LEIGH SALES, PRESENTER: Here is John Clarke and Bryan Dawe.

BRYAN DAWE: Tony Abbott, thanks for your time.

JOHN CLARKE: It's good to be with you, Bryan. Good evening. Do you want a few shots of me walking?

BRYAN DAWE: No, we have got plenty of those, thanks.

JOHN CLARKE: I normally do some. I'm quite good at walking.

BRYAN DAWE: Yes, you are. Why is that?

JOHN CLARKE: It's a gift.

BRYAN DAWE: Terrific.

JOHN CLARKE: I've always had it.

BRYAN DAWE: Good. Tony Abbott, you're opposed to a carbon tax?

JOHN CLARKE: Yeah, I was trying to keep that quiet and we haven't announced that yet, but yes, I am.

BRYAN DAWE: How is the world going to deal with carbon emissions if there's not a financial disincentive to producing them? It doesn't make sense.

JOHN CLARKE: Bryan, I'm not opposed to the reduction of carbon dioxide submissions.

BRYAN DAWE: But how is it gonna happen if there's not a market-based mechanism for doing so?

JOHN CLARKE: Well, I repeat, Bryan: I'm not opposed to the reducing of the carbon moleculars.

BRYAN DAWE: Emissions? Look, if you're not opposed to reducing carbon emissions, why are you opposed to a carbon tax? It doesn't make sense.

JOHN CLARKE: Well I'm opposed to it as a tax.

BRYAN DAWE: Are you opposed to other taxes?

JOHN CLARKE: I'm opposed to other taxes brought in by this government, Bryan. This is a very, very high-taxing government.

BRYAN DAWE: Compared to the previous high-taxing government.

JOHN CLARKE: No, but compared with a low-taxing government, this is a very, very high-taxing government.

BRYAN DAWE: Now Mr Abbott, if you wanna build roads, you have to have taxes ...

JOHN CLARKE: You do.

BRYAN DAWE: ... and provide money for railway lines, etc.

JOHN CLARKE: That's right. That's right.

BRYAN DAWE: Exactly. So - and people understand that, and if they want roads and train lines, they are happy to pay for it.

JOHN CLARKE: That's right, but that way they get a road or a train line, Bryan. They're buying infrastructure.

BRYAN DAWE: So, your objection actually isn't to taxes?

JOHN CLARKE: Bryan, my objection is to a tax brought in by not a very high-taxing government, there's another issue: this is a party that went to the last election ...

BRYAN DAWE: Oh, we've heard that one. Yeah.

JOHN CLARKE: And said to the public - they did say this, Bryan, they said, "We will not bring in a carbon tax."

BRYAN DAWE: Sure.

JOHN CLARKE: And Julia Gillard now oughta be man enough to get up and tell the public.

BRYAN DAWE: Should be what?

JOHN CLARKE: She oughta be man enough, Bryan. She oughta have the courage to get up and say to the public, "Look, um, I've changed my mind, I don't know what I'm doing, ..."

BRYAN DAWE: Yep, we've heard all this.

JOHN CLARKE: "... I'm hopelessly out of my depth, I'm now in bed with the Greens and I'm gonna bring in a great, big, new, huge tax."

BRYAN DAWE: How would she'd go saying that?

JOHN CLARKE: In an election?

BRYAN DAWE: Yeah.

JOHN CLARKE: I think we'd beat her.

BRYAN DAWE: So, do you think she'll do it?

JOHN CLARKE: Bryan, my problem is that what she's got is one product in the shop window, but she's selling something else out the back.

BRYAN DAWE: So your objection to a carbon tax is not on the basis that it won't reduce carbon emissions. Is that right?

JOHN CLARKE: What are they?

BRYAN DAWE: Well, carbon emissions are the problem, Mr Abbott.

JOHN CLARKE: Oh, well, I'm opposed to them then.

BRYAN DAWE: You're against carbon emissions?

JOHN CLARKE: Oh, yeah, we won't be having any of them, Bryan, but my main problem is with the carbon tax put in by this government.

BRYAN DAWE: Yes, because you don't want to bring in a carbon tax.

JOHN CLARKE: That's right.

BRYAN DAWE: Right. OK. Mr Abbott, if there was an election and you won, what would you do about carbon emissions?

JOHN CLARKE: I'd go to them and say, "Look, you know, I'm Tony Abbott, I'm in charge now, now bloody stop it."

BRYAN DAWE: You'd go to the carbon emissions and tell them this?

JOHN CLARKE: I'd be frank with them, Bryan. It's the only way to deal with them. I'd say stop it.

BRYAN DAWE: Stop it.

JOHN CLARKE: Stop it.

BRYAN DAWE: Mmm. Now.

JOHN CLARKE: Right now.

BRYAN DAWE: Thanks for your time.

JOHN CLARKE: I'd say that to them too. Actually, Bryan, you can come. You're good.