On Sunday night, against my better judgement, I started an argument with someone on the Cosmos Twitter hashtag. But in doing so I got at something I think environmentalists and climate change activists need to understand. Many people who deny that climate change is occurring do not care what the truth is.

This conversation is edited for space and clarity. See my twitter page for all comments.

Who is going to tell the Chinese that they are going to have to shut down all of their greenhouse producing factories? India too #Cosmos — Rob Page (@page10rob) June 2, 2014

@page10rob Once solar power is cheaper it will be a no brainier. Increased illness from air pollution is pretty expensive too. — Elizabeth (@MissCherryPi) June 2, 2014

I’m oversimplifying here a bit. But it is true. Coal and gasoline have the hidden costs of damage to public health.

@MissCherryPi I have no beef with converting to clean energy prod but unless we all go back to living like 1750 it's not going to matter. — Rob Page (@page10rob) June 2, 2014

@page10rob I don't know why you say that. Germany is 75% wind and solar and they are an economic power. — Elizabeth (@MissCherryPi) June 2, 2014

I was referring to this article in Think Progress, “Germany Sets New Record, Generating 74 Percent Of Power Needs From Renewable Energy.” Rob was incredulous at first but then he started quoting other sources about how this makes electricity more expensive.

@MissCherryPi NYT – Energy prices have risen each year since 2000 to among the highest in EU — Rob Page (@page10rob) June 2, 2014

@MissCherryPi – one more view on the German miracle http://t.co/9QvRSHo6sZ — Rob Page (@page10rob) June 2, 2014

But I didn’t say that renewable energy would be cheap or easy. My point in citing Germany as an example was a refutation of Rob’s assertion that we couldn’t do anything about climate change unless we “all go back to living like 1750.” It’s clearly not 1750 in Germany right now. The Germans are planning for the future, and trying to abate climate change as well. If we keep going the way we are now, we will face catastrophe.

@page10rob pay now or pay later. Our choice. — Elizabeth (@MissCherryPi) June 2, 2014

“@MissCherryPi: pay now or pay later. Our choice.” And guess what. Someone is making money either way. It's all a fight over who.. — Rob Page (@page10rob) June 2, 2014

Clearly missing the point here, Rob sees clean energy as some kind of money making scam. I wonder if he sees fire extinguishers and car air bags that way too?

@page10rob It's only that simple if you place no value on quality of human life. — Elizabeth (@MissCherryPi) June 2, 2014

“@MissCherryPi: I do, I also believe in human liberty and a healthy portion of suspicion and cynicism. — Rob Page (@page10rob) June 2, 2014

@page10rob what are you suspicious of? People have been studying climate change for decades and evidence only gets stronger. — Elizabeth (@MissCherryPi) June 2, 2014

And here’s when I first found out that the person I was talking to has no idea what the evidence for climate change is.

First he called me a Nazi:

“@MissCherryPi I also lived in a century when leaders lied to their citizens and scientists joined in. Might want to check out that Germany — Rob Page (@page10rob) June 2, 2014

Then he went back to “this is a money making scheme:

@MissCherryPi just follow the money.. People tend to, and wherever the money flows you will find an activity increase. — Rob Page (@page10rob) June 2, 2014

And finally, to his main point, that being contrary for the sake of being contrary is a good thing:

@MissCherryPi I know it feels important and seems real.. often reality behind the curtain is different.. It's wise to question everything — Rob Page (@page10rob) June 2, 2014

@page10rob This is not about feelings. This is about data. And it's all available to the public on the IPCC website. — Elizabeth (@MissCherryPi) June 2, 2014

@MissCherryPi and you trust information from a single source? If you agree with that source it becomes self perpetuating doesn't it. — Rob Page (@page10rob) June 2, 2014

@MissCherryPi cause everything on the internet is true 🙂 — Rob Page (@page10rob) June 2, 2014

Claiming that the IPCC is just “a single source” and just some random website on the internet, revealed that Rob actually has no idea what the evidence for climate change actually is.

@page10rob How about read it for yourself and then get back to me in a few days? I can't argue w/you if you don't know what the evidence is. — Elizabeth (@MissCherryPi) June 2, 2014

And he said yes.

“@MissCherryPi: @page10rob How about read it for yourself and then get back to me in a few days? I tell you what, I will. Deal — Rob Page (@page10rob) June 2, 2014

But then he had to immediately make a joke about how silly this all is.

@MissCherryPi I live in Minnesota and after our seven month nasty winter we're praying for a little global warming. 🙂 — Rob Page (@page10rob) June 2, 2014

@page10rob I know people still rebuilding their homes after Sandy. I'm sure they'd think that was hilarious!! — Elizabeth (@MissCherryPi) June 2, 2014

@MissCherryPi what?!? Are you serious? Sandy was caused by global warming?!? Yeah we didn't have hurricanes 100 years ago — Rob Page (@page10rob) June 2, 2014

@MissCherryPi sorry goodnight wow, good luck with that religion/politics of yours, hope you find something done day that does make u happy — Rob Page (@page10rob) June 2, 2014

So although he has never looked at the evidence for climate change, it seems awfully silly and conformist to go along with, dont ya think? Almost like a religion! Rob clearly has no idea what the scientific method is, or why it works if he equates reading papers filed with data and then basing your views on public policy on that data is the same thing as religious faith. Science changes in response to new information. Religion does not.

@page10rob If you have proof all the scientists in the world are colluding on a massive hoax you should probably tell everyone. — Elizabeth (@MissCherryPi) June 2, 2014

@MissCherryPi I don't, and I don't care if they are or aren't. I'm just not drinking the cool aid.. Lots of people love to be sheep.. — Rob Page (@page10rob) June 2, 2014

And that, right there, is the money quote. For Rob, climate change denialism is not about moneyed interest in fossil fuels, a religious belief that God will protect the Earth, a misunderstanding of the scientific evidence, or even a failure to examine the information available to him. It doesn’t matter what the data is, he won’t believe it, no matter what, because to do so would make him a “sheep.” Nonconformity is more important to Rob than truth.

How to respond to people like this, I have no idea. But at least he told me why he believes what he does.

UPDATE: As I responded in my initial tweet to Rob, BRIC countries will probably decide to limit greenhouse gas emissions on their own. And China looks like they are heading that way right now.