John Podesta is not just the former chairman of the Hillary Clinton’s presidential campaign, but also a central figure in the ongoing narrative of Russian meddling in the US election of 2016. His hacked emails were at the heart of what some have called a coordinated news campaign led by Wikileaks, and so he met with the House Intelligence panel yesterday behind closed doors.

This morning he appeared on Fox Business to discuss the Russian interference, allegations of collusion with Trump campaign and more with host Maria Bartiromo in what became a testy debate that perfectly exemplifies the divided positions that so many Americans hold right now.

Bartiromo, a long-time New York financial news figure has had something of a close relationship with Donald Trump for years, so it’s not a surprise that she consistently showed skepticism over the Russia claims in a defensive posture. And there may be no other individual (without the Clinton surname) that best embodies the Clinton’s web of influence — for good and bad — than Mr. Podesta.

Bartiromo aggressively attacked Podesta and Democrats for what she said were deeper ties with Russia, specifically asking about Podesta’s investment portfolio.

“Get your facts straight,” the former Clinton campaign chair shot back, before dismissing the FBN hosts claims as coming from a dubious source “like InfoWars.”

It went downhill from there.

Podesta gave as good has he got, successfully pivoting to a specific charge that Trump has appeared to follow the foreign policies of Vladimir Putin in a manner that one doesn’t typically see on a Fox News/Business channel.

It was a fascinating and fiery debate that will likely serve to reaffirm pre-existing political opinions for viewers going in. If you believe Podesta is full of beans, you will see that here. If you believe that Bartiromo is a shill for the Trump administration, there’s that too!

Watch the full segment above, courtesy of FBN.

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