“The future is always modifiable by our actions.”

– Dr. Phil Zimbardo

Dr. Philip Zimbardo (@PhilZimbardo) is one of the most distinguished psychologists in the world and a professor emeritus at Stanford University. He is arguably best known for his 1971 Stanford Prison Experiment, in which students were turned into mock prisoners and guards for a continuous 24-hour-a-day study. The experiment was planned for two weeks but terminated after just six days.

In this podcast, we explore how we — as humans — can do less evil, how you can be a “deviant for day,” mindful disobedience, and much more. It was a blast.

Apart from the above, Dr. Zimbardo has served as President of the American Psychological Association and designed and narrated the award-winning 26-part PBS series, Discovering Psychology. He has published more than 50 books, including Shyness, The Lucifer Effect, The Time Cure, The Time Paradox, and most recently, Man, Interrupted.

Dr. Zimbardo currently lectures worldwide and is actively working to promote his non-profit, The Heroic Imagination Project. His current research looks at the psychology of heroism. The question he poses is: “What pushes some people to become perpetrators of evil, while others act heroically on behalf of those in need?”

Please enjoy this conversation with Dr. Philip Zimbardo — our oldest guest to date!

You can find the transcript of this episode here. Transcripts of all episodes can be found here.

#226: How to Not Be Evil - Dr. Phil Zimbardo https://rss.art19.com/episodes/5205a98c-d863-44e5-b575-0b23a489a099.mp3 Download

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Want to hear another episode with a fascinating scientist? — Listen to my interview with Dr. Peter Attia. In this episode, we discuss optimizing blood testing, training for ultra-endurance sports, consuming synthetic ketones, using metabolic chambers, extending longevity by avoiding certain types of exercise, and much more (stream below or right-click here to download):

Ep 50: Dr. Peter Attia on Ultra-Endurance, Drinking Jet Fuel, Human Foie Gras, and More https://rss.art19.com/episodes/0f32a7a5-718f-4328-8706-d7f75d794045.mp3 Download

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QUESTION(S) OF THE DAY: What was your favorite quote or lesson from this episode? Please let me know in the comments.

Scroll below for links and show notes…

Selected Links from the Episode

Connect with Dr. Phil Zimbardo:

Twitter | Website | Facebook | The Heroic Imagination Project

Show Notes

Dr. Zimbardo gives us the background to his legacy (“for better or for worse”): The 1971 Stanford Prison Experiment. [07:31]

Reflecting on the similarities between the Stanford Prison Experiment and abuses at Abu Ghraib. [13:46]

On everyday heroes and resisting the temptation of evil and the power of the group. [17:48]

Celebrating the banality of heroism (in contrast to Hannah Arendt’s “banality of evil”). [19:32]

Ordinary people as heroes in training, and The Heroic Imagination Project. [20:28]

“We don’t rise to the level of our expectations; we fall to the level of our training.” -Archilochus [21:32]

“All evil begins with fifteen volts.” — What the Milgram experiment tells us about mindlessly taking the first step. [24:22]

Dehumanization of others. [26:26]

De-individualization of self (anonymity). [30:14]

Diffusion of personal responsibility. [32:05]

Blind obedience to authority. “Be wary of authorities wearing false lab coats!” [36:57]

Practicing mindful disobedience. [38:45]

Uncritical conformity to group norms. [40:34]

Comfort challenges and being a deviant for a day. [42:05]

Passive tolerance of evil through inaction or indifference. “Tolerance of intolerance is cowardice.” -Ayaan Hirsi Ali [45:20]

Perception of time and its impact on our decisions. [47:57]

Using time perspective therapy to treat PTSD. [53:54]

How an early copy of The Time Paradox had a monumental impact on my own routines and perspective. [57:03]

The Dickens Process. [58:15]

What is the difference between altruism and heroism? [1:00:44]

How the early end of the Stanford Prison Experiment ties in with heroism. [1:02:11]

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