HBO BROADCAST TRANSCRIPT

April 15, 2005

Episode #308



“REAL TIME WITH BILL MAHER”



BILL MAHER



THOMAS FRIEDMAN

(via satellite)

DAVID FRUM

NATALIE MAINES

Gen. WESLEY CLARK

Sen. BARBARA BOXER

(via satellite)



All “Real Time with Bill Maher” transcripts are prepared immediately following the initial HBO broadcast. Due to the speed with which these transcripts are prepared, complete accuracy cannot be guaranteed.



[COLD OPEN: MOCK POLITICAL AD FOR TOM DELAY]

ANNOUNCER: For over 20 years, Tom DeLay has been fighting for you. But now, he’s fighting for his life against the sleazy, liberal attack machine. Tom’s not giving up, but he needs your help. If you share his values, take $20,000 in cash, place half of it in an envelope and send it to “American’s For Tribal Gaming Rights.” [laughter] Now, take the remaining money and split it into two piles. Send half to “Trident Golf Holidays.” [laughter]

Now, get to a landline, then call this number: 1-800-555-3687. When a woman’s voice answers, hang up. [laughter] Put the rest of the money in a bag and drive to the Washington Monument. [laughter] Place the bag in the east trashcan. [laughter] Then walk away slowly. It’s your way of saying, “Thanks, Tom, for cleaning up Washington!” [laughter] Paid for by some Russian guys. [laughter] [applause]



[OPENING CREDITS]

[applause] [cheers] [standing ovation]

BILL MAHER: Thank you very much. Thank you. You’re very kind. Stop. Thank you. Thank you very much. Please, we’ve got a big show. Thank you, I know why you’re happy: it’s tax day. [laughter] Why would they be happy?

But you know Americans, I tell you. It’s not really tax day. Listen to this: the IRS says that they have – they are expecting over nine million extensions. [laughter] And I don’t mean the hair kind. In fact, over at Britney Spears’ house, she said to her husband, “We’re going to be late.” And he said, “You mean you’re pregnant again?” [laughter] [applause] He’s – he’s stupid! [laughter]

Well, President Bush filed. Boy, he’s paying $207K. Wow. Of course, President Bush’s tax return, a little different. He claims the Christian right as dependents. [laughter] He declared the 2000 election as a gift. [laughter] [applause] [cheers] And he tried to write off all the mileage he got out of 9/11. [laughter] [applause]

He had a busy week, the President. He threw out the first pitch at the Washington Nationals game. Washington, D.C., has baseball again. I think that’s terrific. Of course, it’s a little different there. Their scoreboard also keeps track of Tom DeLay’s ethics violations. [laughter] And when an ump makes a bad call, the people chant, “Judicial activist! Judicial activist!” [laughter] [applause]

Well, as if it’s not bad enough that it was tax day, President Bush says he is anxious to sign the bankruptcy reform bill, which makes it a lot harder for Americans who are in financial trouble to get help. But the President says, we Americans, we’ve got to learn a little fiscal discipline. [laughter] I’m serious. He says, as a young man, he only carried one credit card, and that was just to chop up the blow. [laughter] [applause] [cheers] I kid the – oh, I kid the President. He knows that. [laughter]

Actually, I found out this week, we have something in common. Again, me and the President. We both are paranoid about computers. He will not use email, he said, won’t even send correspondence to his daughters because he’s afraid it’ll get public. Think of that, he’s the President of the United States, and if he wants to find out what his kids are up to, he’s got to download pictures on the Internet like everybody else. [laughter] [applause]

Now, over in Rome, the College of Cardinals have started their deliberations. Are you excited to see—[audience reacts]—yeah, who’s the next pope. So they have – I love this – they have moved into a temporary residence hall. It’s like “The Real World.” [laughter] And I think they’ve got a good mix. They’ve got the pretty boy; they’ve got a jock in there; they’ve got a nerd; they’ve got the black guy, and they’ve got the cardinal who doesn’t realize he’s gay. [laughter] [applause] They might have a couple of those.

Now, in a surprise move – wow, we were all surprised about this – the FDA has voted to lift the ban on silicone breast implants. Big news here in California. [applause] [cheers] Yeah, an FDA spokesman said it was a matter of weighing the possible health risks—[laughter]—of the implants against the fact that it makes your tits bigger. [laughter]

So…yeah, there were two big arguments—[a lone laugh]—against the – yeah, you’re right, two big ones for, I didn’t think of that. [laughter] Two big ones against them: one, the cost. But of course the cost of the silicone implants is offset by the fact that if you get them, you never have to pay for your own drinks. [laughter] [applause] So, over a lifetime, that does work out. And two, though, that they are prone to rupture. There is actually a warning label on the new ones that says, “Caution: Don’t get your tits in a wringer.” [laughter] [applause]

All right, we – we have a classy show. Don’t go by this. We’ve got General Wesley Clark. [applause] [cheers] We’ve got Natalie Maines from The Dixie Chicks. He have Mr. David Frum, and a little later, I’ll be speaking with Senator Barbara Boxer. [applause] But first up, he is a three-time Pulitzer Prize-winning – wow! – columnist for the New York Times. His latest book is The World is Flat. The always on the money, Mr. Thomas Friedman. Tom. [applause] [cheers]

THOMAS FRIEDMAN [via satellite]: Hey, Bill.

MAHER: How are you?

FRIEDMAN: Great to be with you.

MAHER: You’re all right?

FRIEDMAN: I’m okay.

MAHER: Now, are you actually in Washington? I see the Capitol behind you. Or did somebody just put a picture of that in your apartment?

FRIEDMAN: I am actually in the nation’s capital.

MAHER: That must feel good. You spend a lot of time on the road in shitholes. [laughter] [Friedman laughs] You must have a high tolerance for crummy hotels.

FRIEDMAN: I do.

MAHER: Yeah, that’s why when you write something, I give it special credence, because you actually go there. A lot of blowhards just write from here, or speak from here, like me. [laughter]

FRIEDMAN: Well, it’s a bad habit I have.

MAHER: Yeah. So, you know, you must feel pretty good these days. You’re one of the guys who said, look, this plan of George Bush’s to go to the Middle East, no matter how badly it was executed, it could work. And now we’ve seen a lot of stuff that’s positive: the election in Iraq, Lebanon, all these things have happened. My question to you is, is the genie really out of the bottle now? Is this freedom-and-democracy-thing in the Middle East, is there no turning back?

FRIEDMAN: Well, there is turning back, Bill. But I do think, I would say, if you look at Iraq, Egypt, Israel, Palestine and Lebanon, what you see is a lot of the necessary things for this democratization movement to get going have really happened. The elections in Iraq, the Syrians getting out of Lebanon, elections among Palestinians and Israel getting out of the Gaza Strip.

But what hasn’t happened yet is what you’d say is sufficient. And the sufficient thing in Iraq is that Iraqis be able to sustain this democracy without 140,000 American troops. And that’s when I would do my victory lap, when we see that we can pull back and that this horizontal dialogue that the Iraqis have engaged in – and it is really important, and it’s really unique – that it can stand on its own two feet. We’re not there yet, but it’s heading in the right direction. And that’s a good thing. It’s a good thing for them.

MAHER: Yeah, it’s enough to hope.

FRIEDMAN: Yeah.

MAHER: It’s enough so that cynics like you and me can go, “Yeah, it might work--”

FRIEDMAN: Yeah, I mean, you know—

MAHER: “—fuckers.” [laughter]

FRIEDMAN: --my colleague, Bill Safire, said to me a month ago, he said, “Hey, you should write a column saying ‘I told you so.’” I said, “Bill, I’ve got to tell you something. I’m just glad to be standing. I’m just glad to be vertical, okay? That after hoping that this would be the outcome for a couple years, and waking up every morning and seeing car bomb after car bomb, and worrying that – wow! – you know, if I supported something that’s been a disaster – I’m just thrilled. I’m thrilled for America. This is a good thing if this works.

You know, Bill, for all these years, we’ve treated the Arab world as kind of just a collection of big gas stations. And all we cared was that the pump was open, the price was low and they’d be nice to the Jews.

MAHER: Right.

FRIEDMAN: And basically, we said, if you do those three things—

MAHER: Well, two out of three ain’t bad, huh? [laughter]

FRIEDMAN: That’s right. [laughs] [applause]

MAHER: But I know where you’re going, yeah.

FRIEDMAN: Yeah, we said, if you do those three things, you can do whatever you want out back, basically. Treat your women however you want.

MAHER: Right.

FRIEDMAN: You know, preach against us, whatever you want. Write in your newspapers whatever lies you want. And basically, on 9/11, we got hit with everything going on out back.

MAHER: Right.

FRIEDMAN: And somehow, some way, we had – we had to create a different context out there. We had to help them create a different context.

MAHER: Now, I have to say I read in one of your columns this week, you said that – what Bush has been saying all along – which was that “we’re fighting them there so we don’t have to fight them here.” And I always thought this is really one of the stupider things he’s said. And that’s saying a lot. [laughter] I mean, that’s close to, “They hate us for our freedom.”

FRIEDMAN: Right.

MAHER: That somehow Iraq was some sort of Roach Motel for terrorists. That, you know, we would get them there and don’t have to fight them here. But in your last column, you say, well, that’s actually what’s going on. And I don’t get that. You’re going to have explain that one to me. Why the terrorists can’t do both.

FRIEDMAN: Well, basically, what their real goal is, Bill, the most important thing from their point of view is to defeat us in the heart of their world. That is what would really give them a huge resonance on the Arab street and in the region. If they could put the American Army, you know, to rout in the heart of their world, that would put every Arab leader on the defensive.

MAHER: Okay, that’s what I don’t understand. Why is it not more important to them to have a victory in the heart of our world?

FRIEDMAN: Because, you know, first of all, 9/11 – and I don’t mean this – it set the bar so high, that, you know, i.e., what could they do that would have a bigger bang than 9/11? I mean, God forbid, number one. But, number two, it just wouldn’t have the impact. So they set off a car bomb – God forbid, you know – in Las Vegas or something like that. Yeah, you know, for a day or two, everyone will chatter about it. But it’s not something that would put the Arab leaders – and remember, they want to take over their world, first of all. That’s what they’re about. That’s their objective.

And defeating us, who is perceived as the prop of all these regimes out there, that is what would really advance their agenda.

MAHER: But maybe they’re not hitting us again just because they don’t have the people to do it? Is that possible? That they used up a lot of their suicide bombers? [laughter] I think the Arabs like us – you would know this better than I – but I think the Arabs like us to think that they’re crazier than they are. I think that works for them. You know, like Saddam, he was going to have – you know, he liked the fact that we thought he had nuclear weapons. And that he found an administration stupid enough to believe it. [laughter] [applause] They’re not really as crazy as they pretend, are they?

FRIEDMAN: Well, you know, what worries me, Bill, is you look at what’s going on in Iraq over the last six months, the number of suicide bombers, we’re talking about probably close to 300 people. Now, you could argue that, you know, with Israelis and Palestinians, 37 years of Israeli occupation made Palestinians crazy, et cetera. But now, in Iraq, they’re getting these guys off the shelf, Bill. They’re able to actually recruit these people and deploy them tactically. That’s disturbing. There are way, way too many people volunteering for this. And I don’t think we fully really know what we’re up against in that sense.

MAHER: All right, let me ask you about your new book, because I read the excerpt in the New York Times Book Review. I think it’s fascinating. And you say there is a looming crisis coming because America needs to wake up to the fact that we are now competing against the whole world. That’s your thesis, that the “world is flat,” that we didn’t used to have to compete against China, India, Russia, Eastern Europe, Latin America. Now we’re competing against the whole world, and we are losing. And part of the reason is the dirty little secret, is that companies here want to outsource not just because it’s cheaper, but because the workers over there are smarter and have a better attitude.

FRIEDMAN: Well, there’s – there’s a lot of truth to this. China and India are not racing us to the bottom. They’re racing us to the top. I mean, you know, if you had a choice 35 years ago, Bill, to be a B+ student in Los Angeles or a genius in Bangalore, India, you would choose to be a B+ student in Los Angeles. Your life choices and opportunities would be so much better. Today, you do not want to be a B+ student in Los Angeles, because that genius in Bangalore, in a flat world, can plug-and-play, compete and collaborate more directly with you or your kids than ever before.

MAHER: So what is – what is the root problem here? Why can’t we defeat them on their own terms? And what is your assessment of why our educational system is where it is?

FRIEDMAN: Well, you know, basically, what we did – you know, President Kennedy inspired a whole generation of scientists and engineers to go into those fields, with the moon shot. And that generation, basically, is dying off and retiring. Now, we filled in the gap with Indians and Chinese and other foreigners all these years. Two things have happened, though, in the last few years. But one is that when the world went flat, you could innovate without having to emigrate. So you don’t need to come here. You can stay home, eat curry, wear a sari, live in an extended family and really be a big-time innovator, number one.

And number two, 9/11 happened, and we told all these people, “No, no, no, we don’t want the first-round intellectual draft choices of the world. Please stay home.” You know, I mean, if your name is Muhammad, sorry, I mean, don’t even think about. [laughter]

So as a result, we’ve got a real gap. And unfortunately, if you look at the international testing comparisons of our schools, you know, by fourth grade, our American kids are ahead in math and science. By the time they’re in eighth grade, they’re about even. And by the time they’re in twelfth grade, they’re behind. They’re getting dumber the longer they’re in school! [laughter] [applause] And that’s a bad trend.

MAHER: Yeah. I noticed that when the fast food restaurants stopped having numbers on the cash register. They only have pictures of the food. [laughter] All right, Thomas Friedman, I thank you for being here. Get a good night’s sleep! [applause] [cheers] In your own bed.

FRIEDMAN: Always a pleasure.

MAHER: You deserve it. All right, let’s meet our panel, everybody. [applause] [cheers] All right, here they are. First up, he is a former assistant to President Bush, who is now a contributing editor at The National Review, whose latest book is An End to Evil: How to Win the War on Terror. From the inner circles of the Bush White House, Mr. David Frum. David, how are you? Good to see you.

DAVID FRUM: Thanks for having me. [applause]

MAHER: [to audience] Come on, you blue-staters! Give him a round of applause. These bastards won’t give it up.

She’s the Grammy-winning guitarist and lead singer, George Bush’s favorite Dixie Chick, Natalie Maines. [applause] [cheers] How are you doing?

NATALIE MAINES: I’m good.

MAHER: And of course, this guy over here, a four-star general, the Supreme Allied Commander of NATO, this close to being president, Mr. Wesley Clark – General Wesley Clark! [applause] [cheers] Okay, so I have a lot of questions about what’s going on here in America, but first I want to ask one question about overseas, because there is a genocide going on in Sudan.

And as a person with a TV show and a soapbox, who – I feel like I should should mention every once in a while—[to Clark]—and you’re a good guy to mention it to, because I want to know, okay, there’s a genocide going on here. There was one going on in Kosovo in 1998. Back then, we made the decision, all right, we’re not going to send troops; we know the public wouldn’t stand for that; but we’re going to bomb the bad guys into submission. Why don’t we do that over there in Africa? I don’t understand why we can’t do what we did in Kosovo, in Darfur, Sudan.

Gen. WESLEY CLARK: Well, we need to put troops in there and secure those people. This has gone on too long.

MAHER: Why? We didn’t – come on, you can’t stop the bad guys with bombing? These guys are on horseback, with a shotgun, raping—

CLARK: Bill, I’m an Army guy, okay. I never – we did bombing because it was the only thing we could get through—

MAHER: [overlapping] And it worked!

CLARK: [overlapping]—a Republican-dominated Congress.

MAHER: But it worked.

CLARK: It worked because we had a ground plan behind it. And we beat Milosevic’s will.

MAHER: I think it also worked because people on the ground don’t like it when bombs fall on them. [laughter] I mean, I’m not an Army guy, but that’s just—[laughter]—from the outside. Sometimes an outsider can see these things. [applause]

CLARK: I’m a military guy.

MAHER: I know.

CLARK: And what I would tell you is, if you want to stop this, that you’ve got to make a national commitment that you’re going to stop it. If you want to start with a couple of bombs, fine. But if that doesn’t stop it, you’ve got to go ahead and put the troops in there. We should have done this. We’ve got another genocide on our hands in Darfur. [applause] And there’s no excuse for it. We know better.

MAHER: I think it was Mr. Christoff, in the New York Times, who said it right. He said, “Boy, you’ve got to have pretty big balls, as George Bush does, to go around talking about a ‘culture of life’ while a genocide is going on that you’re not stopping.” [applause] I mean, what does your boy say about that, Dave?

FRUM: Well, he says this is not just – he says he’s not the mad bomber that he’s made out to be. This is a political problem, too. And there’s some not very cooperative friends. And there is a government in Sudan—

MAHER: Wait a second. When did we ever need friends? Remember, we’re the go-it-alone people. We’re the—

FRUM: That’s – but that’s not true. I mean, you can’t—

MAHER: Come on.

FRUM: --no, you’re—

MAHER: But if we wanted to stop it.

FRUM: You’re believing the President’s reviews, not what the President actually says. And he’s always been—

MAHER: [overlapping] No, it’s what he does I’m interested in.

FRUM: --he’s always been emphatic about how a lot of these things, you need friends, and he wanted friends in everything he’s had to do.

MAHER: Wait.

FRUM: And here in Darfur, we have political problems. We have a lot of European countries that have interests in the Sudanese regime.

MAHER: But—

FRUM: And – and we also have the ability to put political pressure on that regime to make it – to bend its will.

MAHER: But he interrupted his whole life to get that feeding tube back into one starving person. [applause] Because, God forbid, that woman who was dead 15 years ago should pass away, you know, again. But here, I mean, it is a genocide. It just would seem that people who are that concerned about life would get in the game on this one.

FRUM: You know, I sometimes wonder how he’s ever going to win with you, Bill, because when he intervenes—[laughter]—when he intervenes to protect people in Kurdistan and Southern Iraq, that’s bad.]

MAHER: Hey.

FRUM: When he doesn’t intervene militarily in order to—

MAHER: Dave.

FRUM: --in order to – in Sudan, that’s also bad.

MAHER: I’ve been giving – you know, I’ve been giving your boy props on Iraq lately, so—[laughter]

CLARK: I’d like to talk to you about that.

MAHER: Yeah, I know you would. [laughter] [applause] [cheers] I want to ask – but – okay, but we’ll get into it. The President was at Fort Hood, that’s in Texas, right, this week. Okay. And I have to say, when you see him with the troops, they love him. And they don’t love ever Commander in Chief. They didn’t like Clinton. And he [Bush] treats them so badly! It’s like a dysfunctional relationship. [laughter] It’s like the troops are the battered wife. The worse he treats them – he doesn’t give them their armor. I mean, the list goes on and on. [laughter] The worse he treats them, the more they love him. What is up with that?

FRUM: Maybe they know something about him. Maybe they know best. Maybe they’re the best judges—[scornful laughter from audience]—of what they believe in and what they admire. [voices of dissent from audience] Well, there are people here who don’t think they know best. But maybe they do. And what they see in this President is somebody who honors what they have done.

The military life, as General Clark knows, is a life about honor, it’s about commitment, and they look to this President and they see somebody – this is someone who understands us, thinks about the world the way we do, and appreciates what we’ve done. [laughter]

MAINES: I think it is – I think it is about, you know, a war going on. And I would think if you’re over there risking your life, you have to find something that you believe you’re risking your life for. I think it would be very hard to be over there and just be totally disgruntled. [applause] And you have a very real possibility of dying. So I would think that these people, and people – the families who are here – I would think that you try and find something to support because you’re crossing your fingers that something is good – something good is going to happen from it, and that your family member is going to come home.

MAHER: Yeah, I think that’s probably an interesting and accurate appraisal of why they do it, because I can’t figure anything else out. Because they don’t have the armor they need. If a soldier is killed, his wife and kids have 180 days to leave government military housing, and then, “Here’s your flag; don’t let the door hit you in the ass.” [laughter]

MAINES: Bush hasn’t been to one funeral. People aren’t allowed to see these people—

MAHER: Right.

FRUM: [overlapping] Sorry, Bush has not been—

MAINES: --with caskets coming home.

FRUM: [overlapping] Bush has not been – Bush has not been photographed, because he doesn’t seek publicity at these things. [audience scoffs/laughter]

MAHER: [laughs] He doesn’t seek publicity?! Oh, come on.

FRUM: He – he has spent – he has spent dozens – dozens of hours with the—

MAHER: Yes, he—

FRUM: --wounded—

MAHER: --and the widows. [laughter]

FRUM: --and he meets with people—

MAHER: No, he does.

FRUM: He does, he does.

MAHER: There was an article in the Washington Post yesterday. He met with this widow – and by the way, she gave him a bit of an earful. She was talking about the fact that he signed this bill that added an extra $250 per dependent child – wow, can you spare it? [laughter]

However, the fine print said the effective date wasn’t until January 1st of this year, so anyone who died before January 1st in this year, didn’t get it. And she said, “I know that he doesn’t understand everything that he signs.” [laughter] [applause] [cheers] This is what she said. “And that there’s so many bills out there.” You know, I mean, come on. The stop-loss, you know, these people have – their gig is up and they keep them on—

FRUM: The Congress of the United States, signed by the President, almost unanimously, massive increase in all kinds of benefits for those killed and wounded, which there are too many of.

MAHER: Twelve thousand is what they get.

FRUM: But this – the suggestion that—

MAHER: The people in the World Trade Center got $1.65 million.

FRUM: The suggestion – the suggestion that this President does not – or that any President – doesn’t feel it, when he looks people in the eye. I mean—

MAHER: He does. I agree.

FRUM: That is the worst part of the job. And it’s the part of the job that he seeks out.

MAHER: But – but you are what you do. It’s about actions. Okay, let me ask you—

CLARK: Could I just say something here?

MAHER: Yes.

CLARK: A little bit on behalf of the men and women in uniform. First of all, they – they have to be loyal to the orders and to the person of the Commander in Chief.

MAHER: It’s different than liking him. They like him.

CLARK: Listen, I watched them like Bill Clinton. Yes, I did.

MAHER: Really?

CLARK: Absolutely. [applause] I was there with Bill Clinton when he was with the troops. They responded to him very, very warmly. Don’t you believe otherwise. There has been a long-term play to undercut the authority of the Democratic Party within the armed forces. Actually, the Democrats did it to themselves with Vietnam. But I can tell you the names of senators who came to me when I was on active duty and suggested to me that, “Gee, you must really have a hard time working, you know, in your job.” I said, “What do you mean?” They said, “You know, for – you know, with – you know, with who’s Commander in Chief.”

MAHER: Yeah.

CLARK: I said, “No, I don’t understand exactly what you’re saying. Would you explain that again, please?” They wanted me to tell them why I didn’t want to be loyal to the Commander in Chief. When you’re in the United States armed forces, you’re loyal to the Commander in Chief no matter what party he’s from.

MAHER: Right.

CLARK: That’s the duty of every American in uniform. [applause]

FRUM: The soldiers – the U.S. military does vote very, very heavily Republican.

MAHER: Yes.

FRUM: And it would probably be a good thing if it didn’t vote so heavily Republican, even though it would cost us maybe a point or two. Because the Army ought to be the Army of the whole nation. But instead of asking why are these soldiers so brainwashed that they – they support one party and not another, I think what Democrats in particular ought to look at their own party and say, “What is it about the Democratic Party that makes it so difficult for them to connect – connect with the men and women in uniform?” Vietnam was a long time ago. I agree it’s an important part of the story. But for the people who are serving their today who weren’t born during Vietnam, it can’t be the answer. There has to be a deeper cause.

MAHER: All right, let me ask you about this Sergeant Robert Stout. He is the first one I’m aware of anyway, he got a Purple Heart; he’s gay. He’s one of – they estimate – 65,000 gay people serving in our military. And he says he will not go back unless he can serve openly. And I say, “You go, girl.” [laughter] [applause] Because it is – this “don’t ask, don’t tell,” it’s archaic, is it not? It’s stupid at this point. It’s 2005. What are we making our soldiers be actors for? Because you have to be an actor.

FRUM: You know, there’s the disconnect in my last question to you, when I said Democrats need to think about why they don’t culturally connect with the military, to look at the Army and to say, “What we see here is an opportunity for some interesting social experiments. And maybe this is a good idea. Maybe it’s a good idea. The people there don’t seem to think so but they’re probably wrong because they’re not as forward-looking as the rest of us. And so – and so this is going to be our top military priority.” And that is part of the cultural gap. It’s not good for the country. I can’t believe it’s good for the Army, either.

MAHER: Really?

CLARK: Well, hang on a second. [applause] I mean, first of all, the United States Army needs the support of every American today. My Army friends will tell you that what’s happened is the Army is 100% committed to the war, but the country is not 100% to the Army. So we missed our recruiting objective by about 1,000 in February. By about 3,000 in March. We’re not going to buy people back in. We need to support the United States Army if we want to keep a volunteer force. I think that’s the first priority. So I think we ought to be looking at the men and women across America—

MAHER: [overlapping] But what about the gay ones?

CLARK: --and we ought to be coming—

MAINES: [overlapping] I think it’s ridiculous that that’s – that’s a law or a rule, that it’s official. I mean, to me, if someone wants to say, “I’m gay,” then they can definitely say that. I think they might have a really hard time on their hands.

MAHER: I think they have a hard time, because, as I said, you have to do an acting job. You have to be a soldier on one hand – because, let’s face it, when you’re in the Army, it’s not a nine-to-five job. These guys are on top of each other 24/7. [laughter] [applause]

FRUM: They’re your audience.

MAHER: You know what I’m saying. So, on top of being a soldier, you know, when the guys – “hey, we’re going out to the bar to look at some girls,” the guy has to be an actor and go, “Oh, yes, let me come, too.” [laughter] [applause] That is wrong, to make a soldier – why shouldn’t – but, you know, what do you mean, “disconnect”?

CLARK: I agree with you.

MAHER: Thank you.

CLARK: On that. I think the “don’t ask, don’t tell” needs to be re-looked and reworked. But here’s my point: that right now, with the United States Army, we’re mostly – and especially it’s the Army that’s taken the brunt of it in Iraq – we’ve got men and women going back on their third combat tour. The Army is 60-65% married. We’re in a period – it’s like two fighter planes dueling – we’re after the insurgents, and we’re taking out the insurgents in Iraq, and we’re losing recruiting appeal in the American public because they see the casualties and because they see the extended family separations. So, you know, I agree with everything you’re saying about, this is not right, people shouldn’t have to be somebody that they’re not. But we’ve got to pull the country together here and support the armed forces.

MAHER: Yeah, but why shouldn’t gay people serve? They can’t do that job?

FRUM: Well, certainly the consensus of most military leaders, including General Powell, that it would be bad for Army – Army discipline, to introduce this into—

MAHER: It works in other countries. They don’t have a problem.

CLARK: David, that’s about ten or 12 years out of date.

MAHER: Yeah, I think—

CLARK: People have changed. [applause] I know that’s hard to conceive, but that is out of date.

FRUM: You know, I – to my – anyway, to my way of thinking when I look at these problems, the one that sort of strikes me most is the – and I think you’ve talked about this before – is the problem of the translators. And that is a vexing one, where you’ve had people who have language skills, which the United States badly needs and lacks, and who are not in small – who are not on the front lines, who are not in small units. And it’s a little hard to explain why that can’t – why the Army can’t accommodate that.

But it raises some of the questions that Donald Rumsfeld has been asking: does everything that the military does need to be done by people in uniform? And there are a lot of services that maybe you could think of new ways of approaching that would sort of mitigate this problem and take some of the passion out of it.

MAHER: [laughs] So you mean we use the gay people to decorate and things like that? [laughter] Okay, all right. [laughs]

MAINES: I approve of lesbians.

MAHER: Yeah, who doesn’t?

MAINES: They’re strong.

MAHER: I know I do. All right, so in an effort to connect here with the people who I apparently don’t connect with, I watched this show, “Revelations.” Have you seen – it was the big NBC – I guess it’s a miniseries.

CLARK: No.

MAHER: It’s about the end of the world. I found it very disturbing, because they give credence to the idea in the Bible that actually the world is going to end pretty quickly. You know, Jesus is going to come down. And, of course, it did well. And whatever does well in television gets imitated. I can’t believe how quickly some of the other stations have picked up some of these Christian-chic pilots. But look over here. [slides shown with titles] On CBS, they have one coming on called, “CSI: Gomorrah.” [laughter] “In the opener, the CSI team investigates the slaying of Abraham’s first born.” [laughter] “Was it sacrifice or murder?” [laughter]

UPN has “America’s Next Top Messiah.” [laughter] [applause] The teaser says, “Someone is going to suffer and die for the sins of all mankind. Everyone else is going home.” [laughter]

Fox has “The Simple Afterlife.” [laughter] Paris Hilton goes to Hell and says, “That’s hot!” [laughter] [applause]

King World is syndicating “Live with Regis and Kathie Lee” – no, “Live with Regis and Eve!” [laughter] What did I say that for? [laughter]

MTV has “The Real World: Galilee.” [laughter] “Judas has had it up to here with Mary and Jesus hogging the bathroom with all their foot-washing.” [laughter]

And my favorite: ABC has “Jesus in Progress.” [laughter] “In a mix-up, Jesus ends up with two dates for the Last Supper.” [laughter] [applause]

Anyway, earlier today, I spoke with the three-term U.S. Senator from California who serves on the Foreign Relations and Commerce Committees, the Senator who gives ‘em hell, Barbara Boxer! [applause] [cheers]

BARBARA BOXER [via satellite]: Thank you.

MAHER: Okay. Senator, how are you this Friday night?

BOXER: Well, I’m very happy when I hear those cheers. It lifts my spirits.

MAHER: Yeah. No, I think everybody is cheering you because we watched you at the confirmation hearings this week with John Bolton.

BOXER: Yes.

MAHER: The man who wants to be—[applause]—I hope you’re – are you cheering for John Bolton? [laughter] Because when you see that guy – I mean, the same words about this man keep coming up: a bully, an intimidator, scary hairpiece, creepy mustache. [laughter]

BOXER: Well, he was called a “serial abuser” by one of the—

MAHER: Right.

BOXER: --officials at the State Department who is a self-described conservative Republican – said that Bolton was a serial abuser who tried to fire people because they wouldn’t give him the information he wanted, the intelligence information he wanted so that he, Bolton, could say that Cuba was an imminent threat. Not very good.

MAHER: What I don’t understand, I guess, is George Bush and his method of nominating people.

BOXER: Yeah. [laughter]

MAHER: It seems like he only knows a few people. [laughter] He’s a successful man. You’d think he would know more people. [laughter] What is your theory as to why he nominates the same small group of people over and over again?

BOXER: That’s a very serious question. I think that he wants the loyalists, people who are very close to him, people who will just say, “Yes, sir.”

MAHER: Right.

BOXER: And that’s very dangerous. But more than that, for the U.N., he’s putting someone in there, unless we can stop him, who has said that the U.N. does not exist, and if ten floors of the United Nations Building disappeared tomorrow, no one would care or notice. Now, that’s like putting Arnold Schwarzenegger as president of the nurses’ union. [laughter] [applause] You know, he is going after the nurses. Why would you do that?

MAHER: That’s true. We all know eight floors of the U.N. could disappear and no one would notice; but not ten, come on! [laughter] Let me ask you about what’s going on in Congress this week. They are trying to repeal the estate tax again.

BOXER: Yes.

MAHER: The bankruptcy bill is going to be signed by the President. This is something that was really only wanted by the credit card companies.

BOXER: That’s right.

MAHER: These don’t seem like laws that are there for the common man. It seemed like at one point we could all agree on one thing: we all hate taxes – it’s tax day – but if you’re going to tax anybody, tax dead rich people. [laughter] [applause] How – how is it that the Republicans are able to make these populist issues that the people are for? People at Wal-Mart – “Yeah, repeal the estate tax!” How do you guys let them get away with it?

BOXER: We’re trying. They’re very good at words. The fact of the matter is, the estate tax has all but disappeared except for the wealthiest estates, over $3 million. We’re even willing to exempt all the family farms, all the small businesses, and just keep it on those who really got the American Dream. And what’s so terrible if they’re worth more than $8 million at death, that, you know, you say to this country, “Thank you so much, and here’s something because I love this country and I want to make sure it has a strong military and it has a strong education system and a healthy environment.” I don’t see what’s wrong with it. [applause] But you’ve got the Republicans taking it a different way.

MAHER: Okay, today I read that the Senate Majority Leader, Bill Frist, is going to be participating in a Christian TV special where he calls Democrats “people against faith.” He says Democrats are against people of faith. Did you see this today?

BOXER: I have heard about it.

MAHER: And then I see Howard Dean saying – the head of your party – saying that the Democrats have to do more to appeal to voters who they have lost because of their unease with the “values” issue. And I feel like the Democrats are once again being baited into a fight you can’t win. You are never going to win over those “values” people, are you? Why don’t you just fish in the bigger pond of—?

BOXER: Well, Bill, I just don’t see it the same way. When I was raised in a pretty spiritual family, we were taught to care about our country, to care about people who were not as fortunate as we were, to care about the world around us, peace in the world. All those are values.

MAHER: Right.

BOXER: And so I don’t run away from that battle at all. I say, bring that battle on.

MAHER: But I don’t—

BOXER: We should win that battle. [applause] Those are the things we treasure.

MAHER: But that’s not really what Howard means when he talks about values. He’s talking about the Republican definition of “values.” I agree, that is what the Democrats should be saying. But then again, I saw Howard Dean cutting and running on guns again this week. That’s another Republican issue that I feel like here’s the head of the Democratic organization saying, “You know what? We’re not going to fight you on that one either.” And I tell you, if you Democrats cut and run on guns, I’m going back to Nader. [laughter]

BOXER: Oh, no, don’t do that, whatever you do. Listen – listen—

MAHER: Okay, but guns, you’ve got to stand up—

BOXER: --here’s the point. Just because – but, Bill – because one person says something, it doesn’t really, truly speak for everybody. And I think that Howard—

MAHER: [overlapping] He’s the head of the party!

BOXER: No, I think what Howard is trying to say – if I can try to win you back here – is that – that our party is a big tent. I mean, the truth is we do care about protecting kids from gun violence. We are the ones who said you don’t need an assault weapon to go hunting. We stand behind that. But if you don’t agree with us, there’s a lot of things you should agree with us on. So, come into our party. And I think that’s what he’s really talking about, that we are a big tent because there are many issues, and people shouldn’t – excuse the expression – “single-shot vote.”

MAHER: [laughs] Okay. All right, I know you’re busy. I really appreciate you doing this for us on a Friday night. Senator Barbara Boxer, everybody. [applause] [cheers]

BOXER: It’s a pleasure.

MAHER: Thank you, Senator. Okay, so you wanted to say something more about the military?

MAINES: I just wanted to say one thing about the military. I just – I can’t let you get away with saying that the Democrats don’t connect with the military, because to me, that’s all set up by the Republicans. They don’t want us to connect. They don’t want the—[applause] [cheers]—soldiers to think that we connect. I don’t know how many times you hear every single Democrat say, “Just because I didn’t support the war and the way we went to war, does not mean I don’t support the troops.” [applause]

When I said what I said, when you went around asking people, “What was the comment that Natalie Maines from The Dixie Chicks said?” People go, “That she didn’t support the troops.” It wasn’t anywhere near that.

MAHER: Right.

MAINES: And that – that does build a wall. Because—

CLARK: Exactly right.

MAINES: --whenever I see military, I get, like, “Oh, they probably don’t like me and they think I don’t support them.”

FRUM: [overlapping] And yet, inexplicably, they prefer Toby Keith. [laughter]

MAINES: I disagree.

MAHER: No, what they—

CLARK: [overlapping] I think what Natalie is saying is exactly right.

MAHER: [overlapping]–what they morphed it into is that Natalie Maines insulted President Bush, and that hurt the troops’ feelings so much they could barely go into battle. [laughter] Because Natalie Maines was mean to the Commander in Chief! [applause]

MAINES: But it puts up a barrier.

MAHER: Yeah. It was probably the gay troops who got so upset. [laughter]

MAINES: No, the gay troops love me.

MAHER: The gay troops – I’m not surprised. Okay, so we’re talking at the end there with Barbara Boxer about guns. Now, here’s another issue where I think the Democrats, again, I’m worried that they’re not going to stand up. That means there’s no voice for a lot of people in this country. Do you realize that in the Patriot Act, being on a “terrorist watch list” does not – I repeat, not – prohibit you from buying a gun. We can’t have a lighter on a plane now—[laughter]—so if you have one of those head show lighters that looks like a gun, it had better be a real gun. [laughter]

MAINES: Well, first of all, they did background checks after 9/11 on 44 of the terrorists who were part of that, or who were on the list, and 33 of them have bought several guns in the United States.

CLARK: Yeah.

MAINES: And on a Taliban website, they say – they tell all their people, “Hey, go to America to buy your guns. They have all these gun shows and you can buy all these automatic weapons. It’s awesome!” [laughter]

FRUM: Bill—

MAHER: I mean, come on.

FRUM: It’s news to me that you can’t do that, and that’s probably and easy thing to fix. But, look, if you are—[audience reacts]—but the idea that you are worried about terrorism of mass destruction being executed with firearms is, I think—

MAHER: Well, excuse me, but if a terrorist got into one of our not-well-guarded chemical plants and just shot up one of the tanks of deadly propane gas or whatever it is with an AK-47, yes, it could be deadly. It could be very deadly.

FRUM: But – but Japan has the world’s strictest gun laws. They still have the Japanese Red Army.

MAHER: But they don’t hate Japan like they hate us. [laughter]

FRUM: The Japanese – the Japanese had their own terrorists. Look, the thing – when terrorists – when terrorists do the terrible things that we’re trying to prevent them from doing, the weapon of choice is not going to be firearms. The thing to worry about—

MAHER: Well, we didn’t think it was going to be planes, either. Remember Condoleezza Rice? [applause] [cheers] “Who could imagine? Who could imagine?”

MAINES: And the point is – the point is not that they’re going to do something with guns, but, like he’s saying, all the things that have been restricted – and do you know that when you go to buy a gun, even when they do this silly little background check, when you pass it, they just tear it up. Nobody knows that you were there and you got the gun. They keep a record of our phone, and I’m sure they have lots of my conversations and all my little faults. But they wouldn’t know if I have a closet full of guns. And they’re buying them by the truckload and sending them over wherever to do their crimes.

FRUM: But the first thing you said I think was the most true and revealing, which is that this is about banning guns as an end in itself, and if you are opposed to guns, just be opposed to guns. Don’t try to piggyback it onto a terrorist issue which it’s got nothing to do with. That—

MAHER: Oh—

MAINES: No, it’s about—[voices overlap]

MAHER: But the Patriot Act – but it does—

FRUM: [overlapping] Worry about – worry about nuclear materials. That’s—

MAHER: [overlapping] But the Patriot Act asked us—

MAINES: [overlapping] Well, that’s another thing, too.

CLARK: [overlapping] I like to worry about nuclear material.

MAHER: Yeah.

CLARK: But—[to Frum]—your President has done very little about nuclear materials.

FRUM: He’s your President—

MAHER: Yes.

CLARK: He – first, he tried to cut out our efforts to go after nuclear materials, then he’s funded them at steady-state. He’s done nothing about North Korea except ask China to help us. And China is not going to attacked by North Korea. So—

MAHER: [overlapping] But my point was just that it seems like we’ve all been—

CLARK: [overlapping]—let’s don’t talk about proliferation. You’re going to lose. [applause] [cheers]

MAHER: [overlapping]—asked to make sacrifices for—everybody has been asked to make sacrifices in the cause of fighting terrorism except gun owners. When it comes to guns…

MAINES: But you know what? It’s not just guns—

FRUM: There ought to be some connection between what you do and what you’re trying to achieve.

MAINES: [overlapping]—but if we want to make it just guns – if you want to make it just guns, then we’ll go beyond that, because they’re trying to now get it through that you can buy this fertilizer—

MAHER: [overlapping] Terrorists—

MAINES: [overlapping]—that everyone bakes the bombs with, and that they blew up Oklahoma with, and you can get it by the truckload without a permit. But a farmer has to get a permit to have the fertilizer for their hay, or to have anything for their farm. But you can just go – they’ve made it now where you can just load up your truck with this bomb-making fertilizer and go across the Brooklyn Bridge.

MAHER: The “horseshit loophole,” yes. [laughter] [applause] Let me ask you this: in his State of the Union Address this year, when he was selling his Social Security plan, which I’m not against, okay, he said, “Our society has changed in ways the founders of Social Security could not have foreseen.” Doesn’t that logic apply to guns? Hasn’t our world—[applause]—hasn’t the world of guns changed in ways that the founding fathers who wrote the Second Amendment could not have foreseen?

FRUM: And that’s – that’s why there are an extraordinary tissue of regulations on the purchase and use of firearms. [audience reacts with skepticism] That date back to the 1930s. So it is – these are not unregulated. But all I’m saying is just, please, if you want to talk about it, by all means, talk, but don’t piggyback it onto something else. Because the terrorism threat – the terrorism threat is not going to come about because of people popping away with Uzis.

MAHER: How do you know that?

MAINES: Exactly! Just because it hasn’t happened yet? [voices overlap]

FRUM: Because, as you heard in that very impressive interview—

MAINES: They’re going to do it just to prove you wrong now. [laughter]

FRUM: --of Tom Friedman’s. As you heard in that very impressive interview of Tom Friedman’s, that terrorism is a political action that is engaged in – that aims at achieving spectacular results to demoralize the United States, to upset American society. And it’s Friedman’s point exactly. I mean, if you want to try your luck and encourage the Democratic Party to go try their luck, which has not been very successful on the gun issue, go ahead. But, please, don’t piggyback it onto something else.

CLARK: Well, let’s talk about guns for just a second. Number one is, there’s no reason for anybody to have assault weapons in our society for any reason. [applause] They should be banned. If you want assault weapons, we’ve got a uniform and a pair of boots for you to wear. [applause] [cheers] And you can even shoot ‘em.

MAHER: Yeah.

CLARK: Okay, that’s the fact.

MAHER: Yeah.

CLARK: Okay, number two is, we do need things like the Brady Bill out there because there are people in this country who shouldn’t have firearms. And I don’t see any reason why we can’t do – make better use – well, of course, there are many terrorist watch lists, that’s the problem. You know, it’s been four years—

MAHER: Yeah, part of it.

CLARK: [overlapping]—and we still haven’t quite figured out who’s really on a terrorist watch list and why, apparently.

MAHER: Well, it’s the people with the guns. [laughter] Easy way to find them.

CLARK: Or with cigarette lighters, right? So we need to do – we do need to do a better job.

MAHER: Right.

CLARK: I’m real proud of the men and women who serve for Homeland Security, but I’m not proud of the fact that we haven’t pulled together the administrative process in this country to do the things we need to really keep America safe at home, David. [applause]

FRUM: I’m completely with you on that. And if you want to say that there has been an ebbing of urgency and an ebbing of intensity on this, I wrote all – that’s the whole point of that book Richard Perle and I wrote, that you can feel it leeching out of – leaching out of the country.

MAHER: Yes, I agree with that.

FRUM: And there are a lot – I mean, it is still true that there’s not – I mean, there is not adequate domestic intelligence. I mean, there are a lot – I mean—

MAHER: [overlapping] But why won’t you guys—

FRUM: [overlapping] I wrote a book about it. What else can I do?

MAHER: [overlapping]—ever give an inch? But why don’t you ever give an inch? I was – I thought – magnanimous, and I said, after the Iraqi elections, “You know what? This idea of freedom and democracy working in the Middle East, yeah, it might be.” You can’t just give that one point that everybody sacrificed for 9/11 but the gun owners? You couldn’t stand up for the – because, let’s be honest, bad guys plus guns, there is a little logic there, a little. They did 9/11 with box-cutters. [applause]

FRUM: They did 9/11 – but let me ask you this – the most important tool that those 9/11 hijackers had was driver’s licenses. That was the most essential tool they had. And right now, Republicans in Congress are trying to make it more difficult – more difficult for people who are not properly in the country to get driver’s licenses. Are you for that? Because that’s a lot more relevant…No, I guess.

MAHER: Okay, I want to ask you about Tom DeLay. No, because we’re just going to go around in circles again. Tom DeLay, who is a little bit embattled right now, but my guess is he’s going to survive, it looks to me – it’s very hard to categorize all these guys’ transgressions, because they’re very shady. But it seems to be – seems to be centered around playing golf. [laughter] Everywhere he goes in the world where there’s a – where there’s a scandal. He went to Russia, played golf. He went to England and Scotland, played golf. South Korea, golf. The Pope’s funeral, golf. [laughter]

CLARK: Look, look, look—

MAHER: [overlapping] Show the picture of Tiger Woods’ wife there for one second. [insert photo of Tiger Woods’ wife] [audience reacts] Okay, that’s Tiger Woods’ wife. All I have to say is if you’re out playing golf and you’re married to that, you’re not a tiger, you’re a pussy. [laughter] [applause]

CLARK: But, Bill, Bill, come on! Now, look, I’ve got 20 guns in my house.

MAHER: Wow!

CLARK: And I’m a Democrat, okay? And I’m not giving up golf even if Tom DeLay plays golf! [laughter]

MAHER: No, I’m not asking anyone to give up golf. I’m just saying that golf is not a sport, it’s a drug. It is a drug. If it was a sport, there would be less whispering and more children born out of wedlock. [laughter] People are addicted to this and they don’t care. And that’s why Tom DeLay partly is in so much trouble. [laughter] I’m serious!

CLARK: You’re excusing him of responsibility. You’re saying it’s an addiction he can’t control.

MAHER: Well, I—

CLARK: Did you really mean that?!

MAHER: I don’t say that about any addictions, because my addiction is weed. [applause] [cheers] But, you know, golf started as something stupid that men would purposely do, that women would have no interest in following them. And now women play golf and it’s ruined the whole plan. [laughter] Because it was always a place men could go to get away, you know, when they didn’t want—

MAINES: That’s the best part about it, that the men go away for awhile. They like that. [laughter] [applause]

MAHER: Yeah, but—

MAINES: Just – just for an afternoon.

MAHER: Same thing with cigars. Men don’t really like cigars. We know they smell like shit. [laughter] But it makes the women go away. [laughter]

CLARK: I like golf, and I’m sorry that Tom DeLay plays golf. [laughter] And, you know, I think that people who are charged with ethics violations in Congress should be prohibited from playing golf! [laughter] [applause] Because if you can’t trust them in Congress, how can you trust their score on a golf course?! [laughter]

MAHER: I don’t know, but all the presidents cheat. [laughter] Come on, Clinton used to take the Mulligan.

CLARK: No, no, it was called a “Bill-igan.” [laughter]

MAHER: Yeah. All right, it is time for New Rules, everybody. [applause] [cheers]

All right, New Rule: No answering the phone during sex. [laughter] According to Ad Age magazine, 15% of Americans answer their cell phones during sex. Which is not only rude but dangerous because it interferes with your driving. [laughter] [applause] Trust me, when a woman is screaming, “I’m coming, I’m coming!” she doesn’t want to hear that “You’re breaking up, you’re breaking up!” [laughter] [applause]

New Rule: Britney Spears and her husband have to name their new baby “Shithead.” [laughter] [applause] It’s the redneck version of “Apple.” [laughter] [applause] And while we’re at it, stop bugging her about smoking. It’s a little late to start worrying about the DNA when half of it is Kevin Federline’s. [laughter] [applause]

New Rule: Let TV shows die a natural death. Fans of the canceled TV series, “Star Trek: Enterprise,” are trying to raise enough money on their own to pay for another season! [laughter] It’s either that or go outside. [laughter] [applause] So far, they’ve raised $3 million largely by not dating. [laughter] Hey, Trekkies, if you really want to donate money to a lost cause, try moveon.org. [audience “oohs”] [laughter] I guess this is one of those weeks where we really didn’t get a big conservative part of the audience. [laughter]

New Rule: Stop saying anybody or anything is like the Nazis, okay? Republicans aren’t like the Nazis. Even Neo-Nazis aren’t like the Nazis. [laughter] Nothing is like the Nazis…except for Wal-Mart. [laughter] [applause] [cheers]

And finally, New Rule: Parents have to stop coddling their children. The latest is, schools have stopped grading papers with red ink because of complaints that a big, mean, red X is too negative. [laughter] Why, a kid might even think he got it wrong and learn something. [laughter] These parents today are so fixated on protection, it’s amazing they ever got pregnant in the first place. [laughter] [applause] [cheers]

A recent reality show called “Super Nanny” placed an old-school, discipline-wielding nanny into a family where the mother can’t figure out the reason she’s having a nervous breakdown is that she says things to her kids like, “Tyler, mommy would really appreciate it if you didn’t throw rocks at me.” [laughter] You know, moms and dads these days are like the Democratic Party: lame, spineless and not holding up their end of the equation. [laughter] And kids are like the Republicans: drunk with power and out of control! [laughter] [applause] [cheers]

Maybe that’s why there’s also a new phenomenon called “parent coaching,” a kind of tech-support service for clueless parents when their 3.0-year-old goes haywire. [laughter] As described in a recent New York Times article, here are some of the questions a typical mom asks her parenting coach: What should she do when Skylar won’t do his chores? Should there be limits on how he spends his allowance? Should Forrest get dessert if he does not eat a healthy dinner?

Now, for those of you who are saying, “But, Bill, you’re not a parent,” I say, “True. But I have one thing these parents apparently don’t: a brain!” [laughter] [applause] This is not rocket science. What you should do when Skylar won’t do his chores. How about using your size advantage. [laughter] Make him. [laughter] Because if there’s one thing we know about kids, it’s that if you give them an inch, the authorities will raid your Neverland Ranch. [laughter] [applause] [cheers]

Yes, like Michael Jackson, parents these days act like they’re on a date with their children. [laughter] Trying to impress them, trying to buy their love and never contradicting them or giving them a big red X when they’re wrong.

So, no, I don’t have kids. And you know what? I don’t intend to have any until people start making some I’d want my kids to play with! [laughter] [applause] [cheers] Until then, I’m just glad I own a lot of stock in Ritalin. [laughter]

All right, that’s our show. [applause] I want to thank my guests, Thomas Friedman, Barbara Boxer, David Frum, Natalie Maines, General Wesley Clark. And thank you, too, you’re a great crowd. Goodnight, folks. [applause] [cheers]

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