Two City of Toronto employees whose job is to clean cells at police stations gave city councillors an eye-opener on what the job entails.

“I clean HIV blood off the walls, I clean feces off the walls,” said Trish O’Brien. “I clean bedbugs. I clean scabies. Are you going to get somebody to do that for $10.25 an hour?”

O’Brien, 34, and co-worker Christopher Idrovo, 30, appeared before council’s government management committee which is reviewing consultants suggestions to save money, including contracting out police station cleaning.

A recent city report said police station cleaners make an average of $30.32 an hour including benefits, versus $17.60 for private-sector cleaners.

Idrovo recounted a recent case of an inmate injuring himself and smearing blood all over, then being taken to hospital only to return to do it again in another cell.

“People that have HIV cut their wrists, paint the walls,” O’Brien said. “What if I caught something? Do you think I’m not entitled to benefits? I think I am.”

Mayor Rob Ford’s brother, Councillor Doug Ford, supports contracting-out cleaning jobs to save money. He didn’t respond to the cleaners’ submissions, but he earlier accused a city union official of scare-mongering on the issue.

City cleaners perform hard work and work hard on the city’s behalf, Tim Maguire, first vice-president of the Canadian Union of Public Employees, Local 79, told the committee.

“I’m just saying there’s more effective ways and efficient ways of doing it at lower cost,” responded Ford, who was advised by Maguire to be cautious.

“I’m cautious of you guys; that’s the only people I’m cautious of,” Doug Ford told the union official.

In a subsequent media scrum, Ford said the union had “orchestrated” the participation of many people who attended public meetings on solving the city’s budget woes.

“I’ll go to a meeting in Scarborough; you see the same suspects. You go over to North York, the same suspects. They must have a bus that drives these guys to each location.”

Ford added there was a good reason why “Ford Nation” — the nickname for the Fords’ support base — hasn’t been turning out for the public meetings.

“Ford Nation is too busy working, paying taxes, creating jobs, that’s what they’re doing,” he said.

On their behalf, Ford said, he’s working hard to uncover waste at city hall. For example, he is looking at making purchasing more efficient and favours contracting-out 311 call centre work.

He said there’s lots of scope to improve purchasing.

“Hard hats. We have Toronto Hydro ordering hard hats, we have the TTC ordering hard hats, we have the city ordering hard hats. Why don’t we combine it?”

Ford suggested many city officials are career civil servants who aren’t up to speed on private-sector purchasing efficiencies.

“Why don’t we get folks like Walmart in here and teach our procurement folks how to procure properly? Let’s bring the outsiders in and teach us.

“The vast majority of our senior staff has never worked in the private sector. They’ve been down here for 25 to 35 years. What we need is outside people to come in and train them properly.”

Loading... Loading... Loading... Loading... Loading... Loading...

On contracting out 311 call centre jobs, Ford voted with the majority to reject a motion by Councillor John Filion, who wanted to ensure any privatized jobs remain in Toronto.

Ford said the search for a call centre alternative shouldn’t include India or China but could be located anywhere in North America.

“Somewhere in Canada or the U.S.” he told reporters. “You can’t keep it just confined to Toronto. The market’s too small in call centres, so you’ve got a problem there.”