READER COMMENTS ON

"9/12 Tea Bag 'Unity' Sign/Terror Threat of the Moment: 'By Ballot or Bullet'..."

(28 Responses so far...)





COMMENT #1 [Permalink]

... Shortbus said on 9/12/2010 @ 4:20 pm PT...





We had a rally in Saint Louis also, on the Arch Grounds. I did not work it, but my brothers and sisters that did were tweeting some interesting observations. Hopefully pictures will follow.

COMMENT #2 [Permalink]

... Lora said on 9/12/2010 @ 5:29 pm PT...





"By ballot or bullet," eh? Real nice. Any respected leader out there gonna comment on that? Or are they just gonna let it pass, and by default give any obsessed wingnut out there the green light? The tea partiers seem to have co-opted that phrase for quite some time, per Google search, though this is the first time I've been aware of its use. Not to mention, if the elections don't go the way they want, will there be violence, as is implied? How about a counter slogan? "We're not at your Beck and call." I dunno. What Would Hercules Do?

COMMENT #3 [Permalink]

... Soul Rebel said on 9/12/2010 @ 9:34 pm PT...





Oh, this is rich isn't it? Love the photos from TPM. Especially the ones quoting Jefferson (Less Marx, More Jefferson) as if they would know. Case in point, with the Revolutionary-garbed crew and the sign that attributes "Democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not." I'd never heard that before, and I've always considered myself fairly well-versed in TJ lore (WWTJD). Not surprising to have found myself at this expose of that quote. And I wonder if some of them this (OMG!) that Obama will be voted out of office this November. Could someone please call Dick Armey and clarify this matter? Then there's the guy with the "Go Green, Recycle Congress" shirt. Doesn't he realize that's pretty much what we have been doing for the last 30 years (Democrats included, I'm an equal opportunity proponent of a reasonable stay in office.) Of course, it's K street that has been in charge of the recycling. Love the call to arms. I'm locking my door, wake me when it's over.

COMMENT #4 [Permalink]

... Soul Rebel said on 9/12/2010 @ 9:37 pm PT...





However, I do want to give credit where credit is due. The woman holding the sign in the last TPM picture: She used an apostrophe correctly. That's a rare feat for this group. Good on ya, mate!

COMMENT #5 [Permalink]

... Gray said on 9/13/2010 @ 3:19 am PT...





Sry, a bit OT - A US watchdog agency sees problems with the lists of registered voters, the vetting of candidates, biased election officials, but also improvements regarding ballot tracking and polling stations:

http://www.guardian.co.u...hanistan-election-report In AFGHANISTAN! Uh, excuse me pls, but don't you think, too, that this is a bit hypocritical? I mean, from the news about elections in the last years, it seems to me, that the US suffers from the very same problems, too! Despite 200 years more experience with democracy. What's the point in applying standards to another nation that you won't even meet yourself? Won't this unavoidably only result in disappointment and loss of motivation?

COMMENT #6 [Permalink]

... Gray said on 9/13/2010 @ 3:30 am PT...





Uh, English isn't my native language, but isn't it spelled "restAUration"? And "by ballot or bullet" seems to be a strange name for a restaurant. Or is it a tea room, maybe? However, all the best for the grand opening!

COMMENT #7 [Permalink]

... bubba said on 9/13/2010 @ 9:21 am PT...





Where is any violence taking place? People are assembling peacefully and protesting a thuggish government which uses racialism, bigotry, coercion and many other dirty tricks against them and you worry about a couple of signs of warning. Our government is enacting policies that are more fitting of the old Soviet Union or East Germany and using the tactics of governments like Cuba or Venezuela to stifle dissent. Our people have a history of protesting idiotic policies and Obama is not going to be immune from this. The political violence of the past has been from the left so if I was on your side I would be looking in the mirror more closely. Many on the left think we should submit to our governmental overlords because they know best. We the people have only loaned power to our elected officials and only for as long as they perform their duties as we determine they should. It is obvious that the current administration and congress have not listened to us for too long. We have never given up our freedoms and rights enumerated in both the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution of the United States and we are now prepared to use those rights and power to remove from office most of the offending politicians during the next election.

COMMENT #8 [Permalink]

... Brad Friedman said on 9/13/2010 @ 10:54 am PT...





Bubba @ 7 said: Our government is enacting policies that are more fitting of the old Soviet Union or East Germany and using the tactics of governments like Cuba or Venezuela to stifle dissent. What policies? And what tactics? Please be specific. Thanks in advance. (I'll put your comments about "political violence of the past has been from the left" aside, since they are so ridiculous and as JFK, RFK, MLK, the Muslims whose mosque in TN was burned down a few ago, the Muslim cab driver in NYC and members of the Tides Foundation, and thousands of victims of the KKK, just to name a very few, may feel differently than you do.)

COMMENT #9 [Permalink]

... bubba said on 9/13/2010 @ 12:32 pm PT...





If you look back over the last one hundred and fifty years you will notice a trend in political violence and it hasn’t been a flattering one for your side. I find the KKK repugnant and they did many evil deeds in their time but it was started and supported mainly by racists in the democrat party, they also haven’t been a force in politics for longer than your and my lifetime added together. Segregation and Jim Crow laws were not written by republicans, they weren’t in power then, and they were enforced by democrats. JFK was assassinated by a communist sympathizer who was mad at the president for the invasion at the Bay of Pigs. This same wacko tried to immigrate to the Soviet Union. Sirhan Sirhan (who killed RFK) was a pro-Palestinian lefty. I’m not going to go on with more of your examples, you certainly should know all this, but where is the violence that you say the Tea Party people are fomenting? Are there still jerks in the US? The answer is positively yes. I remember the sixties as if it was yesterday and many of these same people are now in power; it is they who find today’s protesters distasteful. Are you telling me you don’t remember all the things that occurred during the sixties? The protest marches, the bombings, the murders of policemen, the arsons, the riots, the bank robberies, the Black Panthers, the acronym groups like the SDS, SLA, RFA, and juvenile wannabe terrorists like Bill Ayers et al. I also remember all the hate spewed from the lefties since 2001 during a republican presidency. Are the Tea Party people frightening to you because they are boisterous and fired up against the democrat’s policies? You really do need to man up, cupcake, if the tone of voice or a stupid sign at a protest bothers you. This is how our system works, people either support policies or they protest them. Governing without the consent of the people is the antithesis of our republic and to continue with policies loathed by a majority of the population is in keeping with a tyrannical government. You may support these same despised policies but come November you will see an overwhelming majority of the population rejecting the congress’ and the president’s policies in one of the ways we have available to correct them. The government must take note of the wishes of the governed and change direction, if they don’t the governed will use more and other means to effect change.

COMMENT #10 [Permalink]

... Soul Rebel said on 9/13/2010 @ 1:52 pm PT...





Hmm. By the ballot seems reasonable. Vote the bums out. Constitutional, even (unverifiable elections notwithstanding.) But...by the bullet? As I have said previously, I'm-a lockin' mah door,let me know when the looney express has left the station.

COMMENT #11 [Permalink]

... Ernest A. Canning said on 9/13/2010 @ 2:02 pm PT...





I hate to burst your bubble, Bubba @9 but 21st Century Republicans have no ideological connection to the first Republican President Abraham Lincoln, who said: Labor is prior to, and independent of, capital. Capital is only the fruit of labor, and could never have existed if labor had not first existed. Labor is superior to capital, and deserves much higher consideration. There is likewise little relationship between today's Democratic Party and the Jim Crow "Dixiecrats" of the 19th and 20th Centuries. In fact, in 1948, Strom Thurmond ran for President as a Dixiecrat. Both Thurmond and the Republican candidate lost to Harry S. Truman. After JFK and then LBJ committed what Thurmond deemed a betrayal by passage of the Civil Rights Act of 1964 and Voting Rights Act of 1965, Thurmond became a Republican --- the party of Reagan (as opposed to Lincoln) having actively courted disaffected, Southern white bigots.

COMMENT #12 [Permalink]

... Ernest A. Canning said on 9/13/2010 @ 2:13 pm PT...





Bubba @9 wrote: JFK was assassinated by a communist sympathizer who was mad at the president for the invasion at the Bay of Pigs. Doubtful! If you read serious studies of the JFK assassination, such as Plausible Denial by Mark Lane, you would retract your statement that "JFK was assassinated by a communist sympathizer..." Lane not only made a convincing case that the CIA killed JFK in a book but in a federal court, where a jury found as much. That case included the sworn testimony of Marita Lorenz, Fidel Castro's former girlfriend who was recruited into the CIA by Frank Sturgis. Lorenz testified she, along with Sturgis, Jack Patrick Hemming, Orlando Bosch and Alexander Rorke, Jr. traveled by way of a two-car caravan from Miami to Dallas in November 1963. One of the two cars was loaded with weapons, M-16s, M-1’s, handguns, shotguns and machine guns. Shortly after Lorenz and Sturgis arrived at a Dallas motel on November 21, 1963, E. Howard Hunt, who during the course of his involvement in the Bay of Pigs fiasco was also known as “Eduardo,” showed up and handed an envelope filled with cash to Sturgis. Hunt remained for about forty-five minutes. Within an hour of Hunt’s departure another individual arrived at their motel room, Jack Ruby! Lorenz, who had not been provided with the identity of the target of their operation, only knew that the operation was “big” and that she was to act as a decoy. Having second thoughts, she persuaded Sturgis to take her to the airport. She flew back to Miami. Hunt’s lawyer, Edward Dunne, concerned with the impact this testimony would have upon his client’s contention that he was not in Dallas on November 22, 1963, did not know when to leave well enough alone. He asked Lorenz whether she later spoke with Sturgis about the assassination. Sturgis had, telling her that she missed "the really big one." "We killed the president that day. You could have been a part of it—you know, part of history. You should have stayed. It was safe. Everything was covered in advance. No arrests, no real newspaper investigation. It was all covered, very professional." This account was later substantiated by Hunt in a deathbed confession. Lane argues the Bay of Pigs played a role, but for the opposite reasons you've suggested; that JFK fired CIA Director Allen Dulles in the wake of the Bay of Pigs invasion and that the Kennedy brothers intended to disband the CIA after the 1964 election. Lane and others also link George H.W. Bush to the CIA, anti-Castro Cubans and the Bay of Pigs invasion. Allen Dulles was appointed by LBJ to serve on the Warren Commission.

COMMENT #13 [Permalink]

... Ernest A. Canning said on 9/13/2010 @ 2:23 pm PT...





Finally, Bubba, whether you engage in a serious study of the 20th Century Democratic Party or today's Democratic Party, I think it important that you focus on the major factions within that party. In the 20th Century there was a major gap between progressive Dems who made up most of FDR's administration, and the reactionary Southern Democrats. Today, the principle distinction is between corporate Democrats (who are not all that different economically from Republicans in their willingness to sell out to the billionaire class) and progressive Democrats, who, like Greens, Democratic Socialists, etc., truly represent the interest of the vast majority of the electorate who make up the working class. I suspect that you, Bubba, fall within that working class. You would do well to move past the billionaire-funded lies which would have you believing that your subjugation to capitalist inequality is the essence of "liberty" and "freedom" to a realization that the billionaires who are funding the "Tea Party" movement are not really looking out for your interests.

COMMENT #14 [Permalink]

... Brad Friedman said on 9/13/2010 @ 2:35 pm PT...





Bubba said @ 9: If you look back over the last one hundred and fifty years you will notice a trend in political violence and it hasn’t been a flattering one for your side. First off, "cupcake", I don't know which "side" you are talking about. My "side" is the side of democracy and non-violence. My "side" includes Republicans, Democrats, Greens, Libertarians, independents and anybody who participates in their democracy. My "side" America's "side", at least when America and her government is living up to the guarantees in our Constitution. So yes, when you Republicans get screwed by voting machines this November, I will be on your "side" to make sure every legal voter who wishes to vote gets to vote, and that ever damn vote is counted and counted accurately and transparently to the best of our ability. "I find the KKK repugnant and they did many evil deeds in their time but it was started and supported mainly by racists in the democrat party" The party you refer to is the Democratic Party. I'd hope you'd have enough respect for all participants in our democratic (small "d") process that you'd accurately represent them. Thanks in advance. Beyond that, I believe you're confusing the Democratic Party with the Left throughout your response. If you believe that the KKK was on the the Left throughout their years of violence, you're more clueless than your general kneejerk response would indicate. That you've also failed to recognize the decades of (continuing) violence by the Right against pro-choice women and doctors and the murders committed against them, as encouraged by folks on the Right across the public airwaves is appalling as well. The rest of your attempts at revisionist history, however, are beside the point. You failed to answer the very direct questions I posed to you: Bubba @ 7 said: Our government is enacting policies that are more fitting of the old Soviet Union or East Germany and using the tactics of governments like Cuba or Venezuela to stifle dissent. What policies? And what tactics? Please be specific. Thanks in advance. Care to take another shot? Are the Tea Party people frightening to you because they are boisterous and fired up against the democrat’s policies? You really do need to man up, cupcake, if the tone of voice or a stupid sign at a protest bothers you. The Tea Party peple don't "frighten" me at all, sweetheart. Their cluelessness, much as yours, saddens me, though I rather enjoy expose them for who they are in hopes that they can be held accountable, and so that some of them --- you even --- might actually be educated where you have been so horrifically and cynically disinformed to fight against your very own best interest by liars and scam artists who have played you for chumps. This is how our system works, people either support policies or they protest them. Great. I've asked you "what policies" and you didn't bother to answer. Wanna try again, dear? Governing without the consent of the people is the antithesis of our republic and to continue with policies loathed by a majority of the population is in keeping with a tyrannical government. You seem to have a misunderstanding of how our Constitution and representative democracy works, as well as what the phrase "governing without the consent of the people" means. Are you suggesting that those in elected office were not put there by legal means? You do understand that liking your representativies in Government and "governing without the consent of the people" are two entirely different concepts? Or am I misoverestimating you, sexy? After all, you do realize how unpopular many of the Bush/GOP policies were for the last 8 years or so, but they were carried out anyway, right? Or is the case that they "govern without the consent of the people" only when your party is out of power and the folks opposed to those policies are largely in the party you don't belong to? You may support these same despised policies but come November you will see an overwhelming majority of the population rejecting the congress’ and the president’s policies in one of the ways we have available to correct them. Fabulous. That is your right. And I will be right there fighting to help you do so. Whether I "support these same despised policies" is besides the point. If you bothered to read this blog --- ever --- you'd likely learn that in the majority of cases, I do not. That said, it's a pity that you and the Tea Baggers are so incredibly disinformed and uneducated about what those policies actually are. When you answer you my original question, perhaps we'll know what you're talking about (and learn how clueless you are in the bargain, but that's just a guess based on the rest of your ill-informed ramblings here to date.) The government must take note of the wishes of the governed and change direction, if they don’t the governed will use more and other means to effect change. Wow. What kind of "other means"? Bullets instead of ballots? And your suggesting it is "the left" and "Democratic Party" who uses violence to get their way when the Constitution isn't enough to appease sore losers like yourself?

COMMENT #15 [Permalink]

... Dennis said on 9/13/2010 @ 2:41 pm PT...





Americans need to wake up the fact that Beck is simply another opinion pushing charlatan who is a product of mormon cult theology and he mixes this with his personal make up as a dry alcoholic. And for the record, he is a Mormon and not a Christian. As someone with a graduate degree in religion, I can say with all qualifications that Mormonism fits all parameters of a cult and has none of the parameters of a religion. A cult is any group (regardless of its size) that interprets the doctrines of a religion in an unorthodox fashion. The problem here is the fact the most Christians do not understand the difference and they easily fall for the lies of Mormon missionaries when they come to one's door. On Beck's radio show and Fox Network program he consistent demonstrates all the unstable behaviors of a dry alcoholic which include grandiosity, judgmentalism, intolerance, impulsivity, ADD and indecisiveness. Alongside that reality, Glenn Beck does not possess a single ounce of journalistic integrity, has no college degree, has no qualifications and he is definitely not a true conservative. But then, what can anyone expect from someone who can't find anything filthier than their own personal reflection. Since people like Beck cannot survive on the basis of any personal merits, they survive by putting others down with lies and half truths in order to feel good about themselves. The truth about Beck is that he a dry mormon alcoholic who never got the counseling required for alcoholics. To further complicate things and confuse people, Beck flippantly throws around Christian terms like "God", "Jesus","Holy Spirit" as well as voices of other so called "Spirit Powers" on his radio talk show. Beck is a mormon in active standing with the mormon church and is not a Christian. Mormonism teaches many gods, that the god of the earth was once a man who attained godhood status, there is no trinity, the cross of Christ means nothing and that Jesus Christ and Satan were brothers. Because Beck does not possess a single ounce of journalistic integrity, he is the perfect abortion poster child for Fox Network. The people who love what Beck says are no different than the impressionable sheep who loved every speech made by Adolph Hitler in his early years when he brought Germany into an era of economic prosperity These same sheep also blindly followed Hitler into one of the darkest chapters of world history. Beck and the Fox Network both cater to the same lowest common denominator of demagoguery. Beck would not know the first thing about God as he is a mormon. Someone should ask him which of the many mormon gods he kept talking about during his argument with himself on Saturday on the square in DC. Like a typical dry alcoholic, Beck even lied on national television when he spoke about holding a document signed by George Washington. That event never took Place. Unfortunately, people who love being led around by the nose do not realize that Beck is talking about a different god than that of Christianity, Judaism or Islam and that he has been a product of mormonism cultism from the day he started doing a radio talk show as an opinion pusher. You don't have to have a degree in psychology to see that he exhibits all the signs of a dry alcoholic. The only reason this unstable impressionable idiot fell into mormonism was because the woman he wanted to have sex with would not do so unless they got first got married and from that point, they joined the mormon cult. Glenn Beck is as big a charlatan as Josephs Smith or that 5th grade graduate (Charles T Russell) who started the Jehovah's Witness cult. This is Glenn Beck in a very accurate and concise nutshell. Considering the fact that Becks personal views are extreme Marxist Libertarian, his form of patriotism is false and he is a person who has no real substance or depth. It will not surprise many of us when Beck’s next big thing is to come out of the closet and announce his homosexuality to the nation. Simply put…he is just another predatory neocon who is pushing the buttons of very ignorant & impressionable people who love being told what to think and believe. We live in a period of history where it has become socially acceptable to be stupid and follow extremist idiots like Glenn Beck, Adolph Hitler, Sarah Palin, Karl Rove, Dick Cheney and Rush Limbaugh. Chicanery and lies are their middle names.

COMMENT #16 [Permalink]

... Soul Rebel said on 9/13/2010 @ 4:03 pm PT...





Dennis...point taken, but Ouch! that was hard to read. Punctuation much?

COMMENT #17 [Permalink]

... bubba said on 9/13/2010 @ 4:19 pm PT...





I appreciate your responses, you all seem passionate and at least you're all mostly entertaining. You can hear and see it coming. There isn't much time left and still you won't do anything to get out of the way. There were many times you could have done things differently, in the last two years, to prevent what is going to happen to you but you didn’t. You haven’t been gracious, I didn’t expect you to be, and you only listen to the partisan players on your own team. You live in a liberal Ghetto and you only look in the mirror for advice. We’ve seen what your ideas are and how unsuccessful they have been. Our congress and president lack wisdom and they are floundering. Wisdom comes from experience not just an education. Most of you here have been educated but you certainly haven’t been schooled. That is going to change on November 2nd.

COMMENT #18 [Permalink]

... gavbrown said on 9/13/2010 @ 4:50 pm PT...





We were there and posted pics. My big takeaway was that the movement is basically about sore-loserism. They can't stand it that conservatives lost the last two elections. http://unsoliciteddrivel...emember-in-november.html

COMMENT #19 [Permalink]

... Jeannie Dean said on 9/13/2010 @ 5:38 pm PT...





@ GAVBROWN: That write-up is hilarious. Thanks for the link.

COMMENT #20 [Permalink]

... gavbrown said on 9/13/2010 @ 6:12 pm PT...





@ JD: Glad you liked!

COMMENT #21 [Permalink]

... Shortbus said on 9/13/2010 @ 6:42 pm PT...





Bubba@17: Most of you here have been educated but you certainly haven’t been schooled. That is going to change on November 2nd. Bubba, You have been "Schooled" on 9/13/10

COMMENT #22 [Permalink]

... Soul Rebel said on 9/13/2010 @ 7:00 pm PT...





Bubba, actually you haven't seen much of what "our ideas" , leastways not if you are talking about the frequent authors and commenters on this here blog. Most of our ideas concern how best to have a civic-minded and tolerant populace grounded in constitutional freedom, with fair and verifiable elections, unfettered by the fascist constraints of a legally purchased government (this applies regardless of political party.) I don't know where you got the idea that we have been pleased with Obama, given that he has only halfheartedly fulfilled a few of his campaign promises and has mostly continued on the corporate path of Reagan and Bush.

COMMENT #23 [Permalink]

... Ernest A. Canning said on 9/13/2010 @ 7:50 pm PT...





Soul Rebel, nice of you to mention Reagan, Bush, Bush, Obama, but don't leave Bill and Hillary Clinton off that "corporate path" of yours. After all it was Bill Clinton who rammed NAFTA through on the fast track. Recall that Hillary served on the Board of Directors at Wal*Mart, which did not have a single store outside the U.S. before 1991. Wal*Mart was one of the principle beneficiaries of trade agreements, starting with NAFTA. By 2003, with its 4,400 stores, Wal*Mart had become the world’s largest corporation and the world's largest beneficiary of sweatshop labor. By 2005, as Wal*Mart was opening its 39th Super Center in China, it had also become the largest retailer in both Mexico and Canada. With a combined personal worth in excess of $100 billion, the five members of the Walton family are amongst the world's ten richest people. This is what the policies of all five of the above-enumerated Presidents have wrought. Yet, uninformed 'Tea Baggers' like Bubba actually think that Obama and Clinton are socialists.

COMMENT #24 [Permalink]

... Brad Friedman said on 9/13/2010 @ 10:52 pm PT...





Wow, Bubba. Drama queen much there, sweetheart? I'm not sure what "schooled" we'll be getting on November 2nd. But before we get there, you've got an important primary election tomorrow in Delaware where every vote cast will be on 100% unverifiable voting machines. I hope the faith-based results will be to your liking. I'll hope the voters intent will be recorded accurately. But who knows if democracy will be served or not, unfortunately. As to the "liberal ghetto" you suggest readers here are living in, you say "We’ve seen what your ideas are and how unsuccessful they have been. Our congress and president lack wisdom and they are floundering." I'm not sure what's been "unsuccessful" about anything that's been passed by this Congress, I don't think they were the ideas (or even hopes) of anyone on this blog, but I'd agree that both the President and Congress lack wisdom and are floundering. So what can I tell ya? Good luck with your imaginary "schooling" and if you need help assuring that all votes are counted and counted correctly, I'll be happy to do my best to help you, and anyone else who asks. No matter how much you seem to hate America and its Constitution. Peace.

COMMENT #25 [Permalink]

... Savantster said on 9/14/2010 @ 9:34 am PT...





And after being asked several times, there still is not enumerated grievance, just generic and ominous musings about "those evil Liberal policies!". Good job, Buba. Every time you open your mouth (or flick your fingers, as the case may be) you support the point of this posting.. that tea baggers are ill informed and don't base their opinions in reality. More faith-based, superstitious bullshit from the right-wing. *sniff sniff* smells like Theocracy to me. Sorry, but I don't want to live under the American Corporate Taliban.

COMMENT #26 [Permalink]

... Jeff said on 9/17/2010 @ 1:34 pm PT...





Dennis is on the left wings payroll. He has posted his same rant word for word across the internet using different names in an attempt to slander conservative voices.

COMMENT #27 [Permalink]

... Lora said on 9/17/2010 @ 7:29 pm PT...





Jeff wrote: "He has posted his same rant word for word across the internet using different names..." This much I've confirmed by Googling (beginning of Dennis's (#15) post) "Americans need to wake up the fact that Beck" Plenty of hits --- same words, different sites. I dunno about the payroll part, Jeff, though. Source?

COMMENT #28 [Permalink]

... Jeffs Daddy said on 9/17/2010 @ 7:54 pm PT...

