Toronto Police Supt. Tony Riviere saw his officers respond to 65 counts of gunfire in 31 Division last year, an area with a checkered past when it comes to its relationship with law enforcement.

Riviere, who oversees the division that polices Jane and Finch and other northwest Toronto neighbourhoods, has asked himself difficult questions recently — namely, can he live up to the reason he became a police officer 27 years ago. Can he make a difference as a black man on the inside?

The head of the 31 Division recently sat down to speak with CBC Toronto host Dwight Drummond about the rise of gun violence in the city's marginalized neighbourhoods — and the idea that other communities incorrectly label the problem as limited to gang warfare.

Holding a community hostage

Riviere: "Every time we discharge a firearm, the community is victimized. You can appreciate that if you lived in one of our neighbourhoods [where] there was a number of discharged firearms, you, too, might be fearful of having your kids play in the backyard."

CBC: To give people an idea of what's happening, could you share the story of the lady who was dropping off her brother.

Riviere recounts the "recent incident" — that of a young woman who drives from Durham to Driftwood every week to pick up her brother and take him to play basketball. She feels unsafe in the neighbourhood, however, and asks her dad to move his car before she arrives so that she can park as close to his home as possible.

Toronto police taped off the intersection at Bayview and Moore Avenues after a woman was found without vital signs in November of 2016. (Trevor Dunn/CBC)

Riviere: It's an example of what's going on. But it's also an example of how the community's being held hostage.

That fear appears to go both ways. On one night, after the woman dropped off her brother, someone walked up to the car with a gun, because they didn't recognize it, Riviere said.

The fear factor

CBC: They thought it was a rival so they approached the car with guns? It's like they're policing the area themselves.

Riviere: And that's what's so alarming. And it might be because they're fearful, because we do have instances where individuals from other neighbourhoods come into a particular neighbourhood and discharge firearms — and that's part of the wider problem of gang rivalries within our city."

CBC: You've seen the rise in gun violence throughout your career; why is it so easy now for these young men to get firearms? These cost money, where's the money coming from? Is it the drug trade?

'They can engage in that type of behaviour with impunity, because no one will speak out. - Supt . Tony Riviere

Riviere: That's the question that's been asked over my entire career — whether it's guns that are located from within our city, from break-and-enters, whether it's guns that are imported from the U.S., I don't know.

But I can say, though, that it gets to a point where there's a comfort zone for people using that firearm."

CBC: How do you get to a point where you're not alienating members of the community, but you're also targeting the ones that are creating the havoc for everyone that's just living here.

Riviere: "In order to gather the intelligence, we need to talk to people, but we need to do it in a structured, professional, respectful manner. And we certainly need the support from the community, because they know ... who the drug dealer was. They're more strategically located to provide that information."

Candice Rochelle Bobb, 35, was killed in May 2016 when the car she was driving in was shot at. Police say she was not targeted in any way.

CBC: There are cases, however, involving people who have been victims of violence who have no connection to gang violence, like Candice Rochelle Bobb. Bobb, 35, was fatally shot in May 2016 and her baby was delivered by C-section, but died days later. Police struggled, however, to find willing witnesses. Is there any hope?

Riviere: "Justifiably, they may say, 'Oh, we don't want to talk, because we may be victimized ourselves.' But the reality is, if we do not assist our police in solving those crimes and being witnesses to those events, all we're doing is perpetuating the violence — and the violence is happening to us, to our community."

"Not only that, you've said a clear statement to others: They can engage in that type of behaviour with impunity, because no one will speak out."

Building trust with witnesses

The first incident of gunfire of the year highlighted that problem. It happened in a packed banquet hall on Jan. 1, but police are struggling to find co-operative witnesses, Riviere said.

Riviere: "Part of the solution could be that, instead of the individual stepping up, we can have a community step up. So that banquet hall where there's a hundred people, what if 20 stepped up as a group?"

Every time a gun goes off in a community, it creates an environment of fear, Supt. Tony Riviere says. (Linda Ward/CBC)

CBC: Some people say that this is a crisis, but that it's not getting the attention it deserves because it's predominantly affecting marginalized people. Is that part of the issue?

Riviere: I'm of the view that the mainstream media right now doesn't look at discharged firearms as being a sexy event anymore. It certainly victimizes our local individuals here — and it's nice for people in the wider community to say, 'Well, it's black-on-black crime. If you don't belong to a gang, you're not going to get victimized.'

"But we know that's not factual."

Institutional racism

CBC: Is this a matter that can be fixed with just enforcement or does it require a balance of social investment?

Riviere: The reality is we cannot enforce our way out of this problem. We cannot. It is a wider issue, but from whatever direction you want to approach this, whether it's social injustice, the reality is we can overcome it.

"You come out here at seven o'clock in the morning and you see a whole lot of good people at that bus stop to go to work. They, too, are faced with the challenges that you have described — the institutional challenges — but they have decided to go out and make a difference. Some of them work three and four different jobs, 18 hours a day.

"It may require us to be a little more diligent than the normal individual, it may require us to work harder, but that injustice doesn't have to suppress us to the point where we throw our hands up and say, 'OK, I'll be a perpetual victim.'

"We can rise above it.

Supt. Tony Riviere said that he joined the police 27 years ago hoping to make 'a difference from within.' (Paul Borkwood/CBC)

Q: It seems that what is happening here — the rise in the gun violence and, in particular, the victimization of young men that look like you, is bothering you.

A: I'm a police officer by profession. I'm a human being. I'm a black human being. And I sit here, not in an enviable position, because on my tour of duty last year, I experienced 65 [incidents of gunfire].

And so I questioned myself, am I able to accomplish my goal? Can I make a difference, even being within? But I know — I know — that we have the capacity as a people to succeed and make a difference. That the incidents that surface and seem to get the attention cannot magnify to the point where it diminishes all the good things we are capable of doing and have already done."