Congress Officially Makes Cell Unlocking Legal Again Last month Senators Patrick Leahy (D-VT) and Charles Grassley (R-IA) introduced the "Unlocking Consumer Choice and Wireless Competition Act (pdf), which aims to make unlocking one's cell phone technically legal again, even if it doesn't fully address the myriad of problems with the DMCA. In January of last year unlocking your cellphone technically became illegal after the Librarian of Congress removed it from the DMCA exception list. It technically remains legal for you to jailbreak your phone, but you can't unlock devices you own without carrier permission, which is, of course, absurd and obnoxious. After some political efforts (read: carrier lobbying attempts) to water the bill down failed, Congress today officially passed the bill and it now awaits the President's signature. "The cell phone unlocking bill has a direct impact on Americans as we become more reliant on our wireless devices," said Grassley in a prepared statement. "This bipartisan bill is pro-consumer and pro-competition and allows for greater ease in the portability of devices. It will provide greater competition and more consumer choice,” Grassley said. Champagne consumption should be tempered however. As Champagne consumption should be tempered however. As many people have noted previously , while the law reverses the Librarian of Congress' ridiculous decision to reduce consumer rights, it fails to seriously address the problems in the DMCA that allow the Librarian to make arbitrary and ridiculous decisions in the first place -- meaning we could be having this conversation again in 2015 when the rule is again up for review.







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topics flat nest

Boricua

Premium Member

join:2002-01-26

Sacramuerto Boricua Premium Member Wow, just wow!! So they only extended it for one year?!?! Geez, they should've left well enough alone and let us handle the unlocking.

humanfilth

join:2013-02-14

cyber gutter 1 recommendation humanfilth Member Re: Wow, just wow!! Barely do today, what you can mostly put off for someone else to do properly, at some future point. 78036364 (banned)

join:2014-05-06

USA 78036364 (banned) Member big deal people don't get carriers not only use different frequencies but different technologies. good luck taking your unlocked att phone to verizon and expect it to do things like call or text or use data. clone (banned)

join:2000-12-11

Portage, IN 1 recommendation clone (banned) Member Re: big deal I'm tired of hearing the same old broken record. SIM unlocked phones are a big deal to a lot of people, including myself. Not only do I refuse to pay exorbitant rates when roaming internationally, I get new phones all the time.



This means that when someone in my family or circle of friends breaks their phone, or wants to test out a new MVNO/prepaid plan, or an iPhone fanboy who wants to dip his toes in the Android ecosystem (and vice-versa), or use a local SIM overseas we can just pop in a SIM and go. In fact, I'm loving using my Verizon LG G2 on the T-Mobile $30 prepaid plan with full LTE and HSPA (meaning that calls, text, and data all work fine!) services.



Phones are getting more compatible by the day, not less. Almost every phone sold today has GSM/HSPA compatibility worldwide. So yes, while in your use case of moving an AT&T phone to Verizon won't work, that doesn't mean there aren't hundreds of other use cases where a carrier-locked phone could be fully functional on another carrier if only the artificial lock wasn't present.



Stop spreading FUD. 78036364 (banned)

join:2014-05-06

USA 78036364 (banned) Member Re: big deal said by clone: I'm tired of hearing the same old broken record. SIM unlocked phones are a big deal to a lot of people, including myself. Not only do I refuse to pay exorbitant rates when roaming internationally, I get new phones all the time. Stop spreading FUD.



If I move to a new carrier I will get a phone DESIGNED for that carriers network. Verizon and I suspect the other carriers already unlock their phone for international use right out of the boxWhat part is FUD? How are you going to make calls using an at&t phone on Verizon's network when at&t phones are GSM only and Verizon uses CDMA for calls and texting?If I move to a new carrier I will get a phone DESIGNED for that carriers network.

Ark4

join:2002-06-08

Lansing, MI Ark4 Member Re: big deal You pretty much have to ignore Verizon and Sprint and then think globally. AT&T, T-Mobile, and the rest of the world all are basically compatible now. I'm absolutely pissed that AT&T refuses to unlock my Galaxy S3, because I haven't had it for two years yet. I have no way to pop in a cheap prepaid SIM if I travel overseas right now, and I'd really like to be able to do that. I absolutely want my phone unlocked and I don't want to have to be at the mercy of AT&T to decide when. 78036364 (banned)

join:2014-05-06

USA 78036364 (banned) Member Re: big deal said by Ark4: You pretty much have to ignore Verizon and Sprint and then think globally.



B) A lot of us couldn't care less about the rest of the world. Rest of the wrong doesn't mean 2 shits to me. AT&T, T-Mobile, and the rest of the world all are basically compatible now. I'm absolutely pissed that AT&T refuses to unlock my Galaxy S3, because I haven't had it for two years yet. I have no way to pop in a cheap prepaid SIM if I travel overseas right now, and I'd really like to be able to do that. I absolutely want my phone unlocked and I don't want to have to be at the mercy of AT&T to decide when. A) yes ignore the fact that Verizon is the largest carrier in the US.B) A lot of us couldn't care less about the rest of the world. Rest of the wrong doesn't mean 2 shits to me.Well as I stated before Verizon's phones are unlocked for international use right out of the box. Maybe older ones like the GS3 aren't( not sure ) but all you have to do is call an they'll unlock them for you. I know for a face that my LG G2 could be used overseas right now without having to ask Verizon to unlock it.

Ark4

join:2002-06-08

Lansing, MI Ark4 Member Re: big deal I don't think Verizon phones work for voice/text overseas, because the SIM card is only for LTE/data. The voice/text is still all CDMA isn't it? Pretty much useless in other countries.



It absolutely doesn't matter if you don't care about the rest of the world. I do, many others do. We want to use our phones with other SIM cards. Having that ability does entirely nothing to change your service in any way, so why do you even care? It's almost as if you're against other people doing things just because you don't do those things.



Unlocking phones is not about taking your phone to or from Verizon or Sprint. It's about taking your phone to or from AT&T, T-Mobile, and overseas. clone (banned)

join:2000-12-11

Portage, IN clone (banned) Member Re: big deal Modern Verizon phones absolutely work for voice/text/data overseas and on domestic GSM carriers. Every Verizon smartphone worth buying has, for years now, supported GSM/HSPA in addition to CDMA.



Additionally, the SIM card is not only used for LTE/data. On any Verizon LTE phone, the SIM card is used to authenticate both CDMA/EVDO and LTE. You simply move your SIM card between devices just as you would on a GSM only carrier. And since they almost all have standard Qualcomm baseband chips that support CDMA, GSM/HSPA and LTE technologies, the SIM slot works for those types of networks, as well.



The last 4-5 Verizon smartphones I've owned have been handed down to someone else using a domestic GSM carrier or MVNO.

koolman2

Premium Member

join:2002-10-01

Anchorage, AK koolman2 to 78036364

Premium Member to 78036364

No such thing as a phone designed for a particular network. Sure, they put their share of bullshit on their phone, but otherwise phone X from carrier Y has the same hardware and wireless chipset as any other carrier using that same technology. 78036364 (banned)

join:2014-05-06

USA 78036364 (banned) Member Re: big deal said by koolman2: No such thing as a phone designed for a particular network. Sure, they put their share of bullshit on their phone, but otherwise phone X from carrier Y has the same hardware and wireless chipset as any other carrier using that same technology. As I said a at&t and T-Mobile phone with NOT work on Sprint or Verizon. At&t and T-Mobile phones do NOT have CDMA radios in them. Heck even Sprint's and Verizon's phones won't work on each other's networks and they both use CDMA. This is FACT not FUD.

koolman2

Premium Member

join:2002-10-01

Anchorage, AK koolman2 Premium Member Re: big deal said by 78036364: said by koolman2: No such thing as a phone designed for a particular network. Sure, they put their share of bullshit on their phone, but otherwise phone X from carrier Y has the same hardware and wireless chipset as any other carrier using that same technology. As I said a at&t and T-Mobile phone with NOT work on Sprint or Verizon. At&t and T-Mobile phones do NOT have CDMA radios in them. Heck even Sprint's and Verizon's phones won't work on each other's networks and they both use CDMA. This is FACT not FUD.



Also, if you noticed, I mentioned "using that same technology", hence why CDMA won't work on GSM and vice-versa; not that this will matter, anyway, as LTE is a GSM technology and therefore eventually all four main carriers will be interoperable...



edit: this is, of course, assuming all LTE will be on one device in the future. We're getting there, slowly... The phone will work on the other networks if the network would program them for it. The problem isn't the device, it's the network operator that won't allow the device on.Also, if you noticed, I mentioned "using that same technology", hence why CDMA won't work on GSM and vice-versa; not that this will matter, anyway, as LTE is a GSM technology and therefore eventually all four main carriers will be interoperable...edit: this is, of course, assuming all LTE will be on one device in the future. We're getting there, slowly...

TuxRaiderPen

Make America Great Again

join:2009-09-19 TuxRaiderPen Member Re: big deal said by koolman2: work on GSM and vice-versa; not that this will matter, anyway, as LTE is a GSM technology "GSM technology" I don't think that means what you think it does!



LTE is NOT "GSM" technology!



LTE is LTE



Those of you who continue MIS use and ABUSE the terms GSM as interchangeable do not understand them,



AMPS = old analog

CDMA = EVDO & 1X voice and data

GSM = GPRS/EDGE

UTMS = HSPDA and oh by the way UTMS IS CDMA! HA! W-CDMA!



LTE = LTE, currently is DATA ONLY regardless of who is using it. VoLTE or the voice portion of LTE is still be bickered about, and probably will be till some one like VZW or some other carrier puts their foot down and picks the "standard" and follows it....dragging the rest with it....like it or not.



NOW... there are progressions in this which you are using and confusing with the RF...



AMPS to GSM to UMTS to LTE



AMPS to CDMA to LTE



GSM is NOT a blanket and interchangeable term for GSM/UMTS/LTE or any combination thereof.



There are HUGE RF differences between GSM and UMTS and LTE, as well as GSM, CDMA, LTE. And differences in CDMA v. W-CDMA while using the same principles of CDMA.



Yes. I am a CDMA snob! Plus the whole GSM thing was a conscious choice by the then PTT's of the EU/UK et al to use anything not US made, CDMA. Additionally there are RF performance issues in GSM v. CDMA where CDMA is much better spectrum wise and coverage wise.



There is a HUGELY EASIER path from GSM to UMTS to LTE for the "BACKEND" non RF support systems v. CDMA to LTE. It makes these RF changes easier for the GSM/UMTS carriers to move to LTE v. the CDMA ones.



Juse because it use a SIM card doesn't make it GSM or UMTS! CDMA *could* have one, the carriers chose to LOCKOUT users this way.



I personally think the practice is bad business and anit consumer. Yes, you can make money and be a moral and ethical company.



Please stop confusing the terms used to identify the phone tech, it is very annoying to those of us who deal with these technologies on a daily basis.



/pet peeve "GSM technology" I don't think that means what you think it does!LTE is"GSM" technology!LTEThose of you who continue MIS use and ABUSE the terms GSM as interchangeable do not understand them,AMPS = old analogCDMA = EVDO & 1X voice and dataGSM = GPRS/EDGEUTMS = HSPDA and oh by the way UTMSLTE = LTE, currently is DATA ONLY regardless of who is using it. VoLTE or the voice portion of LTE is still be bickered about, and probably will be till some one like VZW or some other carrier puts their foot down and picks the "standard" and follows it....dragging the rest with it....like it or not.NOW... there are progressions in this which you are using and confusing with the RF...AMPS to GSM to UMTS to LTEAMPS to CDMA to LTEGSM is NOT a blanket and interchangeable term for GSM/UMTS/LTE or any combination thereof.There are HUGE RF differences between GSM and UMTS and LTE, as well as GSM, CDMA, LTE. And differences in CDMA v. W-CDMA while using the same principles of CDMA.Yes. I am a CDMA snob! Plus the whole GSM thing was a conscious choice by the then PTT's of the EU/UK et al to use anything not US made, CDMA. Additionally there are RF performance issues in GSM v. CDMA where CDMA is much better spectrum wise and coverage wise.There is a HUGELY EASIER path from GSM to UMTS to LTE for the "BACKEND" non RF support systems v. CDMA to LTE. It makes these RF changes easier for the GSM/UMTS carriers to move to LTE v. the CDMA ones.Juse because it use a SIM card doesn't make it GSM or UMTS! CDMA *could* have one, the carriers chose to LOCKOUT users this way.I personally think the practice is bad business and anit consumer. Yes, you can make money and be a moral and ethical company.Please stop confusing the terms used to identify the phone tech, it is very annoying to those of us who deal with these technologies on a daily basis./pet peeve

Aoxxt

join:2010-12-13

Dearborn, MI Aoxxt Member Re: big deal LTE is a GSM technology! Just like UMTS ,EDGE, HSPA+, etc are all 3gpp standards tech hence a GSM standard. Do not confuse GSM as a air interface with GSM the tech core.

bluefox8

@72.78.187.x bluefox8 to koolman2

Anon to koolman2

You should learn about CDMA and GSM before making such comments. Also learn about different LTE bands while you're at it.

koolman2

Premium Member

join:2002-10-01

Anchorage, AK koolman2 Premium Member Re: big deal said by bluefox8 : You should learn about CDMA and GSM before making such comments. Also learn about different LTE bands while you're at it. Yeah, okay. Done and done. Try re-reading my comment and understanding what I said before attacking again. Thanks for playing. mikeluscher159

join:2011-09-04 mikeluscher159 Member Re: big deal You really should learn how networks really operate. I can personally attest to a '13 Verizon Droid Maxx Runs on AT&T's HSPA+ out of the box, and in a few key markets, AWS. It'll also fall back to 3G, and Edge if need be. I personally haven't tested T-Mobile yet. But I've held other phones that were working on T-Mobile LTE network no problem. And these were all Verizon branded Droid's. LTE is a GSM technology. Once a SIM's activated, there's no MEID or IMEI to have to deal with. That also makes them hot swappable, great for international travelers.

koolman2

Premium Member

join:2002-10-01

Anchorage, AK koolman2 Premium Member Re: big deal Uhh, you're basically arguing what I am. Were you meaning to reply to me? mikeluscher159

join:2011-09-04 mikeluscher159 Member Re: big deal Yes.

koolman2

Premium Member

join:2002-10-01

Anchorage, AK koolman2 Premium Member Re: big deal I'm not exactly sure what you're trying to tell me then. You're arguing that devices from one carrier work fine on another as long as the device has the right chipset. This is exactly what I'm arguing.

Bluefox8

@72.78.187.x Bluefox8 to koolman2

Anon to koolman2

No, I don't think you understand. What you are assuming that they use software modulated radios, which currently is prohibitively expensive on battery life.



Instead, each phone has hardwarechipsets for the particular frequencies that their carrier uses. Some, like apple's iPhone or google's motox phones, have a lot of chipsets that cover frequencies of many carriers. But in no way it's universal in covering all carriers, nor do all the other phones have them. So the idea you propose is not possible without opening the hardware and swapping chipsets.

koolman2

Premium Member

join:2002-10-01

Anchorage, AK koolman2 Premium Member Re: big deal No they don't. They use a chipset that can use any frequency it supports. Almost every phone today is a quad-band GSM and tri/quad band UMTS. Take that phone unlocked to any other GSM/UMTS operator and it will work fine. The only exception is areas where T-mobile still only has AWS for it's UMTS network.



Sure, LTE frequencies are basically locked down to whatever that carrier uses, but that's changing quickly as the tech becomes cheaper.

TWC_User

join:2013-07-31

Los Angeles TWC_User Member What is the f**king deal with this unlocking cell phone? I don't seriously get why is unlocking cell phones illegal? Can someone give me a reason? Is there a harm just to unlock cell phones? Bandito

join:2003-01-23 Bandito Member Re: What is the f**king deal with this unlocking cell phone? said by TWC_User: I don't seriously get why is unlocking cell phones illegal? Can someone give me a reason? Is there a harm just to unlock cell phones? It's all about the government protecting the teleco providers. Rakeesh

join:2011-10-30

Phoenix, AZ ·Cox HSI

·CenturyLink

Rakeesh Member Re: What is the f**king deal with this unlocking cell phone? said by Bandito: It's all about the government protecting the teleco providers.



But anyways, as long as Tim Burton is deathly afraid of you sharing footage of Johnny Depp in a bondage suit lest it lose him some potential revenue, you can count on the DMCA always being broken. Not really that...Hollywood basically purchased the WTO and had WIPO created, and now we have anti-circumvention laws. The fact that carriers benefit was just secondary.But anyways, as long as Tim Burton is deathly afraid of you sharing footage of Johnny Depp in a bondage suit lest it lose him some potential revenue, you can count on the DMCA always being broken. Kearnstd

Space Elf

Premium Member

join:2002-01-22

Mullica Hill, NJ Kearnstd Premium Member Re: What is the f**king deal with this unlocking cell phone? That is because the DMCA exists to be broken.



The problem is the DMCA was caused by a dinosaur industry in fear of the future. So while it has good parts (safe harbor) Its bad parts are things like the anti-circumvention laws mean that technically even building a media server requires breaking the law.

JasonOD

@76.16.77.x JasonOD to TWC_User

Anon to TWC_User

Carriers aren't in the business of selling phones that you take somewhere else for service.

acadiel

Press fire to begin

Premium Member

join:2002-06-22

Atlanta 1 recommendation acadiel Premium Member Sprint is still not going to let me unlock my iPhone 4S or 5S Carriers like Sprint aren't going to let me unlock my iPhones still, except ones released after 2015. Yes for international use, but they are still being douchebags about not unlocking the domestic portion of the sim slot....

n2jtx

join:2001-01-13

Glen Head, NY n2jtx Member Re: Sprint is still not going to let me unlock my iPhone 4S or 5S said by acadiel: Carriers like Sprint aren't going to let me unlock my iPhones still, except ones released after 2015. Yes for international use, but they are still being douchebags about not unlocking the domestic portion of the sim slot.... Indeed! My iPhone 4S will never be fully unlocked by Sprint as that is their policy. My policy is to never get another iPhone from Sprint. It isn't as if a new iPhone will give me better Sprint service anyhow. My 3G speeds are horrible and LTE is not officially rolled in my area. Sensorly shows some odd patches of coverage around me but nothing substantial in the areas I go. I find it odd that the 3G and 4G maps do not match since there is only one tower in my area. I suspect the LTE reception is being picked up from adjacent cells.

QuePsiPhi 10

@107.214.96.x QuePsiPhi 10 to acadiel

Anon to acadiel

All you have to do is Google search the procedure of unlocking your iphone. All of my android phones are unlocked/rooted. No longer am I slave to bloatware! Seriously thinking about going to metro pcs since they are springing up all over.



I frequently travel to another state so that is my only reason for maintaining my Sprint account for my SGN 3! I can remember back in the 90's having my bag phone to 24 years later typing on a mobile computer! No change is instant...it is all gradual! clone (banned)

join:2000-12-11

Portage, IN clone (banned) Member Re: Sprint is still not going to let me unlock my iPhone 4S or 5S MetroPCS is just T-Mobile's native network nowadays. It should be available anywhere T-Mobile works. However, there really is actually no way to unlock a Sprint iPhone. Apple can't do it because they have to be blessed by the carrier to do so, and Sprint won't have any part of it.



There are hacks and workarounds, such as Gevey SIMs and GPP SIM cards that can bypass the SIM lock, but they are kludgy and rely on jailbreaks that often times are beyond the technical capacity of the average person. Sprint is complete garbage, I don't know how they are honestly still in business, and I hope they crash and burn. dwoliver1

join:2014-03-24 dwoliver1 Member Just buy an unlocked phone to begin with I understand the different types of networks so I chose the network first and then bought an unlocked phone from a mass retailer. The carrier provided the SIM and a phone call provided the settings for the network.



I will never buy another locked phone. shmerl

join:2013-10-21 930.5 953.2

2 edits shmerl Member Problems of DMCA quote: As many people have noted previously, while the law reverses the Librarian of Congress' ridiculous decision to reduce consumer rights, it fails to seriously address the problems in the DMCA that allow the Librarian to make arbitrary and ridiculous decisions in the first place It's not so much a problem that Librarian of Congress can make arbitrary decisions. The problem is that DCMA is overreaching in forbidding a lot of non infringing activity, and because of that Librarian was designated as an "escape valve" to provide random exceptions from this ridiculous overreaching law (which glaringly admits that the law is crooked and overreaching). Instead of this bizarre setup, the law has to be fixed to make the breaking of DRM for non infringing purposes legal to begin with. It's not so much a problem that Librarian of Congress can make arbitrary decisions. The problem is that DCMA is overreaching in forbidding a lot of non infringing activity, and because of that Librarian was designated as an "escape valve" to provide random exceptions from this ridiculous overreaching law (which glaringly admits that the law is crooked and overreaching). Instead of this bizarre setup, the law has to be fixed to make the breaking of DRM for non infringing purposes legal to begin with.

jsolo1

Premium Member

join:2001-07-01 jsolo1 Premium Member Verizon is scared. Verizon is a relatively large domestic carrier. Their lobbyists are hard at work ensuring verizon's survival. Upgrading their entire US network to gsm capability is a huge and expensive undertaking. At some point verizon will have to incur this expense. For now they're trying to control the market as much as they can.



About the only benefit of verizon phones is the fact they're are true dual mode phones - cdma and full gsm/hspa. There are few tasks that truly require high speed lte. For the average user, working hspa is plenty fast for most things.

Pirate515

Premium Member

join:2001-01-22

Brooklyn, NY Pirate515 Premium Member Re: Verizon is scared. said by jsolo1: Verizon is a relatively large domestic carrier. Their lobbyists are hard at work ensuring Verizon's survival. Upgrading their entire US network to GSM capability is a huge and expensive undertaking. At some point Verizon will have to incur this expense. For now they're trying to control the market as much as they can. GSM is old technology, implementing it on Verizon's network would be a step backward, not forward. At this point, Verizon's LTE is data only, which is why phones on their network must still have CDMA capabilities. What Verizon is working on right now is VoLTE, which is an extension of LTE that will allow making calls over it. Once they'll have it across their entire network, they will start an aggressive push to get their customers to upgrade to LTE-only phones and and to get them off the CDMA/3G network. your comment..

