GHOST | INTERVIEW

GHOST | INTERVIEW

Carl Marsh talks to Tobias Forge, who as Cardinal Copia fronts Swedish occult rock icons Ghost and who will be in Cardiff on Sun 17 Nov.

Would it be fair to say that you like to provoke with the appearance of all the guys in Ghost rather than just the music, or is it a bit of both?

I’d say that the visual aspects of the band, and also what you might refer to as the ‘provoking’ elements of it, is more for the entertainment of those who like stuff like that, rather than to the annoyance of people who hate it – if that makes sense. The idea is not to exist on the sole premise of provoking people who hate rock’n’roll, who hate liberty, who hate free thinking and hate intellectualism and hate foreigners but love guns – that was not the point, really. The idea was to entertain people who are opposed to all of these things.

Your shows are a big spectacular event, and the appearance of your character has changed from album to album; that must put a lot of pressure on you when making these changes?

Well, it’s on my shoulders to take the initiative, but between me taking the initiative and executing there’s obviously a lot of people involved to execute the whole thing. You know, I’m not a tailor. I’m not a building designer. I’m not a mask maker. But I rely on a lot of people to make all these things happen.

Would you have liked to have remained, you know, sort of in character for a few more years? Or are you happy when it was announced who you were in real life?

The character still keeps on living, and that hasn’t changed things. I’m talking to you as a director or an actor, the same way that Harrison Ford would speak with you. You wouldn’t interview him as Indiana Jones or Han Solo [laughs]. But that’s basically it.

I know your next album is a little way off but what direction will it go in, as I remember the first album was quite dark and then they have evolved to be a bit lighter?

I can’t tell you, I don’t want to ruin the surprise, but I have a fairly good picture in my head of where I want the record to go. But you know, writing a record is also, in our case, about thinking about the show, and there’s a lot of production value that goes in, not only to the record but also to the live show.

So you’ve always got the shows and the videos in the back of your mind when you’re writing for a new album, it’s not just about the music?

Yes, that is correct.

That must be hard?

Oh, that’s the fun bit I think – because you need to have your radar on, you need to keep your compass firmly in your hand so that you don’t sidestep.

Who do you bounce your ideas off?

I have a few people that I do that with, and I always do a lot of tests in my home. I play to my kids and my wife, and a lot of that colours my position. I remember five years ago, I was playing the songs to my, at that point, six-year-old daughter and, and I said to her “Which song do you like?” because I was being asked by the record label which song I thought should be the first single. And my daughter said Cirice – that was at that point the only song that she liked. I thought, “Well, the first single will be Cirice then!” because if a six-year-old girl likes that, that’s probably okay [laughs].

That’s funny because I was going to ask you a bit about the lyrics… as you know, they can be a little Satanic, but they’re just words, and music is music, isn’t it Tobias, and should be for everyone?

Exactly. And the thing with music, if you have any intention of so-called ‘making it’, you need to understand that there needs to be a certain way. It’s like if you’re starting a restaurant – the dishes that you’re serving need to appeal to an X amount of people. You can’t just appeal to people with an acquired taste, or you will not have very much business. It’s like when you play music sometimes to people who don’t know anything about music. That’s not important at all – I want to understand how you feel when you hear it. You’re not supposed to sell it to people who know music. It is important what our kids think, it’s important what your mother-in-law thinks of it because it’s all about feeling.

What do you think is the most important lesson that you’ve learnt in your musical career thus far?

Trying not to complicate things and to rely on the ancient wisdom that there are just a few chords, there are only eight notes, and you cannot reinvent the wheel. You have to rely on that wheel which is already perfect, and it rolls. The only thing that you need to make sure is that it turns relatively smoothly, and so the only thing that you can sort of construct is the surface on which your wheel rolls on. And sure, if you like bumps, then you can make it feel a little bumpy but if you’re hoping for this vehicle to move then that wheel needs to be round.

And it’s the same thing with writing. Like, don’t complicate things! Sometimes you can hear about people trying to write songs with chord changes that are super original. Yeah, absolutely. And it’s unlistenable! Because it doesn’t take you anywhere. [Laughter]

Ghost, Motorpoint Arena Cardiff, Sun 17 Nov. Tickets: £38.50. Info: 029 2022 4488 / www.motorpointarenacardiff.co.uk

photo Mikael Eriksson