Discussion

[Breakfast in Beauclair stinger by MojoFilter Media]

Alyssa

Hey everyone, welcome to the episode. My name is Alyssa from GoodMorhen and I'm so excited to have Charlotte from Vengerberg Glamarye joining me from North Carolina.

Charlotte

Thanks so much for having me. [They laugh]

Alyssa

Yeah, I'm so excited to talk to you today, um, so, you and I actually got to know each other through Instagram, like, right when I first started my account. You have your own shop dedicated to lore-accurate fragrances and I'm really excited to have you on today to talk about one of the short stories, "A Grain of Truth," as well as about your business venture.

Charlotte

Yeah, I'm really excited. [Laughter]

Alyssa

So just to give the audience a little bit of background, can you tell us a little bit about your early experiences with the Witcher Universe?

Yeah, absolutely. So, I first was exposed to the Witcher story and the Witcher world, um, through the video games. Mainly just The Witcher III. [Alyssa laughs] But my partner, you know, was really excited about the Witcher series. He got The Witcher III for PC. I basically spent an entire, uh, summer just watching him play it. [Alyssa laughs] I was so engrossed in the story of this video game and also just how stunning the game was. I'd never seen a game that beautiful in my life. Um, and I'm, kind of, I'm really picky about video games. They have to be gorgeous, they have to have a good story, and they have to engage me, you know, for a long period of time and the Witcher pretty much checked all those boxes off. So, I was, like, a—I was a backseat gamer. [Alyssa laughs] I was an over-the-shoulder gamer. And, so, finally I was just, like, give me the controller. Like, it's my turn. I want to play this game. You sit behind me. You watch me play it.

Alyssa

I love it.

Charlotte

Oh, yeah. I–I was obsessed. I'm one of those people that likes to get 100% on video games. And I was like, I can't do that. I can't get 100% on The Witcher. There's just too much to do. If you don't follow certain storylines, you don't get to do these things. So you can just play it, like, for an infinite amount of time and just… it's a different game every time. So, the game was the first introduction. After I played the game, I still wanted more. Uh, so, I got into the books. I actually started with the audio books—

Alyssa

Oh, really?

Charlotte

—instead of the actual, like, paper books. Yeah. Audible has audio books of The Witcher series that are narrated by, probably one of the best audiobook narrators I've ever heard. His name is Peter Kenny. Um, and I'm sure that some people have mixed opinions, I guess, about his reading.

Alyssa

Uh huh.

Charlotte

But, I think he's fucking brilliant. So, I had, like, a two-hour commute at the time.

Alyssa

Oh, wow.

Charlotte

And it made that commute so pleasant and so wonderful and so magical for me. Like, I just wanted to keep driving. I didn't want to get home or, like, get to work. I just wanted to keep listening to the books.

Alyssa

Yeah.

Charlotte

So, first the games, then the audiobooks, then the books.

Alyssa

Yeah, I feel like a lot of people that are very familiar with the Witcher now definitely walked into it through the video games. I mean, there's going to be a lot of people that are coming in through the Netflix show. I think it's going to be really fascinating to see, um, kind of, who comes in through the Netflix series and then if and how they're receptive towards the books and the original source material. But yeah, the way that you got into the Witcher universe sounds exactly the same as how I did too.

Charlotte

Yeah, pretty standard.

Alyssa

Yeah, definitely backseat driving. I think, yeah, with me, I had to be talked into getting my own account and playthrough. I was super content with just watching. I was really sad when I had been playing on, you know, my ex partner's account, and I was super OP [slang: “overpowered”], and then I made a new account and I was just getting mauled by, like, Level 5 wolves. I was so, so heartbroken. [Charlotte laughs]

As we've spoken about, you have your own business centered around perfumes and fragrances from The Witcher. So, can you tell me a little bit about how smells and fragrances play a role in the storyline? And, briefly, how that's inspired, um, your line of work?

Charlotte

Yeah. Geralt, you know, as–as I'm sure most of the audience will know, is a witcher. He's, kind of, a–a mutated human being. And as a result, his, uh, senses are heightened. Most of the time, in the book, focuses around his sense of eyesight, because he's got these crazy cat eyes; he can see in the dark. Or his crazy fighting style or his, you know, like, uh, Witcher sense. Um, but, he also has a really keen sense of smell as a result of, you know, going through the Trial of the Grasses and becoming a mutant. Sapkowski, in the books, really makes a point of illustrating this. Usually when Geralt is around a woman. It comes into play at other points in the book, but for the most part, he emphasizes this very keen sense of smell around the ladies. [Alyssa laughs] And so, you know, he comes across the lady, and he, like, walks up to the lady, and Sapkowski goes to great lengths to describe what he smells in addition to what he sees, you know, with this lady. So, almost every love interest that Geralt galavants around with, in the books, has a very distinct perfume.

Alyssa

Yeah, for sure. Again, like super bizarre to always hear, uh, male authors describe women.

Charlotte

Oh, yeah. I–I just gotta say, I know exactly what you're talking about. Sapkowski does not disappoint in this regard. He certainly falls right into that category. I mean, I love him. I love the books.

Alyssa

Yes.

Charlotte

But–but he is a male author writing about women.

Alyssa

So today, Charlotte and I are going to be discussing "A Grain of Truth," which is the second short story in Andrzej Sapkowski's The Last Wish. Part I starts in a forest:

Geralt in the middle of this forest comes across the corpses of a man and woman. After examining the corpses and contents of the man's belt, Geralt determines that they came from the forest, on their way home from the town where a credit note in the belt came from. He questions, out loud, to his horse, Roach, why they weren't on the highway and he makes the decision to investigate further.

This is a pretty short bit, but it introduces, kind of, the setting and this mysterious tone of what might happen in the rest of this chapter.

Charlotte

Yeah, he definitely starts to implement some of his man hunting skills in this, like, first tiny, little scene.

Alyssa

Yeah.

Charlotte

He's, uh, a clearly a skilled tracker. And when he comes across some weird, morbid shit in the woods, I mean, what's a bored witcher to do, you know?

Alyssa

Exactly.

Charlotte

[Imitating Geralt] “Hey, there's some, uh, dead bodies over here. Let's–let’s go, check it out.”

Alyssa

And the cool thing that you see here is, like you said, how he actually does as a tracker and as, um, a witcher and you really get to see him work. He rummages through these corpses and he comes across a credit note in the man's belt. I think this is, like, really clever. But he says that, like, no one carries a credit note for long. So, he thinks about where the credit note came from and determines that they must have left that town recently. So, they must have been on their way home from there. But, why were they so far off the path? And that's when he's, like, something's odd about this. He notices that the corpses are, like, super bloodied and messed up from some sort of monster. He's not sure what but, he can tell that the animals that, kind of, scavenged the bodies only found them after the bodies were dead.

Charlotte

Yeah, he's a–he's a sharp one when it comes to dead bodies, that's for sure.

Alyssa

But not anytime else.

Charlotte

No, its–it's interesting when he pulls out his, uh, his intelligence, that's for sure.

Alyssa

It's definitely selective.

Charlotte

Yes. Very much so.

Alyssa

But I adore him. So…

Charlotte

Me too. Oh, Geraldo.

Alyssa

Part II, Geralt encounters the wall in the middle of the forest and spots a girl at a distance. Roach is uneasy. And when the witcher tries to talk to the girl, she runs down the hillside and disappears. He passes through the wall's gate and enters the overgrown courtyard of a rundown mansion. Suddenly, a beast charges out from the house toward him. Geralt pulls out his sword in a defensive move and the beast lurches to a halt. The monster threatens Geralt and the witcher calls him out on his bluff. The two trade banter before the monster invites the witcher into the manor.

So, this is one of my favorite scenes in this whole chapter. And I think that the banter here is really funny and really engaging and unexpected, really. So you have Geralt walking into this seemingly abandoned grounds of, like, a home and he starts poking around, and there's this beautiful blue rose bush in the middle. And as he's going to inspect the flowers, there's just this thing that comes out of the house and charges at him. Because, he's a witcher and he's loaded with weapons, um, pulls out his sword and then the beast just, kind of, stops and then it starts talking in the Common Tongue, which is the language that most people speak, um, in the Northern Kingdoms and it threatens him and you get all of this, like, theatrics, where the beast is just, like, "Flee, mortal man!" And then Geralt, kind of, like, "No." He's like, "Make me."

Charlotte

He's like "Oh yeah, what, like, you and what army?" Like—

Alyssa

Exactly. Like, Geralt is not frightened of this creature at all and the creature still threatens him. And then when Geralt really doesn't show any signs of, like, backing down or being terrified. He's just, kind of, like, "Oh. Uh..."

Charlotte

"What do I do now—"

Alyssa

Exactly.

Charlotte

"—Most people scream and piss themselves."

Alyssa

Exactly. So, I think that it just sets it up [in] a very funny and unexpected manner. Especially because, you have this monster. He keeps saying, like, "Oh, pox on it." And it's just very funny and very formal. I love this section.

Charlotte

Yeah. I also think it's interesting for someone who, you know, in the beginning of the books and in the previous chapter is described as a monster hunter, he just, like, kills monsters for coin.

Alyssa

Yeah.

Charlotte

He doesn't immediately start flaying this thing alive. He pulls out his sword in a defensive move and waits to see what will happen.

Alyssa

Right.

Charlotte

You know, luckily for him, the monster is not actually that intimidating.

Alyssa

No. And there's this excerpt from this chapter that I absolutely love because, I just think it's so funny. Again, like, it kind of subverts your expectations about what you presume is a threatening monster. I guess—to back up a second—the description itself is very funny. This monster is described as humanoid wearing "tattered, but well-made clothes" with a "bear-like head, enormous ears, wild eyes, crooked fangs, set in terrifying jaws, and a red tongue flickering like flame." And this is what Geralt encounters and then when they actually get to talking—again, like, they're speaking the same language. This monster is actually strangely formal as well. [Charlotte snickers] But there's this really funny description where—this is at the point where he realizes that Geralt isn't going to be scared of him. This excerpt from the book reads:

[Reading] The monster shifted from one foot to the other and scratched his ear. “Listen you. Are you really not frightened of me?” “Should I be?” The monster looked around, cleared his throat and yanked up his baggy trousers. “Pox on it, What’s the harm of a guest in the house? It’s not every day I meet someone who doesn’t run away or faint at the sight of me.”

It's so bizarre and I think it says a lot about Geralt's experiences in his world. This isn't out of his realm of, like, what might be normal or abnormal.

Charlotte

Yeah. And I think due to his experience, he's able to determine, at this point, just by looking at something, whether or not it's a real threat or if it's something that's been cursed. In the previous story, they set up this whole idea that he's definitely able to break curses that other people aren't capable of breaking due to his profession.

Alyssa

Yeah.

Charlotte

He knows, uh, somebody in a–in a bad situation when he sees one.

Alyssa

Yeah.

Charlotte

Although, I might have just, like, given a–given some stuff away already. [They laugh]

Alyssa

We're going to get to the spoilers in a bit. So, you have a note here about the indigo rosebush—

Charlotte

Yeah.

Alyssa

—and about its symbolic importance outside of Sapkowski's work. Do you want to tell us a little bit about that?

Charlotte

Yeah. When I was reading this story for the first time, I was actually really intrigued that Sapkowski decided to make the rosebush indigo, or blue. I've actually seen blue roses referenced before in other fantasy stories. The first time I ever saw it was in this really old movie from the 1940s called The Thief of Baghdad. If you haven't seen it, you should watch it. It's a trip. But if you have, you'll remember that there's a scene in there where a princess is given a blue rose and when she smells it, she forgets everything. And so, I had this really clear image in my head of seeing this motif of a blue rose somewhere. So, I did a little bit of digging about it, and it turns out that blue roses are, kind of, prevalent in fantasy stories, but they're more prevalent in fantasy stories from China.

Alyssa

Oh, interesting.

Charlotte

Yeah, so, the myth and the legend of the blue rose is from China, as far as I'm aware. They symbolize unrequited or impossible love. Very, very difficult to get or just, like, fantastical, impossible love. And the legend of the blue rose, to summarize it, basically goes like this:

There was a princess and she didn't want to get married. Her father wanted her to get married and she was a very headstrong princess. So, basically she said, "All right, I'll marry whoever brings me a blue rose." And at this point, no one had ever heard of such a thing, such a thing did not exist. So, various people tried to bring her what they thought she meant by "a blue rose." Someone brought her a blue rose made out of sapphires and gold. Someone brought her a blue rose painted on porcelain. Um, someone tinted the windows in the palace blue and, you know, brought her a white one. So, that when the light shone through, it looked blue. And she turned every single one down. Ultimately, she falls in love with someone that she's not supposed to marry, you know, someone who's, like, a pauper, and she's talking to the pauper about her predicament, "Told my father I need a blue rose, now he's got all these guys bringing me all this stuff, I don't know what to do." So, the pauper is like, "It–it doesn't really matter what color rose they bring you, like, when you know it's the right one, you'll see it as blue." So, eventually, like, the pauper presents her with a rose, right? And it's a white rose, and everybody in the palace can see that it's a white rose, but she insists that it's blue! So she ends up marrying this pauper and that's the story of the blue rose.

Alyssa

That's so interesting.

Charlotte

But I thought it was fascinating that he decided to make the forbidden rosebush indigo, because it does symbolize an impossible, really fantastical relationship.

Alyssa

Yeah, which is definitely par for the course when it comes to this story. The idea of fantasy and the idea of a fairy tale is something that, as we'll see, each of the characters actually talks about—the impossibility of fairy tales. So, this is absolutely perfect, and thank you so much for bringing that into the conversation. I think that's so interesting.

Charlotte

Yeah.

Alyssa

So, the monster leads Geralt to a dining room in the house, which lights and fills itself with food at his command. Sat at the table with the feast, the monster introduces himself as Nivellen. After some coaxing from Geralt, Nivellen tells the witcher his story. Years ago, Nivellen became the young head of his family's gang. One day, the gang pillaged a temple, and raped the priestess there. She cursed Nivellen before killing herself, and a few days later, he had been transformed from a boy into a monster. The gang and servants fled, some were killed, and no one returned, leaving him alone for months.

So, this is the first time that we're really hearing about the details of what happened to this monster, Nivellen. Like you had said, clearly, Geralt knows that this isn't something that's necessarily threatening; that this monster isn't necessarily something that's malicious, so he takes the time to actually dig into who this monster is. It's this really incredible part of the story, because it wraps the reader up in, like, the tension that this room has. You have at this table, a monster and a monster hunter, or at least a person who believes he's a monster and a monster hunter, and they don't really know how each of them got there. I think, they're, on some level, a little bit confused, but also uncertain about what the other person's intentions and motives are.

Charlotte

Yeah, definitely. Also, like, when you, when you learn about the backstory of Nivellen, you know he definitely becomes even more human than his, like, bumbling you know, baggy-pants self because, uh, clearly, you know, he's done something wrong. When I was reading through this story again, it was emphasized that Nivellen was, like, forced into raping this priestess? By his friends, or by his gang members, or whatever.

Alyssa

Mmhm.

Charlotte

And that they were like, “Oh, you know, gotta become a man,” and—

Alyssa

Yeah.

Charlotte

—and all this stuff, but like, he still did it.

Alyssa

Right.

Charlotte

He still did it. I don't care if he was, you know, a milksop or whatever he described himself as. [Laughter]; Just, like, some–some stupid boy. I don't know, I–I think that he knew it was wrong.

Alyssa

Yeah.

Charlotte

'Cause he definitely seems to feel remorse about it.

Alyssa

Yeah, for sure. When he talks about his experiences with that gang, it seems that Nivellen came from a family that operated like how a mafia would. Where, he does say that his father had something to do with, like, the levies in the town but, that people also didn't like him and that his grandfather and father had both been robbers. His grandfather went a bit nuts in his old age and his father was chopped up and brought to him in, like, a cart which is [eugh] gross.

So, this is how Nivellen becomes the head of this gang. So he's young, inexperienced, a pushover, and a milksop, as you quoted, which is probably an insult that I should use in the future. [Laughter] Yeah, and he, kind of, gets dragged along and peer pressured, to an extent, into this by older members of this gang. But, you're right, like, he does go along with it. I don't–I don't know if he would have felt remorse or accountability for his actions had, like, this curse not happened either.

Charlotte

Yeah, that's–that's a good point. I don't think he would have really felt that bad about it had nothing happened afterwards.

Alyssa

Yeah, I think he would have just kind of continued on that same milksop trajectory. For. Ever.

Charlotte

Yeah. It's good to have consequences for your actions, you know, puts things in perspective.

Alyssa

So, aside from the actual story that Nivellen tells Geralt, we have the opportunity to learn a lot more about witchers. For a reader reading The Last Wish for the first time, we get a little bit of excerpts from “A Voice Of Reason.” In the last story, “The Witcher,” we had a little bit from King Foltest about, like, what Witchers do. Velerad, again, like, gives the reader a little bit of insight, but it's not terribly thorough, so we get another little nugget about the backstory of witchers from Geralt's conversation with Nivellen.

So, in this part, Nivellen asks Geralt if he can see a portrait of his old self hung above the fireplace and Geralt says "yes" without really thinking. Nivellen then asks Geralt who he is and Geralt responds:

[Reading] "I don't understand."

Nivellen says:

[Reading] “You don’t understand? My portrait is hung beyond the candlelight. I can see it, but I’m not human. At least, not at the moment. A human, looking at my portrait, would get up, go closer and, no doubt, have to take the candlestick with him. You didn’t do that, so the conclusion is simple. But I’m asking you plainly: are you human?”

And Geralt responds, you know, “If that's what you put it then not quite."

It's clever to be able to see Nivellen deduce Geralt's, you know, mutation just from this one simple act.

Charlotte

I wonder how many times he's asked a guest that question though.

Alyssa

Do you think he ever has a reason to doubt?

Charlotte

I don't know. That's the thing is that's a really specific question to ask someone.

Alyssa

Yeah.

Charlotte

And also, like, a very specific set of parameters. It's like, "You would have to take a candlestick, and get up and go closer. And, like, well, who did you last have in here that you were questioning whether or not they were human?

Alyssa

That's—

Charlotte

HMMM.

Alyssa

[Late to the realization] Oh–OH. Spoilers. So, like, again, we're going to get to the details of Nivellen's story, but if you think about the kinds of people that he's had in his complex, they're like painfully normal, [Laughter] like, overly normal and very, very human. There's a very specific kind of person that finds themselves in Nivellen's manor in the middle of the woods and Geralt is not that kind of person, and not that kind of pair of people. So, he's alone, he says that he's lost. He's armored to the teeth. I'm not surprised that Nivellen has some curiosity and skepticism about who this guest is in his home.

Charlotte

Yep, definitely not surprising. Uh, if a guy like that just showed up at my front door, I'd probably be pretty wary too.

Alyssa

Not if he was in a bathtub. [Laughter] Classic. And again, like, the detail that we get about witchers here after Geralt admits that he's a witcher; Nivellen says, like, “Oh, I know what you are like I've heard about them." Nivellen says:

[Reading] “I’ve heard about witchers—they abduct tiny children whom they feed with magic herbs. The ones who survive become witchers themselves, sorcerers with inhuman powers. They’re taught to kill, and all human feelings and reactions are trained out of them. They’re turned into monsters in order to kill other monsters.”

And I think this invites… curiosity from the reader. It fleshes out this person who we've met, but we still don't really know anything about who he is.

Charlotte

That's definitely just, like, some exposition! [Laughter] You know?

Alyssa

Oh, for sure.

Charlotte

"I've heard about you. Let me tell you all about you." You definitely didn't know that apparently it's common knowledge within this world that witchers are abducted children that are drugged up and become monsters that's what everybody seems to think.

Alyssa

Yeah.

Charlotte

You get the overall tone of how the world sees Geralt.

Alyssa

Yeah, when you think back to how Geralt was treated in the previous short story, in “The Witcher,” it informs the reader as they move forward in the story and through the saga about the perception of witchers and we do learn a lot more about it as the story continues. Nivellen here isn't wrong, but it's definitely something that, tonally, has a lot of skeptical or negative undertones to it as he's, uh, interviewing Geralt.

Charlotte

Definitely.

Alyssa

We learned from “The Witcher” that monsters have a sensitivity to silver. Geralt brings this information back in his conversation with Nivellen. Nivellen insists that he's a monster and Geralt says that he's not, because Nivellen is able to touch the silver flatware, he's able to touch the silver medallion that Geralt has. This is where Geralt believes, you know, Nivellen isn't as much of a threat as he might seem, and that it's probably from a spell or a curse, and then this is where we, like, dig into the details of Nivellen's story. We learn about his gang, we learn about his family history, and when it comes to how this curse was placed upon him: they overpowered the priestess and told Nivellen he had to become a man. While he was raping her, she yells out something, and then kills herself during the act, and then the whole gang got out of there. So, what she said was that Nivellen "was a monster in human skin; that he'd be a monster in monster skin" and then something that Nivellen can't remember about "love and blood," which... all of that came true.

Charlotte

And she killed herself afterward, like, oh my god.

Alyssa

Mmhm. That is commitment to, I don't know, retribution? Revenge? Punishment? [Eugh] Grizzly.

Charlotte

Yeah, I mean if it–if it was so bad that she had to kill herself afterwards, so, that is just… that's rough. I don't understand why; she should have just killed him.

Alyssa

Oh yeah, like, she had a hidden dagger, that's how she killed herself. I mean, again, like, if there's a whole gang of people there, she probably wouldn't have been able to take out all of them, but still.

Charlotte

Yeah, it's yeah, they messed up big time. I mean, Nivellen did something that someone committed suicide afterwards, so that's–that's pretty bad.

Alyssa

Right, right. But it was revenge suicide, question mark? This is not useful for anybody, like, this whole thing is just bad juju.

Charlotte

Oh, yeah.

Alyssa

Yeah.

Charlotte

And in this magical world, for all we know, that could have been how the curse is sealed, you know? I have no idea. [Laughs]

Alyssa

Oh, in that, like, she killed herself?

Charlotte

Yeah. Yeah, it could have had something to do with like making sure that curse was–was a good one or something.

Alyssa

Yeah, I assume that that's what it was. I assumed that blood had something to do with starting it and then, spoilers—

Together

—ending it.

Charlotte

Yeah.

Alyssa

Yeah, which we're going to get to.

Charlotte

Yup.

Alyssa

So, a few days after this incident in the temple, Nivellen awakes and finds himself transformed. So, he goes on this rampage through the house. He kills some of the servants, everyone leaves from the complex, and he's just left alone sobbing over the bodies of some of his servants. Yeah, this ain't great.

Charlotte

He just goes on a rampage and has a massive tantrum and then kills people. Like, if he was capable of speaking in the Common Tongue, as he clearly is, I feel like maybe he could have talked to somebody? But, I guess everyone would have just freaked out. I mean, like, I understand, you know. A guy with the head of a bear, that's pretty freaky.

Alyssa

Yeah. [Laughs] I mean, talking to a friend about this, he wondered why, you know, Nivellen just didn't take ten, chill out, and then just emerge, after having contemplated his life and his thoughts and just been like, "Hey, listen, this is weird, I'm aware, but I can control the house now. So, you've got nothing to do.” [Laughs]

Charlotte

“I'm half of a bear now, it's okay though. Everything can continue as normal.”

Alyssa

“And you don't have to do any of the cooking, any of the cleaning, because I got it with my magical curse. Uh, so you can just hang out, we can be friends.” [Charlotte laughs] And... not what happened. He went on a rampage and then everybody ran.

Charlotte

Yep.

Alyssa

Eventually, Nivellen spots a trespasser on the grounds and jumped outside to confront him. The stranger, scared, told the villain the roses he was taking from the rosebush were for his daughter and Nivellen, remembering old fairy tales about romance breaking spells, yells, "Your daughter or your life!"

Charlotte

Oh my god. [Alyssa laughs] Oh, Nivellen.

Alyssa

The merchant confesses that his daughter is only eight. Nivellen, feeling bad, invites the merchant in, giving him gold and precious stones on the way out. So, word spreads amongst peasants about the wealthy beast in the woods and Nivellen hosts a number of girls who are arranged to stay with him for short periods of time, before leaving with some of the family fortune. As the years pass, Nivellen continues to grow confident in himself, and is less concerned about returning to his former state.

Charlotte

I thought it was funny; that part where the merchant's, just, like, "My daughter's eight though." [They laugh] Like, "What do you mean?!"

Alyssa

I can't imagine, like, panicking in the moment, and like, the few milliseconds it must have taken for him to be like, "Argh! Daughter! Argh! Fairy tales! Your daughter or your life." Like, wild.

Charlotte

Yeah, it's definitely a common trope in fairy tales for sure.

Alyssa

Yeah, at this point, he's been alone. This is the first human interaction he's had in months. At this point in his life, he presumably wants to break this curse.

Charlotte

Yeah, [mockingly, because eye-rolling fantasy tropes] the kiss of a fair, virgin maiden, [Alyssa laughs] will break your curse and solve all of your problems.

Alyssa

And he does think that. He does think that. So, as these villagers, you know, keep bringing their daughters to this creature, boar, bear-like thing... just in the middle of the woods. Yeah, it definitely comes out that Nivellen stops believing in, like, the power of women or the power of virgins or, like... he stops believing that, um, because none of it works.

Charlotte

Yeah, he just feels so lonely. He just continues to be a sugar daddy [Alyssa laughs, because it's v. true] for awhile.

Alyssa

Basically, that's–that is exactly what he is.

Charlotte

Oh, yeah. Best Sugar Daddy Ever™ apparently. Yeah, this is, um, the whole arrangement of, you know, the–the "daughter or your life" thing. I mean, I–I–I'm sure most people that have read this story draw common lines between this story and Beauty and the Beast.

Alyssa

Right.

Charlotte

Because in that story, you know, oh, it's the love of the fair maiden, or whatever, that breaks the curse and the beast is no longer a beast. And, Sapkowski, he does this a lot; he sort of does these little homages to famous fairy tales within the Witcher world. Um, he has a tendency to take well known fairy tales and then just sort of like rewrite them in his own way, into the Witcher universe.

Alyssa

Exactly.

Charlotte

And that's kind of what he did here. It's, like, a Beauty and the Beast premise. Um, he's done this with Rapunzel and Snow White and, like, other fairy tales throughout the series, but in the original Beauty and the Beast, the beast, sort of, being a sugar daddy is also a thing. [Laughs] Like, he sends people back with jewels and magical robes and beautiful trinkets and things.

Alyssa

Yeah.

Charlotte

I was like, Oh, that's–this is familiar. Good job Sapkowski. [They laugh] Just throw Geralt in there, yeah, make it interesting.

Alyssa

Yeah, I mean, as a reader reads through the short stories especially, it's definitely clear that, as you said, like, Sapkowski, for lack of a better word, just like, he mutates these fairytales, [Charlotte chuckles] um, into something that's still recognizable and vaguely familiar, but unexpected.

Charlotte

Just like, there's Geralt. What's he gonna do?

Alyssa

He sticks himself in everybody's business—

Charlotte

I know!

Alyssa

—like nobody's business. [They laugh, because it's still true.] What a sweet baby angel, but so... like, no common sense when it comes to other people. Very good at his job, zero common sense with other people.

Charlotte

I'm, like, half the time I'm wondering if he. like, followed this lead of these, like, corpses of travelers on the road out of boredom? Or, it feels like, [imitates Geralt] "Oh, if it's a monster, then maybe I'll get some coin." Like, it's kind of hard to tell where he's going with it. Like, what are his motivations here? Is it just boredom? I don't know.

Alyssa

It–it seems like a really morbid, like, Hansel and Gretel way to, like, find friends. [They laugh.]

Charlotte

Oh yeah.

Alyssa

So we can dig into, like, the arrangement that he really creates with the fathers, rather with the girls themselves. So, he does mention that when these fathers bring their daughters, which happens quite frequently, I think there were at least, like, there were probably, like, five or six girls he spent time with. They go through the same cyclical period of being really terrified of him, and then enjoying his company, and then some of them engage with him, get into the sexy times with him, get a li'l freaky with him, and like, in his beast form. And he does mention, he's like, "I ran in the mirror between breaks to see if anything had changed." [They laugh, half because it's funny, half in pained female disbelief. Lol.] Good on you!

Charlotte

You poor thing.

Alyssa

And it didn't work. Uh, which is why he at some point becomes a little jaded and a little, um, very much a realist with himself in his situation.

Charlotte

Mmhm.

Alyssa

It's so strange. Like, they have this lovely little thing about consent in his story, and when he talks about these women. He says, like, you know, they were treated like princesses when they were here. They only held a fan and didn't–weren't stooping over washing, that sort of thing.

Charlotte

Yeah, I actually found that kind of interesting.

Alyssa

Mmhm.

Charlotte

Just because, you're sort of introduced to this character, sort of, like, "Oh, he's a bumbling, cursed rapist." [Alyssa laughs] You know? And then, like, afterwards, like, "He's a nice guy—"

Alyssa

Yeah.

Charlotte

"—he raped somebody, but he's a nice guy."

Alyssa

It's so bad, because I just had, like, that scene from Shrek pop into my head [Charlotte laughs, probably because she—understandably—has no idea where this tangent is about to go.] and in the background, just, "Time may change me but I can't change time." [They laugh] And that's, like, basically what happens with Nivellen, and I think it's part of the circumstance of a situation where he's, like, no longer this, like, miserable pushover and this uncertain person, and then he just kind of grows into his beastly self, you know, for better for worse? Question mark?

Charlotte

Yeah, I feel like Sapkowski and–and, you know, the character of Nivellen at that point are just sort of, like, you know, "How can I make up for this horrible thing I've done? Well, like, every other woman I meet, I'll treat like royalty."

Alyssa

Yeah, I wonder if it's intentional repentance? Or, if it's really just him not being within peer pressure or being alone? And he kind of reverts back, to some extent, to who he was without this gang in his life. Like, what does his authentic self look like?

Charlotte

Yeah.

Alyssa

I guess that this is it? Question mark? But I wonder, like, what these years have done to him mentally, because he had that period where he was just miserable, depressed, and alone. And then these few years with these women build his confidence.

Charlotte

Yes, maybe–maybe he found the light, you know, who knows? [Laughs]

Alyssa

I feel, like, we–we're all kind of weird and dumb and awkward when we're preteens.

Charlotte

Definitely

Alyssa

Which, presumably, Nivellen, when this happened, is somewhere in his, like, preteens, maybe mid-teens, uh, when this curse first happens. You know, we're now twelve years on, so he's probably... I'd ballpark him maybe in his early to mid-twenties at this point.

Charlotte

Yeah, and, like, I have to keep reminding myself, you know, especially talking about this particular story; this happened in a fantasy world. [Alyssa laughs] You know, like, this isn't something that happened in the real world and in fantasy world, justice is different. [Alyssa laughs]

Alyssa

Also, there are bear people.

Charlotte

Yeah, then there's bear people, yeah.

Alyssa

"I have to remind myself that the bear people aren't real people."

Charlotte

Yeah, not real people. So, it's, yeah, maybe–maybe he's a good guy now.

Alyssa

Yeah, people change, I suppose.

Charlotte

Yeah.

Alyssa

I mean, I know I'm significantly different [laughs] from when I was like thirteen, twelve.

Charlotte

Yeah, he definitely seems to have grown up a bit.

Alyssa

Yes, as is inevitable for all of us.

Charlotte

[Sighs]

Alyssa

Just, like, staring into the passage of time, watching it fly by.

Charlotte

Mmhm.

Alyssa

On his way out, Geralt asks Nivellen about the girl outside the manor, saying that she's likely a monster herself. Nivellen insists to Geralt that they love each other. As they speak, Nivellen interacts with Roach, the witcher's horse, in the courtyard, proud that animals like him. Geralt asks again if Nivellen needs his help and Nivellen tentatively asks about lifting the curse, citing "monstrous dreams that he's been having." Just as he's about to leave, Nivellen calls out to Geralt, asking if he came here following the tracks of a merchant who had been to the property recently. Geralt confirms that something happened to one of them and Nivellen reminds Geralt to leave the forest quickly for his safety and leaves the courtyard.

Charlotte

Well, that's ominous.

Alyssa

This is a very short part of this sub-part, but it has a lot of information that is necessary later.

Charlotte

Mmhm.

Alyssa

Like, all of the information that you get in this part is necessary later.

Charlotte

Yeah–yes [chuckles].

Alyssa

So, before leaving, Geralt tells Nivellen the church that they had raided, was the church of Coram Agh Tera, the lion-headed spider. Again, we hear that this place is just, like, not great; superbad juju, green flames, skulls and bones on the altar.

Charlotte

Sick. [They laugh]

Alyssa

That's dope!

And, yeah, so, this is, like, a very specific temple that's, like, not really known for being... one of the friendlier ones.

Charlotte

Idiots. They're like, "Let's go raid this one! It's got skulls and bones and green fire."

Alyssa

So, Nivellen this whole time, as he's been talking to Geralt, has been telling him, like, "Eh. I don't really want to lift it. I'm stronger this way. I'm not sick all the time as I was when I was human. I have more confidence in myself, my libido is great, like, all this other stuff—

Charlotte

[Laughs] Oh god.

Alyssa

—and then, in this moment of vulnerability, right before Geralt is about to leave, he actually asks, like, is it possible to lift this? He admits that he's been having these wild dreams, and he just describes them as "monstrous" and we don't really get much, but Geralt tells Nivellen in this moment, he's like, "Yes, you should be afraid."

As seemingly unimportant as this may seem, [laughs] uh, Nivellen's interaction with Roach: he's, like, kind of, patting the horse and the horse really likes him. And Nivellen says, like, "Animals like me. My cat came back!" [Charlotte snickers] He says, like, you know, "Even though I'm in this monstrous form, I get along with them." The last little bit of information is the detail of what Geralt believes that girl is. Geralt tells Nivellen that that girl was probably a rusalka. If I'm remembering correctly, a rusalka is a kind of, you know, female water creature or demon.

Charlotte

So, kind of like an OP [“overpowered”] nymph, or something.

Alyssa

Yeah, that kind of sounds like what it is.

Charlotte

Like a messed up water nymph that just wants to see you dead.

Alyssa

Yeah, there's a lot of women like that. [Laughs]

Charlotte

Oh yeah.

Alyssa

Nivellen says that, you know, he suspected as much. She's, like, dark and, like, weird and speaks in a some sort of odd language he can't understand. But then he insists, like, "We love each other." Cute. But also, like, how? [Laughs]

Charlotte

Yeah, that's kind of weird. And also like, why–why wouldn't she take him as a victim? Like, I found that very interesting, too.

Alyssa

Yeah, that's definitely one of the more interesting questions that comes up that's answered by the end of the chapter. In parts III and IV, we see Geralt in these two small moments after he has left Nivellen's manor.

Ignoring Nivellen's advice, Geralt spends the night in the forest, eventually coming across something which makes Roach nervous and fussy. The horse's demeanor reminds Geralt of Nivellen's words at their departure: "Animals like me."

So at this point, Geralt has made some sort of connection that isn't totally clear for the reader just by reading these, um, parts,

Charlotte

He's definitely tuned into what his horse is doing, which makes a lot of sense to me, actually.

Alyssa

Yeah?

Charlotte

I used to work with horses a lot on a pretty regular basis. I used to ride them, I used to take care of them, and I gotta say that they're definitely up there with some of the most psychic animals I've ever been around.

Alyssa

Mmhm.

Charlotte

I'm sure a lot of people know of the saying that, like, horses can smell fear. Or, you know, you can't be nervous when you're around them, because they'll pick up on that and exploit it. [They laugh]

Alyssa

Ominous.

Charlotte

But no, they're–they're very, very psychically-inclined animals, and they pick up on a lot of really, subtle things that most people, and you know, most normal humans aren't aware of. And apparently, they're more sensitive to some things even than witchers. You know, except the poor horse doesn't have, like, a silver sword and, you know, crazy reflexes, so they–they just get scared about it.

Alyssa

It also probably doesn't help that Geralt is just being rather dense this whole chapter. [They laugh]

Charlotte

Yeah.

Alyssa

And then you've got the horse being like, "Um, Ma'am? Something's not right." And it takes so long for Geralt to actually listen.

Charlotte

"Could we–could we maybe not stay here? That would be great."

Alyssa

Yeah. So, the connection that Geralt makes here is that there's this little ring of mushrooms, which the narrator refers to as a devil's ring. These stupid, little mushrooms make Roach scared. Geralt is, like, "What the fuck is wrong with you?" [Not a direct quote] And he remembers how fussy she was at the beginning of the chapter, when Geralt first encountered the girl in the woods and she didn't want to go toward the manor. And comparing her behavior in those two moments against what Nivellen said about "animals like me," it's clear to Geralt that Roach and, you know, her animalistic instincts, has identified that Nivellen is, in her–in her mind, you know, fine and non-threatening, but there's something weird about these goddamn mushrooms and there's something really weird about that girl. And this is when Geralt finally realizes that, like, "Oh, something might be wrong."

Charlotte

Way to go, Geralt.

Alyssa

Took you long enough, but ya got there.

Charlotte

Like, he had completely forgotten about, like, the mutilated people on the road until Nivellen, you know, was like, "Yeah, maybe just don't come back here tonight."

Alyssa

Right.

Charlotte

"Don't worry about it, just head on out. Go find the road. See you later."

Alyssa

I know. Geralt was too busy trying to, like, play it cool and, like, acting his way into Nivellen's home and then he's like, "Oh shit. That's right. That's why. [Laughs] I was here following the tracks of some dead people." [Again, not a direct quote]

Charlotte

Yeah, I don't know what he was doing, he's like "Okay, bye."

Alyssa

Oh. Sweet, sweet baby. [They laugh]

In Part V, Geralt returns to Nivellen's manor, his silver sword now on his back. The gate is wide open and he hears singing in a language he can't understand. The girl from the forest is now on the back of the dolphin, in the middle of the dried fountain, singing. Geralt confronts the girl and guesses that she's been attempting to enslave Nivellen's mind so he'll blindly murder people for her, but also assumes that she hasn't succeeded yet. She reveals herself to be a bruxa, a kind of vampire, and attacks the witcher, turning into a giant black bat. In confronting her, Geralt says:

[Reading] “You’re so like a rusalka that you could deceive anyone. But horses are never mistaken. They recognize creatures like you instinctively and perfectly. What are you? I think you’re a moola, or an alpor. An ordinary vampire couldn’t come out in the sun.”

This scene is so funny, because it's almost, like, this Scooby–Doo monologue where you're not getting it from the villain, but you're getting this huge monologue from the hero about, "I think you're this," and she doesn't say anything because she's mute. He's like, "Are you... this?" She doesn't say anything. She just kind of shakes her head. Um, so she can understand him. It's just really funny.

Charlotte

It's, kind of, like a weird, like, monster jeopardy.

Alyssa

Yeah.

Charlotte

I feel, like, a lot of the time, while he's monologuing to her about, like, "Are you so and so," I think that he's actually just biding time—

Alyssa

Yeah.

Charlotte

—so that he can, like, either get himself into a good position if there's a threat or, like, just try and, um, figure out what she is by, like, getting, like, a little bit closer to her.

Alyssa

Yeah.

Charlotte

Or just seeing if he can reason with her, you know, the same way he did with Nivellen.

Alyssa

Mmhm.

Charlotte

Because of Roach mostly and I guess because his, you know, his, you know, seemingly dull witcher senses at this point. [Alyssa laughs] He's like, "Oh, definitely something up here."

Alyssa

I actually haven't thought about this. Did he know that she would understand him or was he just kind of talking? Like, we do know that there are different kinds of monsters and classes of monsters in this universe and each of them have varying degrees of, um, sentience?

Charlotte

Yeah, or just varying degrees of intelligence and sentience.

Alyssa

I'm curious to know: if Geralt has been unable to identify exactly what she is, if he's talking for the sake of talking or if he knows that she can understand him. And, I mean, obviously, she does, like, because she starts reacting and she starts nodding and shaking her head, but was he just going to talk at her if she didn't?

Charlotte

I'm not really sure, I mean, maybe he was trying to, in a way, like, flatter her?

Alyssa

Okay.

Charlotte

By being like, "Ooh, you're so like this. Ooh, but you're not." [Alyssa chuckles] I-I sort of feel like he was trying to flatter her.

Alyssa

Yeah?

Charlotte

To make her, like, come out in her true form by listing all the things that she's not, like, "You're superior to all of these things."

Alyssa

Interesting. That's an interesting perspective.

Charlotte

"But what are you? Like, oh, what are you. You're superior. All these other things are just inferior to you. You wouldn't like it if I called you a rusalka, would you?"

Alyssa

[Laughs] So any men listening, if you need dating advice... [They laugh] Just lay it on thick.

Charlotte

Just tell me everything that's inferior to me. [Laughter] Tell me how I'm superior.

Alyssa

Oh, Lord. So, you have a couple of details here about things that you've researched about bruxas, do you want to tell us a little bit about that?

Charlotte

Yeah, I–I was interested to figure out if a bruxa was something from Polish mythology or from a different mythology, as Sapkowski is, you know, wont to do. He will just, sort of, grab different bits of fairy tales from all over the world. What I found out was that a bruxa, although I don't know if it's pronounced bruxa, in its native language, but from what I understand it originates in Portugal.

Alyssa

Okay

Charlotte

And it may be pronounced "BRU-há" or a "BROU-hā." Uh, a bruxa is, in Portuguese mythology at least, is a female vampire, and they're normally transformed into a vampiric form via witchcraft. And according to their mythology and fairy tales, they leave home at night in the form of a bird and their favorite activity is tormenting weary, lost travelers. So, I was like, oh, well that fits nicely.

Alyssa

Um, Nivellen does have a note that she likes birds, which then this is probably par for the course with what Sapkowski intended. Yeah, but I feel like lost travelers don't need any additional tormenting.

Charlotte

Yeah, right?

Alyssa

This just sounds like a terribly rude... mosquito-like, uh, vampire.

Charlotte

Yeah, and, uh, well it was interesting, because at the very beginning of this story, Geralt wouldn't even have found the bodies in the road, had he not noticed, you know, like, scavenger birds.

Alyssa

Yes.

Charlotte

Um, and he just sort of, like, [imitates Geralt] "Oh, those birds look like they're interested in something morbid. Let's go that way." [Alyssa giggles] So I thought it was interesting how it, sort of, like, he mentions her like of birds and throws birds into the story. I think as a way to sort of reference the origins of this particular monster.

Alyssa

Mmhm.

Charlotte

I don't know if that's true or not but that's just how I interpret it.

Alyssa

Yeah.

Charlotte

She's–she appears as a beautiful maiden, leads a normal human life by day. Apparently bruxas are able to bear children, but she eats her children as a regular form of food—

Alyssa

Oh no! [Emphatically]

Charlotte

[Laughs] So, there's that. And it's also said that she's impossible to kill.

Alyssa

Eugh.

Charlotte

So, that's also an interesting little tidbit. But yeah, that's that's what I learned about–about the bruxa.

Alyssa

Creepy. [They laugh] Odd. But is eating your own children sustainable? Like, this–this seems, like, really inefficient. If a bruxa has the same, you know, maternity cycle as a regular human, eating like that every nine months, that seems really inefficient.

Charlotte

Yes, I agree.

Alyssa

Some crazy Kronos shit.

Charlotte

Definitely not unheard of for Mother Nature, though, I mean, it happens in nature all the time but—

Alyssa

This is true.

Charlotte

—definitely not sustainable.

Alyssa

No, this seems kind of shortsighted.

Charlotte

Oh, yeah.

Alyssa

At this point, we see the bruxa and Geralt engage in combat. She's fast and she's agile, and Geralt eventually lands a small cut no longer than a little finger on her chest. The bruxa transforms back into her female form and through telepathy threatens to kill him. During the battle, Nivellen stumbles into the courtyard, bleeding and shouting for Vereena, as the vampire and the witcher fight. As each of them struggle to gain the upper hand, Nivellen calls out to her, distracting her from the fight, and stabs her through the chest with a broken pole. The vampire pulls the pole deeper into her chest, bringing herself closer and closer to Nivellen, who still holds the shaft. She attempts to kill him and the witcher instinctively runs toward the pair, and with a forceful cut, beheads the bruxa.

Charlotte

Yeah, it's pretty gory. I remember thinking the imagery of that was, uh, particularly gnarly. [Alyssa laughs, she probably hasn't heard the word "gnarly" since Tony Hawk's 2004 Playstation classic, Underground 2] I quite liked it. I was like, "Ugh, gross."

Alyssa

It's oddly poetic—

Charlotte

Yeah.

Alyssa

—the way that she's described as, like, a white butterfly on a pin. And as she's pulling herself down this pole, this pole is erupting from her back along with her blood. The fight ends very suddenly. So, Geralt and this bruxa are going at it and then Nivellen interjects himself into the fight, and then all of a sudden it's over. As she goes to kill him, she tells him, "Mine or nobody's. I love you." And then that's when she goes to, like, chomp on his neck and end it.

Charlotte

Oh yeah. So, when Geralt cuts her head off, right before she bites Nivellen's throat, when I was reading through it, I was just like, that's how the curse was supposed to end. Nivellen was supposed to die. Right there. In the hands of his bruxa. She was supposed to rip his throat out. And Geralt is just like, "Nope!" Whoop! [Accurately mimics the unmistakable sound of a lethal monster being beheaded.] And he just, like, cuts her head off. Just like, "Nope!"

Alyssa

Can you imagine that sound effect, like, in the Netflix series every time he, like, makes a cut. Whoop! Whoop!

Charlotte

Schloop! Aaand it's gone. But, it's just like, he ruined a perfectly good curse, man. That supposed to be his punishment for rape: death by Bruxa. Like, you totally ruined it.

Alyssa

I don't know if you intended this way—if the curse itself and the details of the curse were about love and blood, saying that he would die at the hands of, like, a vampire, it-it would be, actually, a very interesting and poetic way to tie all that up and an interesting interpretation of what "blood" means in the context of this curse.

Charlotte

Mmhm, yeah, that's definitely how I interpreted it.

Alyssa

Oh my god, all the layers. [They laugh]

Charlotte

Yeah, yeah, she's, like, dragging herself along this pole, you know, pulling her bloody body down this splintering pole towards her lover and being like, "If I can't have you, no one can," and ripping out his throat, like, that's–that's exactly what that priestess intended. [Alyssa laughs] And Geralt's just like, [mockingly] "Derp-a-derr. Oh, I can't let that happen. Sorry."

Alyssa

This is not the time to be hero, um [laughter] Geralt just always finds himself into the middle of everybody's business, when he shouldn't.

Charlotte

Yeah. I mean, it's a complicated situation, I'll give him that. Like, it's complicated.

Alyssa

Yeah.

Charlotte

At least, in killing Vereena, preventing any more weary travelers from–from a horrible fate.

Alyssa

Just leaves the TSA at it then. Eugh!

Charlotte

Yep, mmhm.

Alyssa

[Half-sung] A–mer-i-can Jokes!

Charlotte

America... it's crazy!

Alyssa

[Laughs] Oh, goddamn it. [Laughter]

After Geralt beheads the bruxa, he approaches Nivellen, who has been transformed back into his human form. In his sobbing and laughing disbelief, Nivelelen asks Geralt:

[Reading] “Why? After so many years, how’s it possible?”

And Geralt responds:

[Reading] “There’s a grain of truth in every fairy tale. Love and blood. They both possess a mighty power. Wizards and learned men have been racking their brains for years, but they haven’t arrived at anything except that—”

“That what, Geralt?”

“It has to be true love.”

Charlotte

[Unexpectedly blows raspberry, Alyssa laughs] This is so cute.

Alyssa

It's a surprising end to this. I think given what readers know about The Witcher, as it's been written, up until this point, it's a surprisingly, light-hearted end.

Charlotte

Yeah, it wraps it up in a nice little bow.

Alyssa

Geralt concludes the story with this concept of the power of love and blood. Presumably, he means Vereena's love and blood is ultimately what broke Nivellen curse. Because the curse is finally broken, you can assume that every person that Nivellen has encountered up until this point, regardless of, you know, their relationship with him, has never been true love, which... is interesting, and I think begs a lot of questions around like, what was the nature of their relationship? Did they court each other in a traditional way? Like, how do you go about dating a vampire? Is Netflix and Chill, like, still on the table? [They laugh] What is the–what is the day to day like of being, like, a bear man and this vampire? Like, is she wandering around in pajamas eating cereal, like? Like, do they poop in front of each other? Like, these are the questions that I have, like, how real is this relationship?

Charlotte

That's a really good question. I think it's interesting that they say that she really loves him. I–I know they end the story with, you know, "Oh, it was true love. It has to be true love." But part of me just wonders if the curse was broken, because he killed the bruxa?

Alyssa

Interesting, yeah.

Charlotte

And like, I feel like the bruxa was, like, the embodiment of Nivellen's curse. Although, it's nice to think that, you know, Vereena actually did love him and that her last words were, "I love you," which is very sweet.

Alyssa

Barring the fact that she tried to kill him.

Charlotte

Y–y–yeah, I mean, she–she was like, "If I can't have you, nobody will," [laughs] and was gonna rip his throat out. So, what does the vampiric relationship look like? It's not a very healthy one, I mean, you can apply that term to a lot of relationships in the real world.

Alyssa

Oh, absolutely.

Charlotte

They may not be sucking your blood, but uh, [chuckles] I think–I think on some level, you know, those of us that have been in the relationship game for a while, we know exactly what a vampiric relationship looks like.

Alyssa

Oh yeah. Womp. I, yeah, I suppose you can compare it to an abusive relationship, where you have someone who is a victim and then you also have someone who has a need and a desire for control on, you know, so many levels. In this specific scenario, you know, she wanted or needed Nivellen to be a resource for her as she terrorized this forest and this–and the towns nearby. In–in some, like, in some part of her soul, like, she really did love him, otherwise the curse wouldn't have been broken at all. But it's very much, like, I think, like, an inner perception as to how to define love.

Charlotte

Yeah, definitely. There's a lot of different definitions of it and it's different for everybody. Depends on the situation.

Alyssa

So, now that we've wrapped up our discussion reading of "A Grain of Truth," Charlotte, what have you taken away from this short story?

Charlotte

Well, before I criticize Nivellen and Geralt any more than I already have.... [laughter] I mean, a lot of it, sort of, comes down to don't judge a book by its cover?

Alyssa

Mmhm.

Charlotte

You know, that sort of saying. Um, because Geralt, although, he does seem monstrous to the outside world, isn't necessarily a monster. And, you know, one could say the same of Nivellen. It's just sort of, like, a circumstantial problem that, uh, a lot of people don't bother to understand.

Alyssa

Mmhm.

Charlotte

So, not making split-second decisions and judging people right off the bat.

Alyssa

Right.

Charlotte

Um, is–is sort of, like, one of the little moral takeaways. You know, try to have some sympathy for the villain.

Alyssa

Yeah.

Charlotte

But then, there's the other part of me that's just, like, well, [laughs] you can be a spineless young boy who–who rapes a priestess and gets cursed, and one day a bored witcher could just come along and make everything okay. You know, totally by accident. You don't actually have to face the actual consequence, which should have been a bruxa ripping your throat out on the end of a bloody spike. Like, that should have been your curse. But no, Nivellen! You're a changed man. [Alyssa sighs] So, you know, and also, trust your horse.

Alyssa

Yeah, yeah.

Charlotte

I love Roach.

Alyssa

Iconic, absolutely iconic. Um, so we're going to take a quick break, and when we return Charlotte and I go behind the scenes of her shop, Vengerberg Glamarye.