More than a year after the devastating fire at the Marshall Square retirement community, the highest ranking officials in the Columbia County Fire Rescue department are having to testify about the events of June 2, 2015.

Until now, many of the county officials and personnel did not want to discuss the enormous fire in Evans that resulted in the displacement of more than 80 senior residents and the death of 91-year-old resident Dorothy Carpenter.

“We never turn off sprinklers in any building that’s got live smoke in it until we have that completely under control. That’s just an unwritten law.” — Doug Cooper

But over the past several months, local attorneys have taken depositions in the civil cases against the owners and some of the employees of the former $27 million Marshall Square retirement community, as well as, mostly recently, some depositions involving employees of Columbia County Fire Rescue.

And what these top fire officials are saying is truly jarring.

“It was probably one of the most devastating fires that we’ve seen,” said Columbia County Fire Rescue Chief Doug Cooper, who testified he has served as fire chief for the past 18 years.

According to Cooper’s deposition, he arrived at the three-story building along Ronald Reagan Drive around 4:07 a.m. on June 2, 2015, about an hour after the first fire alarm sounded at the retirement community.

The Marshall Square staff actually waited 17 minutes after the initial fire alarm sounded to call 911 and alert the fire department.

Once Columbia County Fire Rescue arrived on the scene around 3:30 a.m., the sprinklers inside Marshall Square were also manually shut off by Marshall Square’s property manager, Chris Bryde.

However, Bryde has testified that Columbia County fire personnel told him to shut off the sprinklers as soon as they arrived on the scene around 3:30 a.m.

While being questioned by Aiken attorney Robin Braithwaite, who is representing the Nebraska-based company Resort Lifestyle Communities that owns Marshall Square, Cooper insisted that no one from his department would shut off the sprinklers.

“We never turn off sprinklers in any building that’s got live smoke in it until we have that completely under control,” Cooper said. “That’s just an unwritten law.”

Braithwaite asked the chief if he ever discussed the sprinkler system with his firefighters following the Marshall Square fire.

“I did,” Cooper said. “I just said, ‘If anybody cut that sprinkler system off, they better own up and let me know.’”

“And nobody owned up; is that right?” Braithwaite asked.

“That’s correct,” Cooper replied.

Braithwaite’s line of questioning then began to be more specific.

“Let me ask you this, have you made any kind of an assessment or determination what role the shutting down of that sprinkler system played in the spread of this fire?” Braithwaite asked.

“I think it was detrimental,” Cooper replied.

The fire chief insisted that, while the sprinkler system may not have been able to totally extinguish the fire, it definitely would have helped suppress it.

“It can usually hold it in check, and we go in there and we knock it down,” Cooper said. “And what is normal practice for us to do, instead of shutting the sprinkler system down, we plug the sprinkler head that’s going off that’s not needed.”

But Cooper said his firefighters know better than to turn off the sprinkler system.

“I don’t think any individual fireman would cut a sprinkler off,” he said. “I know my firefighters responded appropriately. I know they did. That thing could have been a lot worse than it was.”

Cooper said the fire personnel understand the consequences of any such actions.

“Let me ask you this, would that be dereliction of duty on the part of any fireman who would tell Mr. Bryde to turn that off?” Braithwaite asked.

“It would probably end their career,” Cooper bluntly said.

Braithwaite then went back to Cooper’s conversation with the firefighters regarding the sprinkler system.

“So everybody was just deadly silent when you said, ‘If any of y’all did this, you tell me now?’” Braithwaite asked.

Cooper said there was some discussion, but it involved more general comments such as, “You know we wouldn’t turn off a sprinkler system with smoke in a building.”

The fire chief appeared extremely confident about his firefighters’ actions until Braithwaite announced he was going to play an audio recording of radio communications between the firefighters during the early morning hours of June 2, 2015.

“Chief Cooper, what I’d like to do now is to play for you a recording that was — that we received from counsel, and I’d ask that you listen to it very carefully,” Braithwaite said, as he began to play the audio file.

On the recording, a male voice can be heard saying, “All right. Let’s shut off the sprinkler system as soon as we can.”

After the audio file ends, Braithwaite asked Cooper if he was able to hear the recorded conversation.

“Sounded like something… about shutting down the sprinkler system,” Cooper replied.

“‘As soon as we can,’ did you hear that?” Braithwaite asked.

Cooper said he did hear that part of the audio file.

“All right, sir. And if I were to tell you that that transmission was made at 3:43, you would agree that’s within 13 minutes of the arrival of your personnel at the scene of the fire; is that correct?” Braithwaite asked.

“That’s correct,” Cooper said.

“And do you recognize the voice on there?” Braithwaite asked.

“Sounded like Danny Kuhlmann,” Cooper said, referring to the operations chief for Columbia County Fire Rescue.

Braithwaite asked Cooper to listen to another audio file that occurred almost one minute later at 3:44 a.m. inside the Marshall Square retirement community.

On the recording, a male voice can be heard saying, “I’ve got Engine 3 on their way. We’re by the sprinkler system control valve.”

Again, Braithwaite asked Cooper if he was able to hear the voice on the recording.

“That was Danny,” Cooper replied.

“All right, sir. So if Chief Kuhlmann is saying we need to shut down the sprinkler system as soon as we can, why would he be saying that?” Braithwaite asked. “Do you have any idea?”

Cooper said he didn’t know.

“The only idea I would have is he thinks he’s got the fire put out,” Cooper said.

Braithwaite asked if hearing the recording changed Cooper’s mind about the actions of the fire department.

“It does if he shut that sprinkler system down,” Cooper said. “Like I said, that’s a career-ending move right there.”

Cooper was also asked about the evacuation of the building.

Around 3:55 a.m., Cooper said he heard on the radio that part of the upper floor of the Marshall Square retirement community was “collapsing.”

“I was thinking, this thing’s getting bad,” Cooper said. “I immediately put on my clothes and got in my Yukon … I got over to the dispatcher and told him to call in another shift. I think it took me about 12 minutes to get down there.”

By 3:30 a.m., Cooper said about a dozen firefighters were on the scene.

Capt. Gary Griffith of Columbia County Fire Rescue’s Engine Company 3 was the first to become the incident commander at the Marshall Square fire, Cooper said.

“I just said, ‘If anybody cut that sprinkler system off, they better own up and let me know.’” — Doug Cooper

Kuhlmann was also on the scene and already attempting to help put out the fire when Cooper arrived, he said.

“He didn’t have much to say because I told him, next time you get to a fire, don’t you go in there and start fighting the fire,” Cooper said of Kuhlmann. “You stand outside out there and you be chief officer.”

Instead, Kuhlmann was attempting to help carry a three-inch hose up to the third floor of Marshall Square.

“You’ve got to understand, this hose has got to go up three flights of stairs in this building,” Cooper said, adding it is not an easy task. “Well, sectioning that hose is probably 50 pounds, and a section is 50-foot long, so it’s not going to be something that’s going to happen when you snap your fingers. I would think it would take probably 15 or 20 minutes.”

But the hose never made it up to the third floor to help combat the fire, Cooper said.

“Actually the hose was trapped in the building when the steeple fell,” he said, adding that the residents of Marshall Square needed to be evacuated as soon as the fire was discovered in the building. “Once they figured that they had fire in there, those people should have been gotten out of there.”

Cooper testified that proper procedure is to evacuate those apartments that are closest to the fire and then expand outwards from there because it is the firefighters’ top priority to save lives, he said.

“You can’t get another life, but you can get another building,” Cooper said.

Then, Braithwaite specifically asked about resident Dorothy Carpenter, who was killed in the fire, and Rhetta Cadle, who survived after being trapped in her third-floor apartment for almost seven hours.

“That’s a career-ending move right there.” — Doug Cooper

Their apartments were located right next to the third-floor billiard room, where the fire is believed to have originated.

“Do you know whether Dot Carpenter or Rhetta Cadle’s apartments were ever accessed by the fire department in the first hour of that fire?” Braithwaite asked.

“I don’t think they were,” Cooper answered. “I believe I was told there was debris in the hallway there, that they couldn’t get by.”

But Cooper quickly stated that he felt everyone inside Marshall Square should have been evacuated as soon as the first fire alarm sounded.

“Normally when we go somewhere and there’s a fire alarm going off, the people are out. But we do a preliminary search,” Cooper said, adding that he would have thought the firefighters would have evacuated both Cadle and Carpenter. “I would think that they should have got those people out, you know, but I can’t sit here and second guess them when I don’t know what kind of conditions there were up there.”

However, Braithwaite continued to press the fact that the firefighters failed to evacuate both Carpenter and Cadle in a timely manner.

“Would you agree that their apartments would have been the first locations that should have been checked and evacuated?” he asked Cooper.

“I would,” Cooper replied.

About two months ago, Danny Kuhlmann, the operations chief and former training chief for Columbia County Fire Rescue, testified about his actions during the fire in the early morning hours of June 2, 2015.

Kuhlmann told Augusta attorney Staten Bitting Jr., who is representing Marshall Square, that he arrived at the fire around 3:30 a.m. and found the crew of Engine 2 and Capt. Gary Griffith already on the scene.

Within minutes, Engine 5 and 3, along with an aerial ladder truck, arrived at the fire, he said.

Griffith was initially the incident commander, in charge of assigning tasks to the firefighters who were arriving, Kuhlmann said.

“Once the collapse happened, it was all hell broke loose.” — Danny Kuhlmann

“I had a choice to take command or be the operations officer, which I chose to be the operations officer,” he said. “When I pulled up… on Side A of the building, which is the front side, there was just a small amount of smoke at the roof line and probably a 20-inch dark — what looked like a burn spot on the exterior wall above the air conditioning unit on the third floor.”

Griffith sent the crew from Engine 2 to the third floor, Engine 3 to the rear of the building and Engine 5 to the front of the building, Kuhlmann said.

Soon after arriving at Marshall Square, Kuhlmann said he noticed a lot of water coming down like a “waterfall” from the third floor.

“Do you know what was causing that?” Bitting asked.

“Sprinkler activation,” Kuhlmann responded.

Kuhlmann said he was concerned about the amount of water flowing down into the lobby.

“There were residents lingering around all this water. It was approximately 3 inches deep in the — on the floor on the first level, first floor, and in a building that size, there’s a tremendous amount of power going to this building,” Kuhlmann said. “And the first concern was people getting shocked or electrocuted, so I advised all those residents and people that were standing around all this water to get out, get away from it, ’cause once it hits a wall socket or a big transformer or something, panel box, it can throw electricity everywhere.”

Kuhlmann said he was then approached by firefighter Doug Lord who had keys from a “Knox Box,” which are keys that firefighters use to open any door in the building.

“It’s keys to everything,” Kuhlmann said, adding that they were master keys to every apartment in Marshall Square.

“You can’t get another life, but you can get another building.” — Doug Cooper

“There’s only two sets in that box,” Kuhlmann said. “We gave one set to Engine 5, and I think either Doug Lord or Capt. Griffith had the other set to be issued to whoever needed them next… I assume they were never issued because of the developing conditions.”

Kuhlmann said he went back outside and the crew from Engine 3 pointed to smoke coming out the back of the building.

“We realized we had a working fire,” he said. “We communicated with Griffith that we needed to start evacuating. I went back into the building and went to the third floor, and when I got to the third floor, I walked down to the billiard room, and you couldn’t see three feet into the room, it was that full of smoke.”

“Did you have on any personal protective devices at that time?” Bitting asked.

“Just my helmet,” Kuhlmann said, adding he wasn’t wearing a respirator or any protective equipment.

He then saw Lt. Jamie Champion from Engine 5.

“I said, ‘Y’all need to go ahead and start evacuating this third floor,’” Kuhlmann said.

Bitting asked if Champion responded to Kuhlmann’s order to evacuate the third floor.

“Yes,” Kuhlmann said, but explained he could not remember Champion’s exact response. “I don’t recall. These guys, when they have their gear on, it’s hard to hear and communicate with them sometimes. But he understood me. I just couldn’t understand him as far as talking back.”

By that time, Kuhlmann said he returned back downstairs to help bring a hose up to the third floor to fight the fire.

“Firefighter Thomas Knight and myself started loading hose up on our shoulder, and I asked the deputy to help feed the hose to us,” Kuhlmann said. “We would carry hose on our shoulder, but he needed to feed it — the hose off the truck to us.”

Kuhlmann said he and Knight made it through the front door and into the stairwell, but then suddenly the ceiling of the third floor collapsed.

“Once the collapse happened, it was all hell broke loose,” Kuhlmann said.

“And that would have been the first time a hose was taken up into the building?” Bitting asked.

“Correct,” Kuhlmann said.

“In a poker game, you want to win all the money. We only won $84. I would have liked to have won 85.” — Danny Kuhlmann

“Were you able to get it on up to the third floor?” Bitting asked.

“Negative,” Kuhlmann responded.

Bitting then asked about whether the firefighters were well equipped to begin evacuating the building.

“When you were on the third floor, you saw Champion. Do you know what sort of equipment he had with him?” Bitting asked.

Kuhlmann said Champion was wearing his full protective clothing.

“Did he have any devices that would allow him to try to make a forceful entry?” Bitting asked.

“I don’t remember, but they’re usually required to carry a tool,” he said.

Bitting then asked if Champion or the other firefighter were given the master key to unlock the apartments and evacuate the residents.

“Yeah, he was given one down on the ground floor,” Kuhlmann said. “I’m almost positive Engine 5’s crew was given the key. Now, it could have been lost in the mayhem, but…”

“He didn’t ask you for one at the time when you said, ‘We gotta get these people out?’” Bitting asked.

“No, not at that time,” Kuhlmann replied.

Bitting asked at what point was water actually applied with a hose to the building during the fire.

“Just after the fire broke out of the attic, AT1 (Aerial Truck 1) got set up, they started flowing water from the front side of the building to try to slow the spread of the fire,” he said. “As soon as the Aerial Truck 7 got there, we positioned them in the rear of the building to do the same. And so you’re looking at 25 minutes at least before water started being applied… I mean, it takes time to set those trucks up, get them hooked up and get water flowing.”

Kuhlmann also explained that one of the aerial ladder trucks experienced some difficulties with sufficient water pressure at the scene, so the county’s waterworks department had to “boost the pressure in the system.”

As to whether he ever turned off the building’s sprinkler system, Kuhlmann denied any such actions.

Kuhlmann explained that not long after he arrived at the fire, Marshall Square’s property manager, Chris Bryde, took him to the alarm panel.

As soon as Bryde opened the door, Kuhlmann said Bryde reset the alarm panel.

“We don’t like that, because anytime you reset an alarm, a lot of times, it will clear the display for a few minutes,” Kuhlmann said. “Until the alarm reactivates, that tells you where the trouble is within the building.”

However, Kuhlmann decided not to “fuss” at Bryde.

“No need. I mean, I knew the problem was water was flowing in the building,” he said. “We just needed to pinpoint where and why.”

That was important for a number of reasons, Kuhlmann said.

“Number one, the water flows for two reasons, a pipe break or a fire. We had smoke, so we knew we had a fire,” he said. “And nine out of ten times, the sprinkler system puts the fire out, no problem at all, so our next concern was water damage. And this is a big beautiful building and we wanted to get the water stopped as soon as possible. So we were waiting on the crews to tell us whether or not the fire was out or in check or if they needed help, so they could plug the heads and get the water stopped.”

But at no time did he tell Bryde to shutdown the sprinkler system, Kuhlmann insisted.

“Well, he asked me if I wanted him to shut down the system, and I told him, ‘No. Not until we find out exactly what we got,’” Kuhlmann said.

By the time the firefighters discovered the fire, it was “all hands” on deck to evacuate the building, Kuhlmann said.

“When you went up on the third floor, were the sprinklers still flowing?” Bitting asked.

“Absolutely,” Kuhlmann said. “They didn’t stop till after 10:00 o’clock that morning.”

Thomas Mazziotti, who is an attorney representing Goodman Company, which manufactured the packaged terminal air conditioner that was located in Marshall Square’s billiard room where the fire initiated, specifically asked Kuhlmann about the sprinkler system.

“If someone said that they were advised to turn off the sprinkler system by one of the firemen, do you have any information to disagree with that?” Mazziotti asked.

“None of our people would have told anybody to shut a system down,” Kuhlmann said. “They wouldn’t have done that. You’re not gonna turn off the sprinkler system.”

“I would think that they should have got those people out, you know, but I can’t sit here and second guess them when I don’t know what kind of conditions there were up there.” — Doug Cooper

And only the incident commander can make the decision to turn off the sprinkler system, Kuhlmann said.

“I was the highest ranking officer there,” Kuhlmann said. “I was the only one that had authorization to shut that system down.”

“And you never gave that authorization?” Mazziotti asked.

“No,” Kuhlmann testified.

Mazziotti then asked Kuhlmann’s opinion regarding the evacuation of Rhetta Cadle and the death of Dorothy Carpenter.

“During that morning, did anyone ask about whether Ms. Cadle had been notified about the fire?” Mazziotti asked. “I’m just trying to figure out if Ms. Cadle’s name came up as one of the residents that was missing and … do you know if any of the firefighters specifically went up there to check her unit to see if she was still in there?”

Kuhlmann said, once the fire was brought under control, a team was sent back into the building to check on those apartments.

“A head count was constantly being conducted, and I don’t know at what point, but Carpenter and Cadle ended up being the only two we were missing,” Kuhlmann said. “And when they realized what area they were in, they knew that that area was too dangerous to send anybody in until the fire was brought under control.”

Augusta attorney Jamie Weston, who represents Chris Bryde, Marshall Square’s property manager, asked whether Kuhlmann thought the firefighters should have been able to save Carpenter.

“In a poker game, you want to win all the money. We only won $84,” Kuhlmann said, referring to the number of Marshall Square residents who were evacuated from the building. “I would have liked to have won 85.”

But Weston did not let Kuhlmann off that easily.

“Should Columbia County Fire Rescue personnel, when they conducted their search of the rooms around the core — or around the billiard room, should they have found Rhetta Cadle?” Weston directly asked.

“Yes,” Kuhlmann admitted.

“Same question for Dot Carpenter?” Weston asked.

“Yes,” Kuhlmann responded.