xTJx Profile Joined May 2014 Brazil 419 Posts #21 Blizzard funds GSL to protect their image, they don't wanna be known as a company that abandons their own games (at least not by people outside SC2 community).



Those who defend them, ignoring all their lies and desiterest towards the community over the last 6 years, are just delusional. No prejudices, i hate everyone equally.

Plexa Profile Blog Joined October 2005 Aotearoa 38208 Posts #22 On December 13 2016 00:38 ihatevideogames wrote:

Why are there so many drones mindlessly defending blizzard?

Especially after the Stork interview, anyone who comes out with comments defending them really seems like either a shill or a total drone.

To be completely fair here, Inven Global have had a number of interviews mis-translated to create controversy in recent memory. For instance, there were a couple of interviews with Korean LoL players mistranslated to inflame east-west tension (and obviously drive traffic to their site). Wouldn't be surprised if the same thing happened here. To be completely fair here, Inven Global have had a number of interviews mis-translated to create controversy in recent memory. For instance, there were a couple of interviews with Korean LoL players mistranslated to inflame east-west tension (and obviously drive traffic to their site). Wouldn't be surprised if the same thing happened here. Administrator ~ Spirit will set you free ~

TheSayo182 Profile Joined September 2012 Italy 235 Posts #23 korean players just should blame themselves for not being attractive to viewers

blizzard should be blamed for not making an interesting game, they are throwing a lot of money here "Remember: Probes & Pylons and when behind Dark Shrine!"

lestye Profile Joined August 2010 United States 3182 Posts #24 On December 13 2016 03:01 Heyoka wrote:

Show nested quote +

On December 13 2016 01:02 opisska wrote:

On December 13 2016 00:07 Pr0wler wrote:

If you really want SSL 2017 then go ahead and fund it with your own money.



This is actually an interesting thought - does anyone have an idea, how much subsidy does such a think need to run - not total cost, but net loss to be covered? This is actually an interesting thought - does anyone have an idea, how much subsidy does such a think need to run - not total cost, but net loss to be covered?



I don't know enough to even speculate but the sponsorship situation in Korea is fairly poor, its fairly barren right now outside of SKT and KT funding teams, so I would guess its pretty close to "taking on the cost of the entire thing."



Wax wrote a nice I don't know enough to even speculate but the sponsorship situation in Korea is fairly poor, its fairly barren right now outside of SKT and KT funding teams, so I would guess its pretty close to "taking on the cost of the entire thing."Wax wrote a nice editorial on this that sums it up better than I can.

I wish everyone on TL could read that article. As much as SC2 is hemorrhaging teams, the sponsorship scene in the esports Mecca of the world is not doing well either. It's not like there's tons of money in other games, including brood war sponsorships which aren't exactly the great looking thing ever. I wish everyone on TL could read that article. As much as SC2 is hemorrhaging teams, the sponsorship scene in the esports Mecca of the world is not doing well either. It's not like there's tons of money in other games, including brood war sponsorships which aren't exactly the great looking thing ever. "You guys are just edgelords. Embrace your inner weeb desu" -Zergneedsfood

FFgringo Profile Joined December 2015 38 Posts #25 We will have 3 seasons of GSL, among other tournaments, with a lot of money given by Blizzard.

That's enough for me to be happy.

Kaizor Profile Joined May 2015 Singapore 891 Posts Last Edited: 2016-12-12 20:07:27 #26 On December 13 2016 03:12 Plexa wrote:

Show nested quote +

On December 13 2016 00:38 ihatevideogames wrote:

Why are there so many drones mindlessly defending blizzard?

Especially after the Stork interview, anyone who comes out with comments defending them really seems like either a shill or a total drone.

To be completely fair here, Inven Global have had a number of interviews mis-translated to create controversy in recent memory. For instance, there were a couple of interviews with Korean LoL players mistranslated to inflame east-west tension (and obviously drive traffic to their site). Wouldn't be surprised if the same thing happened here. To be completely fair here, Inven Global have had a number of interviews mis-translated to create controversy in recent memory. For instance, there were a couple of interviews with Korean LoL players mistranslated to inflame east-west tension (and obviously drive traffic to their site). Wouldn't be surprised if the same thing happened here.



I saw the korean article of stork being interviewed translated into chinese and was going to translate it into english but when i saw that they actually had an official english version of it, i didn't bothered.



Now that you mentioned it, i actually took time to look at their english version and the translated chinese version.





Guess what, in Inven's english version, there was something missing that was in the translated chinese version.



Both versions mentioned something like "In their grand scheme of things, SC2 wasn't the only game out there and didn't need to be. " But Inven's english version stopped at there. The chinese translation had one more line after that, which was "In the end, the problem lies with the players"



Mind you, this was a chinese translation from the original korean article. My chinese is good enough that i can translate the original chinese meaning into english but i cannot guarantee the chinese translation was accurate.



But putting this into context, if you just read the english version, you would have come away with the feeling that stork had some resentment or was putting some blame on blizzard. But when i read the chinese translation, it felt more like he came to realize, maybe grudgingly, it wasn't blizzard or kespa's fault.





Here is the link to the original korean article.



http://sports.news.naver.com/esports/news/read.nhn?oid=442&aid=0000048513



I don't know any korean so mayb seeker or anybody good in it can check and see whether there was this line or something along the line of " In the end, the problem lies with the players "





I think this is rather important because i think people are taking stork's interview as proof that blizzard is at fault/not supportive/lying when it could have been the interview just not translated properly enough.

I saw the korean article of stork being interviewed translated into chinese and was going to translate it into english but when i saw that they actually had an official english version of it, i didn't bothered.Now that you mentioned it, i actually took time to look at their english version and the translated chinese version.Guess what, in Inven's english version, there was something missing that was in the translated chinese version.Both versions mentioned something like "In their grand scheme of things, SC2 wasn't the only game out there and didn't need to be. " But Inven's english version stopped at there. The chinese translation had one more line after that, which was "In the end, the problem lies with the players"Mind you, this was a chinese translation from the original korean article. My chinese is good enough that i can translate the original chinese meaning into english but i cannot guarantee the chinese translation was accurate.But putting this into context, if you just read the english version, you would have come away with the feeling that stork had some resentment or was putting some blame on blizzard. But when i read the chinese translation, it felt more like he came to realize, maybe grudgingly, it wasn't blizzard or kespa's fault.Here is the link to the original korean article.I don't know any korean so mayb seeker or anybody good in it can check and see whether there was this line or something along the line of " In the end, the problem lies with the players "I think this is rather important because i think people are taking stork's interview as proof that blizzard is at fault/not supportive/lying when it could have been the interview just not translated properly enough. Hit me up if you need chinese translations. soO fighting !!

Kaizor Profile Joined May 2015 Singapore 891 Posts Last Edited: 2016-12-12 20:29:56 #27 And I find it ridiculous that people are blaming blizzard for not supporting the Korean scene enough.



What do you expect them to do??



Pay for every single Korean team, coach and player?



Pay for all the tournaments and not just the prize pool, even the administrative and logistical costs?



Let's say they did all that. Are koreans going to go watch SC2 in the thousands? Is SC2 going to be popular in Korea?





Let me give you another example. The football league is doing badly in my country. Dwindling attendence and rather poor support. Players are asked to take pay cuts for the next season. Struggling to get any sponsors or even renewed sponsor from the Main Sponsor.



Following the same logic, FIFA is to blame for it !! FIFA should be showing more support. Paying for the league, the teams. More money !!



See how nonsensical it is now?



If the local scene cannot survive on its own, depending on external support aid or help is never healthy or good for its long term prospects. Furthermore external parties are not obliged to give any f*****g support. And even if FIFA was to start injecting money into my country's football scene. Does it mean my countrymen is going to start going to our stadiums and watch our football league. Sorry still no.



And before anybody brings up Riot's example.



Remember how many fans of LOL there are compared to SC2 fans.



It all boils down to this for these people.



Hey we foreign fans want a Korean scene. Blizzard better do something about it!!



Meanwhile in Korea, the numbers show that just not enough Koreans give a damn about it for there to be a Strong, Healthy, Financially viable SC2 scene.



End of story.



Hit me up if you need chinese translations. soO fighting !!

Gwavajuice Profile Joined June 2014 France 1810 Posts Last Edited: 2016-12-12 20:31:06 #28 Last week, the plans for the 2017 WCS Circuit were announced and with the absence of the SSL, many people were saddened, including ourselves.



The SSL was one of the flagship individual leagues in Korea, and as a major broadcasting company that has operated the SSL for the past two years, we are sorry for what has transpired.



According to the announcement, the 2017 WCS Korea circuit announced that WCS points would only be allocated to the GSL. As such, since the SSL is not designated as a tournament which rewards WCS points, there is little to no point to operate the SSL.



Seriously how can anyone think that this statement is anything but shameless PR BS?



Like, they discovered the 2017 WCS plan last week?



And, because of the fact they saw no SSL in the chart, they can't organize any SSL?



Which is a pity, because they really wanted to organize it and would have, if only Blizzard had allocated some WC S points to the tournament?



Are they really thinking we're that dumb?

Seriously how can anyone think that this statement is anything but shameless PR BS?Like, they discovered the 2017 WCS plan last week?And, because of the fact they saw no SSL in the chart, they can't organize any SSL?Which is a pity, because they really wanted to organize it and would have,S points to the tournament?Are they really thinking we're that dumb? Dear INno and all the former STX boys.

r_gg Profile Joined August 2015 141 Posts Last Edited: 2016-12-12 20:36:23 #29 Sounds like standard PR statement to me tbh. Looks like SPOTV has a better PR crew than OGN.



That said, if Blizz deliberately chose GSL/Afreeca over SSL/SPOTV despite how much SPOTV has done for the scene even in its toughest times, I'll feel really bad for SPOTV. Doubt SPOTV had plans to continue though. Writer

BretZ Profile Joined May 2011 United States 1493 Posts #30 sounds like PR. what if SSL just turns back into a BW show and gains its viewership back

showstealer1829 Profile Blog Joined May 2014 Australia 3100 Posts #31 Yeah, as much as I hate Blizzard's choice in regards to WCS/Region locking and all I don't think this is anything more than PR bullshit. If there was genuine interest from SPO I'm guessing Blizzard would've worked something out, if only to stop people thinking they're continuing to fuck over Korea, which they are but it would've stopped most people thinking that way. There is no understanding. There is only Choya. Choya is the way. Choya is Love. Choya is Life. Has is the Light in the Protoss Dark and Nightmare is his chosen Acolyte

Alexcalibur1996 Profile Joined February 2016 United States 39 Posts #32 I don't really care why but the closure of the SSL is pretty sad. Players used to have 2 chances of achieving titles in a season, if one tournament doesn't go well you can still prepare for the other. Now with that many players and a single tournament to compete in every 3 months or so, the stakes are pretty high. Never play sober.

SLimeSC2 Profile Joined November 2016 20 Posts #33 koreans = no viewers

foreigners = more viewers



im finally starting to understand their logic! why they even bothered to award wcs points for gsl is beyond me. screw em all, i say! viewership > all. agree with blizzard on this one

SLimeSC2 Profile Joined November 2016 20 Posts #34 also i love the wall built to prevent other nationalities from crossing into our wcs system. come through the legal way, get a visa that takes months-years to obtain. the whole thing sounds so familiar....

Cricketer12 Profile Blog Joined May 2012 United States 13100 Posts #35 guys...is this time next year the death of kr sc2? Solemn Strike FTW l SC2 Liquibet Season 17 Winner l I am beyond imagination, succumb to madness.

SLimeSC2 Profile Joined November 2016 20 Posts #36 On December 13 2016 05:27 Kaizor wrote:

And I find it ridiculous that people are blaming blizzard for not supporting the Korean scene enough.



What do you expect them to do??



Pay for every single Korean team, coach and player?



Pay for all the tournaments and not just the prize pool, even the administrative and logistical costs?



Let's say they did all that. Are koreans going to go watch SC2 in the thousands? Is SC2 going to be popular in Korea?





Let me give you another example. The football league is doing badly in my country. Dwindling attendence and rather poor support. Players are asked to take pay cuts for the next season. Struggling to get any sponsors or even renewed sponsor from the Main Sponsor.



Following the same logic, FIFA is to blame for it !! FIFA should be showing more support. Paying for the league, the teams. More money !!



See how nonsensical it is now?



If the local scene cannot survive on its own, depending on external support aid or help is never healthy or good for its long term prospects. Furthermore external parties are not obliged to give any f*****g support. And even if FIFA was to start injecting money into my country's football scene. Does it mean my countrymen is going to start going to our stadiums and watch our football league. Sorry still no.



And before anybody brings up Riot's example.



Remember how many fans of LOL there are compared to SC2 fans.



It all boils down to this for these people.



Hey we foreign fans want a Korean scene. Blizzard better do something about it!!



Meanwhile in Korea, the numbers show that just not enough Koreans give a damn about it for there to be a Strong, Healthy, Financially viable SC2 scene.



End of story.







we can agree that sc2 just isnt going to be as popular as bw in korea, ever.

every korean (except the ones that someone will inevitably say that they know) agrees that bw is a better game than sc2. on top of that for people outside of korea couldnt catch the game until 4am/1am (lets also agree that paywalling their vods was a bad idea.) unless it was a grand finals at most every tournament match that i watched never passed 2k viewers. that amount is a bad day for a pokemon go streamer. the korean scene in sc2 had too high of expectations and couldnt deliver.



i am with you on that, but my problem is shutting out koreans from "World" tournaments. i tell ppl that dont play starcraft about this and they cant understand it and it frustrates them just thinking about it. now imagine how actual pro players feel. at one time being able to travel the world, play ur favorite video game and compete for championships. now they are gridlocked inside an area where too many sharks exist and the pond is waaaay too small. idk about u, but for me that looks like career torture we can agree that sc2 just isnt going to be as popular as bw in korea, ever.every korean (except the ones that someone will inevitably say that they know) agrees that bw is a better game than sc2. on top of that for people outside of korea couldnt catch the game until 4am/1am (lets also agree that paywalling their vods was a bad idea.) unless it was a grand finals at most every tournament match that i watched never passed 2k viewers. that amount is a bad day for a pokemon go streamer. the korean scene in sc2 had too high of expectations and couldnt deliver.i am with you on that, but my problem is shutting out koreans from "World" tournaments. i tell ppl that dont play starcraft about this and they cant understand it and it frustrates them just thinking about it. now imagine how actual pro players feel. at one time being able to travel the world, play ur favorite video game and compete for championships. now they are gridlocked inside an area where too many sharks exist and the pond is waaaay too small. idk about u, but for me that looks like career torture

showstealer1829 Profile Blog Joined May 2014 Australia 3100 Posts #37 On December 13 2016 10:43 SLimeSC2 wrote:

koreans = no viewers

foreigners = more viewers





If you don't count the fact that basically every WCS tournament involving just foreigners (IE: 2016) had less viewers than the ones that had Foreigners and Koreans then yeah

If you don't count the fact that basically every WCS tournament involving just foreigners (IE: 2016) had less viewers than the ones that had Foreigners and Koreans then yeah There is no understanding. There is only Choya. Choya is the way. Choya is Love. Choya is Life. Has is the Light in the Protoss Dark and Nightmare is his chosen Acolyte

Kaizor Profile Joined May 2015 Singapore 891 Posts Last Edited: 2016-12-13 05:14:06 #38 On December 13 2016 10:58 SLimeSC2 wrote:

Show nested quote +

On December 13 2016 05:27 Kaizor wrote:

And I find it ridiculous that people are blaming blizzard for not supporting the Korean scene enough.



What do you expect them to do??



Pay for every single Korean team, coach and player?



Pay for all the tournaments and not just the prize pool, even the administrative and logistical costs?



Let's say they did all that. Are koreans going to go watch SC2 in the thousands? Is SC2 going to be popular in Korea?





Let me give you another example. The football league is doing badly in my country. Dwindling attendence and rather poor support. Players are asked to take pay cuts for the next season. Struggling to get any sponsors or even renewed sponsor from the Main Sponsor.



Following the same logic, FIFA is to blame for it !! FIFA should be showing more support. Paying for the league, the teams. More money !!



See how nonsensical it is now?



If the local scene cannot survive on its own, depending on external support aid or help is never healthy or good for its long term prospects. Furthermore external parties are not obliged to give any f*****g support. And even if FIFA was to start injecting money into my country's football scene. Does it mean my countrymen is going to start going to our stadiums and watch our football league. Sorry still no.



And before anybody brings up Riot's example.



Remember how many fans of LOL there are compared to SC2 fans.



It all boils down to this for these people.



Hey we foreign fans want a Korean scene. Blizzard better do something about it!!



Meanwhile in Korea, the numbers show that just not enough Koreans give a damn about it for there to be a Strong, Healthy, Financially viable SC2 scene.



End of story.







we can agree that sc2 just isnt going to be as popular as bw in korea, ever.

every korean (except the ones that someone will inevitably say that they know) agrees that bw is a better game than sc2. on top of that for people outside of korea couldnt catch the game until 4am/1am (lets also agree that paywalling their vods was a bad idea.) unless it was a grand finals at most every tournament match that i watched never passed 2k viewers. that amount is a bad day for a pokemon go streamer. the korean scene in sc2 had too high of expectations and couldnt deliver.



i am with you on that, but my problem is shutting out koreans from "World" tournaments. i tell ppl that dont play starcraft about this and they cant understand it and it frustrates them just thinking about it. now imagine how actual pro players feel. at one time being able to travel the world, play ur favorite video game and compete for championships. now they are gridlocked inside an area where too many sharks exist and the pond is waaaay too small. idk about u, but for me that looks like career torture we can agree that sc2 just isnt going to be as popular as bw in korea, ever.every korean (except the ones that someone will inevitably say that they know) agrees that bw is a better game than sc2. on top of that for people outside of korea couldnt catch the game until 4am/1am (lets also agree that paywalling their vods was a bad idea.) unless it was a grand finals at most every tournament match that i watched never passed 2k viewers. that amount is a bad day for a pokemon go streamer. the korean scene in sc2 had too high of expectations and couldnt deliver.i am with you on that, but my problem is shutting out koreans from "World" tournaments. i tell ppl that dont play starcraft about this and they cant understand it and it frustrates them just thinking about it. now imagine how actual pro players feel. at one time being able to travel the world, play ur favorite video game and compete for championships. now they are gridlocked inside an area where too many sharks exist and the pond is waaaay too small. idk about u, but for me that looks like career torture



My post above was in relation to how people was blaming blizzard for lesser tournaments in Korea.



With regards to "walling korean players off", i have given this example time and time again. And i believe Blizzard has roughly the same view.



Let me use a real sports as an example. One where sportsmen from a certain country dominate it like Koreans dominate SC2.



Table tennis. If you look at the last olympics, out of all 172 representatives from all the countries taking part in the event, 44 were from chinese born in China, and they represented 21 other countries besides China.



Why do i want to point this out? Because my country benefited the most from this policy of importing Chinese players. Singapore got its first olympic medal in about 50 years when our table tennis team won bronez at the female team event and female Singles. Guess who were the players? Yup, all chinese from china.



When they started this policy of importing chinese players from china, they gave the excuse of it will help improve local player skills by playing and training with them. And back then, there were still some locals in our table tennis teams. That was about 15 years ago.



15 years later?? Every single member on our table tennis team is a chinese from china. There is no local scene to speak of. And i can tell you, majority of my countrymen do not give a shit about their achievements because we know they are just mercenaries paid to win medals for us. And seeing my country's success in winning medals by importing chinese players, other countries follow suit. More and more countries had chinese players playing for them in hope of winning a medal. How ridiculous is it for a chinese player to represent Congo and Qatar in the olympics. You think the majority of the people will feel proud or be interested in such a fake out? There will be no local scene, because just like my country, it is way easier to import a chinese than to invest money in youth, training and development that might not even have results.





So what has all this got to do with SC2? Because the casual crowd just wouldn't be attracted to watch foreign tournaments when they know "Hey, this faceless Korean guy who we know nothing about is just going to win. Whats the point in watching?" That is what people will think. I am not talking about people posting in teamliquid that proclaims they just want to watch the highest level of play.



Blizzard is looking to grow the scene if possible. And you can't generate more interest when Koreans are winning everything.



There have been arguments that Blizzard should be catering to the hardcore dedicated core group of fans that are still around. I am sorry, i just do not agree with that. It just does not make any business sense for them to do that. Big Companies will want to project growth in their projects,they will never say ok let's maintain a stable cliche small group of customers. Especially not Blizzard when they have other stakeholders to answer to for every decision they make.



My post above was in relation to how people was blaming blizzard for lesser tournaments in Korea.With regards to "walling korean players off", i have given this example time and time again. And i believe Blizzard has roughly the same view.Let me use a real sports as an example. One where sportsmen from a certain country dominate it like Koreans dominate SC2.Table tennis. If you look at the last olympics, out of all 172 representatives from all the countries taking part in the event, 44 were from chinese born in China, and they represented 21 other countries besides China.Why do i want to point this out? Because my country benefited the most from this policy of importing Chinese players. Singapore got its first olympic medal in about 50 years when our table tennis team won bronez at the female team event and female Singles. Guess who were the players? Yup, all chinese from china.When they started this policy of importing chinese players from china, they gave the excuse of it will help improve local player skills by playing and training with them. And back then, there were still some locals in our table tennis teams. That was about 15 years ago.15 years later?? Every single member on our table tennis team is a chinese from china. There is no local scene to speak of. And i can tell you, majority of my countrymen do not give a shit about their achievements because we know they are just mercenaries paid to win medals for us. And seeing my country's success in winning medals by importing chinese players, other countries follow suit. More and more countries had chinese players playing for them in hope of winning a medal. How ridiculous is it for a chinese player to represent Congo and Qatar in the olympics. You think the majority of the people will feel proud or be interested in such a fake out? There will be no local scene, because just like my country, it is way easier to import a chinese than to invest money in youth, training and development that might not even have results.So what has all this got to do with SC2? Because the casual crowd just wouldn't be attracted to watch foreign tournaments when they know "Hey, this faceless Korean guy who we know nothing about is just going to win. Whats the point in watching?" That is what people will think. I am not talking about people posting in teamliquid that proclaims they just want to watch the highest level of play.Blizzard is looking to grow the scene if possible. And you can't generate more interest when Koreans are winning everything.There have been arguments that Blizzard should be catering to the hardcore dedicated core group of fans that are still around. I am sorry, i just do not agree with that. It just does not make any business sense for them to do that. Big Companies will want to project growth in their projects,they will never say ok let's maintain a stable cliche small group of customers. Especially not Blizzard when they have other stakeholders to answer to for every decision they make. Hit me up if you need chinese translations. soO fighting !!

showstealer1829 Profile Blog Joined May 2014 Australia 3100 Posts Last Edited: 2016-12-13 05:31:12 #39 On December 13 2016 14:11 Kaizor wrote:

So what has all this got to do with SC2? Because the casual crowd just wouldn't be attracted to watch foreign tournaments when they know "Hey, this faceless Korean guy who we know nothing about is just going to win. Whats the point in watching?" That is what people will think. I am not talking about people posting in teamliquid that proclaims they just want to watch the highest level of play.



Again if that was true why was almost EVERY WCS tournament this year with the Korean Ban, where this mythical "Casual viewer who doesn't want to see a "Faceless Korean guys we know nothing about" win" should be coming out in droves down in viewers on the previous year? I'm talking about in what they replaces the WCS leagues and that. In some cases it was 3-1 down. In some cases we had GRAND FINALS down in viewership on a Ro32 stream in the WCS league from the previous year.



The "Casual Viewer" defense is as much of a myth as the "WCS 2016 Global Event" at the moment. Again if that was true why was almost EVERY WCS tournament this year with the Korean Ban, where this mythical "Casual viewer who doesn't want to see a "Faceless Korean guys we know nothing about" win" should be coming out in droves down in viewers on the previous year? I'm talking about in what they replaces the WCS leagues and that. In some cases it was 3-1 down. In some cases we had GRAND FINALS down in viewership on a Ro32 stream in the WCS league from the previous year.The "Casual Viewer" defense is as much of a myth as the "WCS 2016 Global Event" at the moment. There is no understanding. There is only Choya. Choya is the way. Choya is Love. Choya is Life. Has is the Light in the Protoss Dark and Nightmare is his chosen Acolyte

Seeker Profile Blog Joined April 2005 Where dat snitch at? 33624 Posts Last Edited: 2016-12-13 18:56:28 #40 EDIT: I will retract this statement because I do not wish for anymore drama to take place because of it. Moderator PM me if you want translations done | twitch.tv/dankshrine Weekly SC2 Podcast!

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