Historian and author Rutger Bregman has some radical ideas - ideas completely at odds with conventional thinking.

A basic income for everyone, with no strings attached. Free apartments for the homeless, fewer hours at work, and more job-sharing.

Rutger quotes research which indicates how such schemes actually save governments money.

He's travelled the world researching the nature of poverty, and why poor people apparently make poor life choices.

The data led Rutger to realise that everything he thought he knew about poverty was wrong.

Further information

Utopia for Realists - And How We Can Get There is published by Bloomsbury

First broadcast September 2017