Alex Jones sparred with rapper T.I. on the latter’s new podcast, ExpediTIously, on the topic of whether President Trump can unify the country, or if he is “exceptionally dumb.”

TI started the debate with Alex Jones on President Trump by saying that his problem with the President is “his disregard and disrespect for black lives and all the rhetoric that he spews,” giving as an example the debunked quote “there are very fine people on both sides,” in relation to the Charlottesville protests in 2017. “[I] can give you credit for being exceptionally smart and intelligent, or I can deal with you as though you are exceptionally dumb and unintelligent, but I can’t hop back and forth and do both,” T.I. said:

So, a person who is exceptionally smart and intelligent, would know that would lend itself to the opinion of adversity of the peope who are the most oppressed and have been the most disenfranchised throughout history. So you can’t say, “oh well he just said that and he didn’t mean it that way,” unless you want me to assume that he is exceptionally dumb and unintelligent… If you say those words, you know what those words mean if you are exceptionally intelligent, or you are exceptionally dumb.

Jones noted that it could be taken as a dog whistle to white supremacists, but noted that many apparent white supremacist groups have been “infiltrated” and created by the SPLC and others:

[They find] mentally ill people to follow them, over and over again. Many of the leaders of the groups are feds! Those individuals, their parents all worked for Obama and Hillary, and they themselves just a year before worked for Hillary, and then suddenly they’re going round in 1930s Nazi outfits, and suddenly there’s a big clash, and then “oh, America will now fight with itself… In Germany, the Guardian reported that most white supremacist groups are created by the governent, who get them to do atrocities, so they can then sit there and divide the people. It’s the oldest trick in the book…

“Trump is always trying to unify”, Jones said, which prompted T.I. to jump in and claim that that was a lie. T.I. gave the examples of Trump calling third-world countries “s***hole countries,” not giving aid to Puerto Rico, “turning people away at the border,” and calling Baltimore “rat infested,” as evidence that the President is behaving in an “un-American” way:

Those people that came from “s***hole countries,” were people of colour… How can Trump unify people when he’s being critical of refugees from third world countries when America was founded by immigrants?… The leader of the American people, what we know now as the leader of the free world, says to all the people that he’s leading that one of these territories is rat infested… That is not an appropriate way to lead.

Jones then went through and debunked each of T.I.’s points in turn. On the point of America being founded by immigrants, “everybody wasn’t getting free stuff,” when they were coming into the country in decades past. “The US has the most open border policy in the world,” Jones said. “The Democrat/globalist plan is to bankrupt the country.”

He went on to note that T.I.’s comments about what Trump said on Baltimore were simply “not true”:

From the perspective of where you’re coming from, that’s a lie… You heard what they clipped out… Elijah Cummings got up there as chairman of his committee, and he did this whole fake thing, with “Trump is the devil! He’s horrible and there’s these kids in these cages,” when it was Obama who tripled the count of those facilities… Trump goes “why don’t you take care of your own district? It’s not fit for the people who are living there, it’s rat infested and falling apart”… The media spun it to “Trump is saying that black people are rats!” That’s the takeaway!

T.I. applauded Jones for his past coverage of governmental misdeeds, but said that he has “chosen to leave people of colour out of it.” “When it comes to systemic oppression, it feels like, we are the prototype,” he added. Jones counteracted. “I have talked about how blacks have been used as the beta test for oppressing groups,” he said:

There is a systematic system to genocide all cultures. They want a global corporate mono-culture…People need their own identity so that they can be strong and be overwhelmed by this global synthetic thing.

Jones told National File that the full podcast will be “bigger than Joe Rogan” – you can listen to it here.