Many on the left refuse to speak honestly about Islam. They claim that verses in the Quran have nothing to do with the violence and oppression coming out of the Muslim world. Thankfully, some more reasonable Muslims are not afraid to call out this blatant lie.

Earlier this week, a Muslim woman called into a Muslim radio show in the UK to try and justify the beating of women by arguing that context matters. However, the host, a liberal reformist who used to be a terrorist but now works to combat radicalization, rightfully humiliated her for saying this and let her know that her way of thinking is what’s wrong with Islam.

The exchange took place on Leading Britain’s Conversation (LBC) a London-based national radio station while Maajid Nawaz, a former extremist, and current counter-extremist, was on the air. During his show, a woman by the name of Nadia called in to argue that domestic violence was not always a bad. According to her, there are some contexts in which it is okay.

“What rules are suitable for beating one’s wife?” asked Nawaz, adding, “when the Quran directly says…’and for those women whose disobedience you fear, first admonish them, then part ways with them, and if that doesn’t work, beat them. Then if they obey you…..then do not seek a way against them, surely Allah is high and great.’ — what context could possibly justify that in today’s modern age?”

Instead of answering his question, she tried shifting the focus to the fact that there are other steps before things escalate to violence. “Anybody with common sense would see that the first step you take if you have a problem with a woman, you wife, or whoever it is…the first step you take is to discuss with them,” she replied.

“But the passage goes on beyond that first step, doesn’t it? What about the third step?” Nawaz interjected.

“What idiot of a man is going to go back after he separated from his wife and say ‘I’m going to teach her a lesson because she’s still disobeying me and I’m going to beat her?’” she replied.

“So then why is the third step there? If that’s illogical for a man to do, why did God prescribe it?” he asked. After she noted that everything comes in stages so people can use their common sense and reason to do what’s right, he asked, “what do you think of that third stage?” Instead of answering the question, she tried yet again to justify it. Frustrated, Nawaz cut her off. “I’m going to ask you for a fourth time, is it wrong that the Quran says husbands can beat their wives?” he pressed.

Her response was shocking. “It depends which context you take it in,” she said.

Baffled, Nawaz asked, “which context is it okay for a husband to beat their wife?” When she answered that it’s never okay, he asked her how she reconciles her answer with her earlier statement that context matters when it comes to beatings.

Yet again, rather than answer, she tried to go off topic by speaking about how wonderful Mohammad was to women. Nawaz cut her off and told her to stay focused on the topic at hand. “I’m asking you specifically, Nadia, what you think of this passage that allows men to beat their wives. Is it wrong? I’m saying it’s wrong. Do you think it’s wrong?” She answered by saying she believes it’s wrong for someone to beat their wife. However, that’s not what Nawaz asked. “I’m not asking you if it’s wrong to beat your wife. I’m asking you if that passage is wrong…I’m saying it’s wrong and must be abandoned,” he stated.

In response, she told him that she can’t agree with him. “There we are. That’s the problem,” Nawaz stated triumphantly, knowing that while she would be willing to admit domestic violence is wrong, she would never be willing to admit the Quran itself was wrong. “You have just said you can’t dispute a passage that allows a husband to beat his wife. That’s the problem, Nadia, that is in our [Muslim] community. We’ve got to start — like Christianity has done and Judaism has done — we’ve got to start being open frank and honest about these passages and say they no longer apply,” he continued, adding, “this is a despicable thing to say you cannot condemn. It says a husband can beat his wife. That is wrong and we’ve got to say that passage has to be abandoned. It has no place in modernity. And I’m frankly quite sick that as a man I’m making that point because to the nation, you as a Muslim woman should be making that point.”

After she tried to blame one sect for the violence in Islam, Nawaz decided to end the conversation. “You can’t blame it on one sect, Wahhabism…You’re blaming it on one sect when even you couldn’t condemn that passage,” he stated. “And that’s the problem we have here. We got to be able to openly and frankly say that passages like that have no place in our modern discourse,” he concluded. “And you couldn’t say that as a woman…that’s shameful,” he added before hanging up.

The Muslim world needs more reformers like Nawaz. To stop violent extremism, he’s trying to persuade Muslims to abandon the worst parts of their scripture. This is because he’s convinced that doing so will make Islam more like Christianity and Judaism. Hopefully, he’s right. If not, Islam’s future looks bleak.