Anonymous asked:

i can’t remember what ingredients were in moon tea, could you talk about them and how it will kill you?

westeroswolf asked:

Is there something poisonous in moon tea? Not that I was planning on visiting Hoster Tully’s tea shop anytime soon :)

Per Lysa Tully, who should know, the ingredients in moon tea are: “tansy and mint and wormwood, a spoon of honey and a drop of pennyroyal.”

Mint is safe. Honey is safe.

Tansy, on the other hand, is toxic as hell, as is pennyroyal. Wormwood is slightly less poisonous, but is toxic in large amounts, attacking the nervous system. Yes, all of these herbs were used for medicine by medieval people and a few rare herbal practitioners today, but they used mercury as a remedy too.

Note, GRRM is aware of the dangerousness of these herbs.

Tansy and pennyroyal are two powerful (and DANGEROUS) natural abortifactants. Carelessly used, however, they can kill, so I was purposely vague and added a few fantasy touches to “moon tea.” I did not want anyone trying them in real life.

So, moon tea is ~fantasy~, but don’t try it at home. And there’s really good reasons for that.

Some info about tansy:

Tansy’s main constitute, thujone is toxic, and very concentrated in the oil. Thujone also has a potent action on the uterus, its a uterine stimulant. Thujone […] is known to be mutagenic, meaning that it disrupts normal DNA and cell replication, causing birth defects. While all abortifacient herbs are dangerous, Tansy is especially toxic. Not to be used by women who normally menstruate heavily, anyone with epilepsy, liver problems, kidney problems, it is also phototoxic (meaning it can make skin extra sensitive to sunlight and may cause burning of the skin, or rash if skin is exposed to the sun). The essential oil should never be taken internally, it is lethal in small amounts. – source

This is a strong herb and it has been known to cause side effects even when used in small amounts, causing temporary lumps in the breasts, can cause women who normally bleed heavily to hemorrhage. And those who’ve had epileptic seizures should not use this or any herb which contains the chemical thujone. – source

Uncontrolled usage of tansy, depending on the quality of the herb, can result in the absorption of thujone in toxic amounts, even at normal dosages. […] There have been reports of deaths in women attempting to use the tea as an abortifacient. Tansy essential oil is poisonous and should not be used under any circumstances. In large doses, Tansy becomes a violent irritant, and induces venous congestion of the abdominal organs. – source

Pennyroyal:

A woman would have to drink enormous quantities of whole herb tea to to stimulate an abortion, so there is little chance of an accidental overdose, however it is still best avoid use while pregnant. Pennyroyal oil, however is extremely toxic, doses a small 1 teaspoon can cause convulsions. Drinking pennyroyal oil in an effort to abort a pregnancy has resulted in death. Never, ever, never take pennyroyal oil internally for any reason. – source

Side effects are; nausea, numbness in extremities, dizziness, sweating. Too much can be highly toxic. Pennyroyal has been used traditionally to induce abortions. However, pennyroyal is dangerous and has led to serious adverse effects and death. The essential oil of pennyroyal should never be used internally even in small amounts it is a deadly poison. Anyone with kidney disease or damage should not use Pennyroyal. –source

(more info on the deadliness of pennyroyal here and here)

Wormwood:

Not for long term use, do not exceed recommended doses, excessive consumption could be toxic. Pregnant women should not take as it can cause uterine contractions. Wormwood can be used in those cases where quick parasite intervention outweighs the risk of toxicity, but with an abundance of caution and care. This is because wormwood contains an assortment of volatile oils, bitter principles and tannins that can be irritating to the kidneys, and in extreme cases may even damage the nervous system. The FDA lists wormwood unsafe for internal use. – source

(some more info about wormwood’s toxicity and danger as an abortifacient here)

And an important note for herbal abortifacients in general:

Abortificants are strong, powerful herbs and should be used only for short periods of time, if used at all; they are hard on the body, they can stress the kidneys and liver and often they will make one feel ill. Many of these herbs are toxic, and are not considered safe to use on a regular basis or for long periods of time. They should not be taken on a monthly basis as a contraceptive. – source





Now, it’s possible that Lysa’s miscarriages and Sweetrobin’s epilepsy were mostly due to Jon Arryn’s age, but you can’t discount the effect the moon tea had on her system. Recall Hoster Tully, in his illness, was raving about tansy and “the blood”, so Lysa almost certainly had a very strong reaction to the moon tea (probably due to the strength needed to induce abortion as opposed to mere contraception), including hemorrhage and perhaps damage to her uterus.

So even with the “it’s ~maaagic~” explanation, whenever I see fics where someone takes moon tea every month (or every time she has sex!), I shudder. I know ficcers (and even GRRM) use it as the equivalent of a birth control pill or a morning-after pill, but I can’t help but think there are long-term medical effects that would be really bad for the character’s health, and perhaps her future fertility or even her children. And believe me, this is not coming from an anti-abortion or anti-birth control standpoint. I’m pro-choice etc., but I’m also pro-science. Even if ASOIAF is basically “lol, science”.

If you really want your female character to have sex without fear of consequences (I have no problem with that), please have the moon tea provided by a maester or wise woman/wood witch, don’t say she’s brewing it herself. Or at least please say she’s been trained in proper preparation and that she has to be careful brewing it. (And of course you don’t have to listen to me, but it would ease my pedantic mind.)

And, please, please, please, no matter what the legal situation is with abortion where you live, don’t ever use these herbs on your own. Especially not in the moon tea recipe.