Thom Hartmann debates Dinesh D'Souza about whether we had followed Jimmy Carter's proposed energy policy to get us off of foreign oil in 1977 we'd be in the mess we're in now almost 33 years later. He does actually get D'Souza to admit that we would not be in the Middle East were it not for our dependence on that oil

Thom wrote about this back in 2005. Carter Tried To Stop Bush's Energy Disasters - 28 Years Ago:

In his recent news conference, George Bush Jr. suggested that our nation's "problem" with high gasoline prices was caused by the lack of a national energy policy, and tried to blame it all on Bill Clinton. First, Junior said, "This is a problem that's been a long time in coming. We haven't had an energy policy in this country." This was followed by, "That's exactly what I've been saying to the American people -- 10 years ago if we'd had an energy strategy, we would be able to diversify away from foreign dependence. And -- but we haven't done that. And now we find ourselves in the fix we're in." As is so often the case, Bush was lying. Consider President Jimmy Carter's April 18, 1977 speech. Since it was given nearly three decades ago, when many of the reporters in Bush's White House were children, it's understandable that they don't remember it. But it's inexcusable that Bush and the mainstream media (which, after all, has the ability to do research) would completely ignore it. It was the speech that established the strategic petroleum reserve, birthed the modern solar power industry, led to the insulation of millions of American homes, and established America's first national energy policy. "With the exception of preventing war," said Jimmy Carter, a man of peace, "this is the greatest challenge our country will face during our lifetimes." He added: "It is a problem we will not solve in the next few years, and it is likely to get progressively worse through the rest of this century. "We must not be selfish or timid if we hope to have a decent world for our children and grandchildren. Continue reading...

I love that Hartmann makes these debates with conservatives a daily feature on his radio show. If they'd let Thom anywhere near our television screen and the cable news shows, they would have their collective IQ raised quite a few points immediately, but that's not going to happen any time soon.

Here's a tidbit on Dinesh D'Souza I'd never read before if his Wiki page is accurate: