



http://www.bokett.com/tt/dispbbs.asp?boardid=960&id=340563



It includes



1) Ma Long's FH loop-kill against underspin



2) Ma Long's FH loop against half-long serves



3) Ma Long's FH mid-distance counterloop



4) Ma Long's over the table sidespin BH flick



5) Ma Long's traditional BH flick, starting with a fake "push" motion.

Just found this gem!It includes1) Ma Long's FH loop-kill against underspin2) Ma Long's FH loop against half-long serves3) Ma Long's FH mid-distance counterloop4) Ma Long's over the table sidespin BH flick5) Ma Long's traditional BH flick, starting with a fake "push" motion.

-------

Hurricane Long 5



FH: Hurricane 3 Provincial Blue Sponge

BH: Dignics 09c

Sponsored Links







Pure gold!!!



Thank you very much!





FH: Hurricane 3 Neo



BH: Coppa X1 Turbo







My Feedback Timo Boll SpiritFH: Hurricane 3 NeoBH: Coppa X1 Turbo













Super awesome pics. Now I just need to learn how to read Chinese so I can understand the details. (Or is that Japanese?) Maybe I first need to learn to distinguish between the two...

Neo H3 40D| Offensive S | Tenergy 80

Chinese haha

Neo TG3 + Ebonholz V ST + Sriver G3

His weakness is his backhand at middle and middle far table ... Switching to his forehand ....



thanks can you translate it to english?

awesome, anyone translating this to English would be my personal hero!

Blade: Tibhar Samsonov Alpha



FH: Tenergy 05



BH: Acuda S1

From these pictures seems that he has a pretty much backhand oriented grip. I didn't noticed that till now.



As it was said he is more like a new Kong than a new Liqin.





Edited by vali - 01/06/2011 at 4:37am

Clipper

FH: XIOM Vega Asia , max

BH: Yasaka RAKZA7, 2.0



Woow, this is great, can someone translate pictures?

Tibhar Defense Plus



FH: Joola Phenix



BH: Dr. Neubauer Bison 1.5mm







"The dark side of the Force is a pathway to many abilities, some consider to be…unnatural."

Nice pics!



I thought Zhang Jike was the new Kong with his BH grip and his crab stance. But I saw in an interview that ZJ personally likes to hit the ball really hard, and they have to keep trying to get him to chill out a bit...



Ma Long is more willing to let the opponent start attacking first, so I suppose in that sense he is more Kong-like.



So it looks like everyone is Kong?



That loop against half-long serves is interesting. Most people tend to go flatter and the shot seems way easier to do with sticky chinese rubber compared to less sticky euro stuff.





Edited by Vassily - 01/06/2011 at 6:13am

Nittaku Acoustic FL T05 Acuda S2 2.0mm



vali wrote:



From these pictures seems that he has a pretty much backhand oriented grip. I didn't noticed that till now.



As it was said he is more like a new Kong than a new Liqin.





No offense, but I think he has neutral grip. The one who has backhand oriented grip is Zhang Jike. That is why Ma Long is not as strong in his backhand as Zhang Jike. But again, his forehand is better than Zhang Jike. It's just my observation.

No offense, but I think he has neutral grip. The one who has backhand oriented grip is Zhang Jike. That is why Ma Long is not as strong in his backhand as Zhang Jike. But again, his forehand is better than Zhang Jike. It's just my observation.

Current Setup:

Butterfly Primorac Carbon

FH: Andro Rassant Grip

BH: Andro Rassant PowerGrip

blahness wrote:



Just found this gem!



http://www.bokett.com/tt/dispbbs.asp?boardid=960&id=340563



It includes



1) Ma Long's FH loop-kill against underspin



2) Ma Long's FH loop against half-long serves



3) Ma Long's FH mid-distance counterloop



4) Ma Long's over the table sidespin BH flick



5) Ma Long's traditional BH flick, starting with a fake "push" motion.





It is truly a gem. I just need to learn Chinese to know the details. It helps to look at the pictures but it would be greatly helpful if someone can translate in English.



But thanks for the post.



FireHorse

It is truly a gem. I just need to learn Chinese to know the details. It helps to look at the pictures but it would be greatly helpful if someone can translate in English.But thanks for the post.FireHorse

Current Setup:

Butterfly Primorac Carbon

FH: Andro Rassant Grip

BH: Andro Rassant PowerGrip

FireHorse wrote:



vali wrote:



From these pictures seems that he has a pretty much backhand oriented grip. I didn't noticed that till now.



As it was said he is more like a new Kong than a new Liqin.





No offense, but I think he has neutral grip. The one who has backhand oriented grip is Zhang Jike. That is why Ma Long is not as strong in his backhand as Zhang Jike. But again, his forehand is better than Zhang Jike. It's just my observation.

You are right, his strength is at his FH but his backhand weakness is more towards middle/middle far table. His strength in FH and he used it to compensate for his weakness. So after transition from BH, he will focus on his FH attack... You are right, his strength is at his FH but his backhand weakness is more towards middle/middle far table. His strength in FH and he used it to compensate for his weakness. So after transition from BH, he will focus on his FH attack...

!!! Just amazing, thanks a lot!!!

Simply looking at Ma Long, you would think his FH is better than BH.



Chinese commentators and coaches have said in the past that Ma Long's BH is not his weakness but it is even better than his FH. I'm too lazy to look up the references, so if anyone remember them feel free to post them.



Oh and btw you can't say Long's FH is not as 'strong' as Jikes. Are you talking about power? Consistency? Spin? Placement? ... Ma long FH has something that Jikes doesn't and viceversa.



Acoustic

BH: T64

FH: BW2

Ma Long's bh is quite good. To watch Ma long's bh, the 2 last points from 10-10 in the last set to win wang hao in the Asian games.

EJ Club.



MM T05(fh)/Srvfx(bh); InfVps,LSW,Viscaria,RwV,TBAlc,PG7,yextsc,yeo. EJmaster wood. EJ Club.MM T05(fh)/Srvfx(bh);InfVps,LSW,Viscaria,RwV,TBAlc,PG7,yextsc,yeo. EJmaster wood.

It is mentioned in the link posted above. Furthermore, knowing his weakness, he will take the initiative to attack during the first 3 strokes as a way to suppress his opponent and at the fourth stroke, he is able to turn from defensive to offensive using some high difficulty technique to counter-loop and gain the initiative. Basically, he like to take the initiative to be the first to attack so that he can control the match. That's his style. Also the link only mention about his weakness at mid and mid-far table for his BH. So his BH and near table is still pretty formidable ...

Very nice, thank you!

Blade: OSP Virtuoso-L RST 87gr

FH: Butterfly Tenergy 05 FX 2.1

BH: Butterfly Tenergy 05 1.9

When are you guys just gonna realise that strokes don't make the player, any world class player in the top 100 has the same firepower, the looped drive winner is just the hammer that knocks the nail in, the best guy in the world is always than man on top form through other reasons, usually because his total touch/ service, and actually total awareness of top TT play has reached a real peak, its nothing to do with his stroke play.

The Older I get, The better I was.

Okay and I m just able to encourage those who understand chinese to help-out in translating the stuff to benefit other shakehand users. It will feel like a wasted effort right? Anyway, what you said is true as well, 'emulate' the top player doesn't make one a top player ...

TT_haru wrote:



Okay and I m just able to encourage those who understand chinese to help-out in translating the stuff to benefit other shakehand users. It will feel like a wasted effort right? Anyway, what you said is true as well, 'emulate' the top player doesn't make one a top player ... no, emulate, but please prepare your pupils to concentrate on more important things if they are to be successful. The problem is? what is success? Play for USA? Play for China? or just be a local TT star. Local TT stars are good, they are actually brilliant, they can propell young people into a world of positive thinking and worth. They can put on their CV that they are US state TT champion at TT, TT may be a minor sport, but being state Champion carries a level of respect in any capacity, surely. no, emulate, but please prepare your pupils to concentrate on more important things if they are to be successful. The problem is? what is success? Play for USA? Play for China? or just be a local TT star.Local TT stars are good, they are actually brilliant, they can propell young people into a world of positive thinking and worth. They can put on their CV that they are US state TT champion at TT, TT may be a minor sport, but being state Champion carries a level of respect in any capacity, surely.

The Older I get, The better I was.

Usually Chinese handshake players use BH close to the table, unable to counter loop from distance using BH but Ma Long can do quality BH counter loops sometimes.

) but I translated it with simple English anyway:



Ma Long, the latest men-single winner in Asian games,

has beaten lots of top players in the world. Characteristic of his

game is obvious - very good at initiating attack, fast and firece,

consistent and powerful when he is attacking and counter-attacking

from close to mid table. His footwork is reasonable in mid-table,

also his forehand loop has good arc, speed, power, placement, which

make his technique structure complete.



His backhand from mid to far away from table is relatively weak,

therefore, Ma Long always tries to use forehand to attack after

playing passively on backhand. Furthermore, to avoid his own

weakness, he will initate attack on 3rd ball to put pressure on

opponent, and he will counterloop the 4th ball when receiving.

We can say that Ma Long's offensive mind leads to his active style,

and his forehand has made up for his weaker backhand to an extent.

His backhand is a threat when playing close to the table. Ma Long's

"All-round" offensive technique is a nightmare of every player.



I will keep translating the rest before I fall asleep (0044 in UK!)

First picture is a description about Ma Long's style(which I am not really concerned about) but I translated it with simple English anyway:Ma Long, the latest men-single winner in Asian games,has beaten lots of top players in the world. Characteristic of hisgame is obvious - very good at initiating attack, fast and firece,consistent and powerful when he is attacking and counter-attackingfrom close to mid table. His footwork is reasonable in mid-table,also his forehand loop has good arc, speed, power, placement, whichmake his technique structure complete.His backhand from mid to far away from table is relatively weak,therefore, Ma Long always tries to use forehand to attack afterplaying passively on backhand. Furthermore, to avoid his ownweakness, he will initate attack on 3rd ball to put pressure onopponent, and he will counterloop the 4th ball when receiving.We can say that Ma Long's offensive mind leads to his active style,and his forehand has made up for his weaker backhand to an extent.His backhand is a threat when playing close to the table. Ma Long's"All-round" offensive technique is a nightmare of every player.I will keep translating the rest before I fall asleep(0044 in UK!)

APW46 wrote:



When are you guys just gonna realise that strokes don't make the player, any world class player in the top 100 has the same firepower, the looped drive winner is just the hammer that knocks the nail in, the best guy in the world is always than man on top form through other reasons, usually because his total touch/ service, and actually total awareness of top TT play has reached a real peak, its nothing to do with his stroke play.

You cannot win on only service or touch. Strokes are very important. If you do not have any strokes, you will surely lose the game. A player with simple service and excellent strokes are much better than a player without any strokes. The player without good strokes will make errors on returning long services and the other player will be free to attack.

hclnnkhg wrote:



First picture is a description about Ma Long's style(which I am not really concerned about ) but I translated it with simple English anyway:



Ma Long, the latest men-single winner in Asian games,

has beaten lots of top players in the world. Characteristic of his

game is obvious - very good at initiating attack, fast and firece,

consistent and powerful when he is attacking and counter-attacking

from close to mid table. His footwork is reasonable in mid-table,

also his forehand loop has good arc, speed, power, placement, which

make his technique structure complete.



His backhand from mid to far away from table is relatively weak,

therefore, Ma Long always tries to use forehand to attack after

playing passively on backhand. Furthermore, to avoid his own

weakness, he will initate attack on 3rd ball to put pressure on

opponent, and he will counterloop the 4th ball when receiving.

We can say that Ma Long's offensive mind leads to his active style,

and his forehand has made up for his weaker backhand to an extent.

His backhand is a threat when playing close to the table. Ma Long's

"All-round" offensive technique is a nightmare of every player.



I will keep translating the rest before I fall asleep (0044 in UK!)





Awesome, and thank you. I, and others I'm sure, are very grateful for whatever efforts you can put into translation.





Awesome, and thank you. I, and others I'm sure, are very grateful for whatever efforts you can put into translation.

Neo H3 40D| Offensive S | Tenergy 80

Anton Chigurh wrote:



hclnnkhg wrote:



First picture is a description about Ma Long's style(which I am not really concerned about ) but I translated it with simple English anyway:



Ma Long, the latest men-single winner in Asian games,

has beaten lots of top players in the world. Characteristic of his

game is obvious - very good at initiating attack, fast and firece,

consistent and powerful when he is attacking and counter-attacking

from close to mid table. His footwork is reasonable in mid-table,

also his forehand loop has good arc, speed, power, placement, which

make his technique structure complete.



His backhand from mid to far away from table is relatively weak,

therefore, Ma Long always tries to use forehand to attack after

playing passively on backhand. Furthermore, to avoid his own

weakness, he will initate attack on 3rd ball to put pressure on

opponent, and he will counterloop the 4th ball when receiving.

We can say that Ma Long's offensive mind leads to his active style,

and his forehand has made up for his weaker backhand to an extent.

His backhand is a threat when playing close to the table. Ma Long's

"All-round" offensive technique is a nightmare of every player.



I will keep translating the rest before I fall asleep (0044 in UK!)





Awesome, and thank you. I, and others I'm sure, are very grateful for whatever efforts you can put into translation.









Thank you for your appreciation. Here is the first introduced technique:



Ma Long's forehand powerlooping backspin



(Top yellow box)



Powerlooping backspin is the most common attacking method, and it is

one of the most powerful forehand technique. As it is powerloop, the

advantage of power must be emphasised; pratically, the arc should be

low, the ball should have decent amount of topspin, and with flexible

placement, we can achieve maximum output. But many TT-lovers focus

too much on power, the stroke is too big, which desrupt the harmony

between arm and body, leads to decrease in consistency.



When we are powerlooping, we should focus on controlling the arc and

the placement of the ball, then we increase the power if, and only if

we are consistent. On the other hand, although powerlooping is

powerful, recovering is also important. we should control our swing

and ensure body weight is able, so we can recover quickly.



(Caption in Picture 5)



Right foot is pushing the ground, the body starts to lean forward



(Caption in Picture 6)



Close the bat slightly, keep it stable, hit the lower part of the

mid-top of the ball



Forearm is not moving a lot, use your arm primarily



Left foot steps forward using the force generated when body moves

forward



(Caption in Picture 7)



Close the forearm to make the arc shorter



Left foot pushs the floor to stop the body from hitting the table



(Caption in Picture 8)



Waist should turn enough so power of whole body can be used



(White box in bottom-right corner)



(Red text) Footwork is imporant, find the precise hitting point

before you swing, then makes your stroke bigger



(Black text) These picture shows Ma Long doing the stroke. In picture 1,

when Ma Long moved from backhand corner to forehand corner, he kept

his body very low, his legs were bent, and his upper body was leaning

forward. In picture 2, Ma Long back-swinged when his right foot moved.

There are 2 main points: firstly, the step should not be too small or

too big, so he can hit the ball at the most reasonable point; secondly,

don't back-swing too much before the body is at the position, because

the upper-body should be relaxed; Moreover, it would be easier to deal

with a short ball, net ball or edge ball.



Amateur players' biggest problem is their huge swing, it will only

makes the stroke out of control.



In picture 4, Ma Long started to swing faster after he was in the

right position. His arm was fully stretched. His right foot pushed

the floor to make the body move forward. It is crucial to use the

force during the body is moving forward in a powerloop. Amateur

players also use the power from the twist of the waist, sometimes

they jump up when they hit the ball. It will increase the quality of

the stroke, but this motion has a disadvantage: if the coming

ball is not very fast, or it has a short arc, or anticipation is

not precise enough, then we can't use the power of the coming ball,

therefore consistency and effect of powerlooping will decrease

greatly. So, before we do this storke, we should stand a little bit

away from the table, and we should lean forward when we hit the ball.



(Red text) at the hitting moment, hitting it more forward, close your

forearm, control the arc



(Black text) Theoritically, to increase the speed of ball, we need to

increase the forward force. Although lots of amateur players know

that, but they still have prolems in matches. Firstly, does increasing

forward force means more "hitting" Secondly, does the wrist come in

when we powerloop? and thirdly, how much should we close our forearm?

I believe we can find some answers from the motion of Ma Long.



In picture 5, Ma Long's left foot stepped forward, body leaned forward,

using the power when the body moved forward. His bat was close but

not much. In picture 6, his bat angle was stable, hitting the lower

part of the mid-top of the ball. Brushing is essential, as the ball

comes with backspin, we must overcome it. but when we actually do the

stroke, we can feel more hitting than brushing. Because we need to

generate power/speed, therefore hitting more will give better effect.

Also, portion of brushing depends on the height and the spin of the

coming ball. Usually the backspin is not very strong if it is pushed,

so we don't need to brush a lot. Also, we need to hit the ball at its

highest point, with too much brushing, the ball will go over the table.

In picture 5-6, it was obvious that Ma Long was generating a forward

force, in order to increase the power and speed of the ball.



In picture 4, we can see Ma Long's wrist was moving outwards; in

picture 7 and 9, his wrist was moving inwards, this means he used

wrist. As we hit more than brush in a powerloop, wrist movement is

critical for controlling the arc. The movement should not be too big,

but quick in a sudden, to increase the spin of the ball.



In picture 6-8, Ma Long's forearm movement was obvious. It is mainly

for transmitting power from the body to the ball, and controlling the

length of arc. The forearm movement can be separated into two parts:

at the moment of hitting the ball, the movement was limited, he used

mostly his upper arm; just after hitting the ball, the forearm

movement increased, so forward force was reduced, and the arc was

shortened. This is very important when looping close to the table.



Picture 9-10 shows how Ma Long recovered. His left foot pushed the

floor to stop the body from hitting the table; At the same time his

arm relaxed, but he kept his body relatively tight.



I am going to sleep now, this task will take hours! I will continue tomorrow

Thank you for your appreciation. Here is the first introduced technique:(Top yellow box)Powerlooping backspin is the most common attacking method, and it isone of the most powerful forehand technique. As it is powerloop, theadvantage of power must be emphasised; pratically, the arc should below, the ball should have decent amount of topspin, and with flexibleplacement, we can achieve maximum output. But many TT-lovers focustoo much on power, the stroke is too big, which desrupt the harmonybetween arm and body, leads to decrease in consistency.When we are powerlooping, we should focus on controlling the arc andthe placement of the ball, then we increase the power if, and only ifwe are consistent. On the other hand, although powerlooping ispowerful, recovering is also important. we should control our swingand ensure body weight is able, so we can recover quickly.(Caption in Picture 5)Right foot is pushing the ground, the body starts to lean forward(Caption in Picture 6)Close the bat slightly, keep it stable, hit the lower part of themid-top of the ballForearm is not moving a lot, use your arm primarilyLeft foot steps forward using the force generated when body movesforward(Caption in Picture 7)Close the forearm to make the arc shorterLeft foot pushs the floor to stop the body from hitting the table(Caption in Picture 8)Waist should turn enough so power of whole body can be used(White box in bottom-right corner)(Red text) Footwork is imporant, find the precise hitting pointbefore you swing, then makes your stroke bigger(Black text) These picture shows Ma Long doing the stroke. In picture 1,when Ma Long moved from backhand corner to forehand corner, he kepthis body very low, his legs were bent, and his upper body was leaningforward. In picture 2, Ma Long back-swinged when his right foot moved.There are 2 main points: firstly, the step should not be too small ortoo big, so he can hit the ball at the most reasonable point; secondly,don't back-swing too much before the body is at the position, becausethe upper-body should be relaxed; Moreover, it would be easier to dealwith a short ball, net ball or edge ball.Amateur players' biggest problem is their huge swing, it will onlymakes the stroke out of control.In picture 4, Ma Long started to swing faster after he was in theright position. His arm was fully stretched. His right foot pushedthe floor to make the body move forward. It is crucial to use theforce during the body is moving forward in a powerloop. Amateurplayers also use the power from the twist of the waist, sometimesthey jump up when they hit the ball. It will increase the quality ofthe stroke, but this motion has a disadvantage: if the comingball is not very fast, or it has a short arc, or anticipation isnot precise enough, then we can't use the power of the coming ball,therefore consistency and effect of powerlooping will decreasegreatly. So, before we do this storke, we should stand a little bitaway from the table, and we should lean forward when we hit the ball.(Red text) at the hitting moment, hitting it more forward, close yourforearm, control the arc(Black text) Theoritically, to increase the speed of ball, we need toincrease the forward force. Although lots of amateur players knowthat, but they still have prolems in matches. Firstly, does increasingforward force means more "hitting" Secondly, does the wrist come inwhen we powerloop? and thirdly, how much should we close our forearm?I believe we can find some answers from the motion of Ma Long.In picture 5, Ma Long's left foot stepped forward, body leaned forward,using the power when the body moved forward. His bat was close butnot much. In picture 6, his bat angle was stable, hitting the lowerpart of the mid-top of the ball. Brushing is essential, as the ballcomes with backspin, we must overcome it. but when we actually do thestroke, we can feel more hitting than brushing. Because we need togenerate power/speed, therefore hitting more will give better effect.Also, portion of brushing depends on the height and the spin of thecoming ball. Usually the backspin is not very strong if it is pushed,so we don't need to brush a lot. Also, we need to hit the ball at itshighest point, with too much brushing, the ball will go over the table.In picture 5-6, it was obvious that Ma Long was generating a forwardforce, in order to increase the power and speed of the ball.In picture 4, we can see Ma Long's wrist was moving outwards; inpicture 7 and 9, his wrist was moving inwards, this means he usedwrist. As we hit more than brush in a powerloop, wrist movement iscritical for controlling the arc. The movement should not be too big,but quick in a sudden, to increase the spin of the ball.In picture 6-8, Ma Long's forearm movement was obvious. It is mainlyfor transmitting power from the body to the ball, and controlling thelength of arc. The forearm movement can be separated into two parts:at the moment of hitting the ball, the movement was limited, he usedmostly his upper arm; just after hitting the ball, the forearmmovement increased, so forward force was reduced, and the arc wasshortened. This is very important when looping close to the table.Picture 9-10 shows how Ma Long recovered. His left foot pushed thefloor to stop the body from hitting the table; At the same time hisarm relaxed, but he kept his body relatively tight.I am going to sleep now, this task will take hours! I will continue tomorrow

,understandable. The translation will take hours, not to mention, sometime it is very difficult to find the exact english phrase to explain what was written in Chinese ...



Edited by TT_haru - 01/06/2011 at 8:55pm ,understandable. The translation will take hours, not to mention, sometime it is very difficult to find the exact english phrase to explain what was written in Chinese ...

APW46 wrote:



When are you guys just gonna realise that strokes don't make the player, any world class player in the top 100 has the same firepower, the looped drive winner is just the hammer that knocks the nail in, the best guy in the world is always than man on top form through other reasons, usually because his total touch/ service, and actually total awareness of top TT play has reached a real peak, its nothing to do with his stroke play.



This has absolutely nothing to do with the thread. It's amazing how you, as an assistant moderator can be so discouraging to people who are genuinely trying to contribute to the forum. If you have so much knowledge and wisdom about TT, why not produce something helpful for other members of this forum, like producing tutorials through video/articles? I am genuinely speechless.

This has absolutely nothing to do with the thread. It's amazing how you, as ancan be so discouraging to people who are genuinely trying to contribute to the forum. If you have so much knowledge and wisdom about TT, why not produce something helpful for other members of this forum, like producing tutorials through video/articles? I am genuinely speechless.

-------

Hurricane Long 5



FH: Hurricane 3 Provincial Blue Sponge

BH: Dignics 09c

hclnnkhg, thanks for all your efforts!

