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Subject: Making Orks Competitive in 8th - Waaaagh! (Ork tactics)

Jidmah













Waaagh! Ork Warboss on Warbike

I'm da hand of Gork and Mork, dey sent me to rouse up da boyz to crush and kill ‘cos da boyz forgot what dere ‘ere for. I woz one of da boyz till da godz smashed me in da ‘ead an’ I ‘membered dat Orks is meant to conquer and make slaves of everyfing they don’t kill.



I’m da profit of da Waaagh an’ whole worlds burn in my boot prints. On Armour-Geddem, I led da boyz through da fire deserts and smashed da humies’ metal cities to scrap. I fought Yarik, old one-eye at Tarturus, an’ he fought good but we smashed iz city too.



I’m death to anyfing dat walks or crawls, where I go nothin’ stands in my way. We crushed da stunties on Golgotha, an’ we caught old one-eye when da speed freeks blew da humies’ big tanks ta bits. I let ‘im go ‘cause good enemies iz ‘ard to find, an Orks need enemies ta fight like they need meat ta eat an’ grog ta drink.



I iz more cunnin’ than a grot an’ more killy than a dread, da boyz dat follow me can’t be beat. On Pissenah we jumped da marine-boyz an’ our bosspoles was covered in da helmets we took from da dead ‘uns. We burned dere port an’ killed dere bosses an’ left nothin’ but ruins behind.



I’m Warlord Ghazghkull Mag Uruk Thraka an’ I speak wiv da word of da gods. We iz gonna stomp da ‘ooniverse flat an’ kill anyfing that fights back. We iz gonna do this coz’ we’re Orks an’ we was made ta fight an’ win!

- Graffiti on Warlord Battle Titan wreckage, found by Dark Angels at Westerisle, Piscina IV



A lot of fellow warbosses are currently taking their boyz for a spin with the actual rules, so I think we can start talking about actual tactics.



I know, us orks don't like rules, but a couple of things should be said before starting:

- This is supposed to be about competitive gaming. I know there are a lot of players you just want to toss some dice, watch their beautiful converted models, re-enact battles from the fluff and don't really care about who wins the game. You are all awesome people, but sorry, this thread isn't for you :(

- This thread is not the place to make guesses based on rumors or blogs you have read. If you are not one of the lucky people to have 8th edition rules yet, do not give advice based on rumors you've read or heard. Feel free to ask questions though!

- At this point it's safe to assume that any competitive gaming will be using points, not power level. Please don't base tactics on the obvious holes the power level system has.

- Keep in mind that not everybody has access to forgeworld models or rules.

- It is fine to agree to disagree.

- Back up your arguments.

- Orks never lose.

- WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGH!



Ork primer for high level competitive gaming:

https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/751354.page



Collection of battle reports found here (no longer updated)

https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/727761.page#9410547



Having an argument about Da Jump working in turn 1? Take this:

Spoiler:

Picture posted by official GW account on facebook

(Thanks to ZoBo for the link)



Unit summary: (thanks to pismakron and koooaei!)

Boyz One of the best units in the game. The math favours sluggas, but shootas works surprisingly well and gives you some flexibility. If you are struggling with orks, bring more boyz.

Ghazkgull An absolute killing machine and surprisingly durable. Works well in mechanized lists as well as with foot infantry.

Warboss The buffs provided by a warboss are crucial for boy blobs, and his damage output is quite decent. The 'eadwomper's killchoppa (relic BC ) is the best option for a Warboss, as is a Warbike, but leave the Mega Armor at home.

Weirdboy An auto-include. The weirdboy can reliable deny any psyker, is a smite machine, and has access to two good powers in Warpath and Da Jump.

Stormboyz Good for bracketing vehicles so they cannot fall back. Also, you don't lose out on the Greentide bonus by taking lots of min-sized squads. Basically faster moving boyz for a decent price.

Kommandos They can appear anywhere any time you like. While their bonus to their cover save is rarely useful, they are 15 boyz that can appear right next to your opponent, and boyz are good. They can get two burnaz for free.

Kustom Mega-Kannon Since price drop in CA , they are our best shooting option. You can have one crew fire multiple guns and have they other crews capture objectives and/or bubble-wrap.

Big Mek An important part of most ork lists, but not an auto-include. Always give him a KFF . A Warbike is also a good option as the KFF is very dependent on positioning. Don't waste points on klaws, saws, blastas or the shokk attack gun.

Painboy The 6+ save is pretty weak, but his abillity to heal characters is very useful. Healing weirdboyz and Ghaz will earn his points back, and with four attacks he has better damage output than a Big Mek.

Mad Dok Grotsnik A better painboy that only costs 9 more points. He is pretty tough with dual FNP saves and as killy as a warboss.

Tankbustas Very decent damage output, but they are way too squishy to use on foot. Works well in mechanized lists. Only unit that can make good use of the DakkaDakkaDakka stratagem.

Banner Nob Provides a nice buff for all Ork lists, but he is pretty expensive. He is good with both walkers and footsloggers.

Nobz Come stock with 4+ armor now and can take ammo runts that increase their durability - especially useful against multi-wound weapons. They are an important part of most mechanized lists, but sadly our vehicles are overpriced. All shooting options but shootas are too expensive.

Kannon Not as good as the KMK since it has only one shot and big guns are less tough than mek guns. Still a decent anti-tank weapon, especially when spammed.

Snikrot Awesome objective camper due to his cover buff. If you have 2+ units of kommandoz, he can support them, but is by no means required to do so.

Gorkanaut Very tough and a beast in close-combat. The shooting is kind of meh, but better than the morkanaut.

Zaggstruk Extremely good if you take multiple full-sized squads of stormboyz. Some people have reported success running him on his own.

Dakkajet It can do plenty of damage, but it is easy to kill. It's also ok at killing anything, but not actually good against any specific targets. Can be useful for assassinating characters, as it can jump next to them and unload its guns on them.

Kaptin Badrukk he is a strong shooting unit with mediocre range, however his aura doesn't work well with flash gits at all for multiple reasons. Therefore most useful without flash gits.

Burna Bommer Bombs work best against elite infantry, has one more big shoota than a blitza bommer. Use Explosive Demise to discourage your opponent from shooting it down or do lots of damage. Use CP to re-roll explosion result. Do not take skorcha missiles.

Skorchas very cheap and good weapons, but their outflanking is almost useless because skorachs are always out of range. Deploy them regularly, so they can skorch something after advancing first turn.

Killa Kan Reasonably durable and shooty, but needs lots of baby sitting: A Banner Nob to make them usefull in close combat and a Bik Mek with a KFF to make them survive. They also need a warboss or command-points to help with morale. Oh, and they don't benefit from 'Ere We Go.

Lootas Good damage output, but very squishy and needs to remain stationary. Use command points to re-roll their shots.

Battlewagon Ok with hard-top and a deff-rolla. They are expensive and most shooting options are not worth it for their points. Best transport for melee units with little shooting, but too expensive and too easy to kill by dedicated anti-tank.

Trukk Now half a battlewagon for half the price. Best transport for ranged units, but still too easy to kill and too expensive.

Warbuggies/trakks they are basically a couple bikers welded together resulting in a slight increase in durability. Rokkits make them too expensive, big shootas aren't actually great weapons. Can outflank.

Warbikers really fast, have good shooting, are quite durable vs small arms fire but fold like wet paper vs damage 2 or more weapons - most notably overcharged plasma. Since they get to strike first when charging their melee is now decent.

Morkanaut Like the Gorkanaut but with less damage output and a gun that fries itself.

Deffkopta The bomb is good, and the ability to assault things that are behind a screen can be game-winning and they appear almost anywhere on the board. On the downside they are expensive and squishy and do too little.

Bubble chukka Fun option that has the potential to be totally devastating or totally harmless. Most important value is number of shots, and then strength. Strength doesn't matter if you fail to hit, AP and damage don't matter if you fail to wound.

Zzap gun More unreliable version of the kannon, but could potentially do three mortal wounds and kill three marines or something. Not worth the extra 3 points over a kannon though, and KMK does it better.

MANz Kill too little due to hit modifier, too slow. They are hard to kill roadblocks, but not worth their points. Dual killsaws are superior to shooting options.

Blitza-Bommer Bombs are good at causing mortal wounds, perfect for squads of infantry but not that good against vehicles. Since CA more expensive than burna bommer without actually being better at anything relevant.

Deff dread Very good damage output, but the dread is very squishy and badly needs KFF protection. Too slow to reliably charge on turn two. They are useless for shooting.

Burnas Too expensive and to squishy. Both shooting and melee is inferior to regular boyz.

Wazbom Blastajet Instead of paying for a KFF that's never where you need it and a plane with guns that don't hit the broad side of a barn, bring another bommer.

Nob Bikers twice the price of a nob with ammo runt with little to show for it. Combined with all shooting options bein expensive as sin, not worth fielding.

Lobba Don't pay 26 points for a big shoota.

Smasha gun There is no reason to not get a KMK instead of this. Still better against fliers than tractor kannons.

Tractor kannon Strictly worse than regular kannon, even against flyers.

Gretchin Boyz or artillery can do anything better they can do. In some corner case you might want to spend 30 points on a unit to fill a detachment, but try to avoid that.

Runtherd Useless because grots are useless. Can be spammed for character shenanigans.

Mini mek He has a cool model, but he really has no purpose. Waste of points.

Flash Gitz Very expensive and very squishy. They badly need a transport but they also need to remain stationary.

Stompa Costs three times they points of a grokanaut with the shooting of one. A lot of fellow warbosses are currently taking their boyz for a spin with the actual rules, so I think we can start talking about actual tactics.I know, us orks don't like rules, but a couple of things should be said before starting:- This is supposed to be about competitive gaming. I know there are a lot of players you just want to toss some dice, watch their beautiful converted models, re-enact battles from the fluff and don't really care about who wins the game. You are all awesome people, but sorry, this thread isn't for you :(- This thread is not the place to make guesses based on rumors or blogs you have read. If you are not one of the lucky people to have 8th edition rules yet, do not give advice based on rumors you've read or heard. Feel free to ask questions though!- At this point it's safe to assume that any competitive gaming will be using points, not power level. Please don't base tactics on the obvious holes the power level system has.- Keep in mind that not everybody has access to forgeworld models or rules.- It is fine to agree to disagree.- Back up your arguments.- Orks never lose.- WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGH!Picture posted by officialaccount on facebook here (Thanks to ZoBo for the link)(thanks to pismakron and koooaei!)One of the best units in the game. The math favours sluggas, but shootas works surprisingly well and gives you some flexibility. If you are struggling with orks, bring more boyz.An absolute killing machine and surprisingly durable. Works well in mechanized lists as well as with foot infantry.The buffs provided by a warboss are crucial for boy blobs, and his damage output is quite decent. The 'eadwomper's killchoppa (relic) is the best option for a Warboss, as is a Warbike, but leave the Mega Armor at home.An auto-include. The weirdboy can reliable deny any psyker, is a smite machine, and has access to two good powers in Warpath and Da Jump.Good for bracketing vehicles so they cannot fall back. Also, you don't lose out on the Greentide bonus by taking lots of min-sized squads. Basically faster moving boyz for a decent price.They can appear anywhere any time you like. While their bonus to their cover save is rarely useful, they are 15 boyz that can appear right next to your opponent, and boyz are good. They can get two burnaz for free.Since price drop in, they are our best shooting option. You can have one crew fire multiple guns and have they other crews capture objectives and/or bubble-wrap.An important part of most ork lists, but not an auto-include. Always give him a. A Warbike is also a good option as theis very dependent on positioning. Don't waste points on klaws, saws, blastas or the shokk attack gun.The 6+ save is pretty weak, but his abillity to heal characters is very useful. Healing weirdboyz and Ghaz will earn his points back, and with four attacks he has better damage output than a Big Mek.A better painboy that only costs 9 more points. He is pretty tough with dualsaves and as killy as a warboss.Very decent damage output, but they are way too squishy to use on foot. Works well in mechanized lists. Only unit that can make good use of the DakkaDakkaDakka stratagem.Provides a nice buff for all Ork lists, but he is pretty expensive. He is good with both walkers and footsloggers.Come stock with 4+ armor now and can take ammo runts that increase their durability - especially useful against multi-wound weapons. They are an important part of most mechanized lists, but sadly our vehicles are overpriced. All shooting options but shootas are too expensive.Not as good as thesince it has only one shot and big guns are less tough than mek guns. Still a decent anti-tank weapon, especially when spammed.Awesome objective camper due to his cover buff. If you have 2+ units of kommandoz, he can support them, but is by no means required to do so.Very tough and a beast in close-combat. The shooting is kind of meh, but better than the morkanaut.Extremely good if you take multiple full-sized squads of stormboyz. Some people have reported success running him on his own.It can do plenty of damage, but it is easy to kill. It's also ok at killing anything, but not actually good against any specific targets. Can be useful for assassinating characters, as it can jump next to them and unload its guns on them.he is a strong shooting unit with mediocre range, however his aura doesn't work well with flash gits at all for multiple reasons. Therefore most useful without flash gits.Bombs work best against elite infantry, has one more big shoota than a blitza bommer. Use Explosive Demise to discourage your opponent from shooting it down or do lots of damage. Useto re-roll explosion result. Do not take skorcha missiles.very cheap and good weapons, but their outflanking is almost useless because skorachs are always out of range. Deploy them regularly, so they can skorch something after advancing first turn.Reasonably durable and shooty, but needs lots of baby sitting: A Banner Nob to make them usefull in close combat and a Bik Mek with ato make them survive. They also need a warboss or command-points to help with morale. Oh, and they don't benefit from 'Ere We Go.Good damage output, but very squishy and needs to remain stationary. Use command points to re-roll their shots.Ok with hard-top and a deff-rolla. They are expensive and most shooting options are not worth it for their points. Best transport for melee units with little shooting, but too expensive and too easy to kill by dedicated anti-tank.Now half a battlewagon for half the price. Best transport for ranged units, but still too easy to kill and too expensive.they are basically a couple bikers welded together resulting in a slight increase in durability. Rokkits make them too expensive, big shootas aren't actually great weapons. Can outflank.really fast, have good shooting, are quite durable vs small arms fire but fold like wet paper vs damage 2 or more weapons - most notably overcharged plasma. Since they get to strike first when charging their melee is now decent.Like the Gorkanaut but with less damage output and a gun that fries itself.The bomb is good, and the ability to assault things that are behind a screen can be game-winning and they appear almost anywhere on the board. On the downside they are expensive and squishy and do too little.Fun option that has the potential to be totally devastating or totally harmless. Most important value is number of shots, and then strength. Strength doesn't matter if you fail to hit,and damage don't matter if you fail to wound.More unreliable version of the kannon, but could potentially do three mortal wounds and kill three marines or something. Not worth the extra 3 points over a kannon though, anddoes it better.Kill too little due to hit modifier, too slow. They are hard to kill roadblocks, but not worth their points. Dual killsaws are superior to shooting options.Bombs are good at causing mortal wounds, perfect for squads of infantry but not that good against vehicles. Sincemore expensive than burna bommer without actually being better at anything relevant.Very good damage output, but the dread is very squishy and badly needsprotection. Too slow to reliably charge on turn two. They are useless for shooting.Too expensive and to squishy. Both shooting and melee is inferior to regular boyz.Instead of paying for athat's never where you need it and a plane with guns that don't hit the broad side of a barn, bring another bommer.twice the price of a nob with ammo runt with little to show for it. Combined with all shooting options bein expensive as sin, not worth fielding.Don't pay 26 points for a big shoota.There is no reason to not get ainstead of this. Still better against fliers than tractor kannons.Strictly worse than regular kannon, even against flyers.Boyz or artillery can do anything better they can do. In some corner case you might want to spend 30 points on a unit to fill a detachment, but try to avoid that.Useless because grots are useless. Can be spammed for character shenanigans.He has a cool model, but he really has no purpose. Waste of points.Very expensive and very squishy. They badly need a transport but they also need to remain stationary.Costs three times they points of a grokanaut with the shooting of one.

This message was edited 18 times. Last update was at 2018/06/20 10:44:53 Earth is not flat

Vaccines work

We've been to the moon

Climate change is real

Chemtrails aren't a thing

Evolution is a fact

Orks are not a melee army

Stand up for science!



Subject: Making Orks Competitive in 8th - Waaaagh!

KurtAngle2





Dakka Veteran





Something, something really necessary is missing...





























WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGH

Subject: Making Orks Competitive in 8th - Waaaagh!

GreatGranpapy







Regular Dakkanaut



Houston



WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGH!!!





"clears throat"



All roight ladz, foist ordah o' bisness, shootas or sluggas?

Subject: Making Orks Competitive in 8th - Waaaagh!

Jidmah













Waaagh! Ork Warboss on Warbike

KurtAngle2 wrote:

Something, something really necessary is missing... Something, something really necessary is missing...

Fixed Fixed

Earth is not flat

Vaccines work

We've been to the moon

Climate change is real

Chemtrails aren't a thing

Evolution is a fact

Orks are not a melee army

Stand up for science!



Subject: Making Orks Competitive in 8th - Waaaagh!

KurtAngle2





Dakka Veteran





GreatGranpapy wrote:

WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGH!!!





"clears throat"



All roight ladz, foist ordah o' bisness, shootas or sluggas? WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGH!!!"clears throat"All roight ladz, foist ordah o' bisness, shootas or sluggas?



Shoota is decent now but 3+ armies on cover will be a pain in the ass to fight, so choice is slugga for me Shoota is decent now but 3+ armies on cover will be a pain in the ass to fight, so choice is slugga for me

Subject: Making Orks Competitive in 8th - Waaaagh!

JohnU

[DCM]







Probably Drunk



Colorado Springs



For 30 boy mobz I'll try out a mix. Probably 10-12 sluggas and the rest shootas, then adjust from there. Getting 30 shootas into range at the same time isn't always easy and if the mob is down 10-15 boyz by the time they march across the board the slugga boyz can step in and keep the damage up.



For Trukk boyz, still all sluggas. Though I'm not sure about Trukk boyz when Stormboyz are so cheap now.

Subject: Making Orks Competitive in 8th - Waaaagh!

davou













Nasty Nob

Collection of batreps



Green denotes an ork win

Red denotes an ork loss



http://www.3plusplus.net/2017/06/8th-edition-battle-report-1500-pts-tau-vs-orks/ Tau vs orks

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=77HZpu6v0OA BA vs Orks

https://war-of-sigmar.herokuapp.com/bloggings/2121 - BA vs Orks

https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/727637.page Orks vs SM

https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/240/727133.page#9414615 Orks vs SM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4qJKPnAj_2E Orks vs SM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OweX4fk8Br8 - Orks vs Darkeldar

https://www.twitch.tv/videos/150041649 - Orks vs CSM

Green denotes an ork winRed denotes an ork loss

This message was edited 9 times. Last update was at 2017/06/07 15:20:09 ERJAK wrote:





The fluff is like ketchup and mustard on a burger. Yes it's desirable, yes it makes things better, but no it doesn't fundamentally change what you're eating and no you shouldn't just drown the whole meal in it. The fluff is like ketchup and mustard on a burger. Yes it's desirable, yes it makes things better, but no it doesn't fundamentally change what you're eating and no you shouldn't just drown the whole meal in it.



Subject: Making Orks Competitive in 8th - Waaaagh!

GreatGranpapy







Regular Dakkanaut



Houston



Oh can we mix and match sluggas and shootas now?

Subject: Making Orks Competitive in 8th - Waaaagh!

JohnU

[DCM]







Probably Drunk



Colorado Springs



GreatGranpapy wrote:

Oh can we mix and match sluggas and shootas now? Oh can we mix and match sluggas and shootas now?



Yes indeed. And both options are 0 cost. Yes indeed. And both options are 0 cost.

Subject: Making Orks Competitive in 8th - Waaaagh!

Pedroig





Regular Dakkanaut





Keep Boyz in Aura range, it really boosts their value, off on their own, they do o.k., but have them near a Warboss, Banner Boy, and Weirdbo, a kff will help them to keep numbers.



It is not hard to get Warboss, Banner, and Weird supported 25+ Boyz unit into CC on Turn 2, and if they are ChoppaBoyz you are looking at 125 hit rolls, not including the supporters.



Focus fire on turn 1 on your units/vehicles will still tear them up, but it takes quite a bit more focus then it use to...

si vis pacem, para bellum

Subject: Making Orks Competitive in 8th - Waaaagh!

davou













Nasty Nob

Interesting thing; Explodes rules say that damage happens before you disembark. So you get to blow up the trukk, roll for casualties and then put your mob down.



Using trukks like a missile to engage swathes of the other persons line means that when they blow up the trukks, they suffer from the 'explodes' rule and your own models then get to get out with only 1/6 casualties. Not to mention that whatever falls back from the trukks is charge stunned as a result

ERJAK wrote:





The fluff is like ketchup and mustard on a burger. Yes it's desirable, yes it makes things better, but no it doesn't fundamentally change what you're eating and no you shouldn't just drown the whole meal in it. The fluff is like ketchup and mustard on a burger. Yes it's desirable, yes it makes things better, but no it doesn't fundamentally change what you're eating and no you shouldn't just drown the whole meal in it.



Subject: Making Orks Competitive in 8th - Waaaagh!

Nazrak













Dakka Veteran

JohnU wrote:

GreatGranpapy wrote:

Oh can we mix and match sluggas and shootas now? Oh can we mix and match sluggas and shootas now?



Yes indeed. And both options are 0 cost. Yes indeed. And both options are 0 cost.

I missed this. INTERESTING…



I know it's pointless trying to second guess these things, but do we think that's intentional/likely to stick around once a full codex happens? Quite like the idea of my boyz being even less uniform than they are already.





Automatically Appended Next Post:

JohnU wrote:





For Trukk boyz, still all sluggas. Though I'm not sure about Trukk boyz when Stormboyz are so cheap now. For Trukk boyz, still all sluggas. Though I'm not sure about Trukk boyz when Stormboyz are so cheap now.

Aye, this may be just the push I need to start that Evil Sunz stormboyz mob I've been thinking about. Might wait til the new flying stems from those fat jump pack marines are more widely available though. I missed this. INTERESTING…I know it's pointless trying to second guess these things, but do we think that's intentional/likely to stick around once a full codex happens? Quite like the idea of my boyz being even less uniform than they are already.Aye, this may be just the push I need to start that Evil Sunz stormboyz mob I've been thinking about. Might wait til the new flying stems from those fat jump pack marines are more widely available though.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/06/05 20:35:41

Subject: Making Orks Competitive in 8th - Waaaagh!

koooaei













!!Goffik Rocker!!

th ed bat rep.



https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/727637.page



quick insight:

- cover rules suck for orks

- don't let the 6-7 wound on your warboss fool you. He's way less durable vs heavy firepower than before. So, be careful with him. Not saying about any other less durable indep

- vehiles are still killable. Definitely more stable but still, don't expect to roll a trukk in front of your opponent's shooty stuff and keep it intact

- you no longer need troops to create cads with decent amount of command points. So, keep it in mind when building your lists. You might easilly encounter something like a...say, full devastator army.

- 30-strong blobs are FINALLY playable. At least thanks to casualties not being taken from the front. They mostly lost durability cause of no longer geting cover from intervening models but deal way more damage with stable 3+ to-hits, 4 str and more attacks. Templates are dead, so bunch up as much as you want to maximise damage.

- Mek guns are still fine - lost durability despite having more wounds and are way more expensive but ok. I liked a bubblechukka. It's overpriced a bit but a hell lot of fun

- Manz are not that great any more. They lost a lot of punch with 1 less attack and hiting on 4-s instead of 3-s (bully boyz). Can run+charge though. Still too expensive for my taste. Can probably be used to eat overwatch from small arms fire. Wana add my first 8-ed bat rep.quick insight:- cover rules suck for orks- don't let the 6-7 wound on your warboss fool you. He's way less durable vs heavy firepower than before. So, be careful with him. Not saying about any other less durable indep- vehiles are still killable. Definitely more stable but still, don't expect to roll a trukk in front of your opponent's shooty stuff and keep it intact- you no longer need troops to create cads with decent amount of command points. So, keep it in mind when building your lists. You might easilly encounter something like a...say, full devastator army.- 30-strong blobs are FINALLY playable. At least thanks to casualties not being taken from the front. They mostly lost durability cause of no longer geting cover from intervening models but deal way more damage with stable 3+ to-hits, 4and more attacks. Templates are dead, so bunch up as much as you want to maximise damage.- Mek guns are still fine - lost durability despite having more wounds and are way more expensive but ok. I liked a bubblechukka. It's overpriced a bit but a hell lot of funare not that great any more. They lost a lot of punch with 1 less attack and hiting on 4-s instead of 3-s (bully boyz). Can run+charge though. Still too expensive for my taste. Can probably be used to eat overwatch from small arms fire.

Subject: Making Orks Competitive in 8th - Waaaagh!

Nazrak













Dakka Veteran

Something else I spotted today: mega armour guys seem to have lost their stikkbombz. Guess it's pretty irrelevant with kustom shootas being assault 4 now (so more reliable on average than the D6 hits from a frag grenade) and grenades having no effect in CC any more. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Subject: Making Orks Competitive in 8th - Waaaagh!

davou













Nasty Nob

koooaei wrote:

Wana add my first 8- th ed bat rep.



- Manz are not that great any more. They lost a lot of punch with 1 less attack and hiting on 4-s instead of 3-s (bully boyz). Can run+charge though. Still too expensive for my taste. Can probably be used to eat overwatch from small arms fire. Wana add my first 8-ed bat rep.are not that great any more. They lost a lot of punch with 1 less attack and hiting on 4-s instead of 3-s (bully boyz). Can run+charge though. Still too expensive for my taste. Can probably be used to eat overwatch from small arms fire.



added it to my list of batreps!



and MANz hit on 3+ not 4+ 2+ even if you keep a banner nearby added it to my list of batreps!andhit on 3+ not 4+2+ even if you keep a banner nearby

ERJAK wrote:





The fluff is like ketchup and mustard on a burger. Yes it's desirable, yes it makes things better, but no it doesn't fundamentally change what you're eating and no you shouldn't just drown the whole meal in it. The fluff is like ketchup and mustard on a burger. Yes it's desirable, yes it makes things better, but no it doesn't fundamentally change what you're eating and no you shouldn't just drown the whole meal in it.



Subject: Making Orks Competitive in 8th - Waaaagh!

Nazrak













Dakka Veteran

koooaei wrote:

Wana add my first 8- th ed bat rep.



https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/727637.page



quick insight:

- cover rules suck for orks

- don't let the 6-7 wound on your warboss fool you. He's way less durable vs heavy firepower than before. So, be careful with him. Not saying about any other less durable indep

- vehiles are still killable. Definitely more stable but still, don't expect to roll a trukk in front of your opponent's shooty stuff and keep it intact

- you no longer need troops to create cads with decent amount of command points. So, keep it in mind when building your lists. You might easilly encounter something like a...say, full devastator army.

- 30-strong blobs are FINALLY playable. At least thanks to casualties not being taken from the front. They mostly lost durability cause of no longer geting cover from intervening models but deal way more damage with stable 3+ to-hits, 4 str and more attacks. Templates are dead, so bunch up as much as you want to maximise damage.

- Mek guns are still fine - lost durability despite having more wounds and are way more expensive but ok. I liked a bubblechukka. It's overpriced a bit but a hell lot of fun

- Manz are not that great any more. They lost a lot of punch with 1 less attack and hiting on 4-s instead of 3-s (bully boyz). Can run+charge though. Still too expensive for my taste. Can probably be used to eat overwatch from small arms fire. Wana add my first 8-ed bat rep.quick insight:- cover rules suck for orks- don't let the 6-7 wound on your warboss fool you. He's way less durable vs heavy firepower than before. So, be careful with him. Not saying about any other less durable indep- vehiles are still killable. Definitely more stable but still, don't expect to roll a trukk in front of your opponent's shooty stuff and keep it intact- you no longer need troops to create cads with decent amount of command points. So, keep it in mind when building your lists. You might easilly encounter something like a...say, full devastator army.- 30-strong blobs are FINALLY playable. At least thanks to casualties not being taken from the front. They mostly lost durability cause of no longer geting cover from intervening models but deal way more damage with stable 3+ to-hits, 4and more attacks. Templates are dead, so bunch up as much as you want to maximise damage.- Mek guns are still fine - lost durability despite having more wounds and are way more expensive but ok. I liked a bubblechukka. It's overpriced a bit but a hell lot of funare not that great any more. They lost a lot of punch with 1 less attack and hiting on 4-s instead of 3-s (bully boyz). Can run+charge though. Still too expensive for my taste. Can probably be used to eat overwatch from small arms fire.

Cheers for that. Per the MANz point, do we reckon a Waaagh banner with them would be a smart way of mitigating the -1 to hit with Power Klaws? Cheers for that. Per thepoint, do we reckon a Waaagh banner with them would be a smart way of mitigating the -1 to hit with Power Klaws?

Subject: Making Orks Competitive in 8th - Waaaagh!

davou













Nasty Nob

oh right, minus 1 from klaws.... my stupid

ERJAK wrote:





The fluff is like ketchup and mustard on a burger. Yes it's desirable, yes it makes things better, but no it doesn't fundamentally change what you're eating and no you shouldn't just drown the whole meal in it. The fluff is like ketchup and mustard on a burger. Yes it's desirable, yes it makes things better, but no it doesn't fundamentally change what you're eating and no you shouldn't just drown the whole meal in it.



Subject: Making Orks Competitive in 8th - Waaaagh!

Nazrak













Dakka Veteran

davou wrote:

koooaei wrote:

Wana add my first 8- th ed bat rep.



- Manz are not that great any more. They lost a lot of punch with 1 less attack and hiting on 4-s instead of 3-s (bully boyz). Can run+charge though. Still too expensive for my taste. Can probably be used to eat overwatch from small arms fire. Wana add my first 8-ed bat rep.are not that great any more. They lost a lot of punch with 1 less attack and hiting on 4-s instead of 3-s (bully boyz). Can run+charge though. Still too expensive for my taste. Can probably be used to eat overwatch from small arms fire.



added it to my list of batreps!



and MANz hit on 3+ not 4+ 2+ even if you keep a banner nearby added it to my list of batreps!andhit on 3+ not 4+2+ even if you keep a banner nearby

Power Klaws strike at -1 to hit now.





Automatically Appended Next Post:

Beaten to the punch. Just like a 7th ed power klaw.





Automatically Appended Next Post:

Just read that 3plusplus batrep. If I'm not mistaken, I think they misinterpreted how the Counter-Offensive stratagem works – doesn't one charging unit still get to strike first before you can use it? Power Klaws strike at -1 to hit now.Beaten to the punch. Just like a 7th ed power klaw.Just read that 3plusplus batrep. If I'm not mistaken, I think they misinterpreted how the Counter-Offensive stratagem works – doesn't one charging unit still get to strike first before you can use it?

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2017/06/05 21:16:10

Subject: Making Orks Competitive in 8th - Waaaagh!

Palleus







Regular Dakkanaut





AP , and a standard 2 Damage. could this be the age of the Blood Axe? I love the look of Big Choppas now. Hitting better than Power Klaws, -1, and a standard 2 Damage. could this be the age of the Blood Axe?

Subject: Making Orks Competitive in 8th - Waaaagh!

little-killer





Regular Dakkanaut



France







Morkaunaut is pretty good, he left an ik with 1hp before dying just by himself, and the 9" for invu is quite large so you can stack as much boyz as you want.



30 boyz *3 with a weirdboy to teleport is quite good too, just he died turn 2 because sniper .



Tankbustas in trukk well, they got quite better, since trukk is not like one hit and explode, plus since you can tp troops, the ennemy is focusing on what can charge him.



Negative point now, the shokk attack gun useless as feth (well he died turn 2 so maybe i will test him again).



So some questions now, i want to play some stormboyz, but i don't find if they can still deepstrike, or they are like warbikers without the dakka and the save. So i did a game today against mecanicus, just to see what we can do as orks, so no objectives, just extermination, i won.Morkaunaut is pretty good, he left an ik with 1hp before dying just by himself, and the 9" for invu is quite large so you can stack as much boyz as you want.30 boyz *3 with a weirdboy to teleport is quite good too, just he died turn 2 because sniperTankbustas in trukk well, they got quite better, since trukk is not like one hit and explode, plus since you can tp troops, the ennemy is focusing on what can charge him.Negative point now, the shokk attack gun useless as feth (well he died turn 2 so maybe i will test him again).So some questions now, i want to play some stormboyz, but i don't find if they can still deepstrike, or they are like warbikers without the dakka and the save.

40: 10 000 Orks, 3000 Tau, 2000 Deathwatch

AOS: 2000 Kharadrons Overlords

Subject: Making Orks Competitive in 8th - Waaaagh!

gungo





Longtime Dakkanaut





Do you guys think the advanced cover rules will be standard play? It makes cover less generic However it really screws orks with the extra distance on charges through non-ruins. Especially kommandos

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/06/05 21:32:34

Subject: Making Orks Competitive in 8th - Waaaagh!

blaktoof











Longtime Dakkanaut

Played two games of 8th edition over the weekend at 1k points.



Here is what I took.



Patrol Detachment

2x Warboss with kustom shoota, power klaw, attack squig.

2x boys, 10boyz+1 nob. 1 big shoota

2 trukks with big shootas

2 x warbuggies with twin linked big shootas

2 deffdreads with 2 klaws and 2 rokkits each

2 kanz(one unit) with klaws and rokkits





First game was against GSC . Highlights- GSC went first, killes a dread with ambushing genestealers and metamorphs, put 5 wounds on a trukk, a wound on a kan and a couple wounds on a dred. Trukks had boys and warboss in them. They both got out and killed the stealers and mstamorphs. Game ended with a patriarch in assault with two of my trukks, near a warboss and a rockgrinder in the center. In opponents DZ were the buggies, kanz and a dread with 1 wound remaining. Patriarch kills both trukks and one blows up. D3 mortal wounds later to nearby units killed the patriarch, my wounded warboss, and the rockgrinder. This tabled the other player and left me with only the dread kanz and buggies left.



Second game.

Against khorne chaos army. Large fleshhound mob, bloodthirster, some cultists, dark apostle, and a large biker mob. I had some crazy assault rolls that swung the game. Like rolling box cars when needing to get at least an 11 to get a Boyz move to charge the blood thirster. Had a first turn assault from disembark, move, advance then charge from warboss ability. The blood thirster took the middle and sat there until the last turn when you managed to bring it down with my warlord warboss. There were some.epic fights here, in the end the bloodthirster killed 497 pts of my models and left one of the warboss with 2 wounds before going down. Mission was scouring, I held 2 objectives, the superior objective, had slay the warlord and line breaker. Opponent had one objective and first blood.



The kanz were underwhelming both games, by a lot. I used them mostly for assault with shots as they moved up table.



Warboss with Boyz in a trukk is pretty brutally amazing. 8"+ d6 + 2d6 (with reroll) threat range to get within 1" on the turn they disembark is no joke. 3" disembark +5" move is the 8". The advance move is the real game changer with that. It has an effective 3+ d6 or average 6" better charge range than an blob of 30 boyz. That's like having a move of 11 instead of 5". Both games the trukk boys got a charge off turn one or two.



Shooting was underwhelming overall from everything, having assault weapons is nice but move with advance and shoot needs 6s for most ork units to hit..so I rarely hit. My entire army shooting the second game on turn one did 1 wound total.



Buggies were mostly ignored, second game they secured two objectives late game thanks to 14" move and d6 " advance.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2017/06/05 21:36:00

Subject: Making Orks Competitive in 8th - Waaaagh!

JohnU

[DCM]







Probably Drunk



Colorado Springs



little-killer wrote:





So some questions now, i want to play some stormboyz, but i don't find if they can still deepstrike, or they are like warbikers without the dakka and the save. So some questions now, i want to play some stormboyz, but i don't find if they can still deepstrike, or they are like warbikers without the dakka and the save.



They can't deepstrike, but they can advance and charge without needing a Boss nearby. They're also dirt cheap. They can't deepstrike, but they can advance and charge without needing a Boss nearby. They're also dirt cheap.

Subject: Making Orks Competitive in 8th - Waaaagh!

GreatGranpapy







Regular Dakkanaut



Houston



I'm still going to give Power Klaws a chance, a lot of my nobs are modeled with them after all.



How do you think combi-rokkits on nobs are? Stick some ammo runts on them and they can hit anything as well a a tankbusta, with 2 wounds and a 4+ to boot.

Subject: Making Orks Competitive in 8th - Waaaagh!

little-killer





Regular Dakkanaut



France



JohnU wrote:

little-killer wrote:





So some questions now, i want to play some stormboyz, but i don't find if they can still deepstrike, or they are like warbikers without the dakka and the save. So some questions now, i want to play some stormboyz, but i don't find if they can still deepstrike, or they are like warbikers without the dakka and the save.



They can't deepstrike, but they can advance and charge without needing a Boss nearby. They're also dirt cheap. They can't deepstrike, but they can advance and charge without needing a Boss nearby. They're also dirt cheap.



Fu ck, so i will go with weirdboyz and boyz, i got them and it's funnier. I don't want to buy thousands of stormboyz. Fu ck, so i will go with weirdboyz and boyz, i got them and it's funnier. I don't want to buy thousands of stormboyz.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2017/06/05 21:50:39 40: 10 000 Orks, 3000 Tau, 2000 Deathwatch

AOS: 2000 Kharadrons Overlords

Subject: Making Orks Competitive in 8th - Waaaagh!

Reecius















San Diego, California

San Diego, California Awesome Autarch





Just to alleviate some concerns, orks are bad ass, like, super good in 8th. In our games, they are very, very competitive.



You have mobility options, mortal wounds if you need them, great melee, morale control, and shooting, too.



Things are different than you may be used to but in general the classic list archetypes work quite well. You can go Speed Freaks, Kan Wall, horde, etc. and they work quite well.



Did anyone have any specific questions I will try to pop in from time to time to address them if that sounds good.



Oh, and feel free to join us for a live bat rep tomorrow at 5pm PST on our Twitch Channel. I will be playing Orks vs. Chaos: Hey guys, Davou asked me to pop in and answer some questions about Orks in 8th ed, which I am happy to do.Just to alleviate some concerns, orks are bad ass, like, super good in 8th. In our games, they are very, very competitive.You have mobility options, mortal wounds if you need them, great melee, morale control, and shooting, too.Things are different than you may be used to but in general the classic list archetypes work quite well. You can go Speed Freaks, Kan Wall, horde, etc. and they work quite well.Did anyone have any specific questions I will try to pop in from time to time to address them if that sounds good.Oh, and feel free to join us for a live bat rep tomorrow at 5pm PST on our Twitch Channel. I will be playing Orks vs. Chaos: https://www.twitch.tv/frontlinegaming_tv

Subject: Making Orks Competitive in 8th - Waaaagh!

JohnU

[DCM]







Probably Drunk



Colorado Springs



I think you mentioned in the stream that you also tested FW models, but didn't discuss them since you didn't have the books. You able to talk about that at all?

Subject: Making Orks Competitive in 8th - Waaaagh!

JimOnMars







Battlewagon Driver with Charged Engine





Reecius wrote:

Did anyone have any specific questions I will try to pop in from time to time to address them if that sounds good. Did anyone have any specific questions I will try to pop in from time to time to address them if that sounds good.

Wow thanks, Reece. We just discovered that the 'ere we go re-roll is one OR both dice because of the definition of re-roll on p. 178. Can you confirm? Wow thanks, Reece. We just discovered that the 'ere we go re-roll is one OR both dice because of the definition of re-roll on p. 178. Can you confirm?

Subject: Making Orks Competitive in 8th - Waaaagh!

Reecius















San Diego, California

San Diego, California Awesome Autarch

@JohnU



No, not yet, sorry =(



@JimOnMars



It is reroll failed charge rolls. I believe the definition on pg . 178 isn't meant to directly interact with Ere We Go in the way you present it, but I will see if we can confirm that. I see the logic, there.

Subject: Making Orks Competitive in 8th - Waaaagh!

davou













Nasty Nob

Reecius wrote:

Hey guys, Davou asked me to pop in and answer some questions about Orks in 8th ed, which I am happy to do.



Did anyone have any specific questions I will try to pop in from time to time to address them if that sounds good.



Hey guys, Davou asked me to pop in and answer some questions about Orks in 8th ed, which I am happy to do.Did anyone have any specific questions I will try to pop in from time to time to address them if that sounds good.



Thanks bro!



Transports Feel pretty expencive, how do trukks feel when the new survivability is considered?



How do orks deal with lists that can cheaply screen against assaults screen with chaff (kroot, cultists or grots?) Thanks bro!Transports Feel pretty expencive, how do trukks feel when the new survivability is considered?How do orks deal with lists that can cheaply screen against assaults screen with chaff (kroot, cultists or grots?)