Shaq Goodwin

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By Jason Smith of The Commercial Appeal

Shaq Goodwin has ended his University of Memphis career and is preparing to audition for NBA scouts at the Portsmouth Invitational Tournament in Virginia. But first, he sat down with The Commercial Appeal to talk about his career, his relationship with coach Josh Pastner, the state of the program and more.

The conversation comes after the Tigers missed the NCAA Tournament and NIT for a second straight year. Goodwin, an all-American Athletic Conference first-team selection this season and one of just four players to have played four seasons for Pastner, emphasized that he agreed to do the interview not for himself, "but for the ones behind me to have a better opportunity."

"We gotta change," he said. "Change is the most consistent thing in the world."

Q: Are you happy with how your season went?

A: Team-wise, I like the way we finished. Throughout the season, we lost a couple of close games. But we could've laid down against Tulsa. We could've just come out like, 'OK, we beat them already. This game is gonna be easy.' So for us to make it to the (AAC) championship and lose against a great UConn team, you can't be mad with the results. But I would definitely like for the duration of the season, I would definitely have liked for our record to be a little better than .500.

Q: Why wasn't the record better with the talent you guys had? Josh said part of the reason you guys struggled this year was because you didn't have three starters in Austin Nichols (who transferred before the season), K.J. Lawson (who played in 10 games due to an Achilles injury) and Kedren Johnson (who appeared in 10 games due to a shoulder injury). Do you agree with that?

A: I think it's a lot of reasons. For one, where do I start? I feel like our focus was in the wrong place a lot of the season, especially in a lot of those close games. I know for a fact, SMU, we had a chance to win the game at halftime and we had other things going on. I know Tulane, after my tech (technical foul), more attention was on the tech than winning the game. At halftime — because it was before the half that I got the (technical foul) — more attention was called on the tech than I've ever seen in my life. This isn't the first time I got a tech, but it seemed like it was the first time I had ever gotten a tech in my whole life.

The focus was off a couple of games. We could've prepared differently in a couple of close games. I think coach Pastner had a lot of stress — he might have had a lot of stress with the fans, the city, the athletic director's on him, giving him that stress, which kind of trickled down on us a little bit.

Q: How so? In the way he talks to you? Or did you see it?

A: I think it took a toll on his demeanor — on how he carried himself. Or his temper. Stuff that, how do I word it? He'll bring it up every two days or something like that. Like, you could tell that it was on his mind.

Q: The lack of fan support or the losing?

A: The fact that, 'Hey, guys, I know my job is in jeopardy, but we need to stop worrying about that and worry about the wins.' But if you say that five times in a week, you know.

Me, personally, I don't like to point the finger, because everybody points the finger. Coaches, players, fans, media — everybody points the finger. But that's the truth. It wasn't just this reason, or injuries, or just a coaching standpoint. It was the fans, too. The fans, even when we traveled — I know they cut the bus short or whatever it is and now all boosters can't travel, so we've got five fans there and three of them don't want to be there because they feel like we're gonna lose. So, it's just. Man, it's a lot.

Q: It sounds like you were really disappointed in the fans this year.

A: I am. Not so much for me, but for the ones behind me. Because I've seen Memphis be supportive. I saw us go from Memphis Madness to not having a Memphis Madness. I saw it go from having a (postseason) banquet, where Joe Jackson and Chris Crawford were there, to not having a banquet. Calvin Godfrey had no banquet. None. My mom comes to everything that I do this year, and she didn't even get a chance to come to that. And she was mad. You know she was mad. So it's just the whole — it's crazy, man. It's crazy watching it.

Q: How is your relationship with Josh?

A: It is bittersweet.

Q: What does that mean?

A: It's bittersweet, for one, because I know I can't speak too much or I won't have a career. (Goodwin laughs). That's for one. It's just, it's up and down.

Q: So it never leveled out, even by your senior year? Where you knew where he was coming from and he knew where you were coming from?

A: Part of me having my best season yet at Memphis (as a senior this year), a part of it was having a better relationship with coach Pastner. If I didn't, I knew I would have another (bad) season like I did the year before. Then, I watched players, people I was close with like Damien (Wilson), watched Damien leave and I didn't understand it. Like, why? Then I watched Austin (Nichols) leave and it was just like, 'What really is the reason? Should I leave?' After I realized that I was gonna stay, I knew I had to have a relationship with him. I gotta make something work. If I don't, nobody will. And then I got 14 people watching me. That's another thing I had to get adjusted to.

Q: We all said you had to be a leader this season — the team, the media.

A: I used to tell him, 'I don't want to be the leader because I believe the leader should lead his way, because he's the leader. If I'm the oldest person on the team, if I'm the leader, if I can relate the best with everybody, I should do it my way. You know I'm not going to ... do something belligerent. So if I can't do it my way, I don't want to do it.' He used to be, 'This is a dictatorship. You gotta do it my way or the highway. You can do it your way when you're a six-time All-Star.'

So our relationship is bittersweet. I respect him as a businessman.

Q: Do you love him? Should players love their coaches?

A: I can say I love him because if I didn't I would've left. So I definitely care about him.

Q: Would you run through a brick wall for him?

A: I'd run through a brick wall for him. I feel like whatever leader you have should definitely be 10-toes behind the head coach. I believe in respect the traditional way, you know what I'm saying? I'm gonna ride with him regardless. But still, it's bittersweet because I've still got this stuff on my mind. I've still got the fact that you sat me on the bench last year when I was struggling. When I needed an extra push, I got pulled. So I feel like the bitter part just came with him not trusting and not believing in me. Like, point-blank simple.

Q: When you watch coaches interact with players, sometimes you'll see them put their arm around them and it looks like there's love there, you know? And by the time they're ready to graduate, guys are crying because it feels like it's a family, right? I don't see that much with you all.

A: One of the best feelings of my life was to feel like I could move forward. The feeling that I can move forward. Not so literal, but I felt like ropes were on my back. Now I just feel free. For four years, I felt like I was playing for something that was unstable. Now I feel like I got a solid foundation to play for, because I'm playing for myself. I know what I'm doing.

And you can check the facts on that. We done had four new (assistant) coaches (in his four years at Memphis). Fifteen transfers. And everything else. And two strength coaches being fired. So you can add all that in there, too.

Q: Did you like (former strength coach) Frank (Matrisciano)?

A: Yes, I liked Frank. And not because him and coach went at it. Not because Frank did his own thing. But because Frank was Frank, from Day 1 until when he left.

Q: You want folks to be real with you; to know where you stand?

A: That's what I'm saying. If you're soft today and you're hard tomorrow, how do I know how to treat you the day after tomorrow?

Q: How is (assistant and big men coach Robert) Kirby (as a coach)?

A: Kirby is one of the great reasons why — he helped me become a man. He helped me put what's important first. And (assistant coach Keelon) Lawson. I respect coach Lawson because I see what he did for his family. Can't do nothing but respect that. He doesn't step on any toes, but if he sees something that needs to be said, he will.

Q: Are they going to be OK?

A: The basketball team?

Q: Yeah. Is the program going to be OK?

A: Yes. Let me tell you why. This young fella K.J.? Now, it's more than skill. He's got leadership qualities. Keelon Lawson Jr. I'm a fan. I wasn't a fan of him all year. Probably because he wanted to win so bad, we clashed a lot. We clashed a lot. But when I'm watching him, like toward the end of the year when we really knew he was redshirting and he started practicing a little bit because his leg started feeling a little better, I saw, like, it's all for the love of the game. When he's shooting, he's shooting because he feels like nobody else is going to score it, so why not shoot it? On defense, he's going to work his (butt) off. He probably ain't the fastest, but he's going to run as fast as he can, get in the way. He just really wanna win, and you can tell that by looking at somebody. I see it in him. I like him. I like that. He's going to be an important reason (Memphis will be OK). He can't do it by himself.

I feel like no matter what, I wanted to win. Like, whether I'm on the bench or not, mad or what, I still want to win. I don't give a (dang). I just want to win. And that's what I see in him, too.

Q: Looks like Jeremiah (Martin) might have some of that in him, too?

A: Definitely, Jeremiah. He's going to be important, too. He's one of my favorites.

Q: You played for Josh for four of the seven years he's been a head coach. If he's still the coach at Memphis next year, can he get better?

A: Let the record show, I'm so nervous about talking because I feel like I will get put in the gutter, and I will never be seen again. I could be buried. I just want the best for the ones behind me.

But I feel like me and him, we crossed the communication barrier. Now I can text him. Now I can call him, and we can talk. It took a lot. It took for me to say, 'OK, I'm gonna force it,' and then he had to be receptive. So he did step it up there and did become receptive. So I feel like if he can do that, there's a chance for him to get better. He has to want to.

Q: But it seems like something is missing between player and coach. I don't know if love is the right word? Or trust?

A: I think it starts with your head coach. Because if your head coach sets the tone, everybody follows. If he were to just — like you said, with that love — be that overly loving, unconditional love coach, that would spread throughout the program. And then the assistants would say, 'That's how he handled it, so that's how I'm gonna handle it.' And the players would look at it like, 'So that's how we're gonna handle it.'

But since sometimes there's some love, sometimes there's this, then sometimes it's just, 'Go to the bench' — it's just so much, you're just like, 'I don't know what to do.'

Q: So you never really know where you stand?

A: You don't know where you stand. I could be buried one day and I could be the man the next day."

Q: Would you do it differently if you could? Would you go to a different school?

A: The way my lifestyle is, I don't regret anything. That's real. I grew here. Before I came here, I didn't talk to my mom, I didn't talk to my dad, I didn't talk to my AAU coach. This is something that I wanted to do because I saw it with my own two eyes. So I'll live with it.

But I can say this is some of the craziest stuff I've ever seen. Some of the craziest people, the craziest program. Absolutely amazing, man.