Ex-New York Times reporter Judith Miller and rightwing guerilla filmmaker James O’Keefe filmed an hour-long discussion trying to answer the question that has persisted through their careers: “Why do they hate us?”

“I think journalists who poke holes in comforting narratives tend to be subjected to a fair amount of scorn,” Miller told O’Keefe. “I’ve spent my whole life trying to poke holes in comfortable narratives. And I think that annoys people.”

She commiserated with O’Keefe about being “despised” by the mainstream media, saying that the two were united by “skepticism” and their efforts to get at the truth.

Miller is widely known for her reportage on weapons of mass destruction in the lead up to the Iraq War, while O’Keefe is known for doing things like crossing the U.S.-Mexico border dressed as Osama bin Laden.

“That’s what journalism is, trial and error,” Miller said to O’Keefe in the interview.

Watch the clip: