At a Port Washington, New York roundtable on gun violence Monday, former Secretary of State and current Democratic presidential frontrunner Hillary Clinton ruffled some feathers when she nodded in agreement, then applauded enthusiastically for a panelist who told the audience that gun manufacturers “make terrorists out of our citizens.” As you can see from the video, Hillary’s agreement is anything but reluctant:

We are worried about terrorism, but we have terrorism on our own soil. Our gun manufacturers, our ammunition manufacturers make terrorists out of our citizens. A sobering fact, go online, Go buy a semi-automatic weapon. They’re all available online with not much to prove, because mom and pop somewhere out there are making them, and there’s nothing to prevent people who are mentally ill, and people who are on terrorist watch lists, to making our citizens become terrorists. This is a home problem, this is a problem we all face.

Well, it at least ruffled the feathers of The Daily Caller‘s Chuck Ross, who described the speaker as “a woman,” a “supporter” of Hillary Clinton, a “panelist,” and “the woman.”

That speaker, though, has a name, and it’s Rita Kestenbaum, 2015 Democratic candidate for Hempstead Town Supervisor and a former town councilwoman. She’s a human being whose daughter, Carol Kestenbaum, was killed by her best friend’s domestic abuser. Her statement was, if anything, an understatement. Even the relatively low percentage of gun murders that are the result of mass shootings dwarfs the number of Americans killed by terrorists.

Ross also took exception to Hillary’s claim that “The state that has the highest per capita number of those guns that end up committing crimes in New York come from Vermont,” which is actually 100% true. Ross’ problem appears to stem from the low raw number of crime guns from Vermont, and the fact that Senator Bernie Sanders doesn’t set gun policy at the state level. Hillary, though, went on to explain what that stat illustrates:

(Senator Sanders) frequently says, “Well, you know, I represent Vermont, it’s a small rural state, we have no gun laws.” Here’s what I want you to know: most of the guns that are used in crimes and violence and killings in New York come from out of state. And the state that has the highest per capita number of those guns that end up committing crimes in New York come from Vermont. So this is not, oh, you know, I live in a rural state, we don’t have any of these problems, this is, you know what? It’s easy to cross borders. Criminals, domestic abusers, traffickers, people who are dangerously mentally ill cross borders, too, and sometimes they do it to get the guns they use.

This is the flip side to the “Chicago” argument that gun extremists always use, that Chicago has strict gun laws and lots of guns, therefore gun control doesn’t work. The lax gun laws in neighboring states undermines strict local and state laws, highlighting the need for strong federal laws.

Another panelist was Sandy Phillips, who lost her daughter Jessica Ghawi in the Aurora massacre, and who was ordered to pay the ammunition company $203,000.00 thanks to the shield law that Bernie Sanders supported. She described the fallout from that case, and a phone call she placed to Senator Sanders for help:

Secretary Clinton also took a crack at Sanders in her closing remarks, pointing out that the Phillips’ lawsuit did not even seek any financial damages, just an injunction against those sorts of ammunition sales, and that the NRA was instrumental in winning that judgment against the slain girl’s parents:

Bernie Sanders and his campaign don’t like being called out for siding against the families of gun massacres, but the fact that they must use lies and deflection rather than simply explain the principle at stake is a sign of that principle’s weakness.

This is an opinion piece. The views expressed in this article are those of just the author.