kaila

join:2000-10-11

Lincolnshire, IL kaila Member Republic Wireless first impressions Ok, despite the disastrous launch due to the overwhelming crush of demand, I somehow managed to get a phone from Republic Wireless late last week. The business model appears to be to sell modified android handsets above cost (customers frontload operating capital), then offer $19mo for unlimited VoIP, text, data, with access to Sprint's network if you can keep cell network usage in check- wifi to cell percentage/cell usage limits have not been defined.



I've used the phone quite a bit and it's been mostly positive, but you definitely come away feeling this is a very beta product right now. There are some major shortcomings that will need to worked out.



The phone they currently offer is LG's Optimus S supporting Sprint's CDMA network. It's a year old phone with aging spec's (600Mhz CPU, 3.8" screen size). While not being tops in anything (screen, cpu, camera, etc) it does do everything pretty well and runs Android 2.3 smoothly. This was a safe launch phone. They say more phones are coming.



The good: Wifi calling works well, at least on the networks I've tried. Call quality has been good and call connection times are quick (inbound & outbound), and I haven't experienced any echo, jitter, or latency issues. Republic Wireless has built wifi (VoIP really) call functionality into the native dialer, making wifi calling a seamless experience. I haven't been to any public hotspots yet and would expect more difficulty using those types of networks. Android 2.3 seems well baked and a nice fit for this phones capabilities- I did have to reinstall voice search to get it to function.



The bad: No GV voicemail support, although GV calls can be forwarded to the phone and dialed out. They are working on this. No incoming/outgoing MMS. Republic Wireless's Android mod needs improvement. They have removed the 'factory reset' setting, so one can't restore the phone to a clean state. Seamless in-call wifi to Sprint network handoffs do not work. Their website needs a lot of work, no promised forum as of yet, and the 'usage' meter for individual accounts isn't working right now. From their blog posts, most of their attention seems to be focused on dealing with the fact that they sold what they thought was a month and a half supply of unprovisioned phones in 8 hours. At one point, they will have to let us know what the usage expectations are and give us some way to monitor it. And if one has expectations of a handset more in line with an iPhone, they will be disappointed.



Again, it's been a mostly positive experience, calls have been great. But again, this is a beta product with a lot of loose ends. One would be crazy to port a number to them right now. I do hope they can get the in-call wifi to cell handoff working in the real world. It's my understanding wifi and Sprint network calls stay on Bandwidth's infrastructure so they are always in the middle. In theory, when you are in a call and it's detected that you are moving away from the wifi network, Republic Wireless (or Bandwidth) will open a channel between your phone and their servers using Sprint's tower, then essentially transfer your call 'in-house' over to the newly established connection. It hasn't worked for me yet.

gweidenh

join:2002-05-18

Houston, TX gweidenh Member Thank you for the update. Please do check in once in awhile with more updates.



I was not able to get in on the Beta, but would be interested in switching when some of the kinks have been worked out and Republic is in a better position to handle the obviously high demand.



engineercarl

Premium Member

join:2003-02-24

Washington, DC engineercarl to kaila

Premium Member to kaila

I also got one of these phones last Friday, and despite the "bugs" I am discovering in the UI, I am pretty impressed with the phone.



Such is the life of a beta tester though. I have more than a year on my iPhone contract with AT&T, so I am willing to sit it out and pay the $19/month while things get better.



One of the most amazing things I have seen so far is that it roams on Sprint like a regular postpaid Sprint handset. I took it down into the Washington DC subway last night, where I know (in most places between stations) Verizon is the only carrier in existence. It roamed fine, and even showed me that it was roaming.



Once they get the forums back up and running, I will be looking forward to filing bug reports and helping them refine what seems to be a pretty good service.



BTW, the phone can be "factory reset" even though the option in the firmware was removed. Search the Android forums and look for the keypress combination to do it. I had to do it once.



Engineer Carl

rizzo2dial

Premium Member

join:2004-08-05 rizzo2dial Premium Member In my limited experience, wifi usage on cell phones tends to drain the battery. What kind of battery life do you get w/ these phones?



crazyk4952

Premium Member

join:2002-02-04

united state Ubiquiti EdgeRouter Lite

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crazyk4952 to kaila

Premium Member to kaila

said by kaila: At one point, they will have to let us know what the usage expectations are and give us some way to monitor it.

unlimited usage.



Looks like this is what you get to use from the Sprint network before you get slapped on the wrist:



-300MB data

-550 minutes

-150 SMS



I was very close to getting one of these phones, but after I saw these limits, I decided that it would not work for me.



»www.gadgetell.com/techno ··· tations/ Thank you very much for posting your early experience.I have seen a few articles on what is too muchusage.Looks like this is what you get to use from the Sprint network before you get slapped on the wrist:-300MB data-550 minutes-150 SMSI was very close to getting one of these phones, but after I saw these limits, I decided that it would not work for me.

kaila

join:2000-10-11

Lincolnshire, IL kaila to rizzo2dial

Member to rizzo2dial

So far a solid day, meaning I've been able to get through 7am~10pm with varying amounts of battery left with what I'd consider moderate usage- phone, gmail, spotify, audible, some netflix.



It feels a little less capable battery wise than my iPhone 4, but not far off. Based on the 4 prior smartphone I've owned, I don't expect more than a day and charge nightly. So far so good.



They do make an extended battery for this phone, but it requires a different back cover making the phone thicker.

rizzo2dial

Premium Member

join:2004-08-05 rizzo2dial Premium Member said by kaila: I don't expect more than a day and charge nightly. So far so good.



They do make an extended battery for this phone, but it requires a different back cover making the phone thicker.

Getting a spare battery and/or an extended battery sounds like a good idea then. Thanks for info.

kaila

join:2000-10-11

Lincolnshire, IL kaila to crazyk4952

Member to crazyk4952

said by crazyk4952: Looks like this is what you get to use from the Sprint network before you get slapped on the wrist:



-300MB data

-550 minutes

-150 SMS

.....



These are Sprint labeled phones, and it's been speculated that Republic Wireless is sharing revenue from the phones purchase price (they charge above cost), buying 'device access' to Sprint's network (like Amazon's 3g Kindle) with some aggregate limits. Aggregate limits meaning lighter Republic Wireless cell users would subsidize the heavier ones, and Republic Wireless would have some flexibility with the usage limits.



Different speculation is that the more data and cell usage Republic Wireless ramps onto wifi, the more Sprint will allow through the cell network. Which fits the wifi/cell ratio importance message. That came from a quote by an employee that was refuted by a VP buried somewhere in the blog comments on their site. Nobody really knows yet, and I guess it's possible they are still working out details with Sprint. From what they have stated so far, it appears to a sliding degree at least, that the wifi/cell ratio is a very important factor.These are Sprint labeled phones, and it's been speculated that Republic Wireless is sharing revenue from the phones purchase price (they charge above cost), buying 'device access' to Sprint's network (like Amazon's 3g Kindle) with some aggregate limits. Aggregate limits meaning lighter Republic Wireless cell users would subsidize the heavier ones, and Republic Wireless would have some flexibility with the usage limits.Different speculation is that the more data and cell usage Republic Wireless ramps onto wifi, the more Sprint will allow through the cell network. Which fits the wifi/cell ratio importance message.

Stewart

join:2005-07-13 Stewart Member This "ratio" thing makes no sense to me. While it's true that Wi-Fi data costs Republic nothing, Wi-Fi calling and SMS must cost them something. Consider:



User A, calls 300 minutes cellular, 3000 minutes Wi-Fi (great ratio).

User B, calls 300 minutes cellular, but uses other services when at home or at the office, so uses no Wi-Fi minutes (unfavorable ratio).



What possible reason would Republic have for treating user A better, when providing his service costs them more?

androidfan

join:2011-09-15 androidfan Member said by Stewart: This "ratio" thing makes no sense to me. While it's true that Wi-Fi data costs Republic nothing, Wi-Fi calling and SMS must cost them something. Consider:



User A, calls 300 minutes cellular, 3000 minutes Wi-Fi (great ratio).

User B, calls 300 minutes cellular, but uses other services when at home or at the office, so uses no Wi-Fi minutes (unfavorable ratio).



What possible reason would Republic have for treating user A better, when providing his service costs them more?

Isn't Republic Wireless run by Bandwidth.com, and isn't Bandwidth.com a CLEC? So Wi-Fi calling and SMS might not cost them - depending on how much incoming sms's and wi-fi call's they get. Of course, this still doesn't explain why the ratio should matter.

gweidenh

join:2002-05-18

Houston, TX gweidenh to Stewart

Member to Stewart

Lets keep this thread focused on the user experience and bugs.



there is already a 4 page monstrosity of a thread regarding "I dont get their business model..."



Please add your questions/concerns regarding their business model to that thread.

tom thomas

join:2010-11-04 tom thomas to Stewart

Member to Stewart

said by Stewart: This "ratio" thing makes no sense to me. While it's true that Wi-Fi data costs Republic nothing, Wi-Fi calling and SMS must cost them something. Consider:



User A, calls 300 minutes cellular, 3000 minutes Wi-Fi (great ratio).

User B, calls 300 minutes cellular, but uses other services when at home or at the office, so uses no Wi-Fi minutes (unfavorable ratio).



What possible reason would Republic have for treating user A better, when providing his service costs them more?





unless republic wireless believe they can shape their customer profile by doing this. they do not want be the super cheap carrier for low incomes. it could be a way to target a certain group of people who are likely to on average use their phone less. i agree totally. it makes no sense.unless republic wireless believe they can shape their customer profile by doing this. they do not want be the super cheap carrier for low incomes. it could be a way to target a certain group of people who are likely to on average use their phone less.

kaila

join:2000-10-11

Lincolnshire, IL kaila Member said by tom thomas: i agree totally. it makes no sense.....



It does seem like Republic Wireless is more of a partner or direct reseller- the phones are Sprint labeled, arrive Sprint activated, and have full access to Sprint roaming. Albiet they are a partner or reseller that picks up the marketing, support, and backend (when on wifi at least), while adding to Sprint's subscriber count.



When viewed at way, it would make sense that Sprint would accomodate heavier Republic Wireless users (provide more data). And Republic Wireless would have the leverage to ask for it, as long as they encourage/enforce the mostly wifi model (the ratio part). It is tough to make sense of a ratio model and it would be far easier to just establish hard limits and call it a day. And I have to wonder if this is just a creative marketing scheme cooked up by Sprint (or Bandwidth) to sell more phones and open up a new smartphone market.It does seem like Republic Wireless is more of a partner or direct reseller- the phones are Sprint labeled, arrive Sprint activated, and have full access to Sprint roaming. Albiet they are a partner or reseller that picks up the marketing, support, and backend (when on wifi at least), while adding to Sprint's subscriber count.When viewed at way, it would make sense that Sprint would accomodate heavier Republic Wireless users (provide more data). And Republic Wireless would have the leverage to ask for it, as long as they encourage/enforce the mostly wifi model (the ratio part).

mitchflorida

join:2004-09-01

Deerfield Beach, FL mitchflorida Member Re: 2Wire2701 HG-B Not Forwarding Ports The original offer was for the first month and phone for $100, so they are charging $81 for the phone according to the special offer. Where is the profit there?



Without the special offer, the phone is $181. What are you saying the cost of the phone is to Republic?

kaila

join:2000-10-11

Lincolnshire, IL kaila Member It's safe to say these phones are under $100 wholesale. No-contract CDMA Optimus models are selling at retail for sub $100. Virgin is selling their Optimus for $129.



Sprint of course, has their branded Optimus S model way overpriced at $299 unsubsidized in order to drive people into a contract which ironically includes a $350 ETF!



Haha

@rr.com Haha to crazyk4952

Anon to crazyk4952

Re: Republic Wireless first impressions The statistics you quoted was theoretical usage for Sprint only with 0% wifi usage. They said if you use about 60% wifi and 40% Sprint, you shouldn't have a problem. This seems like a deal to me.

nonymous (banned)

join:2003-09-08

Glendale, AZ nonymous (banned) to kaila

Member to kaila

Does this phone allow browser login?



crazyk4952

Premium Member

join:2002-02-04

united state Ubiquiti EdgeRouter Lite

Ubiquiti UniFi AP-LR

Actiontec C1000A

crazyk4952 to Haha

Premium Member to Haha

said by Haha : The statistics you quoted was theoretical usage for Sprint only with 0% wifi usage. They said if you use about 60% wifi and 40% Sprint, you shouldn't have a problem. This seems like a deal to me.

Well good to know. It would just be nice to see something official....

tom thomas

join:2010-11-04 tom thomas Member said by crazyk4952: said by Haha : The statistics you quoted was theoretical usage for Sprint only with 0% wifi usage. They said if you use about 60% wifi and 40% Sprint, you shouldn't have a problem. This seems like a deal to me.



Well good to know. It would just be nice to see something official....



someone is running out of cell usage allotment so they make a bunch of really long calls over wifi just to pump up your allowance. maybe they even make fake calls just to keep the ratio correct.



how will they address that? of course the problem will be this:someone is running out of cell usage allotment so they make a bunch of really long calls over wifi just to pump up your allowance. maybe they even make fake calls just to keep the ratio correct.how will they address that?

PX Eliezer70

Premium Member

join:2008-08-09

Hutt River PX Eliezer70 Premium Member said by tom thomas: of course the problem will be this:



someone is running out of cell usage allotment so they make a bunch of really long calls over wifi just to pump up your allowance. maybe they even make fake calls just to keep the ratio correct.



how will they address that?

Bet they didn't think of that.

PX Eliezer70 PX Eliezer70 to kaila

Premium Member to kaila

Re: 2Wire2701 HG-B Not Forwarding Ports said by kaila: No-contract CDMA Optimus models are selling at retail for sub $100.

I would be eternally grateful if you could tell me where.

kaila

join:2000-10-11

Lincolnshire, IL kaila Member said by PX Eliezer70: I would be eternally grateful if you could tell me where.

Amazon has a list of sellers offering the identical Virgin Mobile version under $100- » www.amazon.com/gp/offer- ··· 04LJ8N78

tom thomas

join:2010-11-04 tom thomas to kaila

Member to kaila

Re: Republic Wireless first impressions android phone with similar specs are regularly available under $100 from prepaid CDMA carriers such as cricket and metropcs.



new cheap gsm androids are much harder to come by.

kaila

join:2000-10-11

Lincolnshire, IL kaila to nonymous

Member to nonymous

said by nonymous: Does this phone allow browser login?

You mean logging into the phone via terminal, or vnc from a browser? Logging into a website using the phone's browser?

kaila kaila to Haha

Member to Haha

said by Haha : ....They said if you use about 60% wifi and 40% Sprint, you shouldn't have a problem. This seems like a deal to me.

That sounds more like some sort of peering agreement (you carry my traffic, I'll carry yours), where the minimum value of Sprint's bits are 50% higher than RW's.

gweidenh

join:2002-05-18

Houston, TX gweidenh Member I dont believe its the individual cell:wifi ratio of concern... its the individual cellular:community cellular ratio that is of importance.



If an individual user uses 300 minutes of cellular in a given period, and the community also uses 300 minutes on average in that same period... that user would have a 1:1 ratio and be in good terms with the community.

nonymous (banned)

join:2003-09-08

Glendale, AZ nonymous (banned) to kaila

Member to kaila

said by kaila: said by nonymous: Does this phone allow browser login?



You mean logging into the phone via terminal, or vnc from a browser? Logging into a website using the phone's browser? Do not know exactly how to word it I guess. Some hotspots require you login through a browser for authentication. Not just a ssid or password for the wireless.

mazilo

From Mazilo

Premium Member

join:2002-05-30

Lilburn, GA mazilo to gweidenh

Premium Member to gweidenh

said by gweidenh: I dont believe its the individual cell:wifi ratio of concern... its the individual cellular:community cellular ratio that is of importance.



If an individual user uses 300 minutes of cellular in a given period, and the community also uses 300 minutes on average in that same period... that user would have a 1:1 ratio and be in good terms with the community. R U practicing hypocrisy here when you participated in such a debate as you opposed in your previous post