Monday 19th October 2015

She's the former union boss once lauded as a "lion of the union movement" for blowing the whistle on corruption. He's a senior quasi judicial officer ruling on major industrial disputes with the power to rule on workers' wages and conditions.

Together, Kathy Jackson and Michael Lawler appeared a formidable power couple.

But in a stunning reversal of fortune, four years after first hitting the headlines, Jackson has been branded a liar, found to have illegally spent more than a million dollars in union funds to fuel a lavish lifestyle and the subject of a major police investigation.

Lawler too is facing a barrage of criticism and calls for his removal as Vice President of the Fair Work Commission over allegations he's benefitted from her illegal spending and conducted complex legal work for Jackson while claiming sick leave.

With extensive and exclusive access, reporter Caro Meldrum-Hanna takes you into their highly controversial world.

Until now, Michael Lawler has never spoken publicly. In candid and at times startling scenes he talks in detail about the controversy engulfing them both. And Jackson, in her first interview since the finding of theft, reflects on her actions.

Caro Meldrum-Hanna: "Perhaps you've lost sight, you've been caught up in a conspiracy theory or created one in an attempt to cover up your own wrong doing?"

Michael Lawler: "That's bullshit."

Four Corners takes you into the eye of the storm.

'Jackson & Lawler', reported by Caro Meldrum-Hanna and presented by Kerry O'Brien, goes to air on Monday 19th of October at 8.30pm. It is replayed on Tuesday 20th October at 10.00am and Wednesday 21st at midnight. It can also be seen on ABC News 24 on Saturday at 8.00pm, ABC iview and at abc.net.au/4corners.

Transcript

19 October 2015 - Jackson and Lawler: Inside the Eye of the Storm

Viewer Advice: The following program contains extremely coarse language.

KERRY O'BRIEN, PRESENTER: Tonight on Four Corners: as scrutiny intensifies and authorities close in, we take you inside the world of Kathy Jackson and Michael Lawler, the union official and the industrial tribunal vice-president in a world of trouble.

POLICE OFFICER: Michael and Kathy, this is Inspector William. He's also from the Wollongong Local Area Command. Mr William will go up to the shipping container, where a search of this shipping container will start with another search team.

(Footage of Kathy Jackson reading newspaper article about herself and Michael Lawler)

KATHY JACKSON, NATIONAL SECRETARY, HSU, 2008-2015: It says, "Police raids coincide with preparation for an ABC Four Corners program. Blah-blah-blah. The story of their troubled lives."

(Michael Lawler brings Kathy Jackson a cup of tea. He kisses her on the forehead)

MICHAEL LAWLER, VICE-PRESIDENT, FAIR WORK COMMISSION: Here we are, sweetheart.

KATHY JACKSON: Oh, thank you.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA, REPORTER (to Kathy Jackson and Michael Lawler): Is it possible that perhaps you have lost perspective? You've been caught up in a conspiracy theory or created one in an attempt to cover up your own wrongdoing?

(Kathy Jackson snorts contemptuously)

MICHAEL LAWLER: That's bullshit.

KERRY O'BRIEN: Kathy Jackson is the former union boss who went from the hero who blew the whistle on corruption to the pariah who herself illegally spent more than $1 million of union funds to fuel a lavish lifestyle and is now the subject of a major police investigation.

Jackson's partner, Michael Lawler, is the quasi-judicial officer ruling on major industrial disputes who is now facing allegations that he benefited from her illegal spending and rorted his sick leave while working on her court room defence.

They have now given extraordinary access to reporter Caro Meldrum-Hanna to give startling and at times bizarre accounts of how they came to be in the mess they're in: accounts that raise new and serious questions about their conduct.

Lawler has never spoken publicly before about their predicament. In candid moments he reveals, amongst other things, that he secretly taped conversations with his boss, the president of the Fair Work Commission.

Tonight we take you into the eye of their storm.

(Excerpt from Michael Lawler's video diary, 24 July 2014)

MICHAEL LAWLER: Hello. Ah, my name's Michael Lawler. Er, you don't normally hear from somebody like me. I hold a quasi-judicial office in an organisation called the Fair Work Commission.

I am going to make some allegations that are properly described as sensational.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA, REPORTER (voiceover): This is the secret video diary of a desperate man.

MICHAEL LAWLER: There are strong conventions against judges or quasi-judicial officers making public comment on matters of public controversy. I have been involved in matters of public controversy these last several years and I have refrained from making public comment.

But having weighed the matter carefully, I can see that it is my duty to make this statement.

(Excerpt ends)

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: Michael Lawler is vice-president of the Fair Work Commission, the tribunal responsible for industrial relations and workplace rights across Australia. He holds one of the most powerful offices in the land.

He's also a man under enormous pressure.

MICHAEL LAWLER: Everybody's got a breaking point and I've certainly been close to mine. It took quite a long time to get there but, um, I've certainly been close to mine.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: Michael Lawler's troubles began eight years ago, when he met and fell in love with the woman who's ended up almost destroying them both.

(Excerpt from Michael Lawler's video diary, 24 July 2014)

MICHAEL LAWLER: In 2008 a significant accident occurred in my life - and by accident, I don't mean a mistake: by accident, I mean something coincidental. I met and formed a relationship with Katherine Jackson, the national secretary of the Health Services Union.

(Excerpt ends)

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: Do you think that your love for Kathy will ultimately be your downfall?

MICHAEL LAWLER: Um... I'm not very good at predicting the future. And if it is, so be it. Um, the real question is whether or not my love for Kathy has clouded my judgement about the facts...

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: Has it?

MICHAEL LAWLER: ...and about the evidence. And I don't believe that it has.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: Well, do you feel responsible for dragging Michael into this?

KATHY JACKSON: Of course I do. Sometimes I wish he just would've run and not at all got involved. And it would've been so far easier if they just killed me early on, destroyed me early on.

KATHY JACKSON (Lateline, ABC TV, 24 Aug. 2011): Anyone in our organisation who misuses union money, be it for, you know, prostitution services or other au- unauthorised services, has committed a crime.

KATHY JACKSON (18 Oct. 2011): Our first priority is to the members of the Health Services Union, not to members of the Australian Labor Party.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: As far as falls from grace go, the demise of Kathy Jackson, the former national secretary of the Health Services Union, has been nothing short of spectacular.

She was the courageous whistleblower taking on union corruption: the Coalition's pin-up girl.

TONY ABBOTT, OPPOSITION LEADER (25 Aug. 2011): Mr Speaker, Kathy Jackson is a brave, decent woman and she's speaking up on behalf of 70,000 members.

CHRISTOPHER PYNE, EDUCATION MINISTER (25 Feb. 2014): Kathy Jackson is a revolutionary, Madam Speaker, and Kathy Jackson will be remembered as a lion of the union movement.

(Footage of Kathy Jackson entering court building, archive)

JOURNALIST 1: Because you're adamant you've done nothing wrong?

KATHY JACKSON: No.

JOURNALIST 1: OK.

KATHY JACKSON: Got nothing to hide.

(Footage of Health Services Union meeting, 2009)

UNION MEMBER: You've completely f**ked us over. Well, we think you should f**k off, too!

(Audience cheers. Footage ends)

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: But in a remarkable twist, Australia was told the whistleblower was actually the biggest fraudster of all.

(Footage of Health Services Union meeting, 2009. Kathy Jackson fields questions from a hostile audience)

UNION MEMBER (off-screen): You're married to Jeff Jackson!

KATHY JACKSON: I am not married to Jeff Jackson!

(Footage of Kathy Jackson entering court building, archive)

JOURNALIST 2: You have issues with answering questions from the royal commission?

KATHY JACKSON: Of course I don't.

JOURNALIST 3: But whose money was it?

JOURNALIST 4: Yeah, whose money? Could you tell us whose money it was?

(Footage ends)

JUANITA PHILLIPS, PRESENTER (ABC TV News, 18 Aug): Disgraced former union leader Kathy Jackson has been ordered to pay $1.4 million dollars for misusing union funds.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: In this court room, in a civil case brought against her by the union she used to rule, Kathy Jackson was found to have illegally spent $1.4 million of her members' money. The judge said she'd shown a "pervasive sense of entitlement": years of secret, lavish spending.

(To Chris Brown) Over how long? How many years did Kathy Jackson misappropriate union money?

CHRIS BROWN, NATIONAL SECRETARY, HSU: Look, that we're aware of - because we had to reconstruct the records to be able to establish the evidence; the evidence is documentary evidence - um, it was a period of about, er, seven or eight years.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: The court heard evidence of hundreds of items and activities Kathy Jackson paid for, using a secret account and her work credit cards, from paying off her mortgage to fine dining at the best restaurants...

CAPTION: Restaurants: $22,959.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: …car expenses…

CAPTION: Silverston Jaguar: $11,454.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: …cameras…

CAPTION: Camera and accessories: $2,684.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: …food and liquor...

CAPTIONS: Food and liquor: $19,639.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: …department store purchases…

CAPTION: Department stores: $20,565.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: …baby accessories…

CAPTION: Baby wear: $1,964.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: …luxury brand shopping…

CAPTION: Bulgari: $3,000.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: ...even artworks.

CAPTION: Charles Blackman sketch: $4,636.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: She still denies it.

(To Kathy Jackson) Did you, Kathy Jackson, take $1.4 million from the HSU?

KATHY JACKSON: No, I did not take anything like that or anything from the HSU ever...

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: Ever?

KATHY JACKSON: ...that I wasn't to entitled to. And I do want to qualify it like that, because they'll come out and say, "Yes, but you d- spent this money on travel." Yes, I did. I was entitled to that.

(Home video footage taken by Michael Lawler in Santorini)

MICHAEL LAWLER (off-screen): This is the San Antonio apartments in Santorini. That's the front door. Pretty spectacular view.

(Camera pans to show Kathy Jackson on apartment balcony, overlooking the Aegean Sea)

MICHAEL LAWLER (off-screen): Hello, sweetheart.

(Michael Lawler makes kissing sound. Kathy Jackson responds with the same)

(Home video footage taken by Michael Lawler in London)

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: And then there's the travel: 34 trips, $175,000 over eight years.

MICHAEL LAWLER: We're at Piccadilly Circus and there's Eros.

(To Kathy Jackson) What have you got to say for yourself, sweetheart?

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: In these never before seen home videos, Michael Lawler and Kathy Jackson traverse Europe in August and September 2010.

MICHAEL LAWLER (off-screen): Sweetheart how are you? We're at Covent Garden.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: Street parties in England, ancient ruins in Greece, road tripping in America.

(Home video footage taken by Michael Lawler at Yosemite National Park)

KATHY JACKSON: We're at Yosemite National Park in the south...

MICHAEL LAWLER (off-screen): South-east corner of California.

KATHY JACKSON: No, but the south-west corner of the park.

(Michael turns camera around to show his face as he lies on a picnic blanket)

MICHAEL LAWLER: That's me.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: Life on the union dime was very good.

MICHAEL LAWLER: It turns out that I have been the beneficiary of, um, airfares and a small amount of accommodation that was paid for by the union. I didn't know that at the time.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: But when you go away on a trip together, you discuss who is paying for what. How didn't you know?

MICHAEL LAWLER: Well, I did pay for parts of it. If I thought that I was actually the recipient of stolen money, I'd be wanting to repay it myself. But I don't believe that I am.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: Your so-called entitlements seem, at the very least, extraordinary and lavish. How much travel were you entitled to every year when you were with the union?

KATHY JACKSON: Oh, up to about, ah, $28,000 worth of travel.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: So that's in writing: travel entitlements of $28,000 in writing?

KATHY JACKSON: Yes. And they have that.

MICHAEL LAWLER: But the writing's - well, they have it but it's gone. It's not in the public domain. All the minutes - all bar eight sets of minute- meeting minutes are missing.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA (voiceover): Kathy Jackson claims the evidence that could have proved her innocence - minutes of meetings - have disappeared or been destroyed. The court rejected her claim.

Michael Lawler and Kathy Jackson have retreated to the New South Wales south coast. It takes courage - or madness - to let a film crew into your life when your world is collapsing around you.

(Footage of Caro Meldrum-Hanna driving to Michael Lawler's and Kathy Jackson's property. She knocks on the front door)

MICHAEL LAWLER: Hi, Caro. There you go.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: Hi, Michael.

MICHAEL LAWLER: Good to see you. Welcome.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: How are you?

MICHAEL LAWLER: Come in.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: Thank you. S-so Kathy's home today?

MICHAEL LAWLER: She is.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: OK. If I actually can ask you something first-off: you have never spoken publicly. You have never entered into any sort of media coverage o-on, on all of this. Why have you decided to take a different turn and speak?

MICHAEL LAWLER: I feel that my duty is to speak rather than remain silent. I would rather have (laughs) no involvement in any of this. I've been sucked into the political world on account of being Kathy Jackson's partner - and that's an accident of history.

KATHY JACKSON: Can I leave my hair up? What do you think? Out?

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA (voiceover): Kathy Jackson is home on day release from a private mental health facility. She's there voluntarily. She's been in treatment for eight weeks.

KATHY JACKSON: Some days I get so low that I just don't want to keep going anymore. Um, I see the effect it has on my children. I see the affect that it's had on my parents, on Michael and I just don't feel I can go on some days.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: Diagnosed with post-traumatic stress disorder, acute anxiety and depression, she's also come close to suicide.

So why did Jackson blow the whistle if she is corrupt herself?

MICHAEL LAWLER: She blew the whistle because I urged her and encouraged her to do so and reminded her that it was her duty to do so. And really, um, this for her is a case of redemption.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA (to Kathy Jackson): But for Michael Lawler, who is right across there, would you have stayed silent?

KATHY JACKSON: I probably would've resigned and not stayed there.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: What is the importance of your love, Michael Lawler, to this whole story; to this whole saga?

KATHY JACKSON: Everything. Everything. I don't want to, um, ever jeopardise my relationship with Michael and I knew that, um, if I was to do what they wanted me to do, that it would. And I just couldn't do it.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: Kathy Jackson's successor, HSU national secretary Chris Brown, suggests a very different motivation:

(To Chris Brown) Why would Kathy Jackson blow the whistle if she herself was a fraudster?

CHRIS BROWN: Kathy Jackson was of the view that if she blew the whistle and was seen to be the person, ah, cleaning up the union then any wrongdoings that she had done would be overlooked and exonerated.

She, whether it was right or wrong, was of the view that if she blew the whistle at the royal commission, the re- royal commission wouldn't examine her wrongdoings. And so I think that- that was the reason why she blew the whistle.

KATHY JACKSON: Do you think I'm stupid enough to go to the police and make all these allegations and do all this stuff if I'd been like them? I don't think so.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: Kathy Jackson says she had certain terms and conditions - spending entitlements - as part of her employment at the HSU.

The court believed otherwise.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: The Federal Court has ruled against you, accusing you of a $1.4 million fraud.

KATHY JACKSON: Yeah, the Federal Court who didn't have my evidence. They just worked on, or went off their evidence. That's a really fair Federal Court, isn't it?

CHRIS BROWN: The documentary evidence that we were able to put together...

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA (voiceover): Chris Brown is the man who led the union's charge against her.

CHRIS BROWN: So there's a lot of items that we still think were probably questionable that we didn't include in our statement of claim and, ah, we gave her the benefit of the doubt. Um, no doubt we anticipated that if she had evidence to the contrary - like, she could have put, ah, any of those, ah, people on the stand to give that evidence - she would have done so.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: For eight years Kathy Jackson wasn't cautioned or disciplined about her spending habits at the HSU.

Her credit card bills were paid without question, month after month, year after year, by a small group of people: the union's branch committee.

CHRIS BROWN: Ultimately it's the branch committee of management's responsibility. But Jackson as the senior officer, ah, has, um, certain obligations under the Act, um, and they include ob- obligations to take, um, you know, care and due diligence in the, ah, the expenditure of funds; to not...

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: OK. Rewind: you've just said the ultimate responsibility lies with the branch committee?

CHRIS BROWN: That's right. We've questioned some of them...

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: OK.

CHRIS BROWN: ...but some of them have refused to talk to us.

The only people that could have known at the time were the branch committee of management.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: Yes.

CHRIS BROWN: Now, for whatever reason, ah, they either didn't ask for the information, they weren't provided with the information or they were misled.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: Well, what they: incompetent or neglectful in their duty?

CHRIS BROWN: Look, I think at the time, um - and, you know, the union largely and probably not only the HSU but other unions as well at the time, probably did not have proper governance procedures or didn't have proper governance procedures in place.

(Montage of excerpts from Michael Lawler's video diary, 24 July 2014)

MICHAEL LAWLER: And what that rather suggests is that...

...a hung Parliament voting situation...

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA (voiceover): Last year, on the 24th of July, 2014, Michael Lawler began recording this video diary in an effort to clear his name and save his lover.

MICHAEL LAWLER: I've got a lot of ground to cover... and I do want to talk to ordinary Australians.

The content of the rules is a matter for the organisation itself.

We're on the plane.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA (voiceover): In a five-hour monologue, Michael Lawler claims that he and his partner, Kathy Jackson, are the victims of a sophisticated, complex conspiracy against them beginning in 2012.

Led by individuals high up in the ALP, working in concert with corrupt union officials to smear them both, ruin their credibility and destroy them completely.

He calls it 'The Machine'.

MICHAEL LAWLER: It is a thing that is concerned with the way in which power is acquired and maintained within unions and acquired and maintained within the ALP. It is a thing that is concerned with the relationship between the unions and the ALP and the manner in which the factional system in the ALP operates.

(Montage ends)

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: Why is no-one listening to your conspiracy theory?

MICHAEL LAWLER: Because nobody has read the material - or they're too scared.

KATHY JACKSON: And more importantly, they've, um, they've jumped to the tune of the media. The media runs a story about Kathy Jackson; the royal commission then investigate.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: You're not delusional?

KATHY JACKSON: Definitely not.

MICHAEL LAWLER (laughs): No. No.

KATHY JACKSON (laughs): No.

(Footage of Michael Lawler standing on his office balcony, overlooking the CBD of Sydney)

MICHAEL LAWLER: I come to work with a sense of dread about the snake pit that I am about to enter. And I'd happily give up the office and the view - and a lot more besides - um, for all of this crap not to have happened.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: Michael Lawler was appointed vice-president of the Industrial Relations Commission in 2002. At the time he was a successful barrister, hand-picked by the then workplace relations minister, Tony Abbott, pictured here at Lawler's swearing-in ceremony.

(Footage of Kathy Jackson and Michael Lawler at their property. They kiss)

KATHY JACKSON: Good morning!

MICHAEL LAWLER: Good morning, darling. That wasn't what you said earlier. Wasn't it, like, "Get the f**k off" or something like that? (Laughs)

KATHY JACKSON: I did not say that to you... this morning; other mornings, yes.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: Michael Lawler first met Kathy Jackson in 2006, pictured here at the annual HSU Ball in Sydney, before Jackson blew the whistle on union boss Michael Williamson, when Bill Shorten was still her friend.

At the time, both Lawler and Jackson were married with children.

(Michael Lawler sits for Four Corners interview. Kathy Jackson comes behind him with a cloth and wipes his face. She walks off)

MICHAEL LAWLER (whispers to Caro Meldrum-Hanna): I love that girl. (Chuckles)

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: In March 2008, Kathy Jackson says, they began a romantic relationship. It was a highly controversial union: the vice-president of the Fair Work Commission in bed with the head of the union he was meant to independently adjudicate for or against in massive industrial disputes.

(To Kathy Jackson) Did you reach out to him or did he reach out to you?

KATHY JACKSON: No, I reached out to him. Um, and that was, um, during the conciliation but, like mid... in my mind it's probably about March, 'cause I had left, I'd left my husband by that point. But in March, April, May of 2008, um, we were in regular contact in relation to the, um, conciliation and then in about July, August of 2008, um...

MICHAEL LAWLER (off-screen): Can I interrupt here 'cause you - darling, just as a matter of fact you've just got that wrong as a matter of historical fact.

KATHY JACKSON: No I haven't.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA (voiceover): At this point in my interview with Kathy Jackson, Michael Lawler interrupts.

MICHAEL LAWLER (off-screen): The conciliation occurred in 2007 and I had a professional relationship with you as a party. And then the conciliation finished and then in early 2008 you separated from Jeff and we had...

KATHY JACKSON: Had the conciliation finished then?

MICHAEL LAWLER (off-screen): The conciliation had finished - but this is a matter of historical record. You can go back...

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: The timing of the start of their romantic relationship is dangerous territory for Michael Lawler: a glaring conflict of interest, one he kept secret for five months - and, crucially, after he'd mediated on at least one private conciliation involving his lover: a bitter dispute between the HSU, the Government and various health sector employers.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: It's been reported that you favoured the union over the employers - or, say, Government representatives in this private conciliation.

MICHAEL LAWLER: That's a lie.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: Are there any other private conciliations that you sat in on or oversaw, involving Kathy Jackson, your- your lover...

MICHAEL LAWLER: That's...

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: ...during this time before you were removed as panel head?

MICHAEL LAWLER: That is the only matter that I was involved in that involved her or her union.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: So Michael Lawler never gave you any favourable treatment before he declared that conflict of interest?

KATHY JACKSON: Definitely not. Otherwise we would have got an outcome - and a favourable outcome - which we didn't. (Laughs) We got an awful outcome.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: Seven years later, Michael Lawler's personal life with Kathy Jackson has put his job at the Fair Work Commission in jeopardy.

(Footage of Michael Lawler reading newspaper article about himself)

MICHAEL LAWLER: It says I'm embroiled in a sick leave controversy, but that's a confected controversy. It makes me mad.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: Today his conduct is front page news again: accused of falsifying nine months' sick leave in order to work on Kathy Jackson's case, all the while enjoying a taxpayer-funded salary of almost $500,000, more than a Federal Court judge.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: How sick were you if you were able to help Kathy in her very complicated legal proceedings?

MICHAEL LAWLER: I'd like very much if you could, ah, ask my psychiatrist to explain that to you, rather than have me do it.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: Michael Lawler gave us his confidential psychiatric report, dated July 2015. It says he has been diagnosed with a "Major Depressive Disorder"; that "He definitely needed this time off work."

MICHAEL LAWLER: There is absolutely nothing wrong with taking leave to help your partner defend herself against unjust attacks. In fact, I would have thought most Australians would regard that as an honourable and decent thing to do.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: When Kathy Jackson was first accused of being a fraudster in 2012, behind the scenes Michael Lawler made an extraordinary decision. He began recording private phone conversations with his boss, the president of the Fair Work Commission, Justice Iain Ross, without his knowledge.

During some conversations, Michael Lawler and Ian Ross discuss Kathy Jackson's case.

(Excerpt from audio recording of telephone conversation between Michael Lawler and Iain Ross)

IAIN ROSS, PRESIDENT, FAIR WORK COMMISSION (recording): How's Kathy bearing up with... 'cause I think you've got the Federal Court thing?

MICHAEL LAWLER (recording): Oh, not very well. Oh, it's just... I-it's a, it's a nightmare, Iain. It's just an absolute bloody nightmare.

(Excerpt ends)

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA (voiceover): Michael Lawler now has around 60 audio files: hours of top secret recordings.

He claims they contain the evidence that will clear him of allegations of misconduct.

(Footage of Michael Lawler accessing audio files on his computer)

MICHAEL LAWLER: Right now… one moment...

(Excerpt from audio recording of telephone conversation between Michael Lawler and Iain Ross, March 2015)

IAIN ROSS (recording): Hey, Michael.

MICHAEL LAWLER (recording): Oh, g'day, Iain. How are you going?

IAIN ROSS (recording): Not bad.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA (voiceover): In this recording, Michael Lawler and president Iain Ross discuss Lawler's extended sick leave. Lawler says that, in this conversation, Iain Ross tells him there's no cap to his sick leave entitlements.

IAIN ROSS (recording): I think um, your health's the first priority.

IAIN ROSS (recording): Yeah.

MICHAEL LAWLER (recording): And there's no, um... I mean, I'll, um... er, take responsibility for any amounts of sick leave you, you seek. There's no cap or anything like that.

MICHAEL LAWLER (recording): Oh, no, no. I understand there's no cap on it.

(Excerpt ends)

MICHAEL LAWLER: "I'll take responsibility for any amounts of sick leave. I know there's no cap on it." And then he writes to me, denying he said anything to that effect.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: Michael Lawler gave us a copy of that letter, written by Justice Iain Ross three months after this phone conversation.

In it, Justice Ross writes:

LETTER FROM IAIN ROSS (voiceover): I reject the suggestion that I made any statement to you to the effect that you had unlimited entitlement to sick leave.

MICHAEL LAWLER: So let me explain how the recordings are made.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA (voiceover): Later, Michael Lawler shows me how he makes his covert recordings.

MICHAEL LAWLER: If one holds the recorder close to the earpiece on the phone but not touching, and then you lift it all and hold it to your ear...

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA (voiceover): Secretly recording phone conversations is generally illegal. Michael Lawler says he has a defence: he did it for the protection of his own legal interests.

MICHAEL LAWLER: Alternatively, you can hold the recorder with your fingers.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: How do you think Iain Ross will react when he discovers you have made those recordings?

MICHAEL LAWLER: I imagine he will be, ah, er, very annoyed indeed.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA (voiceover): Michael Lawler isn't just fighting to keep his job; he's fighting for his partner, Kathy Jackson.

MICHAEL LAWLER: What's been done to my beloved is just evil. She's a thoroughly decent, kind, generous person. She has been totally destroyed. Her career has been totally destroyed. She has no income. She has no prospect of getting a job or income. She's suffering from a very deep depression, um, and, ah, there's no colour in her life.

DAVID ROFE, RETIRED QC: (off-screen): Well, we've a bit of, bit of pressure on us now.

(Michael Lawler and Kathy Jackson laugh)

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA (voiceover): Jackson and Lawler have a visitor: the source of enormous controversy for the couple. He's 83 years old and suffering from advanced dementia.

DAVID ROFE: Mrs, eh...

KATHY JACKSON: Jackson.

DAVID ROFE: Jackson, and the other- any other witnesses... and that's what's happening this afternoon.

I went up there...

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: This is David Rofe, eminent Sydney barrister and Queen's Counsel, Michael Lawler's old colleague and mentor, Kathy Jackson's adviser in 2012.

Now, Michael Lawler and Kathy Jackson stand publically accused of trying to pocket part of the ailing barrister's $30 million dollar estate.

(David Rofe laughs. Kathy Jackson laughs with him)

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA (to Michael Lawler): Both yourself and Kathy have been portrayed to, to Australia as money-grabbing: as taking advantage and exploiting...

MICHAEL LAWLER: Fraudsters, crooks. Mm. It's false.

He is my friend and my mentor. I love him. I promised that I would help him. I've been trying to honour that promise but I don't want to harm him.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: Michael Lawler was appointed David Rofe's power of attorney in June 2013.

Eight months later, Kathy Jackson was written in to David Rofe's will as a 10 per cent beneficiary of his $30 million dollar estate.

Michael Lawler gave us a text message that he says was written by David Rofe's primary carer and sent to Lawler two weeks before Kathy Jackson was written in to the will. According to the message, Jackson was written in at Rofe's request.

(Excerpt from text message sent 23 Feb. 2014)

TEXT MESSAGE (voiceover): Many, many months ago David expressed to me that he wanted to include a special lady, Kathy, into his will. Kathy has been the greatest help to David.

A few nights ago David said quite clearly to me he wants Kathy in there: one tenth.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: The controversy surrounding Lawler and Jackson's relationship with David Rofe doesn't end with the old man's will.

But he'd asked, ah, premier...

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: In June 2014, using power of attorney and $1.35 million of David Rofe's money, Michael Lawler purchased this four-bedroom home where we're standing now. It's conveniently located just across the road from Lawler and Jackson's house.

MICHAEL LAWLER: I would like to think it was a selfless act doing it, because when you are living close to somebody with dementia the demands on your time are increased significantly.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: Michael Lawler put the house in David Rofe's name.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: Do you want David Rofe's money?

MICHAEL LAWLER: No. Not only do I not want David Rofe's money: on at least a dozen occasions I've asked- asked him to promise me that he won't give me any of his money. And I can produce recordings of that.

(Excerpt from audio recording of conversation between Michael Lawler and Iain Ross)

MICHAEL LAWLER (recording): I don't want and have no interest in your money and neither does Kathy.

DAVID ROFE: Well I know, I-I...

(Excerpt ends)

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: Michael Lawler gave us dozens of recordings. For legal reasons we can't play many of them. They include discussions involving several people connected to David Rofe's finances.

On the eve of the Wombarra property auction, Michael Lawler rang David Rofe.

(Excerpt from audio recording of telephone conversation between Michael Lawler and David Rofe)

MICHAEL LAWLER (recording): David, I need to say something to you and you need to listen to this.

DAVID ROFE (recording): Did you take some money out of our account today?

MICHAEL LAWLER (recording): Yes.

DAVID ROFE (recording): Well, how much did you take and why did you take it...

MICHAEL LAWLER (recording): One hundred and sixty... $160...

DAVID ROFE (recording): ...and did you notify me about it?

MICHAEL LAWLER (recording): $160,000 has been taken.

DAVID ROFE (recording): You have...

MICHAEL LAWLER (recording): And the reason why it's happening...

DAVID ROFE (recording): ...no authority from me to buy that house.

MICHAEL LAWLER (recording): I, I know I don't. I know I don't. I know. I know you've said not to.

DAVID ROFE (recording): And you are now doing something that has absolutely no authority or backing by me.

MICHAEL LAWLER (recording): I've talked to you about this a lot.

DAVID ROFE (recording): You have not talked to me about it a lot.

MICHAEL LAWLER (recording): Oh, it's just you...

DAVID ROFE (recording): I've never been in favour of it. I told you that I did not want...

MICHAEL LAWLER (recording): Let me explain to you David, please...

DAVID ROFE (recording): ...I've been isolated by you people.

MICHAEL LAWLER (recording): No. Please let me, please let me say something. Please? You've, you've done a lot of speaking. Now listen for a moment. It is not your fault that you have dementia.

(Excerpt ends)

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: The next day, Michael Lawler purchased the Wombarra property at auction. Within hours, David Rofe revoked Lawler's power of attorney in this handwritten letter. Twenty-four hours later, Michael Lawler rang David Rofe to try and change his mind.

(Excerpt from audio recording of telephone conversation between Michael Lawler and David Rofe)

MICHAEL LAWLER (recording): You are going to look like a complete f**king idiot and I don't want that to happen to my friend. You've got to stop this, David. You're being stupid.

DAVID ROFE (recording): It is a disgrace for you to ring me up after wha- what you... has happened in the last few, what, days.

MICHAEL LAWLER (recording): Listen, David I told you. I told you repeatedly...

DAVID ROFE (recording): What do you want? What, what do you want?

MICHAEL LAWLER (recording): I told you repeatedly that I was...

DAVID ROFE (recording): I am not going to take responsibility...

MICHAEL LAWLER (recording): ...going to purchase that property for you because (name deleted) had agreed...

DAVID ROFE (recording): Oh, you poor little darling.

MICHAEL LAWLER (recording): Yeah, I'm a poor little darling.

DAVID ROFE (recording): What sort of things are you causing other people?

MICHAEL LAWLER (recording): Oh, god!

DAVID ROFE (recording): Some of the people you...

MICHAEL LAWLER (recording): You don't want to know about the rest of my life, for Pete's sake...

DAVID ROFE (recording): ...don't deserve anything.

MICHAEL LAWLER (recording): The great HSU saga?

DAVID ROFE (recording): There's something medically wrong with you and I honestly suggest you... try and find out what it is.

(Excerpt ends)

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: Why did you make those recordings? It's a peculiar thing to do?

MICHAEL LAWLER: W- um... er... From a... time in early 2012, I began to understand that I was exposed to being attacked around actions that I had taken and that it would come down to contests between who said what to whom.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: Michael Lawler and David Rofe have patched up their differences.

Rofe still owns this house. Jackson and Lawler recently rented it for themselves to live in. They plan to care for David Rofe here, permanently.

That afternoon, inside Rofe's kitchen, Jackson prepares lunch.

MICHAEL LAWLER: I'm worried about Kathy. I'm worried about Kathy.

DAVID ROFE: Well, she's in a very worrying position. There's no doubt about that.

MICHAEL LAWLER: Yes. It's looking grim at the moment but as I keep on saying to you, the thing that she's missed most is having somebody of your competence appearing for her.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: David Rofe isn't just here for lunch: he's running his eye over Kathy Jackson's appeal.

MICHAEL LAWLER: Did David have any suggestions on the notice of appeal?

DAVID ROFE: I wouldn't...

MICHAEL LAWLER: Well, it's, ah, really a holding position because the appeal period runs out today.

DAVID ROFE: Yeah, well, there you are. So...

KATHY JACKSON: I just don't feel justice has been done and there is a vendetta against me and I know I'm sounding crazy when I say that. But, um... I'm going to put, put an appeal in 'cause I never got a fair hearing.

You know, I never give up. And, um, I'm not going to let these bastards drag me down for their own political purposes.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: If you need to f- I don't know. Do you have to do something?

KATHY JACKSON: Yeah, I've got to go. Yeah, I've got to go.

(Footage of Kathy Jackson driving to Sydney)

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: Kathy Jackson's appeal period expires today. If she doesn't get to the Federal Court in the next hour, her hopes of appealing and overturning the judgement against her will be dashed for good.

She makes it just in time.

(Footage of Kathy Jackson outside Federal Court building)

KATHY JACKSON: Yeah. It's done.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: You are sticking your head in the lion's jaws?

KATHY JACKSON: It's been there from the beginning, hasn't it? (Laughs) Got nothing else to lose.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: I've been wondering, um, are you brave or are you mad?

KATHY JACKSON: I'm angry. There's a difference.

(Footage of Kathy Jackson and Michael Lawler seated in their back garden)

MICHAEL LAWLER: It's great to have you home, darling.

KATHY JACKSON: It's only day one. Don't get too excited.

MICHAEL LAWLER: Don't get too excited? I love you so much.

KATHY JACKSON: I'm just feeling all... negative.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: Later that week there's more bad news for Jackson and Lawler. The ALP has written to the Coalition, asking Prime Minister Malcolm Turnbull to urgently address Michael Lawler's conduct at the Fair Work Commission.

(Footage of Michael Lawler reading newspaper, 17 Sep.)

MICHAEL LAWLER: O'Connor has written to Turnbull, suggesting a bipartisan approach to removing me.

KATHY JACKSON: For what?

MICHAEL LAWLER: Oh, for misconduct and/or incapacity.

KATHY JACKSON: Incapacity?

MICHAEL LAWLER: Yeah.

KATHY JACKSON: What incapacity?

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA (voiceover): It's an unprecedented move.

KATHY JACKSON: For Michael Lawler to be removed from office 'cause he's done the right thing and supported me: then there's something wrong with this country, something seriously wrong with our political system and the judicial system.

MICHAEL LAWLER: I believe that, on account of the assiduous study that I've done over these last four years, I've come to an understanding of how the machine operates, what its standard operating procedures are, how they do their business. And I have predicted precisely this type of attack.

STEPHEN CONROY, LABOR SENTATOR (17 Sep.): Mr Lawler's conduct over the last five years can only be described as extraordinary: taking extreme amounts of leave at the expense of the taxpayer, nine out of the last 12 months.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: That afternoon, in Parliament, the stakes are raised even higher. ALP Senator Stephen Conroy, Kathy's old union friend, is launching a blistering attack.

STEPHEN CONROY (17 Sep.): In his greed, he received ownership of a property purchased with the proceeds of crime.

(Kathy Jackson and Michael Lawler sit down in front of television to watch parliamentary broadcast)

STEPHEN CONROY (17 Sep.): The money trail leads straight from the HSU to Jackson's Melbourne mortgage, then onto financing the Wombarra mortgage for the home that Mr Lawler now includes as one of his own assets. Lawler is living off the proceeds of crime.

KATHY JACKSON: Oh my god!

MICHAEL LAWLER: If it weren't so serious, it would be very funny.

STEPHEN CONROY (17 Sep.): To protect the integrity...

KATHY JACKSON: Destroy, destroy, destroy Michael. You know that. That's what they do. This is the way they operate.

Michael.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: There is a, a very real question, though, to be answered: and that is, Michael, whether you have benefited from the proceeds of crime; of fraud from the HSU. Have you?

MICHAEL LAWLER: Um, I have not knowingly benefited from the proceeds of crime. And when it's tested in a criminal court, we'll find out.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: Later, Michael Lawler makes a significant admission about Jackson's activities at the HSU.

MICHAEL LAWLER: There are a number of transactions that have been discovered, um, that are prima facie crooked and that need an explanation.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: The "crooked" transactions involve a money transfer made by Kathy Jackson into the joint mortgage account she had with her ex-husband, Jeff Jackson, in 2009, when fraudster Michael Williamson was still running the HSU.

The ALP claims that money has flowed into Jackson and Lawler's Wombarra home.

MICHAEL LAWLER: The last time I did a count, it was in the order of $50,000 and they are the transactions that represent the payment of monies from the NHDA - the slush fund of the number three branch - ah, into the, er, Jeff Jackson account or their joint mortgage account. And, um, I know what her explanation for those transactions is. It's not a very palatable explanation but it's an explanation nonetheless and it'll be given at some point.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: Kathy, what's the explanation?

KATHY JACKSON: Well, the explanation is that it was an, an arrangement that was put in place by Michael Williamson and, um, Jeff in relation to work that Jeff did for the number one br- ah, for the, um, NSW branch.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: Did you know at that time that you were making a payment that was probably improper?

KATHY JACKSON: No. No. With the benefit of hindsight, yes. But every time the, a payment was made I spoke to the bookkeeper and told her that, you know, it's- this is what the payment was for. And it was written up in the accounts in such as fashion as well.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: At home with Michael Lawler and Kathy Jackson, the mood is tense. A criminal investigation into their finances is gathering pace.

KATHY JACKSON: Oh, I just can't believe that (sniffs) it's just ended up like this. Like, all these people that we've been talking about: they're all quite real. And I was friends with all of them.

MICHAEL LAWLER: I'll be characterised as that scumbag, crook, fraudster and, at the very best, somebody who's been bewitched by an evil harridan, namely Kathy; that I'm c**t-struck and that I have been utterly, um, taken in by somebody who is a serious crook.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: Have you been?

MICHAEL LAWLER: No. No.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: Lawler and Jackson still claim they have the evidence that backs up their conspiracy theory. Time's running out for them to prove it.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: Is it possible that perhaps you have lost perspective? You've been caught up in a conspiracy theory or created one in an attempt to cover up your own wrongdoing?

(Kathy Jackson snorts contemptuously)

MICHAEL LAWLER: That's bullshit.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: Twelve days ago, Victoria and NSW Police and the AFP - Joint Taskforce Heracles - raided Jackson and Lawler's Wombarra home.

(Footage of police officers at Kathy Jackson and Michael Lawler's property, 7 October. They assemble confiscated evidence outside the house)

POLICE OFFICER: Mr William will go up to the shipping container, where a search of this shipping container will start with another search team.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: The police spent 10 hours searching their home for evidence, removing hard drives, boxes of documents, artworks, investigating whether Jackson and Lawler have benefited from misappropriated union funds.

(Footage of Kathy Jackson reading newspaper article about herself and Michael Lawler)

KATHY JACKSON: And then in here it says, "Police raids coincide with preparation for an ABC Four Corners program. Blah-blah-blah. The story of their troubled lives."

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: A range of formidable forces now confront Kathy Jackson and Michael Lawler: unionists, the Government, the judiciary, and the police.

But Jackson is sticking to her story.

KATHY JACKSON: They might think I'm just this harping harpy that's going to carry on - and I will until the truth is out about what actually happened at the Health Services Union. There was a protection racket in there. It's still there and those bastards are still running the show.

Anyway. I sound like a crazy conspiracy theorist when I say that, but I'm not.

CARO MELDRUM-HANNA: Outside, Michael Lawler is mulling over their future.

MICHAEL LAWLER: I mean, I know enough about the way this process works. "Darling, you've got a Taskforce Heracles investigating anything. You need to be very careful. Now, is there anything you need to worry about?" You know, summarizing the way it's put. "No, there's nothing I need to worry about."

Well, it remains to be seen whether she's right about that or not. If it turns out that she's committed offences: well then, so be it. The consequences will be what they are.

KERRY O'BRIEN: It will now be interesting to see how the Fair Work Commission reacts to Michael Lawler's revelations tonight and to see what the police investigation finds.

We approached a number of other people relevant to this story including the Minister for Industrial Relations, Michaelia Cash, Opposition Leader Bill Shorten, Senator Stephen Conroy, Fair Work Commission president Iain Ross and people connected to David Rofe, but they declined to be interviewed.

That's the program for tonight. Until next Monday, good night.

END

Backgrounder

NEWS UPDATES

Michael Lawler's recordings of Fair Work president Iain Ross appear to comply with Commonwealth laws, barrister says | ABC News | 20 Oct 2015 - www.abc.net.au/news/2015-10-20/lawler-says-recordings-are-a-protection-of-his-legal-interests/6867810

Kathy Jackson's partner Michael Lawler details secretly recorded conversations with Fair Work Commission president | ABC News | 20 Oct 2015 - www.abc.net.au/news/2015-10-19/michael-lawler-recorded-talks-with-fair-work-commission-boss/6867280

Independent Review into complaints against Fair Work Commission VP Lawler | 19 Oct 2015 - The Government has released the Terms of Reference and announced the appointment of Peter Heerey AM QCas the independent investigator to undertake a review of matters relating to complaints against Vice President Michael Lawler of the Fair Work Commission. Read the TOC. www.scribd.com/doc/285852751/Independent-Review-into-complaints-against-Fair-Work-Commission-VP-Lawler

BACKGROUNDER

Fair Work Commission's Michael Lawler breaks silence about his partner Kathy Jackson | ABC News | 19 Oct 2015 - www.abc.net.au/news/2015-10-19/michael-lawler-kathy-jackson-break-their-silence/6864174

Fair Work vice-president ichael Lawler 'urged' Health Services Union secretary Kathy Jackson to blow whistle on corruption | Herald Sun | 19 Oct 2015 - www.heraldsun.com.au/news/victoria/fair-work-vice-president-michael-lawler-urged-health-services-union-secretary-kathy-jackson-to-blow-whistle-on-corruption/story-fnpp4dl6-1227573553344

Kathy Jackson union 'payback' denied by Michael Lawler | The Australian | 13 Oct 2015 - www.theaustralian.com.au/news/nation/kathy-jackson-union-payback-denied-by-michael-lawler/story-e6frg6nf-1227567185621

Victorian Police raid former HSU national secretary Kathy Jackson's home south of Sydney | ABC News | 7 Oct 2015 - www.abc.net.au/news/2015-10-07/police-raid-former-hsu-national-secretary-kathy-jackson-home/6834682

They're back! HSU wants to rejoin Bill Shorten's Labor fold | SMH | 23 Sep 2015 - www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/theyre-back-hsu-wants-to-rejoin-bill-shortens-labor-fold-20150923-gjszqq.html

Michael Lawler 'shockingly conflicted' over affair with Kathy Jackson | The Australian | 31 Aug 2015 - www.theaustralian.com.au/business/legal-affairs/michael-lawler-shockingly-conflicted-over-affair-with-kathy-jackson/story-e6frg97x-1227505321829

VIDEO HSU's Kathy Jackson admits bending rules | Lateline | 29 Aug 2014 - www.abc.net.au/lateline/content/2014/s4077530.htm

Labor considers push to dismiss Kathy Jackson's partner Michael Lawler | AFR | 24 Aug 2015 - www.afr.com/news/politics/labor-considers-push-to-dismiss-kathy-jacksons-partner-michael-lawler-20150823-gj5zvp

Kathy Jackson ordered to pay $1.4m in compensation to Health Services Union | ABC News | 20 Aug 2015 - www.abc.net.au/news/2015-08-19/kathy-jackson-ordered-to-pay-1-4m-in-compensation-to-hsu/6707598

VIDEO Jackson used funds for divorce settlement | Lateline | 27 Aug 2014 - www.abc.net.au/lateline/content/2014/s4075873.htm

Kathy Jackson court case: More evidence reveals former union official's alleged lavish spending | ABC News | 9 Jul 2015 - www.abc.net.au/news/2015-07-09/evidence-reveals-kathy-jacksons-alleged-lavish-lifestyle-court/6608544

Kathy Jackson went on eight-year spending spree on HSU money, court hears | ABC News | 8 Jul 2015 - www.abc.net.au/news/2015-07-08/kathy-jackson-eight-year-spending-spree-on-hsu-coin-court-hears/6605258

Senior unions conspiring to destroy controversial HSU figure Kathy Jackson, court hears | ABC News | 22 Jun 2015 - www.abc.net.au/news/2015-06-22/unions-conspiring-to-destroy-hsus-kathy-jackson-court-hears/6563590

FWC's Michael Lawler 'said he would work while on sick leave' | The Australian | 20 Jun 2015 - www.theaustralian.com.au/news/inquirer/fwcs-michael-lawler-said-he-would-work-while-on-sick-leave/story-e6frg6z6-1227406542335

VIDEO Slush funds linked to Kathy Jackson | Lateline | 30 Apr 2014 - www.abc.net.au/lateline/content/2014/s3995460.htm

ROYAL COMMISSION HEARINGS

Submission: The HSU, Katherine Jackson and Craig Thompson | 2 Oct 2015 - The Counsel Assisting the Royal Commission made submissions about Ms Jackson. Sections concerning the National Health Development Account, the cashed cheques and the credit card expenditure are found in paras 71 - 202 of the submissions. www.tradeunionroyalcommission.gov.au/Submissions/Documents/2015-Submissions/HSU-Submissions/Counsel-assisting-submissions-HSU-2-October.pdf

Katherine Jackson Transcript of Public Hearing | 18 June 2014 - www.tradeunionroyalcommission.gov.au/Hearings/Documents/Transcripts/turc-transcript-public-hearing-18June2014.pdf

Katherine Jackson Transcript of Public Hearing | 19 June 2014 - www.tradeunionroyalcommission.gov.au/Hearings/Documents/Transcripts/turc-transcript-public-hearing-19June2014.pdf

Katherine Jackson Transcript of Public Hearing | 30 July 2014 - www.tradeunionroyalcommission.gov.au/Hearings/Documents/Transcripts/turc-transcript-public-hearing-30july2014.pdf

The Royal Commission into Trade Union Governance and Corruption - www.tradeunionroyalcommission.gov.au/

WATCH RELATED FOUR CORNERS PROGRAMS

Machine Man | 24 Aug 2015 - Four Corners puts Labor leader Bill Shorten under the microscope. >>Watch Online