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Hello peeps,

Got a question for you: Do we, as paddlers, have cultural etiquette?

I mean, what does our etiquette say about chipping in for gas? Or about name-dropping? Or hooking up with your best-friend's girlfriend (who is a paddler)?

I'm asking because I'm writing a brief guide to paddler's etiquette and I'm wondering if you guys have any ideas?

Lemme know.

Catch your eddies,

Christian

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I think bootie beers must always be savored in front of an audience...

If you don't know where you are going, any road will get you there.



Daniel Patrinellis

360.434.4616

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there is certainly wave etiquette, which gets a little hazy when you are coming downstream to the wave. do you eddy out, or hop on in front of everyone else? otherwise things like gas money seem like just the right thing to do no matter the situation.

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Not sure if this falls under "trip etiquette" or "cultural etiquette" or what, but showing up on time is near the top of my list. If you agree to meet at Split Rock at 11, then you damn well better show up at 11 unless something completely unforeseen delays you, and even then you should call your crew to let them know you're on your way. I suppose if you're a way cool, super-good boater, everyone will cut you slack if you're late, but I'm neither of those things so I get there early.

Don't waste water!

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I think it's appropriate to chip in for gas on short trips, but a necessity to split the gas on longer trips.

Wave etiquette is a little grey, largely depending on the wave size and whether you know the person on the wave or in the eddy. If you know them, you'll know if it'll bother them or not. If I don't know them, I will go to the back of the line in the eddy and wait my turn for the wave. Now, if it's a fly-by wave and you've had your chance to be on it, give it up to someone upstream of you. But that might just be me... like I said, it's grey.



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Don't overstate your skills. It makes people not want to paddle with you again.

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I always heard the person going downstream had right of way. People got off the wave as others came downstream.

Jon Shell Bee

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Don't use the following excuses for swimming.



My skirt was on wrong

The outfitting somehow came loose

I had way to much water in my boat



I could name some others but you get the idea... you can quickley get tagged as "that guy"



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Being on time is a bog one with me too. If I got up early to get to the river on time, so can you. 30 minutes is my max waiting time unless there's a call. If someone is late that is almost always on time I'll give him a break though. One thing I've found to be really wonderful is that when it comes time to need team work weather it's getting boats up or down a hill or cliff or rescue work are whatever may need to be done, it seems that the paddlers I paddle with jump right in there and take on a roll with no questions asked. It's some of the best team work I've ever been around. If someone joins a trip that drops names and talks about all of the hard runs they've done making sure that everyone knows, I generally don't care to paddle with them again. If they're good enough, word will get around without them bragging. Courtney I've always heard it as downstream traffic has the right of way but if that downstream traffic isn't running the rapid but instead wants to surf the way, he needs to go to the back of the line and wait his turn instead of cutting the durger goys time off the way after he's waited in line. Of coarse if this is a catch on the fly wave then it's nice to take a quick turn and get off so the upstream people can have a chance at it too.

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Damn! Spell check would have been good before I sent that.

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GET OFF MY WAVE!!!!!

Nomad

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Always bring enough cam straps to get your boat on someone else's car/truck/mule. It sucks when I go on a fun trip and come home with less and less straps.

If you don't know where you are going, any road will get you there.



Daniel Patrinellis

360.434.4616

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Originally posted by James



Don't use the following excuses for swimming.



My skirt was on wrong

The outfitting somehow came loose

I had way to much water in my boat



I could name some others but you get the idea... you can quickley get tagged as "that guy"

Ah yes, we do all do know "that" guy. When you swim you should man up and admit you did so because you got scared. Seems backwards but it's not.

... preparing for a river beating!



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Here's one that I have seen be dangerous and its more of a creeking rule really than etiquette. If you are the first guy in a line of kayakers coming up on a portage or a place to scout a big rapid it is imperative that you get in the eddy, out of of your boat and then for you to get your boat out of the river or in a secure spot. I think its best if you then wait til everyone is out of the river and maybe help people. There have been many times where everyone is eddied out below me and I come into the eddy and no one is there but their boats are precariously left all over the only spot to get out and everyone in already downstream scouting. One time this happened to me and I had a hell of a time getting out of my boat because there was no where to park. In my effort to get out of the river I knocked someones boat into the river and it ran the rapid without them making me a bad guy......

MORE RAIN PLEASE

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Paddler's etiquette I think of as stuff that occurs while paddling, on the river, such as right of way ect... -- Traditionally, the upstream boat has the right of way. If you are surfing a wave, technically, by this old-school rule, you should get off so the upstream boat can pass by. While the spirit of this rule makes sense, the letter of it doesn't adapt well to paddling culture from the mid '80's till now. Perhaps it is worthy of revisiting and modifying somewhat. I'd say if someone is surfing, it is better etiquette to boat around them and eddy out for your own surf. --A boat that is bigger than you has right of way (rafts). In maritime law it is called the rule of tonage. If it's bigger than you stay the fu*k out of its way. If you get run over by one, you either didn't anticipate your need to get out of its way soon enough, or you deserve to get run over. That simple. Rafts have a right to hit waves, too. In fact, most of the occupants of that raft paid money to hit that wave. Something to consider. --Here's my BIGGEST etiquette pet peeve: Stop Bumping my boat while we are sharing the eddy. Yeah, some eddies are really turbulet, begging an exception to the rule, but most of the time, people could exercise some control of their boats. Seriously it really is an invasion of my personal space any time you hit, or even touch, my boat or paddle. Quick bumps will happen, and aren't a big deal, but it's more about the intent. At least TRY to have some style and social grace. I know, many of you are probably rolling your eyes right now. Seriously- take pride in your boating skills and stop bumping me and/or trapping my stern against a rock because you are too lazy or too indifferent to control yourself in close proximity with others. Yeah, beginners get a free pass with this one, but most boaters have no excuse for being so... un-consciencious. Pitching in for gas and being on time, and being helpful, in my opinion fall under the broader catagory of human etiquitte.

🐋🐋🐋🐋🐋🐋🐋🐋🐋🐋🐋

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and yeah, Franz- GREAT example, buddy!

🐋🐋🐋🐋🐋🐋🐋🐋🐋🐋🐋

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Safety-wise. Always have a throw bag. I know its common sense but you need to have one all the time when you're in your boat and when you're scouting. It needs to be clean, strong and above all accessible. Its not gonna do anybody any good smashed behind your float bags. When you inevitably scout that rapid, you need to have safety set for the guy that runs first and shows you the line, stuff goes wrong sometimes.

If you don't know where you are going, any road will get you there.



Daniel Patrinellis

360.434.4616

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Just about any explanation comes out sounding like an excuse. If you don't acknowledge that you fu*ked up, and do it openly and explicitly, then even the best explanation in the world still sounds like another lame excuse.

Don't waste water!

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A few things...



1. always waiting to head dowstream until the last boater is in their boat floating in the water. Not in their boat on the shore, or almost has their skirt on, but actually floating. The death on the little white last year could be attributed to this.



2. maintaining situational awareness ie. looking back upstream and keeping an eye on your buddy.



3. helping at putin/takeout with group gear before personal gear, ie unloading/loading of boats.



4. thanking friends for pushing your boat and paddle to shore when you swam like a fish. I know it sounds silly, but it's happened enough for me to mention it.



5. I would like to reiterate Franz's point about takeout/scouting eddies. Proper placement of gear so that everyone has an opportunity to scout, and having one person remaining at the eddy to assist with getting out of boats etc. Also related to this is not losing your gear because it may jeopardize the whole group.



I'm sure there are more, but this is all I can come up with for now. All of these sound like safety issues, but in my reality recognizing safety is tantamount to etiquette. By ignoring basic things that keep a trip safe, a paddler is ignoring etiquette.







The line will become apparent

978-273-7723

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Here's some more things I have thought of.



Put-in and take outs:



-don't block access points with your car for longer than it takes to load or unload your boats or at least be considerate if other boaters arrive. Rafters can be really bad about this



-if you are running shuttle at the end of the trip do your best to get back to the take out as soon as possible. changing, having safety breaks, and eating could wait til your back to the rest of the group. I have froze my ass off, stone cold "unsafe", and hungry waiting for shuttle to return and when they do return they are all changed, glassy eyed, and eating a sandwich. Then when it takes me longer to change and get my crap together they are waiting for me and then I'm in a rush. If you can do some of those things while driving I don't mind multi-taskers....





There are also many more etiquette points to make about multiday trips.



My rule number one is to do my best to not allow my problems to become the groups' problems.



Bring enough libations for yourself. if you drink ten beers a day and have 10 safety meetings a day in your normal life than bring more per day on your trip. Don't eye up my supplies and then not ration because you see me with a fat sack and plenty of beers knowing I'm a nice guy and I'll hook you up and ration my own supplies.



When you get to camp, don't rush off with your personal gear to set up your own stuff before the group's gear is unloaded and set up. Community gear first, personal gear next.



Take your chores seriously. If you are scheduled to do the cooking for a given day don't get so hammered that you can't do it or that you do a crappy job. and if you are cooking try to do your best to make the clean up easy for the clean up people.





There is more I'm sure.....



MORE RAIN PLEASE

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How about if you're shuttling to the put in, leave dry clothes at the takeout. Don't pile into my truck soaking wet and muddy. And don't say, "It's ok, it's a kyaking rig." It's not. It's my every day vehicle and I like nice sh*t. I can't afford a different vehicle for each of my hobbies. Respect my stuff. I'd rather have you bump my boat in an eddy than keep tapping my rear quarter panel with your F'n paddle. Like JP said, that my be more like good human behavior than kayaking ettiquette...

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SHOW UP ON TIME!!!! Sampson, this means you...

Nomad

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I also always liked Fish's personal safety protocol.... If I swim, rescue in this order: Beer first, boat second, me last.

Watching your spacing within your group is important. This can be considered a safety issue as well as etiquette. For instance on a narrow creek run, keep together so you can keep tabs on each other, but don't be so close that if someone gets stuck on a rock or stopped by a hole that you're going to run into them. Also if we're on a play run, don't follow right behind me, so if I grab a surf you're going to knock me off of it.I also always liked Fish's personal safety protocol.... If I swim, rescue in this order: Beer first, boat second, me last.

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Another bit of multi-day etiquette... Kayakers... If I tell you I will carry a bag down the river for you on my raft, don't show up with 2 bags and a cot and a chair. Show up with the one bag we agreed upon and a 12 pack of beer (for me... any buy cans. I, and many others do not like glass in their inflatable boat). And don't tell me where to load your bag either. It's my raft and I have a good idea of how I like gear loaded on it.



Also, if your rower does not drink, that does not mean you don't have to buy the 12-pack. Buy it and send it to me since I taught you this rule.

Gee, Slickhorn... something tells me you've have some some of those things occur to you on the river.Another bit of multi-day etiquette... Kayakers... If I tell you I will carry a bag down the river for you on my raft, don't show up with 2 bags and a cot and a chair. Show up with the one bag we agreed upon and a 12 pack of beer (for me... any buy cans. I, and many others do not like glass in their inflatable boat). And don't tell me where to load your bag either. It's my raft and I have a good idea of how I like gear loaded on it.Also, if your rower does not drink, that does not mean you don't have to buy the 12-pack. Buy it and send it to me since I taught you this rule.

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This is becoming very philosophical. 12-packs!!



Kayaking is really unique in the level of emotion and trust that is involved, and this is especially true if you have a mentoring relationship. I'm still very much in the learning phase of kayaking, and here are a few things about teaching and learning:



- Be kind and giving, and take people out on class II every once in a while. Share the joy!



- Work really hard on your roll! People seem to be enjoy taking out beginners a lot more if they don't swim every time they flip over.



- If someone takes you out kayaking, GIVE THEM GAS MONEY without being asked. If they say no, insist. People in the PNW are too polite to ever ask for yucky things like money, but they will be passive-aggressively peeved (I know I am).



- Give people a chance. Even if they're not as cool (yet) as you are, take them on slightly harder runs - you might be suprised by how well they do. Or not.



- If someone is generous enough to lend you their gear, give them some goodies. Beer speaks louder than words.



- If you destroy the gear that someone lent you, don't even ask if they want it replaced. Just replace it, or pay up. Same problem as with the gas money...



- Don't grossly overestimate your skills. Just because you once ran a class IV rapid (upside down, presumably) it doesn't mean that you should start off with a class IV rapid the first time you're back in your boat in 10 years. Especially if downstream is a walled-in gorge. If your paddling partners say, hey, should we just do that class II stretch downstream, beause I think this is too hard for you and you will be swimming a lot, take a minute to think about whether they might have a point. If in doubt, you may want to trust the judgment of the more experienced boater. Perhaps that will put you on something slightly below your skills, but it will also prevent an epic.

