We are really pleased to be able to close 2015 with an article exploring AMBW groups and relationships. This article has been on our to do list for several months now and we hope you find it helpful.

Let’s start with some definitions since we do occasionally hear some questions about what all these jumbo of letters mean. In the Blasian couple community, there are two groups of couples as there are in any interracial couple pairing. Black men, Asian women couples are known as BMAW or AWBM couples, and Asian men, Black women couples are known as AMBW or BWAM couples. We have been intrigued by the question of why AMBW groups outnumber BMAW groups for some time, particularly when US census numbers indicate that BMAW married couples far outnumber AMBW couples. There is plenty of room for both AMBW and BMAW groups to thrive and be successful, so to be clear, this intrigue is not about trying to create some sort of contest between the AMBW community and the BMAW community, but is merely an intellectual curiosity.

So it’s natural to question why AMBW groups predominate in online and meetup groups and it’s a question that we have seen pop up in BMAW groups in the past. It’s also interesting as we spoke to people in the AMBW community, that some would question whether there really are more BMAW couples in real life or not because they predominantly see AMBW couples, not BMAW couples. So we think it’s a question worth exploring a little deeper. Any way you cut the data which we will dive into in a moment, both BMAW couples and AMBW couples are today less than 1% of all equivalent couples in the US, so both groups are still relatively small, but both groups are growing rapidly as one of the fastest growing interracial combination of couples. Online and in person meetup groups are often an important resource to help small growing groups collaborate around common issues and solutions, and show support for one another. Also in the case of Blasian couple groups, they also serve an important function of sometimes knocking down old stereotypes which then helps to create and encourage new Blasian couples. So what drives more activity for AMBW groups when the number of AMBW couples is much smaller than the number of BMAW couples.

Contributors To This Article

While we at ABC have been involved with Asian and Black couples for many years now, our experience is almost exclusively with BMAW couples. So to explore this question, we reached out to several other Asian and Black couple bloggers and group admins, especially in the AMBW community. We are very thankful to the following contributors (listed alphabetically) and their websites and groups who graciously shared their thoughts on this question with us.

Allie Shepherd, African American, the creator of the group, AMBW Worldwide, which creates AM/BW Destination Meetup Events

The Blasian Narrative, which focuses on AMBW couples and topics

J, Afro French, a former AMBW Youtuber who now desires anonymity

Jennifer Gabriel, Nigerian American, the author of the blog, Western Girl Eastern Boy, which focuses on AMBW couples, Korean culture, and life as a Black female in Korea.

Lily J. Lee, Korean, the creator of the YouTube channel, Blasian Family Channel 블라시안 패밀리 채널, which covers her life as part of a BMAW couple

Minky, Korean, who is married in a BMAW couple and is the creator of the blog, Asian Woman Black Man, which focuses on photos of BMAW couples

Rhea Alexander, African American, the creator of the Facebook page, AMBW For Life, which focuses on AMBW couples and topics

Rick, Asian, the author of the blog, Breaking Bread With An Asian, which focuses on AMBW topics and improving the media image of Asian men

Sharean Morishita, African American, the creator of S-Morishita’s Studio, which creates the AMBW comic/anime series, Love! Love! Fighting!

ShaSha LaPerf, African American, the author of the blog, My Husband is Asian, which focuses on her life as part of an AMBW couple

Sooyong, African American and Korean, the author of the blog, Schizo-Alias, which focuses on her life in Japan and random topics

Tara Kamiya, African American, the author of the blog, Tara Kamiya, which focuses on her life in Japan as part of an AMBW couple

Toni D.B. Ward, African American, the lead group admin of the Facebook group, AMBW, a group focused on building relationships between Asian men and Black women.

Some of the contributors actually researched this question independently and checked with other AMBW colleagues before sending me their input which I really appreciate. Throughout this article, I will share various quotes from some of these contributors. All of the contributors were very warm and helpful and indeed, I look forward to future collaborations with several of the contributors.

Also when we reference census statistics here, all of these numbers are sourced from:

The US Census Bureau – using the 2000 census, the 2010 census, and the 2013 American Community Survey (ACS) Pew Research Center, a national think tank that focuses on demographic trends and other social research topics Asian-Nation, a blog focused on Asian American demographics and other Asian research topics ABC calculations based on numbers obtained from these sources.

Finally, when we reference Asian and Black couple groups and blogs here, we are primarily using data from our own ABC research found at Asian and Black Couple Groups, Blogs, and Other Resources and Top Asian and Black Couple Websites – 2015 Q4. We regularly update these group listings based on new groups and websites that we find from time to time, however we purposely exclude any groups we find that are primarily sex oriented, or have not had any meaningful activity in the last 12 months as web sites come and go all the time. We are always looking for groups and websites that are seriously devoted to either encouraging existing Asian and Black couples, or building long term couple relationships with Asian and Black singles.

Census Numbers For Asian and Black Couples

How many Asian and Black couples exist? In the US, census numbers give us insights about married and cohabiting Blasian couples every 10 years. Also other resources like the annual US Census ACS, Pew Research, and Asian-Nation help us better understand the makeup of the US census numbers as well as provide ongoing demographic data and estimates in the years between the 10 year census polls. In this section, we will dive into the specific numbers, but for those who just want the top level summary without all the numbers, here are your key takeaways for this section: the number of Asian and Black couples in the US is still relatively small, but growing very rapidly, and there are over 6 BMAW couples for every 1 AMBW couple. That’s it, skip to the next section if you like, but for those who like numbers, read on.

In 2010, there were 48,931 Asian and Black married couples in the US. Asian and Black married couples grew by 41% from 2000 to 2010. This compares to only a 4% growth in total US married couples from 2000 to 2010. Of the roughly 49,000 Asian and Black married couples in the US in 2010, there were 42,254 BMAW married couples and 6,677 AMBW married couples, so there were 6.3 times as many married BMAWs as married AMBWs. From 2000 to 2010, BMAW married couples grew by 42%, and AMBW married couples grew by 35%.

Also in 2010, on the BMAW side, 1.1% of all married Black men were married to Asian women, and 1.3% of all married Asian women were married to Black men. On the AMBW side, 0.2% of all married Asian men were married to Black women, and 0.2% of all married Black women were married to Asian men. So while BMAW married couples are small at about 1 out of every 100 married Black men or 1 out of every 100 married Asian women, AMBW married couples are really rare at about 1 out of every 500 married Asian men or 1 out of every 500 married Black women.

In 2010, the census also counted another 10,793 Asian and Black unmarried households or cohabiting couples. The number of cohabiting Blasian couples grew by 72% from 2000 to 2010, even faster than married Blasian couples. Of the roughly 11,000 Asian and Black cohabiting couples in the US in 2010, there were 9,434 BMAW cohabiting couples and 1,359 AMBW cohabiting couples, so there were 6.9 times as many cohabiting BMAWs as cohabiting AMBWs. From 2000 to 2010, BMAW cohabiting couples grew by 73%, and AMBW cohabiting couples grew by 62%.

Also in 2010, on the BMAW side, 0.9% of all cohabiting Black men were living with Asian women, and 5.0% of all cohabiting Asian women were living with Black men. On the AMBW side, 1.0% of all cohabiting Asian men were living with Black women, and 0.2% of all cohabiting Black women were living with Asian men. For both Asian women and Asian men, they cohabit with Black partners at rates 5 times as high as Asian women and Asian men married to Black spouses. If a good percentage of these cohabiting couples transition to marriage, it’s clear that we would expect to see the percent of Asians married to Blacks increase over time. For Black men and Black women, there currently is not much difference in their rate of marriage or cohabiting with Asians.

One other indicator of the fast growth of the Asian and Black couple community is the fact that the Blasian population – people with mixed Asian and Black heritage – grew by 74% from 2000 to 2010. This compares to a total US population growth of only 9.6% from 2000 to 2010. Granted, Asian and Black couples and Blasians are growing from small absolute numbers, still it’s hard to ignore the fast growth in the Blasian community.

In terms of 2015, we estimate that there are currently roughly 59,000 Asian and Black married couples in the US, with roughly 51,000 BMAW married couples and 8,000 AMBW married couples, or about 6.4 times as many BMAW married couples as AMBW married couples. We also estimate that there are currently roughly 15,000 Asian and Black cohabiting couples in the US, with roughly 13,000 BMAW cohabiting couples and 2,000 AMBW couples, or about 6.5 times as many BMAW cohabiting couples as AMBW cohabiting couples.

So overall, the census numbers show that while the number of BMAW and AMBW married and cohabiting couples are both small and rapidly growing, there are about 6.4 times as many BMAW couples as AMBW couples. The census numbers obviously do not tell us how many Blasian couples are dating or engaged, but they give us good insight into married and cohabiting Blasian couples.

Check out Interracial Marriage – Asians and Blacks for even more numbers and stats.

Asian and Black Couple Groups and Websites

So given that there are 6.4 times as many BMAW couples compared to AMBW couples, are there equally as many BMAW groups compared to AMBW groups? The short answer is no, but let’s take a look at the numbers. While our question is primarily about groups, we will also look at blogs and other social media websites here as they are closely related.

When we narrow the number of groups and blogs that we track on the ABC Groups and Blogs page down to groups and blogs that primarily focus on either BMAW or AMBW, we arrive at the numbers below. Note that some of the groups and blogs that we track focus on Blasians, Blasian families, living overseas, or other resources useful to Blasian couples that are not necessarily more related to BMAWs or AMBWs.

BMAW and AMBW Groups and Blogs As of December 2015

Online Groups: 6 AMBW, 2 BMAW

Meetup Groups: 8 AMBW, 0 BMAW

Blogs: 39 AMBW, 19 BMAW

Pretty much any way you look at it, there are far more AMBW groups and sites than their BMAW equivalents. In the category of in person meetup groups, all of the meetup groups are primarily AMBW focused today and there are no BMAW focused meetup groups today.

In addition to AMBW groups and blogs outnumbering BMAW groups, AMBW groups and blogs are also predominantly the most popular Asian and Black couple websites. As shown in the Top Asian and Black Couple Website Rankings for 2015-Q4, AMBW websites captured the following honors:

AMBW Website Winners By Category For 2015-Q4

Online Groups: 5 of the top 10

Meetup Groups: 8 of the top 8

YouTube Channels: 5 of the top 10

Instagram Pages: 6 of the top 11

Facebook Pages: 7 of the top 10

Blogs: 7 of the top 10

So overall, AMBW groups, blogs, and websites not only outnumber their BMAW equivalents, but are among the most popular sites in the Blasian couple community. So what drives this divergence between BMAWs predominating in real life, while AMBWs predominate online?

The Top Four Reasons Why AMBW Groups Outnumber BMAW Groups

In discussing this subject with our list of contributors, the conversations identified four key reasons why we see more AMBW groups and websites, despite seeing more BMAW couples in the general population. We will discuss the four reasons here in order of most significant to least significant. Note that both the contributors and ABC will use generalities as we discuss these top four reasons, so please adjust these comments as necessary if these generalities do not fit your personal situation. Also we recognize that some of these reasons are correlated, but we still believe that each reason has merit to be discussed on it’s own.

1. Black Women are Culturally More Open About Their Relationships Than Asian Women

Women generally are more likely to start social groups or write blogs about relationship matters than men. However Black Women and Asian Women generally are culturally very different in terms of how open they are about discussing their relationships. Combine these two reasons together and it’s not surprising that there are more AMBW groups than BMAW groups.

Tara Kamiya, who previously wrote a guest post for ABC says, “My personal thoughts are that the woman is the one who pushes social interaction. It could be that the differences are due to the woman and what she regards as being social as opposed to being reserved or private.” Along these same lines, Toni Ward is even more direct by saying, “I also believe the AMBW groups are growing because we Black women are not a shy bunch.” Indeed many of our contributors agree that one of the key reasons why AMBW groups outnumber BMAW groups is because of the strong effort put out by Black women who have noticed how rare AMBW couples are, and who have taken the initiative to create successful online and meetup groups for Black women and Asian men to meet. To be clear, Asian men have also either created or helped to create some of these AMBW groups and indeed, the current largest AMBW group, Black Women Asian Men United was created by an Asian man. However most of the current AMBW groups were created by Black women. The reality of today is that you simply will not find many Asian women creating BMAW groups or even BMAW websites, although there are a handful of exceptions such as two of our contributors on this article, Lily Lee, who created Blasian Family Channel, and Minky who created Asian Woman Black Man.

Lily Lee, who is Korean, reveals the Asian woman perspective by saying, “Most Asian women are not interested in BMAW groups unless they are married to a Black guy. Even if Asian women are married to Black guys, they have been raised to not publicly display their relationships, so they may read BMAW stuff online, but they won’t publicly participate that much. Black women are probably more likely to be public about their relationships.” Lily has collaborated with ABC on stories in the past, and we both have seen stories that either Lily or ABC was working on about BMAW couples where the Black guy was really enthusiastic about publishing their Blasian couple love story, only to have his Asian wife or partner squash the story due to her desire to stay private about their relationship. Lily goes on to say, “Even when Asian women date Asian guys, they will keep their relationships private, and this happens even more so when Asian women date Black guys.”

2. Black Men Generally Can Find And Meet Asian Women On Their Own, Whereas AMBW Groups Are An Essential Tool For Asian Men To Meet Black Women

The vast majority of Asian women we know tell us that they never have problems meeting Black men – whether they want to meet them or not, they have Black men approach them regularly. However, Jennifer Gabriel tells us, “Asian guys rarely approach Black women in real life, or so I have heard and experienced. And, as women we are taught not to approach first. There is a lot of confusion, like is he or she going to be into me, I heard he or she does not like this or that, etc.” Rhea Alexander adds on this notion, but telling us, “Sadly too, Asian men have not truly mastered the art of picking up women. Black women are a new and often intimidating approach. This is why AMBW online groups have had such success for so very many. It’s less intimidating, creates lasting friendships, overcomes those stereotypes through further in-depth discussions, and this new type of connection is only going to grow.”

While we know that many Black men will also say that they need BMAW groups to find Asian women, what these Black men do not realize is that Asian women do not need to join a BMAW group to find Black men – they are regularly approached by Black men. So many single Asian women in particular avoid BMAW groups simply because they don’t need to be approached by a bunch of new guys. So for most Black men, approaching Asian women is not generally the issue, although we admit that some Black men could improve their approach to Asian women. With Asian men though, while we now personally see Asian men being bolder in their approach of women, in general approaching women is not a strong suit for many Asian men. The notion of using groups for dating purposes is just more in line with their culture and less awkward for them personally. Lily Lee explains to us, “Asian men generally don’t even approach Asian women when they like them. In Asian cultures, an Asian guy just randomly approaching women to try to date them will be seen as a not too serious guy or a playboy. Most Asian women will not seriously consider dating a guy like this.” Asian cultures often rely on group hangouts often involving group meals and / or karaoke as a way to get to know potential dating partners in a lower pressure, less awkward way that lessons rejection or potential loss of face. For Asian men, the AMBW online and meetup groups effectively become a tool for him to ease into relationships with Black women in friendly environments. Again though, we at ABC know more and more Asian men who step to Black women with confidence which is great to see.

Allie Shepherd reiterates the difference for BMAW couples by sharing, “On the contrary to what Asian men and Black women hear, Black men and Asian women are arguably the two most sought after groups. Black men being with women of other races has become somewhat commonplace at this point, and the same goes for Asian women. You don’t see as many groups for that pairing because they don’t need groups to show others that they’re interested and available.” Minky from Asian Woman Black Man agrees that Black men are more likely to approach Asian women by adding, “It could be that Black men travel more and are more likely to approach a girl outside his race. Whatever the reason, I’m glad that AMBW couples are getting more attention.”

3. Negative Dating Stereotypes About Black Women and Asian Men Actually Help Drive Interest In AMBW Groups

There are many negative stories and stereotypes about the desirability of Black women and Asian men for dating purposes that we don’t really care to repeat here. Everyone has heard them or can easily google them. However it should come as no surprise that many Black women and Asian men do not put much stock in these negative stories and stereotypes, and hence have a desire to “explore things firsthand” rather than believe the hype. ShaSha LaPerf, explains, “Rather than just taking these negative articles at face value or wondering about the misconceptions Asian men have about Black women, we can see for ourselves just what they think, while letting them know who we are.”

Rick from Breaking Bread With An Asian does a nice job of explaining this phenomenon by sharing, “In American culture, perceived masculinity is viewed as a desirable characteristic of males, whereas perceived femininity is viewed as a desirable trait of women. In American culture, Black men are hyper-masculinized and Asian women are hyper-feminized. On the other side of the coin, Asian men are feminized, and Black women are masculinized. This cultural conditioning favors the pairing of BMAW over AMBW. In effect, American culture gives Black men and Asian women voices that favor their pairing. Because these same cultural forces deprive Asian men and Black women the voices that favor their pairing, Asian men and Black women take it upon themselves to create communities, groups, and voices where they can be heard, appreciated, and valued. Therefore, there are more AMBW communities in the virtual world. Just like how there aren’t many favorable voices for people of color (POC) on the big screen, POC have created and are continuing to create their own avenues to give themselves voices (e.g., Wong Fu Productions, Timothy DeLaGhetto, JustKiddingFilms, Issa Rae, Chescaleigh, Tyler Perry movies, etc.).” We all know this phenomenon all too well. The more people are repressed, under represented, told no, and fed a bunch of nonsense, it often just leads to people being more determined to find their own path to success to prove all the naysayers wrong.

Toni Ward, who acknowledges that often Asian men and Black women are generally last to be picked in the dating pools says, “We are not throw-away people. If many of us broaden our horizons just a little, we could find love in some of the most unexpected places.” Toni goes on to share a great perspective saying, “By hook or by crook, many Black women go after that which we desire and since many of us desire to be in a loving, romantic relationship with an Asian man, we join these AMBW groups to find our ideal man. Asian men are not usually going out of their way to look for Black women, but as word of AMBW grows, many Asian men are beginning to discover that Black women do actually find them attractive and desirable and vice versa. I believe that as long as society continues to play favorites, Asian men and Black women will continue to find one another and pretty soon our census numbers and dating statistics will skyrocket.” So in an ironic way, the negativity aimed at Asian men and Black women just serves as fuel to drive AMBW groups forward.

Along these same lines, several contributors mentioned that when Black men and Asian women get together, it’s not that uncommon and it’s essentially socially accepted. However when Asian men and Black women get together, it’s rare, and in many ways an act of social defiance. Since AMBW comes from a socially defiant standpoint, once Black women and Asian men discover and openly accept their attraction to one, they tend to stick to that preference. Allie Shepherd, the creator of AMBW Worldwide, which organizes destination meetups for Asian men and Black women describes what typically happens at her meetups by telling us, “During the many meetups I’ve organized and been to, I came to find that for most of the people in attendance, this is the first time they’ve had the opportunity to talk to like-minded people in our demographic without having to be nervous about how they will be received. Honestly, Asian and Black cultures have more in common than anyone first believed and in that way I think that Black women and Asian men as well as Asian women and Black men are actually quite well suited. Black men and Asian women had that figured out a little while ago – Black women and Asian men are really just starting to realize this so it’s been really interesting and enlightening to be a part of that especially because I know this is just the tip of a vast iceberg.”

4. Hallyu, AKA the Korean Wave, has attracted more Black females than Black males, boosting interest in AMBW.

Hallyu, AKA the Korean Wave, (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Korean_Wave) is the worldwide popularization of Korean culture most commonly through K-pop and K-dramas which have won new fans worldwide. Black women like many others around the world, have embraced Hallyu and the Korean culture fever much more so than Black men have. Indeed various websites have been created aimed at Black women who are interested in K-pop and K-drama, even though there are very few Blacks to be found in either K-pop or K-drama. One of the few Blacks in K-drama, Sam Okyere, Ghanaian, has captured the hearts of women all over the world in part due to Hallyu – see more on Sam Okyere at our prior post, Korean Movie, “나의 절친 악당들 (Intimate Enemies)”, Breaks Ground Portraying A Blasian Family. This phenomenon happens even more so with the big name Korean performers. G-Dragon can tweet that he loves Rihanna and send Black women Kpop fans into a tizzy. Taeyang can show some appreciation for Black culture and stir speculation about him being open to marrying Black women for months on end. Or Rain, who clearly shows some chemistry with Naomie Harris in the movie, Ninja Assassin, will likely have Black female fans for life. The point being that many Black women have clearly been impacted by the Korean Wave in a way that Black men have not been impacted which is another contributor to the interest in AMBW groups.

Toni Ward gives a great explanation of this phenomenon by sharing, “I believe that the AMBW movement is growing exponentially due to Black women being affected by Hallyu. Though Hallyu is a Korean concept, many Asian cultures are benefiting from the push by the Koreans to popularize their culture. Through Hallyu, many Black women have come to discover their love for things like anime, cosplay, gaming and Korean pop music. Many within the Black culture are not familiar with these things, so who better but perhaps an Asian man would share in these interests? But one aspect of Hallyu that is highly beneficial to many Asian men of all cultures is the Korean Drama. Korean Dramas show sides of Asian men that most media does not. Though these shows are pure works of fiction, Korean Dramas show Asian men as masculine, sexy, fashionable and capable of showing affection and emotion…the complete opposite of that which we are used to seeing in western media…and we love it!”

Summary

At the end of the day, both BMAW and AMBW are still very much emerging groups, and as many of our contributors pointed out, we really have just scratched the surface of where Asian and Black couples are headed in the future. It will be exciting to watch the development of both groups, both in real life and online, as America transitions into a minority majority country over the next generation or two.

As we worked with the many contributors on this article, we were struck by a couple of key observations. First, it became clear for us that BMAW groups and AMBW groups today often serve slightly different purposes for their respective constituents. BMAW groups today are much more effective at serving established BMAW couples who are looking for support and advice regarding common issues that many BMAW couples experience. BMAW groups today are less effective at bringing Black men and Asian women singles together. This helps explain why the most successful BMAW groups are fairly mature groups with many established couples who delete and ban any nonsense related to guys just trying to pick up women or attract women with inappropriate pictures and the like. Whereas for AMBW groups, in a world that is not always kind to both Asian men and Black women, AMBW groups are an essential tool for Asian men and Black women to connect, learn more about each other, and explore things firsthand. At the same time, established AMBW couples also find value in AMBW groups as a safe place to discuss issues without all the negative baggage that society mindlessly repeats.

Secondly, given that Asian and Black couple relationships are interracial and often intercultural relationships, it should come as no surprise that the cultural differences between Asian women and Black women, as well as cultural differences between Asian men and Black men drive big differences in how these groups are perceived and used by the respective BMAW and AMBW communities.

The final observation was that despite the potential for a lot of wide ranging and diverse opinions on this topic given the number of contributors on this article, we were struck by the consistency and clarity of the contributors. Sure different people had different ways of expressing the same thoughts, but we were very pleased to see a tight clustering of thoughts around a couple of similar ideas. This gives us some degree of comfort that we have identified the key answers to our opening question, but as always we welcome additional thoughts and feedback from our readers below in the comments.

Despite all the discussion on race and gender in this article, we think it’s important to remind our readers that whether it’s BMAW or AMBW, it’s always about love first and foremost, not race. While we love Blasian couples of all kinds, we regularly remind those looking to enter into Blasian couple relationships to seek love first, and everything else will take care of itself. ShaSha LaPerf leaves us with a great closing thought, “Although the last census happened years ago, it will be interesting to see if there’s any changes in the numbers. Heck my Asian husband and I weren’t even counted since we were married after the last census was taken. I’ve seen AMBW couples connect through Facebook and Tumblr and in meet-up groups or other sites. I don’t know if this has led to more marriages, but at least it has led to more interaction and getting to know each other, which I think is the most important aspect in all of this.”

Once again, we are so very thankful for all of the great contributions from everyone involved in this article. We will repeat the names and links of all of the contributors below and we highly encourage our readers to check them all out!

CONTRIBUTORS