09[11:11pm] [11:11pm] OdinYggd sets mode: +m

[11:11pm] <08@OdinYggd> go ahead Sygma

[11:11pm] <08@Sygma> Thanks

[11:12pm] <08@OdinYggd> If anyone wants a turn to talk, PM me and I will voice you for one question each

[11:12pm] <08@Sygma> So as you know I'm a dev for two coins, ORG and POT. I have say over ORG I do not have say over POT but I will talk with the folks in charge there.

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[11:12pm] <08@Sygma> The interesting thing about coindevs is we generally have a large amount of liquid reserve.

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[11:13pm] <08@Sygma> Furthermore every dev with a coin on this exchange wants to see it survive

[11:13pm] <08@Sygma> Well thats my hope anyways.

[11:13pm] <08@Sygma> Thus I'll extend an open offer.

[11:14pm] <08@Sygma> Any dev that wants to provide liquidity to the users of this site will get 2 things in return

[11:14pm] <08@Sygma> #1 They will get an equity stake proportional to the amount of liquidity they actually provide.

[11:14pm] <08@OdinYggd> In writing?

00[11:15pm] <04@Devianttwo> Hold questions for the end please.

[11:15pm] <08@Sygma> #2 The will get direct ownership and admin of the hotwallet used for their coin.

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[11:15pm] <08@Sygma> This will make CR the first altcoin exchange operated by actual altcoin devs.

[11:15pm] <08@Sygma> And yes this will be in writing

[11:16pm] <08@OdinYggd> This is what will set that point apart from CRS. They never had any documentation beyond site statements.

[11:16pm] <08@Sygma> I'm announcing it here with you guys in hopes some of you are also coin devs and willing to go along with this plan.

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[11:16pm] <08@Sygma> I realize that Odin and you are correct

[11:16pm] <08@Sygma> There are issues with CRS that will be recitified

08[11:17pm] [11:17pm] SoepkipSad (~Soepkip|M@5419B6C5.cm-5-2c.dynamic.ziggo.nl) is now known as Soepkip

[11:17pm] <08@Sygma> They are directly acknowledged as a non-convertible debt instrument that will be made convertible the day the incorporation papers are signed off on.

[11:17pm] <08@Sygma> Ok I'm open for questions.

[11:17pm] <08@Sygma> No PMS

[11:17pm] <08@OdinYggd> You have two waiting in the queue

[11:17pm] <08@Sygma> err PMs

[11:17pm] <08@OdinYggd> I wil ltake all PMs

[11:17pm] <08@OdinYggd> PM me to be given a chance to ask

00[11:17pm] <04@Devianttwo> PM OdinYggd to join the queue to ask questions please.

00[11:17pm] <04@Devianttwo> he will voice you guys one at a time.

09[11:17pm] [11:17pm] OdinYggd sets mode: +v NomZ

[11:18pm] <10+NomZ> If you know, how much in total has CryptoRush lost, exactly? How much are you able to fund? How much would be required for CR to become financially viable again?

[11:19pm] <08@Sygma> This is about the size of it and I'm not trying to be facetious http://i.imgur.com/JPYdPd9.jpg

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[11:19pm] <08@Sygma> Everyone saw the paste bin. Would that be correct?

[11:19pm] <08@OdinYggd> I'm getting the impression that the actual sum of the damage still needs to be calculated.

00[11:19pm] <04@Devianttwo> 11•7Sygma11• I have a comment here if I may

[11:19pm] <08@Sygma> I'm going off the tool right now.

[11:19pm] <08@Sygma> Of course

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00[11:19pm] <04@Devianttwo> The actual BTC Lost including all currencies.

00[11:19pm] <04@Devianttwo> the last time We checked

00[11:20pm] <04@Devianttwo> was around 1200 BTC

00[11:20pm] <04@Devianttwo> that is the ACTUAL total btc value.

00[11:20pm] <04@Devianttwo> between all currencies.

[11:20pm] <08@Sygma> At last strike?

[11:20pm] <08@DogeyMcDoge> including LTC, etc.

00[11:20pm] <04@Devianttwo> that is as of 5 days ago

00[11:20pm] <04@Devianttwo> when fyrstikken had us calculate it.

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00[11:20pm] <04@Devianttwo> values may have changed since then.

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[11:21pm] <08@Sygma> Anyone live near the Ukraine and want to make a quick 120 BTC PM Deviant for instructions :D

[11:21pm] <08@DogeyMcDoge> lol

00[11:21pm] <04@Devianttwo> and that includes Zeitcoin and blackcoin.

[11:21pm] <08@OdinYggd> Next question then?

[11:21pm] <10+NomZ> I have a followup question, if you don't mind.

[11:21pm] <08@Sygma> Yes

[11:22pm] <08@Sygma> Oh ok nomz

00[11:22pm] <04@Devianttwo> Quick comment first.

[11:22pm] <08@Sygma> ga

00[11:22pm] <04@Devianttwo> the 1200 BTC Value INCLUDES zeitcoin and blackcoin losses.

00[11:22pm] <04@Devianttwo> Ok ask away NomZ

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[11:22pm] <10+NomZ> How much do you estimate you currently have of the 1200 BTC in potential investors?

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[11:23pm] <08@Alex123> Actual total value is down given withdrawals and fyrstikken's robbery.

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00[11:23pm] <04@Devianttwo> Sygma.

00[11:23pm] <04@Devianttwo> I believe he is asking

00[11:23pm] <04@Devianttwo> how much do you and your team currently have

00[11:23pm] <04@Devianttwo> to fund missing currencies.

00[11:23pm] <04@Devianttwo> as of right now.

00[11:23pm] <04@Devianttwo> aproximately

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[11:24pm] <08@Sygma> I want to provide a figure but I do not have anything I can offer that wouldn't be pie in the sky right now.

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[11:24pm] <10+NomZ> That's fair. I'll step down now :]

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09[11:25pm] [11:25pm] OdinYggd sets mode: -v NomZ

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[11:25pm] <08@Sygma> Next?

09[11:25pm] [11:25pm] OdinYggd sets mode: +v johnnn_

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[11:25pm] <10+johnnn_> Sygma: it sounds like a cool and new idea (dev wallet control) but don't you think that perhaps the devs don't want that responsibility and that part of the 'job' of an exchange is to be in control of those options? Think a coin that may be on 10+ plus exchanges. I may be totally wrong, but it's just a thought. also, I highly recommend CR takes on a new layout and design to ensure further user interest.

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[11:26pm] <08@Sygma> johnnn_ it's a direction we have considered, but a UI revamp at this stage would just be re-arranging the deck chairs on the Titanic.

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[11:26pm] <08@Sygma> The coindev aspect is at the interest of the dev.

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[11:26pm] <10+johnnn_> heh, nice analogy

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[11:27pm] <10+johnnn_> makes sense. So you provide them with the option i suppose

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[11:27pm] <08@Sygma> If they want to help us they will attract more users to their coin. We will promote them heavily etc. They also get an ownership stake which frankly may include the ability to have a say in any new coins brought online.

[11:28pm] <08@Sygma> Not sure about that last part yet.

[11:28pm] <10+johnnn_> hm

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[11:28pm] <10+johnnn_> fair enough

[11:28pm] <10+johnnn_> thanks

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00[11:29pm] <04@Devianttwo> Any other questions johnnn_?

00[11:29pm] <04@Devianttwo> next please OdinYggd

[11:29pm] <10+johnnn_> nope. good to go, thanks for taking the time to answer.

09[11:29pm] [11:29pm] OdinYggd sets mode: -v johnnn_

09[11:29pm] [11:29pm] OdinYggd sets mode: +v loq

13[11:29pm] * @OdinYggd kicks loq

[11:29pm] <10+loq> oh

[11:29pm] <08@Sygma> Next?

[11:29pm] <10+loq> dont kick me

[11:29pm] <08@OdinYggd> lol

00[11:30pm] <04@Devianttwo> not literqally kick :P

00[11:30pm] <04@Devianttwo> ask away loq

00[11:31pm] <04@Devianttwo> loq do you have a question?

[11:31pm] <08@Sygma> 10

[11:31pm] <08@Sygma> 9

[11:31pm] <10+loq> hai my loves. my question is, what is your responsibility towards people that are being made culprits of todays problems. we all know who I am talking about and if we go not to far into past history, we had people doing similar stuff such as wolong. how are we going to deal with them?

[11:31pm] <10+loq> no technical question

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[11:33pm] <08@DogeyMcDoge> If I can comment, I would say that it is the responsibilty of the user to decide who they trust their investments to. If the person is a self proclaimed "pump and dumper", do you want to take the gamble of being the last holder on the dump

[11:33pm] <08@Sygma> I'm going to let like anyone else but me field that question. I seriously don't even want to see finger pointing.

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[11:33pm] <08@OdinYggd> Yeah, though it is a very valid question its one we'll have to answer some other time.

[11:34pm] <08@Sygma> I honestly don't have the brain horsepower left to field that.

[11:34pm] <08@Sygma> I'm open to suggestions

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[11:35pm] <08@OdinYggd> Just a moment

[11:35pm] <08@Alex123> We can't prevent pump&dumpers, but we can prevent listing of coins they promote.

[11:35pm] <10+loq> its okay. Im always up for some talk about how to deal with those individuals. my approach is just that these people do not deserve a platform after performing certain actions

09[11:35pm] [11:35pm] OdinYggd sets mode: -v loq

09[11:35pm] [11:35pm] OdinYggd sets mode: +v P-Funk

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13[11:36pm] * @Devianttwo pokes P-Funk with a wake up stick

08[11:36pm] [11:36pm] googolhash_u (googolhash@unaffiliated/bencoinanke) is now known as googolhash

[11:36pm] <08@OdinYggd> P-Funk is #4 of 8 currently in the queue

[11:36pm] <08@OdinYggd> Please have your questions ready to enter when it is your turn

[11:36pm] <08@OdinYggd> Its getting late, we're wasting time waiting for people

00[11:37pm] <04@Devianttwo> 11•7P-Funk11• ?

00[11:37pm] <04@Devianttwo> keep him voice

00[11:37pm] <04@Devianttwo> move on OdinYggd

[11:37pm] <08@OdinYggd> okay

09[11:37pm] [11:37pm] OdinYggd sets mode: +v mixan_

[11:37pm] <10+mixan_> Hey Sygma! What do you think about spreading fyrstikkens 10% of CRS that Devianttwo took back today, to all the holders based on % held, who supported/stayed trustfully to Cryptorush and that now may have have felt like they lost/been fooled a lot thx to the lies we have been through causing CRS to drop so much in value

00[11:38pm] <04@Devianttwo> if I may respond to that one sygma.

[11:38pm] <08@Sygma> Actually devianttwo no you should not

00[11:38pm] <04@Devianttwo> Alright

00[11:38pm] <04@Devianttwo> go ahead then.

[11:39pm] <08@Sygma> That really is the type of question that can cause us grief in the long run.

[11:39pm] <08@Sygma> If you bought CRS on fyrstikkens word then we owe you a debt plain and simple. You bought it under the color of authority period.

00[11:40pm] <04@Devianttwo> I was only gonna respond to the fyrstikken shares part.

[11:40pm] <08@Sygma> That said there is no legal method for a company to simply redistribute a users shares like that. I'm not looking for a new set of bracelets and a girlfriend with a beard.

00[11:40pm] <04@Devianttwo> those where returned to the selling account and there are no plans to redistribute them currently.

00[11:40pm] <04@Devianttwo> was all I was gonna say.

[11:40pm] <08@Sygma> What I will do is this

00[11:41pm] <04@Devianttwo> also as a side note. fyrstikken never officially purchased shares.

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[11:41pm] <10+mixan_> we did

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[11:41pm] <08@Sygma> If you bought on fyrtikkens word file a support ticket. We will buy back at the price you bought at.

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[11:42pm] <08@Sygma> Alternatively you can opt to be credited whatever the pricing differential is in CRS

[11:42pm] <08@Sygma> Thus if you bought at 1500 and it's 500 when you file the ticket, your share balance will triple.

[11:43pm] <08@Sygma> I hope that you consider that to be a fair agreement.

[11:43pm] <08@DogeyMcDoge> Hard cap limit on the # of shares sold still at 25%

[11:43pm] <10+mixan_> ok, so you wil go through those earlier buys then?

[11:43pm] <10+mixan_> im happy with that

[11:43pm] <08@Sygma> On request only

[11:43pm] <10+mixan_> sure

[11:44pm] <10+mixan_> ty

[11:44pm] <08@Sygma> YW

[11:44pm] <10+mixan_> next :)

09[11:44pm] [11:44pm] OdinYggd sets mode: +v TeaHC

[11:44pm] <10+TeaHC> What are your plans in order to get the coins needed to revive the exchange?

09[11:44pm] [11:44pm] OdinYggd sets mode: -v mixan_

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[11:46pm] <08@Sygma> So there are several methods all will be used. However one will be at your option we aren't going to force it on you.

[11:46pm] <08@Sygma> #1 Bring in the coin devs I just discussed

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[11:47pm] <08@Sygma> #2 coins where the wallet is empty will stop trading until the wallet has something in it

00[11:48pm] <04@Devianttwo> Once done I have a follow up question.

[11:48pm] <08@Alex123> So do I.

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[11:49pm] <08@Sygma> #3 Declare a 7 day "Bank Run" period during which you can and should exit by any means nessecary if you are not comfortable with the daily audit figures.

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[11:49pm] <08@Sygma> #4 At the end of the bank run and remaining outstanding balances can be resolved in one of two ways and really it is up to you.

[11:49pm] <08@Sygma> We can do a vircurex "these funds are on hold" style lockdown

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[11:50pm] <08@Sygma> Or we can convert to CRS at market rates and you will become a literal shareholder and owner of this exchange.

[11:50pm] <08@Sygma> I like the second option better

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[11:51pm] <08@Sygma> BTW both of those are only for wallets that are insolvent. If it's not insolvent it will just continue to trade like normal.

[11:51pm] <10+TeaHC> what exactly do you mean bank run? not sure of the term

[11:51pm] <08@OdinYggd> A bank run is what has been happening

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[11:51pm] <08@OdinYggd> People know something is wrong, and are panicking to get their money out

[11:52pm] <08@Sygma> You will see a daily audit as well just like I pastebined today and honestly I'd like to get an IRC bot going with that info.

[11:52pm] <10+TeaHC> oh ok

[11:52pm] <08@OdinYggd> There isn't enough money to pay them all, so the panic intensifies

[11:52pm] <08@OdinYggd> In a real bank run there is no altcoins to escape with. Just a lot of upset people usually rioting inside and outside the offending bank

[11:52pm] <10+P-Funk> back

00[11:53pm] <04@Devianttwo> P-Funk one moment please

[11:53pm] <08@OdinYggd> Oh good. All set Tea?

00[11:53pm] <04@Devianttwo> your next.

[11:53pm] <08@Sygma> Anyways doing that allows us to have solvency

00[11:53pm] <04@Devianttwo> now my follow up question Sygma.

[11:53pm] <08@Sygma> Starting in 7 days

00[11:53pm] <04@Devianttwo> You stated that trading would stop on wallets with nothing in them.

00[11:53pm] <04@Devianttwo> after the bank run.

[11:53pm] <08@Sygma> Yes Deviant your turn

00[11:53pm] <04@Devianttwo> What about BTC & LTC?

[11:53pm] <08@Sygma> Thats the plan and yes

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00[11:53pm] <04@Devianttwo> How will that exactly get resolved?

[11:54pm] <08@Sygma> Deposits allowed with warning on those since everyone wants to exit it seems like using those two

00[11:54pm] <04@Devianttwo> I mean I have some internal ideas about it. but nothing on paper yet for you to look at.

[11:54pm] <08@logicaluser> is this going to become the first all doge exchange?

[11:54pm] <08@Sygma> No

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[11:55pm] <08@Sygma> But we do want to focus on the actual coins. I do not want this place to become a dumping ground for people

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[11:56pm] <10+TeaHC> my question has been answered, thank you!

09[11:57pm] [11:57pm] OdinYggd sets mode: -v TeaHC

[11:57pm] <08@OdinYggd> P-Funk

[11:57pm] <10+P-Funk> my question is: are you gonna get the money back from fyrstikken that he withdrew to "arbitrage"

[11:57pm] <10+P-Funk> or is he gone full on thief

[11:58pm] <08@Sygma> Alright so here's my thoughts on that.

[11:58pm] <08@Sygma> I honest to god do not have enough information on what really happened and is happening on that front to say what that even looks like.

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00[11:59pm] <04@Devianttwo> You do have the withdraws in logs though.

[11:59pm] <08@Sygma> I'm aware of the situation. But not the particulars of it.

00[11:59pm] <04@Devianttwo> and I pastebind it.

00[11:59pm] <04@Devianttwo> and I can fill you in on missing details later.

[11:59pm] <08@Sygma> Yes and I haven't slept in 36 hrs

[11:59pm] <08@OdinYggd> We can ask him to give it back. No guarantees he will.

[11:59pm] <08@OdinYggd> If he refuses, the only real option is to settle it in court

[11:59pm] <08@OdinYggd> and that could take months, if at all

[11:59pm] <08@Sygma> Before I go full in investigator mode I'd like at least a short nap :D

Session Time: Mon Mar 31 00:00:00 2014

[12:00am] <10+P-Funk> so he hasn't given it back or offered to give it back

[12:00am] <08@Sygma> My understanding is they are sitting on an open order waiting for the price to rise at like Allcoin or something

[12:00am] <10+P-Funk> lol

00[12:00am] <04@Devianttwo> Sygma actually they are completely withdrawn.

00[12:00am] <04@Devianttwo> no longer on the site.

[12:00am] <08@Sygma> Reread what I said

00[12:01am] <04@Devianttwo> k

[12:01am] <08@Sygma> I am aware they are no longer in our posession. But I am also aware of a pledge to repay once the coin goes up.

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[12:02am] <08@Sygma> Incidently if anyone wants to buy any KRN :D

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[12:02am] <08@Sygma> I am hopeful they will be returned to us safely. But that's just a gut feeling I have no evidence to back it up.

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[12:03am] <08@logicaluser> fyi, BTC just plummeted in china, people may want to take a glance

[12:04am] <08@OdinYggd> All set then?

[12:04am] <08@Sygma> To put a positive spin on that the USD obligation just dropped by what $75k?

[12:04am] <08@logicaluser> we're at 2.5k BTC volume on huobi in past 3minutes

08[12:04am] [12:04am] Shimben_ (~Shimben@c-67-161-20-189.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) is now known as Shimben

[12:04am] <08@logicaluser> 11% fall

[12:05am] <08@OdinYggd> Ready for the next question then?

[12:05am] <08@Sygma> http://guardianlv.com/2014/03/bitcoin-not-illegal-in-china-value-still-falling/

[12:05am] <08@Sygma> Yeah please

[12:05am] <08@OdinYggd> To anyone who is just arriving, PM me to ask Sygma a question about Cryptorush.

09[12:05am] [12:05am] OdinYggd sets mode: +v tom14cat14

09[12:05am] [12:05am] OdinYggd sets mode: -v P-Funk

[12:05am] <10+tom14cat14> When does your team take full control of the site and admin duties. Such as fixing current trade issues?(Not withdrawal). And a comment on the locking BTC and LTC trades would this be just until after the bank run? It seems that after the bank run and if everyone decides to use the CRS to be made whole the BTC and LTC would be solvent once people start depositing them right away since the slate would be wiped clean.

[12:05am] <10+tom14cat14> sorry it was so long just kept adding as others had ques

[12:06am] <08@Sygma> So here is the process and time table...

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[12:07am] <08@Sygma> Tomorrow Linkandzelda and Devianttwo will sign a contract pledging the existing assets of CR (all IP such as the website, servers etc) to a new entity in exchange for a stake in that entity.

[12:07am] <08@Sygma> Once that is signed we will begin the process of incorporation.

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[12:08am] <08@Sygma> Concurrent with that Deviant will be training X3n0x on the daily admin duties.

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[12:08am] <08@Sygma> Several of you have asked if you can be part of the transition team and my answer so far has pretty much been yes.

[12:09am] <08@Sygma> I won't lie there is a LOT of hardwork to do ahead.

[12:09am] <08@Sygma> An ungodly fraction of that involves the current team working to help the transition team with things like server migrations etc.

[12:10am] <10+tom14cat14> so for those of us then still believe in CR are the trade pairs that are broken and still live just going to be left for a few day/weeks with us missing random coins

08[12:10am] [12:10am] BCJesus (~BKDoge@S01061c7ee52ee0f9.vc.shawcable.net) is now known as AlwaysPanic

[12:10am] <10+tom14cat14> ie: WAS

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[12:11am] <08@Sygma> I will do everything in my power to ensure that any coin you trade into actually exists on the site.

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[12:11am] <08@Sygma> There will be a daily audit of all balances posted so you can see where the currencies you are interested in actually stant.

[12:11am] <08@Sygma> stand

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[12:12am] <10+tom14cat14> Thanks. I believe you guys can pull this off. But I do not want to trade when it deducts 1 coin and does not add the coin I traded for.

[12:12am] <08@OdinYggd> We mentioned float issues in some of the wallet balances

[12:12am] <08@OdinYggd> Its possible that it is visible on the trading floor- it would appear exactly as you describe

00[12:12am] <04@Devianttwo> and those are normally like 1 satoshi.

[12:12am] <08@OdinYggd> decimal places that don't add back up to the whole

00[12:12am] <04@Devianttwo> but they have been known to be bigger. I've seen it myself.

[12:13am] <08@logicaluser> several people have reported issues with not receiving WAS on WAS/LTC and WAS/TEA

[12:13am] <10+tom14cat14> yea I have 280 million missing

00[12:13am] <04@Devianttwo> Just remember. those are actually visible issues. and the actual wallet has what it says it has.

[12:14am] <08@Sygma> Ok I want that corrected though ASAP please

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[12:14am] <10+tom14cat14> So i am just wondering since you guys are busy with the transfer will you take it off line so no one else has this problem? And when will you get to it

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[12:14am] <08@Sygma> Something like that adversely impacts people to feel whole.

[12:14am] <08@OdinYggd> All set then? I still have 4 more people waiting

[12:15am] <10+tom14cat14> Yes I will take a risk and deposit more coins here hoping you turn it around but not if trades do not go through fully. Thanks for you time

[12:15am] <08@Alex123> If you freeze BTC and LTC, what about opening up markets with lower-value bases like DOGE, POT, ORG, etc.?

[12:15am] <08@Sygma> Deviant fix that please

[12:15am] <08@OdinYggd> To those just arriving, Sygma will be heading up Cryptorush from here on in, with contracts in writing being signed tomorrow to make it official. He is currently answering people's questions, PM me to join the queue

[12:15am] <10+tom14cat14> Thanks again

[12:16am] <08@Sygma> Alex123 that is also a huge priority

09[12:16am] [12:16am] OdinYggd sets mode: +v Soepkip

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[12:16am] <08@Sygma> If we have a coin and it's liquid please open markets on as many other solve coins as we have.

[12:16am] <10+Soepkip> Since BC(BlackCoin) was not in the audit as reported above: What is going to happen to the 1.5 million coins lost (121~BTC value at the time), Also will you implement cold storage before reopening the exchange again, and moving away from full hot wallet systems. (thus making it impossible for big withdrawels to suddenly happen in a short time frame). Also, will a system be implemented that does not use the accounts feature of getba

[12:16am] <08@Alex123> Please also look into User 14's WAS holdings.

[12:17am] <08@Sygma> Do we know the nature of the failure with BC?

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[12:17am] <08@logicaluser> incompetence, a mix of coin dev and exchange dev

[12:18am] <08@OdinYggd> Linkandzelda you here?

00[12:18am] <04@Devianttwo> yes Sygma we do.

00[12:18am] <04@Devianttwo> The BC situation was a issue with stake. and a coin upgrade.

00[12:18am] <04@Devianttwo> developer admited to mistake

[12:18am] <08@Linkandzelda> im here

00[12:18am] <04@Devianttwo> but is not covering the losses.

[12:18am] <08@Sygma> The other answers are yes. There will only be enough on hotwallets to cover 1 days withdrawal requests and absolutely no more than 10% of liquid funds is to end up in a hotwallet.

00[12:18am] <04@Devianttwo> that 120 btc value was included in the 1200 btc value I said earlier.

[12:19am] <08@Sygma> How much of that is rat4's fault and how much is ours?

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00[12:19am] <04@Devianttwo> Honestly

00[12:19am] <04@Devianttwo> about 50/50

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00[12:19am] <04@Devianttwo> we upgraded.

00[12:19am] <04@Devianttwo> we did not verify

00[12:19am] <04@Devianttwo> he released the update.

00[12:19am] <04@Devianttwo> so 50/50

[12:20am] <08@DogeyMcDoge> I think there needs to be a secondary balance check on users besides daemon

[12:20am] <10+Soepkip> I do not fully agree with that, but that is a personal view.

[12:20am] <08@Sygma> Soepkip in what way?

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[12:21am] <08@Sygma> I'm a coin dev you can actually get REALLY technical here and I'm going to try to keep up.

00[12:21am] <04@Devianttwo> I have a question and an answer next.

00[12:21am] <04@Devianttwo> that I know everyone wants to know.

[12:21am] <10+Soepkip> Seeing as the exchange relied on a system that is inherently broken (even more so in PoS coins)

[12:22am] <10+Soepkip> And a new update was not properly tested, since you do rely on third party software for your accounting.

[12:22am] <10+Soepkip> But that's a personal view again

[12:22am] <10+Soepkip> I think Linkandzelda already has agreed in an earlier cryptorush statement that Blackcoin will be refunded via CryptoRush, i just wanted to make sure you are aware of these losses.

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00[12:22am] <04@Devianttwo> 11•7Soepkip11• I can give a reason behind that exactly. Normally after what happend with ZeitCoin we test updates before publicly releasing

00[12:23am] <04@Devianttwo> however, We was already 8 hours behind on the update. it was a forced instant fork by the coin dev. and we was unaware there was a stake problem as the dev never told us. We also was unaware of this issue in POS.

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[12:23am] <08@Sygma> Crap, guys I need to AFK 5 mins. My kids. BRB

00[12:23am] <04@Devianttwo> We probably missed it somewhere thats why we said 50/50

[12:23am] <10+Soepkip> ;And also to make sure that the earlier statement is still valid.

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00[12:24am] <04@Devianttwo> The reason why we updated our wallet without really testing it is due to the outright spam in the channel. We had to get it up asap. was unaware of any problems as other exchanges had already been using it.

00[12:24am] <04@Devianttwo> so we trusted it where we should not have trusted it.

[12:24am] <10+Soepkip> Yeah, rat4 admitted to the mistake made, so I can't say otherwise from blackcoins point of view

[12:25am] <10+Soepkip> And also to make sure that the earlier statement made by Linkandzelda is still valid for the new management in cryptorush.

[12:25am] <08@Alex123> but he shouldn't have been threatened with death.

[12:25am] <10+Soepkip> Oh dear god

[12:25am] <10+Soepkip> :')

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[12:25am] <10+Soepkip> We laugh about it really

00[12:25am] <04@Devianttwo> What was the statement Soepkip

[12:25am] <10+Soepkip> Euhh

13[12:25am] * +Soepkip goes and find it

00[12:25am] <04@Devianttwo> k take your time.

00[12:26am] <04@Devianttwo> and No he shouldn't have

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00[12:26am] <04@Devianttwo> Ok I got the statement

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[12:26am] <10+Soepkip> Just the blackcoin one yeh

00[12:26am] <04@Devianttwo> the statement about ZEIT and BlackCoin being refunded was actually piped to link by fyrstikken before the move. I believe it will still stand but your going to have to wait on sygmas answer on that.

[12:26am] <10+Soepkip> Oki :)

00[12:27am] <04@Devianttwo> I think it will work with the same situation as BTC and LTC

[12:27am] <10+Soepkip> Just want to be informed about it so I can point users in the right direction

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00[12:27am] <04@Devianttwo> ofc.

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[12:27am] <10+Soepkip> dat fyrstikken :>

00[12:27am] <04@Devianttwo> Soepkip For now I would probably refer to the step 1 step 2 etc that he linked earlier

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[12:28am] <08@OdinYggd> All set? There are still quite a few people waiting, and at least one had to go to bed

[12:29am] <10+Soepkip> Just use my name when answering sygma , i'll read it

[12:29am] <10+Soepkip> next :)

09[12:29am] [12:29am] OdinYggd sets mode: +v hinv

09[12:29am] [12:29am] OdinYggd sets mode: -v Soepkip

[12:29am] <10+hinv> oops

[12:29am] <08@OdinYggd> lol

[12:30am] <10+hinv> it was reported that Linkandzelda said and we also sold some of the on site balance of mazacoin, pot coin and AUR

[12:30am] <10+hinv> that brought in another 60 odd BTC

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[12:30am] <10+hinv> what I wan to know is:

[12:30am] <10+hinv> were those customer's coins?

[12:31am] <10+hinv> did Linkandzelda sell customers mazacoin, pot coin and AUR?

00[12:32am] <04@Devianttwo> 11•7hinv-11• Actually. it was partially me. and Link that did sell some coins to convert back to btc. However, this was at the order of fyrstikken as stated earlier today. and I believe it will still have the same rules of refunding as stated earlier.

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00[12:32am] <04@Devianttwo> basically we did that in order to balance the load.

[12:32am] <10+hinv> Linkandzelda, do you concur?

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[12:33am] <08@Linkandzelda> yes hinv, indeeed

[12:33am] <08@DogeyMcDoge> Gnight all.

[12:33am] <10+hinv> that sound's like embezzlement to me

[12:34am] <10+hinv> Correct me if I am wrong.

[12:34am] <08@Sygma> Ok I'm back reviewing

[12:34am] <08@OdinYggd> The part I want to know is what became of that btc. Is it sitting in a wallet waiting to be released back to the exchange? Or are those sells yet unfilled and those people on their honor to return it

[12:35am] <08@Linkandzelda> I can answer that OdinYggd

[12:35am] <08@OdinYggd> hinv, I believe it was an attempt to rebalance liquidity- by taking some coins from wallets that had sufficient supply to tranfer worth to a wallet that was insufficient

[12:36am] <08@OdinYggd> Such wouldn't be abnormal under other circumstances

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[12:36am] <08@Sygma> Soepkip to the extent possible we will honor all previous promises regardless of the source.

[12:37am] <10+hinv> Let's not take Banksters as setting the standards for normal.

[12:37am] <08@Sygma> Part of that will probably entail me going hat in hand to the coindev and asking them to help us through this time.

00[12:37am] <04@Devianttwo> Ok to fill that in Odin.

00[12:37am] <04@Devianttwo> What he said is correct but as for what happened to those funds

[12:37am] <08@Sygma> Ok sorry I had to AFK, my kids heard about Noah at church today and decided to replicate the flood scene.

00[12:38am] <04@Devianttwo> The funds where placed back into the btc wallet before we found out that the hacker had actually dumped privatekeys (the log did not state this so we did not know this)

[12:38am] <10+hinv> lol I've had that happen also

00[12:38am] <04@Devianttwo> therefore those funds where stolen as well as the initial funds.

[12:38am] <08@OdinYggd> Then there was actually multiple releases of btc

00[12:38am] <04@Devianttwo> Including almost everything that was earned from crs.

00[12:38am] <04@Devianttwo> yes OdinYggd. 600 btc originally

[12:38am] <08@Sygma> Yes it appears to have leaked a few times.

00[12:38am] <04@Devianttwo> and an additional 350 btc over time leaked from a stolen privatekey on the wallet.

00[12:39am] <04@Devianttwo> that was since resolved by the replacement of the bitcoin wallet.

00[12:39am] <04@Devianttwo> same issue with PotCoin.

[12:39am] <08@OdinYggd> So the 1200 btc was not all at once.

00[12:39am] <04@Devianttwo> No. it was over time.

[12:39am] <08@Sygma> Alright I need a min here I have a proposal for everyone currently in chan.

[12:39am] <08@OdinYggd> all set then hinv?

00[12:39am] <04@Devianttwo> probably around 750 btcish was intially stolen.

[12:39am] <10+hinv> So will this happen again?

00[12:39am] <04@Devianttwo> then 1.6 billion zeitcoins where lost due to a bug.

00[12:39am] <04@Devianttwo> then the Blackcoin was stolen due to stake.

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00[12:39am] <04@Devianttwo> No hinv it will not.

[12:40am] <08@Sygma> We will need to incentivize deposits especially in the beginning.

00[12:40am] <04@Devianttwo> the new team will insure top security on these servers.

[12:40am] <10+hinv> Do you guys believe it is OK to sell off customers coins to cover another shortage in another market?

[12:40am] <08@Sygma> No hinv it was not appropriate

[12:40am] <08@Sygma> It was a rash decision made in the heat of the moment by people who did not want to see this thing fail.

00[12:40am] <04@Devianttwo> 11•7hinv-11• No I do not. but in the situation it was the only resolution that was available. There was always plans to return those funds if needed.

00[12:40am] <04@Devianttwo> There was never more then 10% of any given currency sold off.

[12:41am] <08@Sygma> I don't believe the consequences were thought through.

00[12:41am] <04@Devianttwo> therefore the site would easily operate off what was left.

[12:41am] <10+hinv> Sound's like situational ethics.

00[12:41am] <04@Devianttwo> and at the time we was only going off what fyrstikken told us to do as the best resolution. which we should have NEVER done. I admit.

[12:41am] <10+hinv> Can I ask another related question?

[12:41am] <08@OdinYggd> There are 2 people remaining in the queue.

[12:42am] <10+hinv> About super hot wallets?

[12:42am] <08@Sygma> Make it quick

00[12:42am] <04@Devianttwo> yeah I have a question about that do.

00[12:42am] <04@Devianttwo> go ahead hinv you'll probably ask it.

[12:42am] <08@Sygma> Yeah that goes away tomorrow.

[12:42am] <10+hinv> It seems that fyrstikken doesn't understand what a cold wallet really is

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[12:42am] <10+hinv> and promoted his super hot wallet idea

00[12:42am] <04@Devianttwo> So how is actual funds going to be handleed now sygma? is there gonna be a cold storage for all coins and only a certain amount kept in the actual onsite wallet?

00[12:42am] <04@Devianttwo> and have someone refill it?

[12:42am] <08@Sygma> There will be exactly 1 day's average liquidity in the hot wallet.

[12:43am] <10+hinv> but it seems like more embezzlement for arbitrage.

00[12:43am] <04@Devianttwo> Thank you for clarifying that to me as well Sygma. I like that.

[12:43am] <08@Sygma> Is there anyone in this chan who has a licensed financial background such as CPA?

[12:43am] <10+hinv> What are you guys going to do with cold/hot/superhot wallets on exchanges?

[12:43am] <08@OdinYggd> That works on one condition- that if the wallet must be topped up two days in a row or more than once per day, a full audit is required.

[12:43am] <08@OdinYggd> MtGox had a cold wallet. It emptied over time due to leaks

00[12:43am] <04@Devianttwo> Agree OdinYggd

[12:44am] <08@Alex123> I took accounting and finance classes in business school.

[12:44am] <08@Sygma> I'm looking for someone with financial auditing experience.

00[12:44am] <04@Devianttwo> also sygma I'm pretty sure the site can basically tell you whats needed if we go through the scripts easy enough.

[12:44am] <08@Sygma> Preferably licensed

00[12:44am] <04@Devianttwo> make it an average on a week or even a month.

[12:44am] <10+hinv> Sygma please don't look to the fractional reserve system as normal

[12:44am] <10+hinv> they are crooks that create funds out of thin air....won't work here

[12:45am] <08@Sygma> Don't plan to.

00[12:45am] <04@Devianttwo> Comment on that

[12:45am] <08@Sygma> go for it

00[12:45am] <04@Devianttwo> If someone wants to withdraw more then the normal daily trading value. they would have to submit a ticket before withdrawing. correct Sygma?

00[12:45am] <04@Devianttwo> so that we could refill that wallet to what they need.

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00[12:46am] <04@Devianttwo> AKA daily volume of say 100 VirtualCoins and they want to withdraw 300 VirtualCoins.

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00[12:47am] <04@Devianttwo> Is that correct sygma?

[12:47am] <08@OdinYggd> In that case I would expect it to be fairly simple to add a notice to the withdrawl page- much like how right now it returns an error that it cannot send btc, make it pop up a similar notice saying this withdrawl exceeds daily withdrawl caps. Please submit a ticket to withdraw this amount manually

[12:47am] <08@logicaluser> Sygma, the channel is moderated fyi, if your expecting responses from the peanut gallery they'll have to be PM

[12:47am] <08@OdinYggd> All set hinv?

00[12:48am] <04@Devianttwo> Or even list a page that people can view that shows them how much is currently in the hot wallets so they know if they can withdraw enough at that point in time.

[12:48am] <08@OdinYggd> If anyone else wants to ask a question, please PM me. I have 2 people waiting, and 1 question from someone who left

00[12:48am] <04@Devianttwo> mabye?

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[12:48am] <10+hinv> kind of....I would like an update of how cold wallets are handled when figured out.

[12:48am] <08@Sygma> Ues Sygma sorry was in chat with another coindev

[12:48am] <08@Sygma> err yes

[12:48am] <08@Linkandzelda> or you simply modify the withdraw system to be semi-automatic, setting all large withdraws to pending for admins ot refill and aprove

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[12:49am] <08@Sygma> All options which will restore customer confidence are on the table.

00[12:49am] <04@Devianttwo> that could be done as well.

[12:49am] <08@Sygma> I do like them all.

00[12:49am] <04@Devianttwo> I would also like to announce

00[12:49am] <04@Devianttwo> As long as Sygma requires my assistance

00[12:49am] <04@Devianttwo> i will be glad to stick around and assist him the best I can.

00[12:50am] <04@Devianttwo> I will no longer be an owner of the site but I will be glad to assist him where it is needed.

[12:50am] <08@Sygma> Thanks your assistance is most welcome.

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[12:50am] <08@OdinYggd> Ready for the next person then?

00[12:50am] <04@Devianttwo> As for activity.

00[12:50am] <04@Devianttwo> Next month I start my new job

[12:50am] <10+hinv> yes

00[12:50am] <04@Devianttwo> so I won't be as active.

[12:50am] <08@Sygma> No not yet

00[12:50am] <04@Devianttwo> but I'll still help when I can.

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[12:51am] <08@Sygma> Alright I have a question for everyone.

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[12:51am] <08@OdinYggd> Should i unmute for a bit then?

[12:51am] <08@OdinYggd> That way people can answer?

[12:51am] <08@Sygma> We need to have a way of incentivizing deposits especially on wallets that are insolvent.

00[12:51am] <04@Devianttwo> I'll unmute for a min once sygma finishes the question.

[12:52am] <08@Sygma> I've done the math. I think we have the ability to pay some amount of interest on the insolvent balances in exchange for real deposits.

[12:52am] <08@Sygma> I am comfortable with the idea. But I want to know how you feel about that.