Pack your bags, because The Amazing Race is back for its 30th season! Every week, Parade’s Mike Bloom will bring you interviews with the team most recently eliminated from the race.

In a game that functions around two-person teams, it’s safe to say trust is at its keystone. As people are pushed to their absolute mental, physical, and emotional limits, they need to be able to rely on their friend, family member, or significant other to talk with locals, navigate, and even handle some tasks on behalf of both of them, in the case of the Roadblock. But trust or distrust in your partner can lead to one’s game going as haywire as a dolly full of bags of frozen frites around a tight turn, as April Gould and Sarah Williams found out.

The two came into the race as friends of over 20 years and business partners, responsible for being the origin point of the “goat yoga” trend. Unfortunately, their dynamic turned gruff as they landed in their first destination of Iceland. April had apparently acquired directions on the plane while Sarah was sleeping, and Sarah took that to mean that April did not trust in her navigation skills. Both women that got into their verbal warrior poses and exchanged some cross words while driving through the vast countryside, throwing around accusations of being overly emotional and “a little B.” The “B” word they should have been talking about was “behind,” as they had quickly fallen to the back of the pack and outran Dessie Mitcheson and Kayla Fitzgerald by literal inches to avoid having their race end right there. Now with a second lease on life, April and Sarah were ready to face their next leg as the teams headed into Antwerp, Belgium, their moods as sky high as where Sarah would be during the harrowing Roadblock. After getting lost in the Belgian streets, they were not able to shine in the “Diamond Glint” side of the season’s first Detour. Tasked with calculating a diamond necklace’s value, their imperfections on finding imperfections dropped them to the back of the pack once more. But they were still confident when they left before Eric and Daniel Guffrieda when their attempts at the printing press on the other side of the Detour made them feel as backward as their typesetting. But the team who had succeeded in a historic footrace only a couple of days before was now subject to another Amazing Race first: the Head-to-Head. April suited up to face against Henry Zhang, who had fallen all the way down from third place with his girlfriend Evan Lynyak due to their lack of steering and mounting exhaustion. But Henry was able to channel a second wind, and his Yale-force gust pushed him ahead of April and into a relieving eighth place. Now competing with the team they had just left inspecting diamonds, Sarah finally put her trust in April and elected to have her run again. While it was a commendable representation of the short arc they had, their struggle with directions had carried over when April got turned around in a collision on the course, allowing the firefighters to pass them and Team Goat Yoga to pack up their mats and go.

Now out of the race, April and Sarah talk with me about their thoughts going into the Head-to-Head, who they were closest with of the remaining teams, and what was the impetus behind their dynamic on the race.

I want to start by talking about the Head-to-Head, which was the centerpiece of the episode. When you get to that course and see the task ahead of you, what goes through your head?

Sarah Williams: Well, honestly when we first got there, it seemed like a good challenge for me. But April was also very enthusiastic about it. She said, “I have an obstacle course in my backyard! I push wheelbarrows around for my goats! I’m going to be awesome at this.” They didn’t give us any time to stop and think. So I said, “Ok, go ahead and do it.” Evan and Henry had been waiting there for about three hours. So we seemed pretty confident, and we had April do that first [race].

April, what was your main issue with the dollies? We saw things from other teams about the steering issues and the turns, did you have similar problems?

April Gould: For sure, the biggest difficulty was that each big of French fries was really heavy. They’re like 20 pounds, and there’s eight of them. So it was more than 150% my body weight. I can run, but running and pushing were very difficult. Plus, they were hard to control, and I didn’t want them to fall. And then Henry cut me off! (Laughs.) We were running for a million dollars, so it wasn’t just a fun little playground race. It was the real deal.

Sarah: After watching it back last night, Henry improved his technique a lot by the time he got to April. So that practice really did help. She did really keep up with how long Henry had practiced, and they had a three-hour break before we got there.

April: Like Sarah said, they knew the course well. We can see the course, but running the course is very different. You could tell they had already talked about strategy with [cutting us off]. They knew what exactly to do to make it, and they did! And if it weren’t for us, they might not have been there.

Sarah: (Laughs.) Right.

So was that the reason why you decided to keep April on the dolly for the second race because she had run the course one more time than Daniel?

Sarah: We had a long time to wait [before they came]. And everyone who was around watching said, “You guys did so well! You did a lot better than the other people; everyone else was dropping the bags and tipping over.” April hadn’t dropped any of the bags; she didn’t tip anything over. So it just got me nervous. If those many people were falling, and she was that good on the first time, then she’s probably going to do fine. We also figured we were losing either way. (Laughs.)

April: I mean, we were going against Marine firefighters.

Speaking of the Marine firefighters, I did see in an extra video this week that your two teams had really bonded over being parents, even going out to dinner the night before. Were they who you were closest to on the race?

April: We were for sure the closest . We had been forming an alliance, and in Iceland, we followed them all the way to traversing [the waterfall]. We stopped when they had to stop; we stayed with them the entire time. We were all parents, and they’re very spiritual people too. They’re just all around good guys. So we were crushed when we found out we had to go against them, that was the saddest part, having to go against someone we had really bonded with.

Sarah: And he had a baby three days before the race. So if we were going to lose to someone, that would be the person we want to lose to the most. (Laughs.) For them to be out that early would be really sad for us.

April: And for us to also go. (Laughs.)

Were there any other teams that you bonded with, or on the opposite side of the spectrum, saw as threats to possibly take out down the line?

Sarah: [For threats], Team Extreme was awesome. (Laughs.) They were good at everything. As for making friends, we were really good friends with the eaters. Everyone was really nice, but in the beginning, Team Extreme was a little guarded. They didn’t want to talk to people as much, but they gave me shoes in the airport because I didn’t bring any flip-flops. So that was nice! (Laughs.)

April: Sarah was wet from jumping in the fountain.

Sarah: Yes, my shoes would not dry. (Laughs.)

I heard a lot last week about wet clothing as well. It seemed like a very fun, but moist, experience in Iceland!

April: It was! And Sarah was wet the entire day because she was the one who jumped in the fountain and went on the buggy [in the Roadblock]. So she was wet the whole time, I felt bad for her.

Well, let’s stay on that Iceland path. It’s interesting to me; you two are one of the teams who know each other the longest, but you were also the quickest to get on each other’s nerves. Does that come with knowing someone for so many years, that you are the aware of the things you don’t necessarily like about another person that can come out in extreme circumstances?

Sarah: Oh, yeah. We practiced a little bit beforehand, but we knew going in that maps were going to be our issue. And we were exhausted. The editing was dramatic. (Laughs.) I mean, we do fight with each other, and we are okay with it. So that might be part of it too.

April: We have a very dysfunctional relationship. (Laughs.)

Sarah: April thinks it’s dysfunctional.

April: It is so dysfunctional! (Laughs.) It’s not normal to be mean to each other and then be able to hang out. But we work really well together, and Goat Yoga is booming. When we’re in business, we do very well.

So then, were you not surprised with how quickly and how often you two argued when the race began?

April: I actually was not surprised at all. That was my biggest fear; I was just hoping we could get along and not fight on national television. How you saw it is what really happened. We fought the entire time.

Sarah: She takes offense to stuff really easily. I feel like a lot of people would be like, “Ok, I’m going to do this.” She’s just very sensitive, so I don’t think it’s dysfunctional. I just think she takes offense really easily.

You spoke about navigation, and the map-reading seemed to be one of the things you had the most trouble with. Can you give any advice to future racers as to how to improve their directional skills?

Sarah: [It didn’t pay off] in Iceland, because it didn’t make a lot of sense. There were a lot of curvy roads. The skiers were saying in the first episode, “We’ve got this little tiny sign for a freeway.” And in America, we’re used to giant signs for freeways. So it was tricky.

April: The language is very tricky too. Every word is super long. (Laughs.) You’re trying to go fast, and at the same time, you’re trying to look at all of these signs. All of the signs are really little and in yellow and black. So you pass every sign and think, “Is that a marker?” It was tough, but we followed the twins the whole way, so we weren’t alone.

Going to the end of that leg, it comes down to a foot race between you and the Ring Girls for elimination. At the moment, did you have confidence that you would have been able to outpace them?

April: When I saw the Ring Girls, my first reaction was, “We’re not done!” It was a good feeling; we got a renewed energy knowing we were still in the race. But they were just as fast as us. I wasn’t confident that we had this and we were going to beat them. We would be ahead, then they would be ahead; we kept switching back and forth. When one person started to walk, we’d all walk together. Then one person started running, and we’d all run together. I thought it was still going to be a tough race.

In your introductory package, you talk about all the things you do in your lives. Even outside of goat yoga, you do puzzles, adult parkour, and so much more. Did having an overall aptitude for so many activities help you in the race, where you face so many different types of tasks?

Sarah: I was prepared, and then when you get in there, it’s a lot harder. (Laughs.) In this season, nobody was really scared of any of the heights things. This is a pretty intense group of people. So as prepared as we were, we weren’t prepared to go up against NBA players and X Games skiers. In a normal group of people, we would have been pretty good. So we were a little overconfident in the beginning.

You two have known each other for over twenty years at this point, but did you learn something about the other person in your time on the race?

April: I learned she could get pretty cranky if she doesn’t eat and sleep. (Laughs.)

Sarah: The extreme sensitivity. I mean, she went online and talked about how mean I was. She tells everyone how mean I am. Honestly, I don’t think it was that big of a deal. It’s just a confrontation you have with someone. If I were with my husband, we would argue too. The sensitivity part is probably what I noticed the most.

April: I didn’t put anything online that wasn’t true. Sarah, you were mean to me, and everybody saw that. I felt like I was holding my own; I don’t feel like I was oversensitive. I was asking you to calm down because we were going to be on TV and our kids would be watching this, and I knew we were going to be the fighting team But I wasn’t oversensitive; I feel like I was dealing with what I had to deal with.

Sarah: Right, but [he asked] how we each feel. So that’s good. You feel how you feel, and I feel how I feel.