Survivor Ghost Island has arrived! Every week, Parade’s Mike Bloom will bring you interviews with the castaway most recently voted off of the island.

It’s tough to get a crowd of hundreds of people to stay absolutely silent. This is especially the case in a Survivor finale, with the requisite live studio audience coming in brimming with energy, a season’s worth of cheers built up for their favorite players. And while I was in attendance for the Ghost Island ending, it was clear that Wendell Holland was one of those cheer-worthy players. He received hoots and hollers during his intro package, and he earned one of the biggest laughs of the night when he screamed, “JEFF PROBST!” after finishing the puzzle that gave him his first Immunity Challenge win, a reference to when he had lost out previously due to not calling the host over. But right now, you could hear a pin—or a nail—drop, as Probst came in with only one vote to read. For the first time in the history of the show, a tie vote had occurred at the Final Tribal Council, giving default third placer Laurel Johnson the sole choice to decide who would win between the tight pair of Wendell and Domenick Abbate. Interestingly enough, the silence before the reveal of the lone ballot seemed to be a sign from above that the man who dubbed himself the “silent assassin” previously in the episode would prevail. And so it was that Wendell received the vote of his close ally, making him the winner of Survivor’s 36th season in the closest final vote yet.

Related: Domenick Abbate Dominates, but Gets Damaged by Deadlock

Much like shaping a piece of wood into furniture, the first few moves one makes in Survivor can ultimately determine what the outcome ends up being. Perhaps that’s why Wendell moved carefully, though at that point everyone was overshadowed by the apparent conflict between Domenick and Chris Noble. After getting the hook from “Sea Bass” that Chris was going after the father, Wendell decided to let him know on the side, laying down the foundation for what would become the strongest partnership in the game. Naviti didn’t go to Tribal Council for the first week in the game, so when they lost their first challenge after a tribe swap, the purple people saw nothing but red. This allowed the former Malolos to take power in the vacuum; while Wendell, Domenick and Morgan Ricke went after an absent Chris’ closest ally in Angela Perkins, they showed they knew their way around Tribal Council by taking a different route than the trio instructed and voted out Morgan.

After that night, Domenick mused to Wendell that they “got their asses kicked.” But they were ready to get up for the next round of the fight, and were able to utilize growing connections to make a new alliance between themselves, Donathan Hurley and Laurel. Wendell’s relationship with the latter began to strengthen, particularly when they were sent to a new beach along with Chris, Sebastian and Jenna Bowman. On the surface, the powerhouse tribe seemed to be coasting on Immunity Challenge wins and classic Chris Noble stories. But Wendell was continuing to make precise moves in his game, thinking ahead to the next phase of the game. As a result, he re-formed a connection with Sebastian, hand-delivering a shell he had left behind at Naviti, and struck off on his own during his girlfriend’s birthday to find his own gift of an idol. This season’s merge brought the three tribes together back on Naviti beach, and it was clear old Naviti drama was still top of mind when Domenick and Chris continued to target each other. With aggressive feelings prevalent, Wendell tried his hand at diplomacy when he sat the two guys down to hopefully join together and take out the Malolos. When those peace accords failed, he stuck with his Day 1 buddy, sending Chris out with his own scathing diss track on his sports-reference-laden rapping.

A clear target had been knocked down with Wendell’s slingshot, a skill he was soon going to show in a memorable Reward Challenge performance. But this made Wendell and Domenick realize that Chris had laid down some mines in their direction, and as such they promised to take each other to the end, knowing if one of them went, the other was soon to follow. He didn’t know how right he was, as the Malolo minority, particularly Michael Yerger, was starting to throw his name out. Luckily, he had Laurel there to dissuade any uprising, though she was now debating the idea of adding a bullet point to her résumé by taking him out. As the days counted down to that magical number of 39, it became more apparent that Domenick and Wendell were ruling the game, though they were able to stay that way by making endgame promises to Laurel and Sebastian. But as the numbers winnowed down, they found themselves literally pulling things out of their bag of tricks to stay alive. At the final six, there was one point where Wendell donned three necklaces: the Immunity Necklace, his idol (also once an Immunity Necklace) and a fake idol. The next night, with safety hanging around him once more, he chose to substantiate his loyalty to Laurel by playing his idol on her on its last possible night of existence. When he lost the final Immunity Challenge, the new rules at the final four put his fate in the hands of flint, some kindling, and a machete. He understood he had to earn his way to the finals rather than have Domenick take him and, perhaps due in part to some color superstition, he took out Angela Perkins. Sitting in the Final Three, Wendell tried his best to separate his game from his partner, earning both kudos for his soft style of approaching Tribal Council and ire for not managing relationships as well as Domenick. But when the votes came in, it was only one person’s relationship that mattered. Wendell received the votes of the last five people voted out, creating a tie for the title for the very first time. Laurel now automatically became a member of the jury, and between their time in two premerge tribes together, their mutual protection and his idol play on her, it was clear who she would choose to give the win to. It only got confirmed nearly a year later on the CBS studio lot, when the vote got revealed, sending Wendell into an ecstatic but tender embrace with his family.

I got to speak with Wendell moments after his win about if there was anyone’s vote he was surprised to get, how he tried to separate his game from Domenick’s and whether he and Chris made up after the statements about his rapping.

You said at the reunion that once you knew Laurel was casting the tie-breaking vote, you knew you had this locked up. How did it feel watching the entire season back knowing that was the case?

At the beginning of the season, I didn’t get too much airtime, and I’m like, “All right! I’ll just hang out. I believe I’m gonna win.” Then I started getting more and more airtime. In my city, people are like, “Hey, I know you win. I know you’re about to win.” And I’m like, “I can’t say anything, but I have a strong feeling that if Laurel’s the tie-breaking vote, [I win].” So I kept gaining momentum, and finally, it all boiled down [to] tonight. It’s been an amazing evening. It was crazy watching everyone’s reactions. My heart was pounding out of my chest as Probst read the votes, and it brought us right back.

So when Jeff says, “I’ll read the votes” right there on the island, which hasn’t been done at Final Tribal Council since the very first season, did you have a feeling something was up?

When he said that, I’m like, “All right, it’s Probst. He’s joked with us before off-camera. Probst is just joking again.” But he was dead serious. I was shocked. As he started actually reading the votes, we were stunned; my jaw dropped. I was thinking, “Man, does he just do this every season?”

[Laughs] And then they fake their surprise at the reunion?

Yeah, exactly. So at some point, between him saying, “I’ll read the votes” and him starting [to read them], Dom whispered something to me like, “Oh my God, it’s a tie.” He was about to read them, and I know what happens when there’s a tie. So as he’s reading them, I’m just in shock, and I’m understanding, “Man, Laurel is about to cast the tie-breaking vote.” And I’d been bonding with her for the last 39 days. We’d been taking care of each other; she’s been looking out for me, and I’ve been looking out for her. Our relationship was more like a brother-sister relationship. My big sister’s name is Lauren. They’re similar in stature; they’re big, strong and super-smart. And I was just drawn to Laurel out there. So I didn’t know for certain, but I had a strong belief that if Laurel has to cast that tie-breaking [vote], she would probably be writing down “Wendell.”

Going into that Final Tribal Council, you called yourself a “silent assassin.” That stuck out to me, because admittedly there were only a few moments where I feel like we saw the differentiation between yours and Domenick’s games. Can you elaborate a bit more on what you meant by that?

You’ve got two distinct games. Dom is a big New York personality; he’s always kind of in your face. A lot of times it works, sometimes it doesn’t work. He’s one for big moves. I will interact with people, but I’ll keep to myself. I’ll observe, but I’ll make more covert moves. I’m not the boisterous one at Tribal Council, I’m not the one negotiating for more rice with Probst before a challenge. I’m not doing a lot of things that Dom was doing. There was a time where Dom and myself put all our idols and flexed in front of Donathan. I realized that, in hindsight, and even that day, I was like, “That’s not necessarily me.” I’m not the guy that is doing all these theatrics in front of the jury. I’m friends with Donathan. I’m the guy that will have a conversation with him and apologize about that, because that’s not me. So that was my blunder. I just thought, “Man, I didn’t need to flex for Donathan. It’s Donathan. This guy’s a sweetheart.” So my strategy was more playing from your heart. In the past, Jeremy Collins had a similar game. While Dom had a more in-your-face game like a Tony or even a Boston Rob. You had these two strong games collide at the end and end up in a tie.

Was there anyone whose jury vote you were surprised to get?

I was very surprised that I got Chelsea’s vote. Dom convinced Chelsea that they were going to the end together, so for us to get rid of her at eight left a sour taste in her mouth. But also I respected Chelsea’s game. She didn’t get a lot of airtime; she didn’t get a lot of confessionals. But she talked to a lot of people. She was great in challenges; she won two individual Immunities. We realized she could continue this trend. I realized she was a threat, and although she didn’t get as much airtime as one might desire, it was time to get her out of there. But get her out of there while respecting her game. She has to know that you respect her game, so I think I communicated that to her. It wasn’t on camera; she knew I was intimidated by the player that she was.

Speaking of immunities, something I noticed the past few weeks is that, when you weren’t winning challenges, and your name was coming up, you end up sitting on your idol. It ended up paying off for you when you make the gesture to give your idol to Laurel, which probably secured your win. But how difficult was it to not play it in those moments of danger?

If you hear your name come up, your immediate thought is you want to play your idol. A lot of times, the smart move is to play the idol. What if someone else has an idol? It took everything in me to feel secure in my alliance. But [when] my name started coming up, I had already been bonding with Laurel. This was our secret alliance. She was letting us know, “Hey, they’re gunning for you. I’m with you.” So having that spy with you that’s willing to relay information, she saved me so many times. Laurel’s the reason why I have this check in my pocket.

Literally!

Literally. Laurel saved me back on the third vote out when they blindsided Morgan. [She told the Malolos], “We need Wendell.” From then on, she saved me throughout the game.

In the Final Tribal Council, you spoke about how you utilized your skills as a carpenter to make camp life more comfortable for the Navitis. How did that translate to strategy?

Some people enjoyed that, and others were like, “All right, Wendell’s building something, and this isn’t helping his social game.” If we have this amazing camp and this wonderful resort, then we’ll be happy and upbeat. We’ll want to come out to compete, and we’ll beat the other tribe. Granted, we were given a beautiful beach to start. Naviti was a wonderful beach; I never went to Malolo, but I heard about it.

We certainly did.

Yeah, it was a bunch of dirt! We had this beautiful beach, so maybe I contributed a little bit to us winning so much because I helped build this wonderful camp life.

Last question: Kanye or Chance the Rapper? You brought up to Desiree at the Final Tribal Council that you would stay up debating the topic as a display of your social skills. But who did you choose?

Des loves Kanye. I miss the old Kanye. Chance is my guy right now.

[Laughs] I thought you were about to start going into a Kanye track! Could give Chris a run for his money, especially after coming for his rapping.

Chris is…yeah. I don’t want to rehash that, because Chris and I got into that a little bit. We were great friends after the show, and then when I said those things, he was a little upset at me. We got into it when I was in New York, and now we’re friends.