DouglasCole Doctor of GURPS Ballistics



Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Burnsville, MN

Re: Telekinesis and Moving Vehicles Question Quote: whswhs Originally Posted by But the shove rules on p. B372 don't specify how much weight you can shove, or how much you can change the velocity of the target, or how much collision damage your shove can stop.



You do thrust/crush doubled for a two-armed TK shove. At ST 31, that's equivalent to 6d+2.



For Knockback (p. 378), you'd either need to calculate the ST of the car, or use HP (depending on if you decide the car is "resisting"). This was given as ST/HP of 50, the same in either case.



Every 48 points of shove damage (by a literal interpretation of the rules with ST-2), or perhaps as low as 40 points (80%, or the equiv of ST-2 on a ST 10 person) would shove the car back one hex. Max shove damage is 38 points; you basically can't affect the car, which given ST 31 vs ST 50, is probably not too far wrong. If you roll a critical hit on the shove, you might get a damage multiple, which might double or triple that value, perhaps allowing you to move the car one or two hexes.



Point is, shoving is a perfectly valid thing to do with TK, and the rules for a TK shove are not at all different than any other kind of shove. This is precisely the same as a ST 31 superhero or robot shoving the car with two hands.



That the shove rules might not scale well or be easy to adjudicate in this case applies generically (and I don't disagree that it's odd); but TK is very straightforward in how it's applied.



Looking at it another way, car tires will often hold the road against anywhere from 0.5 to over 0.9 gravities of acceleration. For the car, which itself weighs 2300 lbs, that's about 1200-2300lbs of lateral resistance to shoves. The grip of the tires themselves is stronger, almost certainly, than the maximum force our shover can exert, so my analysis above (shoving won't do much) and the force comparison above (shoving won't do much) produce the same result. No, the shove rules say how much knockback you can inflict on a target.You do thrust/crush doubled for a two-armed TK shove. At ST 31, that's equivalent to 6d+2.For Knockback (p. 378), you'd either need to calculate the ST of the car, or use HP (depending on if you decide the car is "resisting"). This was given as ST/HP of 50, the same in either case.Every 48 points of shove damage (by a literal interpretation of the rules with ST-2), or perhaps as low as 40 points (80%, or the equiv of ST-2 on a ST 10 person) would shove the car back one hex. Max shove damage is 38 points; you basically can't affect the car, which given ST 31 vs ST 50, is probably not too far wrong. If you roll a critical hit on the shove, you might get a damage multiple, which might double or triple that value, perhaps allowing you to move the car one or two hexes.Point is, shoving is a perfectly valid thing to do with TK, and the rules for a TK shove arethan any other kind of shove. This is precisely the same as a ST 31 superhero or robot shoving the car with two hands.That the shove rules might not scale well or be easy to adjudicate in this case applies generically (and I don't disagree that it's odd); but TK is very straightforward in how it's applied.Looking at it another way, car tires will often hold the road against anywhere from 0.5 to over 0.9 gravities of acceleration. For the car, which itself weighs 2300 lbs, that's about 1200-2300lbs of lateral resistance to shoves. The grip of the tires themselves is stronger, almost certainly, than the maximum force our shover can exert, so my analysis above (shoving won't do much) and the force comparison above (shoving won't do much) produce the same result.

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