Prime Minister Justin Trudeau's new point man in the Senate is asking for some $800,000 to set up his office and begin the work of ushering government legislation through the Red Chamber.

Peter Harder appeared before the internal economy committee Thursday — the body that essentially governs the upper house and doles out budget money — to ask for the trappings normally reserved for the government leader.

Harder said he is hoping to hire at least nine people for his office at a cost of $787,000 to $886,000 — staff who would help him manage the independent members of the Senate. That money would be in addition to the $188,000 all senators are allotted to run their offices, providing Harder with a pool of $1 million to conduct his affairs.

The Ontario senator identifies as an independent and is not a part of the Liberal caucus nor does he formally sit in cabinet. He has eschewed the title of "leader," preferring to call himself the government's "representative," a term that supposedly reflects Trudeau's desire to remove partisanship from the chamber of sober second thought.

Harder told the committee he wasn't asking for anything more than what Claude Carignan, his predecessor, received when he was the Conservatives' government leader in the Senate.

"The role that I have assumed, while somewhat different than in the past, is very much like the role that was provided for and budgeted for previously, and in many respects given the challenge of managing a larger number of independents in the chamber ... [this] is perhaps even a more complex role," he said.

I do expect that we will have 20 more new senators in the fall and I would wish to anticipate that arrival by having some at least nascent practices of how do we bring some level of coordination amongst a large number of some loose fish - Sen. Peter Harder

"I would very much appreciate it if this committee would consider this request at an early opportunity because it's getting quite lonely."

He also indicated that he was hoping to form a sort of leadership team, with the appointment of a "deputy representative" and a whip to help him conduct the business of the government in the Senate.

The Conservative members on the committee jumped on his request, adding that he wanted more cash and staff without the responsibility of running a traditional party caucus.

Senate appointee Peter Hander discusses his role as government representative and how he will balance that with the goal of a non-partisan Senate. 8:01

"You can't have your cake and eat it too. If you want the government leader's budgets, abilities, that sort of thing, you have to assume the government leader's responsibilities — things like question period," Conservative Senator Denise Batters said.

Senators ultimately punted Harder's request to a sub-committee that has yet to have members appointed to it.

20 more senators coming this year

There are currently 17 vacancies in the upper house, and three more seats will be vacated in the next six months as more senators are forced into mandatory retirement after turning 75.

Harder confirmed Thursday that Trudeau would fill all those seats by the fall.

"I do expect that we will have 20 more new senators in the fall and I would wish to anticipate that arrival by having some at least nascent practices of how do we bring some level of coordination amongst a large number of some loose fish," he said in his testimony.

Harder will meet with all of the independent senators next week to discuss how they can work effectively in a chamber that has long been defined along partisan lines. These sort of meetings will occur on a regular basis, he said, but they will not identify themselves as a caucus.

The chamber is in flux as a number of senators have abandoned both the Conservative and Liberal caucuses to sit as independents.

Some senators have been left off Senate committees, the crucial vehicle through which the chamber reviews and amends legislation, because they are not part of the formal party structure. Harder said he hoped to include independents on committees moving forward.

Harder was among a group of seven senators who took their seats in the Senate this week, the first batch of senators appointed under a new appointments process.