaine (D-VA) stated President Trump has tried to divide people based on race and either holds sincerely racist beliefs or believes it is politically advantageous to stoke division.

Kaine said, “There is a concerted effort that he has been engaged in to divide people, including dividing them based on race. … I think he has stoked division. I think he has stoked these fears of hatred.”

Host Margaret Brennan asked Kaine, “Why do you think he’s stoking that? Do you think he’s racist?”

Kaine answered, “I do not know him. I have no idea about who he is as a person. So, whether it’s a sincere feeling, or whether he thinks it gets him some political edge or gain, I don’t know the answer. But I don’t know which of those two is worse. If it’s not your view, but you do it to try to get a political edge, and you try to stoke division, in some ways, that’s every bit as morally bad as holding views that are that are bigoted or racist.”

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