Katazia said: SouthStar,



But if he designed and created us and he didn’t want us to do these things and we did them then that says he is an incompetent designer but since he is perfect and hence cannot be incompetent then we can only conclude he designed us with these capabilities deliberately and that makes these actions entirely his fault. We can only do what he designed us to do.



Of course the Christian argument to that is that he also gave us freewill so that we might choose between good and evil.



But this still comes down to his design criteria. Even with freewill why did he design us so that some of us would choose evil over good? If good is what he wanted and such an obvious choice if we knew the consequences then why didn’t he design us so we can make such an easy decision?



But again we can argue that if he simply wanted everyone to be good why didn’t he simply design us that way in the beginning and skip the entire Christ/savior/judgment nonsense?



But let’s look at the big picture. He designed and created a bunch of people who he wanted to worship him. In the end some pass his quality test and rest are rejected and destroyed. Why would any need to be rejected if he was a perfect designer? Why didn’t he simply have a higher quality design and just create perfect people?



The real conclusion is that Christianity is just paradoxical gibberish.



Kat Click to expand...

1I speak the truth in Christ--I am not lying, my conscience confirms it in the Holy Spirit-- 2I have great sorrow and unceasing anguish in my heart. 3For I could wish that I myself were cursed and cut off from Christ for the sake of my brothers, those of my own race, 4the people of Israel. Theirs is the adoption as sons; theirs the divine glory, the covenants, the receiving of the law, the temple worship and the promises. 5Theirs are the patriarchs, and from them is traced the human ancestry of Christ, who is God over all, forever praised![1] Amen.

6It is not as though God's word had failed. For not all who are descended from Israel are Israel. 7Nor because they are his descendants are they all Abraham's children. On the contrary, "It is through Isaac that your offspring will be reckoned."[2] 8In other words, it is not the natural children who are God's children, but it is the children of the promise who are regarded as Abraham's offspring. 9For this was how the promise was stated: "At the appointed time I will return, and Sarah will have a son."[3]

10Not only that, but Rebekah's children had one and the same father, our father Isaac. 11Yet, before the twins were born or had done anything good or bad--in order that God's purpose in election might stand: 12not by works but by him who calls--she was told, "The older will serve the younger."[4] 13Just as it is written: "Jacob I loved, but Esau I hated."[5]

14What then shall we say? Is God unjust? Not at all! 15For he says to Moses,

"I will have mercy on whom I have mercy,

and I will have compassion on whom I have compassion."[6] 16It does not, therefore, depend on man's desire or effort, but on God's mercy. 17For the Scripture says to Pharaoh: "I raised you up for this very purpose, that I might display my power in you and that my name might be proclaimed in all the earth."[7] 18Therefore God has mercy on whom he wants to have mercy, and he hardens whom he wants to harden.

19One of you will say to me: "Then why does God still blame us? For who resists his will?" 20But who are you, O man, to talk back to God? "Shall what is formed say to him who formed it, 'Why did you make me like this?' "[8] 21Does not the potter have the right to make out of the same lump of clay some pottery for noble purposes and some for common use?

22What if God, choosing to show his wrath and make his power known, bore with great patience the objects of his wrath--prepared for destruction? 23What if he did this to make the riches of his glory known to the objects of his mercy, whom he prepared in advance for glory-- 24even us, whom he also called, not only from the Jews but also from the Gentiles? 25As he says in Hosea:

"I will call them 'my people' who are not my people;

and I will call her 'my loved one' who is not my loved one,"[9] 26and,

"It will happen that in the very place where it was said to them,

'You are not my people,'

they will be called 'sons of the living God.' "